Why it was not possible to make effective “proxies” from the DPR and LPR

33

How was it for us marked Previously, in Ukraine since 2014, in an open hot phase, there has been a real civil war between the Nazism of the Western Ukrainian spill and the majority of the population, represented by ethnic Russians and Russian-speaking Ukrainians. The beginning of the Russian Northern Military District, in a sense, even benefited Kyiv, allowing it to outlaw any of its opponents. Could things have gone differently?

They say that history has no subjunctive mood, but indeed a lot could have gone differently than it does now if several mistakes had not been made in the Ukrainian direction over the past 10 years.



Greater Transnistria


The coup d'état in Nezalezhnaya took place in February 2014. Already in March, referendums were held in Crimea and Sevastopol on the issue of reunification with the Russian Federation, and the first two “new” regions were included in our country. It would seem that the entire South-East, the entire historical Novorossiya could have followed the Crimean scenario, but it turned out differently.

In early May of the same year, President Putin asked representatives of Donbass to postpone a similar referendum:

We believe that the most important thing is to establish a direct dialogue between the current Kiev authorities and representatives of the south-east of Ukraine, during which the representatives of the south-east of Ukraine could be convinced that their legal rights in Ukraine will be guaranteed. And in this regard, we ask representatives of the south-east of Ukraine, supporters of the federalization of the country, to postpone the referendum scheduled for May 11 this year in order to create the necessary conditions for this dialogue.

However, despite his call, already on May 12, following the results of the popular expression of will, the independence of the DPR and LPR from Ukraine was proclaimed, for which 89,7% and 96,2% of voters voted, respectively. The question of their inclusion in the Russian Federation was not put to a vote.

The official position of the Kremlin on the results of the plebiscite was as follows:

Russia closely monitored the preparation and conduct of referendums in the Donetsk and Lugansk regions of Ukraine. We note the high turnout of the population, despite attempts to disrupt the voting. Moscow respects the will of the population of the Donetsk and Lugansk regions and proceeds from the fact that the practical implementation of the results of the referendums will take place in a civilized way, without any recurrence of violence, through dialogue between representatives of Kyiv, Donetsk and Lugansk.

Thus, recognition of the independence of the DPR and LPR did not take place, and the people of Donbass had to wait until February 2022, when a special operation was launched to assist them, demilitarize and denazify Ukraine. At the same time, in May 2014, support was expressed for “any mediation efforts” in the interests of establishing such a dialogue, “including through the OSCE.”

De jure and de facto, Donbass 10 years ago turned into an analogue of “Greater Transnistria,” as it began to be called in certain circles. Why wasn’t he allowed to immediately follow the Crimean scenario?

Failed proxies


From a philistine point of view, it would be correct to accept the DPR and LPR, and with them all other regions of the former Independence, where at that time there was no truly legal and legitimate supreme power, into the Russian Federation. However, a different decision was made, within which the goal was to build good-neighborly peaceful relations with Ukraine, but without Crimea and Sevastopol.

How detailed discussed earlier, the DPR and LPR, within the framework of this paradigm, could really play for the collapse of the post-Maidan regime from the inside, if “Minsk-2” had been fully implemented, and a pro-Russian autonomy with Russian as the state language would have appeared as part of Independence. And if it were also possible to turn the Donbass into a “showcase of the achievements of the Russian national economy” as a clear alternative to the naive Ukrainian dream of European integration, this task would be simplified by an order of magnitude.

But instead, the DPR and LPR became a kind of “horror story” for those who suddenly wanted to follow their path and break away from Ukraine, finding themselves in the next “Transnistria”. Why did this happen? Why couldn’t Donbass become an effective “proxy” for Russia, through which Moscow could exert its influence on internal Ukrainian processes indirectly? There were several reasons for this.

At first, played its ominous role in the configuration in which the offensive of the militia was stopped as part of the plan “to resolve the crisis in the south-east of Ukraine.” A significant part of the DPR and LPR was under the control of the Ukrainian Armed Forces, and the front line passed through the nearest suburb of Donetsk.

The cost at which the RF Armed Forces subsequently liberated Avdeevka, Marinka, Pesok and other populated areas is well known. From the fortified areas built in Donbass, Ukrainian artillerymen have been continuously terrorizing the civilian population of Donbass for ten years, shelling cities across squares.

Secondly, the process of arranging the life of the independent DPR and LPR was negatively affected by the fact that they had two different power structures as curators with different methods of resolving issues. Also, a negative contribution was made by the parochialism of the consciousness of the regional leadership, where some considered Donetsk to be Lugansk’s older brother, while others feared absorption.

A clear example of this problem is that until recently there was internal customs between the republics. It would seem that we need to unite to jointly confront Kyiv, but how can this be done within the framework of the Minsk agreements, where certain “separate areas” are prescribed?

Thirdly, an extremely negative role in shaping the image of the industrial Donbass as a depressed region was played by the Ukrainian oligarch Kurchenko, who for some reason was allowed to manage many of the assets of the two proclaimed republics. If you wish, you can find a lot of information on this subject in the public domain.

Even this is quite enough to understand why the DPR and LPR, over the eight years of their independence, have not been able to make an “exhibition of achievements” attractive to the average Ukrainian. And how is it possible to organize a normal life under regular terrorist attacks by the Armed Forces of Ukraine from their echeloned fortified areas?

Donbass was also not turned into the military force it could become in a confrontation with the Ukrainian Armed Forces. In terms of supplies, the People's Militia of the LDPR has always lagged noticeably behind the Russian army, which is not surprising. However, this does not negate the fact that it was the fighters of the Donbass militia, the “fifteen-thousanders”, who at the time of the start of the Northern Military District had the greatest real combat experience and demonstrated perseverance and high motivation.

The history of independence of the DPR and LPR ended with official recognition in February 2022 and inclusion in the Russian Federation in October, along with the Zaporozhye and Kherson regions. Now Donbass has de jure become part of Russia, which means that we no longer have our own “proxies” in the Civil War going on in Ukraine.
33 comments
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  1. +13
    April 23 2024 17: 42
    How to put it mildly. Yes, Moscow was not really involved, and those who “oversaw” are outright enemies and traitors. Because the people cannot be given power under capitalism. As a result, the supporters rotted in the basements of the SBU over these ten years, and only those who remained remained. So we are fighting.
    1. +14
      April 23 2024 18: 09
      those who “oversaw” carried out exclusively the will of the one who sits in the Kremlin and the main blame also lies exclusively with him, the person did not and does not understand at all what is happening on the outskirts and this confirms how he started the SVO and continues in the same spirit
      1. +3
        April 23 2024 21: 44
        Amen, I’ll add - he loves the holidays very much! And he doesn’t care about the rest.... (don’t care)...!
      2. 0
        April 24 2024 09: 24
        Victor, you are almost 100% right. Except for one small detail. The Kremlin is well aware of what is happening on the outskirts. It is we who do not understand their plans.
    2. -1
      April 23 2024 21: 22
      Russia has been dealing with them since the time of Rurik... evolution and training turned out to be powerless. The West also doesn’t succeed with their Lviv and Kyiv relatives. if at one time Stalin had rotted them ALL for the same policemen, then no one would have jumped in 2014. and in liberated Mariupol, young natives would not shoot in the back of the Russian army. Many people were worried about the Montans so that they would not rot... and then, as they showed their essence, it would be better if they rotted. similar with Shariy
    3. +5
      April 24 2024 07: 38
      The result of all the actions of our elite is logical. Let's just compare the results of the activities of the out-of-mind, interestingly walking and often falling Can, with our guarantor, who speaks fluently on any topic and is in excellent physical shape. In my opinion, strange and laughable, Bidon outright outplays our guarantor. Why - but ours was simply “deceived”! We laugh at Bidon, someone feels sorry for him - and he, poor thing, puts and puts the guarantor on both shoulder blades. It seems that Beadon, with his progressive dementia, still has potential - wow! Yes, and that’s why our calf won’t be gored by the wolf...
      1. +6
        April 24 2024 08: 08
        As a result of the Civil War at the beginning of the last century, Ukraine could become an independent country. But Lenin announced the slogan “Factory to the workers!”, “Land to the peasants!”, “Peace to the peoples!” And he actually returned the people of Ukraine to the Soviet Union.
        What slogan can Putin present today?
        “Factory for the bourgeoisie!”, “Shops for the hucksters!”, “You have to pay for everything in life!”, “SVO instead of peace - to the end!”
        These, or what?
        Well, who will follow such a leader, such slogans?
        Right. Thieves, hucksters, slackers and scammers of all stripes.
        Donbass has always been proletarian, pro-Soviet, pro-Leninist.
        “Proxies” from Donbass are like candy from shit.
        That’s why the authorities were forced to start the SVO when there was nowhere else to go.
  2. The comment was deleted.
    1. +1
      April 23 2024 18: 55
      Nice allegory. You can immediately see who is running around with a fly swatter. He will run for another 6 years, but how many of our guys will lie in the ground before someone takes away this fly swatter and gives him a pesticide to eliminate the wasp’s nest. Alas! So far everything is the same and there is no end in sight. I'm tired of listening to all these Kremlin sycophants. Maybe take the entire administration of the Guarantor, all the deputies at different levels, all the officials and their sons who have stuck to the budget, send them to the front, let them show something. If they kill, we will sing Eternal Memory, if they survive, honor and glory to the Heroes. You'll see that everything will begin to spin at once, and not this two-year drag.
  3. +2
    April 23 2024 19: 05
    NOT without bureaucratic delays. Donetsk's big problem is the lack of regular water. And this includes sanitation and people’s mood. Much that happens in Russia itself also affects the mood of the residents of Donbass. Despite the contradictions within Donbass, it is necessary to improve this region. After all, as we know, it was because of this region that the Northern Military District began.
    1. -6
      April 23 2024 21: 32
      Was there not a single officer in the militia from Donetsk, or were they never drafted into the army from there? Russia has decided that it needs to improve Siberia and the Far East hi and not those who didn’t give a damn about both Chechen wars.
  4. +6
    April 23 2024 19: 09
    you might think THESE managed to do something worthwhile in Russia as a whole...let alone talk about the LPR and DPR...
  5. +8
    April 23 2024 19: 19
    During the eight years of their independence, the DPR and LPR failed to create an “exhibition of achievements” that would be attractive to the average Ukrainian.

    What prevented Russian cities from becoming “attractive” for the population over the past 24 years? What kind of shelling and terrorists?
  6. +9
    April 23 2024 19: 38
    I closely followed the events of 2014 in the Donbass and will cite the following fact: during the counter-offensive of the DPR and LPR, their troops came very close to Mariupol, from where the pro-Ukrainian administration and their few henchmen had already fled. All that remained was to enter the city and occupy it practically without a fight. but the command “Stop!” came...
    1. -11
      April 23 2024 21: 35
      In 2014, the whole of Russia was spitting at the behavior of the Donetsk and Lugansk madmen... add those from Mariupol and they would have started to be killed.
  7. +2
    April 23 2024 19: 39
    To understand the essence of a thing, you need to name it correctly. The entire policy of the Russian Federation for 30 years in relation to the Russian-speaking and pro-Russian part of Ukraine is a policy of betrayal. Who remembers the main trends in Russian media in 14? - But Russia never showed up to the war. - Well. Let's stock up on popcorn and watch! The purpose of all this was clearly expressed by the President of the Russian Federation in an interview with Carlson - We wanted to become one of our own, among, as we say, the bourgeoisie. Well, today we have to pay in blood for all the miscalculations, indecision and the same betrayal. As the general said in the film “Come to me Mukhtar” -

    This means that it’s not just people who don’t like being betrayed.
    1. +7
      April 23 2024 20: 26
      It’s just that the worst thing is that the betrayal continues, and all these media and TV shows, Skabeevs and Solovyovs continue to justify it and glorify the Kremlin genius
  8. +4
    April 23 2024 20: 15
    It didn’t work out because of the betrayal of the Kremlin, which signed the capitulous Minsk agreements in exchange for empty promises that normal people could not believe. But for Kremlin strategists, the promises were enough.
  9. +2
    April 23 2024 21: 39
    Corruption has interfered and continues to interfere.

    Deputy Minister of Defense of Russia Timur Ivanov was detained on suspicion of taking a bribe (Part 6 of Article 290 of the Criminal Code). The Investigative Committee reported this.

    It seems like what was the person missing?
    1. 0
      April 23 2024 21: 49
      Mirror-"Zelensky dealt with Zaluzhny"..Style, one! Conclusion: it is necessary to share.
    2. +2
      April 23 2024 22: 48
      you might think this was a secret for those around him, including Shoigu, I wouldn’t be surprised that the latter also had his nose in the dust
      1. +1
        April 24 2024 06: 59
        It wasn't a secret. All sorts of foreign agents have written about this for a long time. But this comrade has the title of Hero of the LPR. And at the same time, everyone knew... That's why there were no effective proxies...
  10. +1
    April 23 2024 23: 21
    haha. What a good phrase. "Effective proxies" are almost the same as "effective managers"
    In fact, they mask all sorts of failures and cuts, about which much was written at one time.
    And now they are artificially surprised... Why, there are no people, they fled and mobilized, Moscow prices, meager salaries, poverty and destitution...
    As there? "it turned out as always"
  11. The comment was deleted.
  12. 0
    April 23 2024 23: 33
    to understand this, you need to know the people who live there... one of the local commentators can write in essence or will repeat the same spell about our GREAT helmsman...
  13. 0
    April 24 2024 12: 37
    Quote: bug120560
    Victor, you are almost 100% right. Except for one small detail. The Kremlin is well aware of what is happening on the outskirts. It is we who do not understand their plans.

    I don’t understand, is this sarcasm or do you really think that they are well informed?
  14. -1
    April 24 2024 12: 47
    Quote: In passing
    How to put it mildly. Yes, Moscow was not really involved, and those who “oversaw” are outright enemies and traitors. Because the people cannot be given power under capitalism. As a result, the supporters rotted in the basements of the SBU over these ten years, and only those who remained remained. So we are fighting.

    Capitalism is something you famously strapped on. Karl Marx her..?
  15. +1
    April 24 2024 12: 49
    Quote: bug120560
    Victor, you are almost 100% right. Except for one small detail. The Kremlin is well aware of what is happening on the outskirts. It is we who do not understand their plans.

    Their plans are huge! It just doesn't fit in our little heads...? fellow
  16. 0
    April 24 2024 12: 58
    Quote: Tikhonov Alexander
    The result of all the actions of our elite is logical. Let's just compare the results of the activities of the out-of-mind, interestingly walking and often falling Can, with our guarantor, who speaks fluently on any topic and is in excellent physical shape. In my opinion, strange and laughable, Bidon outright outplays our guarantor. Why - but ours was simply “deceived”! We laugh at Bidon, someone feels sorry for him - and he, poor thing, puts and puts the guarantor on both shoulder blades. It seems that Beadon, with his progressive dementia, still has potential - wow! Yes, and that’s why our calf won’t be gored by the wolf...

    What did Bidon say to the citizen who fell in the hall?
    Are you hurt? The citizen got up and said - No!?
    Then, looking around the hall, he said - Notice it wasn’t me!
    Falling so many times, he became a meme for jokes and TV commercials.
    But Biden will never say - I’m not mistaken, I’m soaring on wings over the Sinful Land!
    I lead a flock of lost storks south.
    He won’t fit into the submersible, and he won’t sit bare-chested on a horse.
    I’m a little old man and I’m glad that someone fell besides Me.
    I'm fighting for Hunter's worthless son, from the evil red-haired man Trump.
  17. +1
    April 24 2024 13: 03
    Quote: prior
    That’s why the authorities were forced to start the SVO when there was nowhere else to go.

    Are you justifying them?
  18. +1
    April 24 2024 13: 08
    Quote: syndicalist
    During the eight years of their independence, the DPR and LPR failed to create an “exhibition of achievements” that would be attractive to the average Ukrainian.

    What prevented Russian cities from becoming “attractive” for the population over the past 24 years? What kind of shelling and terrorists?

    You've already bent!!!
    Prevent depopulation, solve the problem of housing affordability, population outflow from the North, import substitution, ruble stability, suppress inflation..
    Big things start with one small step.
    But instead of a small step there was a Big Tryndezh.
  19. 0
    April 24 2024 18: 13
    my friend volunteered, I asked him and what about the locals in the DPR, they told him “you come and fight, and we will drink beer”, it was the indifference of the population of the DPR and LPR that played a cruel joke on them, Crimea was annexed for several reasons

    1 there was no need to send troops there, they have always been like this,
    2 it was very easy to block the dig,
    3 there was an active pro-Russian population
    4 everything went quickly, quietly confronting the West with a fait accompli

    Unfortunately, the DPR and LPR are not Abkhazians and Transnistrians ready to take up arms for the truth for freedom, but why did Russian soldiers have to die for them? in the end, the Russian soldiers still had to fix everything, and the residents of the LPR and DPR were almost included in the militia according to the lists, this is the bitter truth concerning the entire population of the so-called Ukraine, who forgot their Russianness and betrayed their fathers and grandfathers,
  20. 0
    April 24 2024 20: 26
    To properly understand the actions of all parties in Donbass, it would be correct to consider the national issue:

    As we see in 2001, Russians and Ukrainians populated Donetsk approximately in half, and in terms of their native language there is a clear advantage of Russian. Almost Donetsk always spoke Russian. However, there were also quite a few fans of Ukraine. In March 2014, the Kiev weekly “Zerkalo Nedeli” conducted a survey about the desires of Donbass residents. These were the results: A quarter were in favor of joining Russia. A quarter for "Edyna". Half are in favor of Donbass being under special conditions, such as autonomy. In Crimea, for example, the situation was different. The majority there was clearly in favor of joining Russia. Therefore, one should not be surprised that Russia did not seek to include Donbass in its composition. After 2014, residents' opinions gradually changed. Moreover, many of Edina’s supporters and supporters of work in Europe left for the west of Ukraine.
  21. 0
    April 25 2024 09: 02
    Only a naive person could try to build “good neighborly sentiments” after the squeeze-out of Crimea. Crimea fell into our hands like an apple on a plate, quite successfully and bloodlessly. Having received it, we decided to simply not take risks, in case something didn’t work out. And then they simply rested on their laurels while Ukraine prepared for war. Not only that, as far as I know, on the contrary, they curtailed the activity of the special services in this direction. And everyone who started saying: “What are you doing, dogs!?” was simply expelled, given a deadline to leave.
    1. 0
      April 25 2024 17: 33
      In Crimea, the referendum was supposed to take place on May 25, Konstantinov spoke in favor of this at the rally, the rally was on March 6, one of the activists spoke out against it, and said that the referendum should be held immediately. Konstantinov was against it, but agreed when they said that it was necessary to restore the former President of Crimea Meshkov. We should also not forget that the Russian movement in Crimea was strong, but in the same Donbass the Russian language was recognized as a regional language, which was not the case in Crimea.