Strategic challenge: West intends to prevent Russia from winning over coronavirus


Following the first phase of the ordeal that humanity was subjected to during the COVID-19 pandemic - overcrowded hospitals, mass deaths, severe quarantines and devastating blows to the economy whole countries, it seems, comes the second. And it is far from the fact that it will not become in many ways even more dramatic than the previous one. After all, now we are talking about the opportunity to get rid of the disease, a real opportunity to return to a normal, "pre-coronavirus life."


The price of the issue is reliable and affordable drugs for vaccination against this disease. Reports of their creation coming in one after another from all over the world made many feel optimistic. It turned out to be premature. Everything turned out to be far from so simple ...

The rescue! But not for everyone ...


In the most terrible days of the pandemic, when daily reports of its spread resembled (at least in terms of the number of victims mentioned in them) reports from the fields of another world war, the creation of the first vaccine (or vaccines) from the ailment that struck humanity was expected, like a miracle. At the same time, somehow, by definition, it was understood that a saving injection would be available to all thirsty and suffering - after all, millions, tens of millions of human lives are at stake! However, cynics and pragmatists already warned that instead of a panacea, humanity is likely to receive another bone of contention, which will give rise to many disputes, conflicts, squabbles and intrigues. As usual, they were the ones who were ultimately right. Today the real situation is as follows: two groups of states will be able to organize a truly massive (and the other simply will not be effective) vaccination of their citizens.

The first, as you might guess, includes those that have the capabilities (scientific, technological and others) to organize the development and production of their own appropriate drugs. The second - countries are so rich that they can easily afford to buy the required number of doses of vaccine, and from various manufacturers. The third group of countries - those who will have to rely on the goodwill and mercy of the first two. In other words - simply wait for the life-saving vaccine to be shared with them out of philanthropy or some other considerations. Wait, slowly dying out from the coronavirus ... If COVID-19 broke something completely and irrevocably, into small smithereens, it was the naive idea of ​​some kind of "united humanity" that had been in the world before it came into the world. In fact, this is not at all the case.

According to the American Higher School of Health, the long-awaited salvation will be distributed as follows: more than half of all actually existing and available doses of the coronavirus vaccine on the planet will receive countries in which less than 15% of its population lives. It is easy to calculate that the remaining 85% will get everything else, that is, less than half. Consequently, according to American scientists, 25% of the inhabitants of our world may not even dream of being vaccinated, at least in the next two or three years. At the same time (this is data from the Goldman Sachs company) already in April of this year 50% of the citizens of the USA and Canada will receive it, a month later - half of Europeans, Japanese and Australians. At the same time, there is one more, very characteristic detail: all these countries make purchases of vaccines not just "on a trip", but in quantities that are multiples of the number of their inhabitants. For example, in the European Union, this figure averages 2.5 doses per person, in the United States - 3 doses, in Britain and Australia - 5. Canada has completely decided to play it safe and collect ten doses for everyone who lives there.

UN Secretary General Antonio Guteris on this matter can only, as usual, helplessly shrug his shoulders, reproaching the "big" countries for policies "Vaccine nationalism" and row all the drugs that they can reach, thereby sharply reducing the chances of salvation for "small", that is, poor states. In any case - who will listen to him ?! Unfortunately, the words of the Secretary General are deafened even when he asks rich states to “throw” the UN “on poverty”. Or rather, to allocate funds for the widely advertised COVAX program, in the framework of which the most underdeveloped and poorest countries were to be provided with vaccines. Guterisch last spoke about $ 4 billion in the first two months of this year. As far as we know, for the whole of 2021 the program “lacks” 21 billion. It looks like there will be no "vaccine charity" ...

Politics above mercy


In many respects, such "thrifty" of developed countries is due to the fact that none of the currently existing vaccines have passed the third clinical stage of the trial, and the information received about their effectiveness and safety is often very controversial, and sometimes differ to the exact opposite. For example, according to the US federal database Vaccine Adverse Event Reporting System, 55 people have already died in the country as a result of the use of Moderna and Pfizer / BioNTec vaccines. There are twice as many cases of life-threatening complications, requiring urgent hospitalization of patients - four times. By the way, both companies are exempted by the US Congress from liability for the use of their drugs, the development and testing of which is carried out in a "forced mode". However, on January 6, the use of Moderna in the EU was approved by the European Medicines Regulator (EMA) and the European Commission. A day earlier, the same decision was made in Israel.

Meanwhile, Australia has already “rebelled” against the Anglo-Swiss vaccine AstraZeneca, the use of which in the Old World is going to be considered “as soon as possible” (and, most likely, positively). Local doctors, represented by representatives of the Australian-New Zealand Society of Immunologists (ASI), have formally asked the government to withdraw this drug from the national vaccination campaign, since, according to them, the effectiveness of AstraZeneca is no more than 62,1%, which makes it unsuitable for creation mass immunity. Extremely contradictory data are also received regarding CoronaVac, a drug from the Chinese company Sinovac Biotech, which is now breaking out into the leaders in sales in the world market. Indonesia claims 97% effectiveness, Turkey (where the Medicines and Medical Devices Agency has already approved its emergency use) 91% effectiveness. However, experts from the Brazilian National Health Surveillance Agency, which conducts research and testing of this drug, claim that its effectiveness ranges between 50% and 60%. However, this is not yet the final conclusion.

Fortunately, the residents of Russia have no cause for concern. Mass vaccination with Sputnik V begins in the country, and two more domestic drugs are on the way. The problem is different - any attempts of the Russian vaccine to "break through" to the foreign market are met with such fierce resistance that it instantly becomes clear: the point here is not at all about medical or scientific issues. Rather, in economic interests - after all, our drug can be a very serious competitor at a price to any of the Western ones. Well, and, of course, in politics, and the most, that neither is a bad kind. Of course, the most frank ones on this topic were expressed in Ukraine. The local Foreign Minister Dmitry Kuleba agreed to the point that the use of "Sputnik V" in the "non-railway" is completely unacceptable, even if it shows 100% efficiency. Cause?

According to the chief diplomat of Kiev, "Moscow intends to impose its ideology and propaganda clichés by supplying vaccines." Well, here, you know, in my opinion, there is even nothing to comment on. Psychiatry of the purest water. Ultimately, desperate to get a vaccine under COVAX, Ukraine entered into a contract for the supply of Chinese CoronaVac. For the price of the most expensive American drugs, by the way ... The Russian vaccine is absolutely unambiguously adopted "with open arms" in Belarus and Serbia. In Hungary, having received several thousand doses of Sputnik and characterized it very positively, they said that there are "few" vaccines, and therefore will be vaccinated with what the EU will allocate. Again politics ... Perhaps the most original thing was split off in Albania. The local Prime Minister Edi Rama demanded an apology from the embassy of our country for the fact that its representatives ... offered to vaccinate the country with "Sputnik V", calling this friendly gesture an "inappropriate provocation." Truly, ingratitude has no limits.

As it became known recently, the account of our vaccine "Sputnik V" was blocked by Twitter for completely incomprehensible reasons, after the well-known events of Washington, it hit the censorship and blocking everything and everyone. A strange decision, to say the least. Later, however, access to the page was returned. However, recently things have been happening to Sputnik that are worthy of serial TV action movies. So, four hundred doses of it from those who arrived in Argentina, where the Ministry of Health at the end of last year urgently approved the use of our drug, were irreparably damaged. The reason - an incomprehensible "failure of refrigerators", which, according to the prosecutor of the judicial department of the Olavarria municipality of the province of Buenos Aires, Azul Marcelo Sobrino, who is investigating the case, may well have been caused not by accident, but by someone's malicious intent. Simply put, we are most likely facing another anti-Russian sabotage. There is no need to talk about the mass of spiteful articles in the Western media trying to present the case in such a way that in fact Russia does not have any vaccine at all. Even such a respected publication as the Financial Times has recently come to such fabrications. And this is despite the articles of their compatriot, the Moscow correspondent of The New York Times, Andrew Kramer, who experienced the effects of Sputnik on himself. In the United States, they were immediately declared "Kremlin propaganda" ...

The reasons and motives for such, to put it mildly, unseemly actions should be sought, I think, in one thing. The British Ambassador to the United States, Karen Pearce, spoke very specifically on this issue not so long ago. According to this lady, "the leaders of an open society" (by which she, of course, primarily means Washington and London) should in no case allow Russia and China to become "the new winners in the world recovering from the coronavirus pandemic." This is a "strategic challenge" for the West and they intend to resist it there at any cost. Such trifles as millions of human lives in this case, of course, do not count.
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  1. Dmitry S. Offline Dmitry S.
    Dmitry S. (Dmitry Sanin) 18 January 2021 10: 02
    +4
    Actually, there could be no other option in modern conditions.
    And Ukrainians with brains are already negotiating vaccinations in the Rostov region. A Russian drug, please note.
    1. Just a cat Offline Just a cat
      Just a cat (Bayun) 18 January 2021 11: 39
      +3
      Vaccination against COVID-19 on commercial terms is not possible for foreign tourists. This was stated by the assistant to the Minister of Health of the Russian Federation Alexei Kuznetsov.

      Earlier, information appeared in the media about the sale of tours in the Russian Federation in several foreign countries for the purpose of vaccination against a new coronavirus infection. The cost of vouchers in the Czech Republic started from 30 thousand kroons (about 1 euros) and more.

      The Ministry of Health called it a common fraud: vaccination is possible only for citizens of the Russian Federation:

      “Vaccination is already underway, and it is free for citizens. Russians have absolute priority in vaccination. And only after satisfying the internal need - when the risk groups and all those who wish are vaccinated - it will be possible to talk about some kind of commercial supplies, ”TASS quotes Kuznetsov.

      https://realnoevremya.ru/news/192089-vakcinaciya-ot-koronavirusa-na-kommercheskih-usloviyah-inostrancam-nevozmozhna

      If this is not corruption, then let the Sumerians jump on.
  2. Bulanov Offline Bulanov
    Bulanov (Vladimir) 18 January 2021 10: 08
    +6
    The main indicator of the suitability of a given vaccine will be the reduction in the number of diseases in a particular country. The best advertisement for Sputnik-V will be the complete vaccination of Russian citizens and the final withdrawal of this disease from Russia, like measles and smallpox used to be. Then it will become clear whose vaccine is better and who lost by not using the Russian vaccine.
  3. Sergey Latyshev Offline Sergey Latyshev
    Sergey Latyshev (Serge) 18 January 2021 11: 08
    -2
    It's all bullshit. The number of sick and dead in the Russian Federation is growing, and it is being discussed what is happening with Sputnik over the hill.
  4. Alexzn Offline Alexzn
    Alexzn (Alexander) 18 January 2021 11: 43
    -6
    Someone interferes with selling Sputnik abroad? Nonsense! There is an acute shortage of vaccines on the market, they will sweep away at once!
    Why replace the problem of lack of vaccine production capacity with the problem of counteraction?
    In the Russian media, Western vaccines are poured no less slop than those on Russian ones. Read the Russian media so BP strychnine golimy.
    The indignation that the rich countries will be the first to take root is not understandable. Is it different? Should the Swiss give up their doses in favor of the Urundi Burundi? Why doesn't Russia give its own? Stupid?
  5. Vladest Offline Vladest
    Vladest (Vladimir) 18 January 2021 13: 00
    -4
    Quote: Dmitry S.
    And Ukrainians with brains already

    Can you tell me why Ukraine should love Russia?
    1. Dmitry S. Offline Dmitry S.
      Dmitry S. (Dmitry Sanin) 18 January 2021 16: 28
      +4
      I didn't understand the question at all. It seems that no one wrote about love. And I don’t know the country of Ukraine - there’s a frankly stitched monster of Frankenstein, but there is no country. There are three more Baltic mongrels who have forgotten their history.
    2. gore Offline gore
      gore (Alexander) 19 January 2021 05: 23
      +1
      Yes, it's just stupid because it (Ukraine) exists even as a "territory of mankurts" ...
  6. Vladest Offline Vladest
    Vladest (Vladimir) 18 January 2021 13: 08
    -4
    Quote: AlexZN
    Someone interferes with selling Sputnik abroad?

    This article is pure propaganda. The fact is that Russia itself does not apply for registration of its vaccine. Plus, the capacity for its production is not enough even to cover their needs. Who wants to turn to Russia on the issue of Vaccines. This is the master's business. No one wants to impose on anyone.
    The author's groaning about caring for the weak is not yet appropriate. After the pandemic, everything will be counted. And the conclusions will be drawn, who and how helped others with the vaccine.
    The EU already

    EU aid package for countries worldwide to fight coronavirus to reach 20 billion euros

    How is this situation in the Russian Federation?
    1. Alexzn Offline Alexzn
      Alexzn (Alexander) 18 January 2021 14: 40
      -2
      Russia is switching to MASS vaccination. We are talking about the desire to reach the level of 5-6 million doses per month. At this rate, the population will be vaccinated by the end of 2023. I think that by the end of 2022 there will be no more applicants, but the level of herd immunity will be obtained. Today, Russia is somewhere in the 13-15th place in terms of vaccination. In fact, from the end of the year, the collective West will launch programs to provide the Third World, 3-4 Western vaccines will be produced in BILLION batches, Russia will produce ... 60 million by next year.
      Next year we'll talk about who saves whom and how
      1. Dear sofa expert. 19 January 2021 21: 26
        +1
        Today, Russia is somewhere in the 13-15th place in terms of vaccination.

        And here's an interesting fact. A quarter of the population has already been vaccinated in Israel. Not the first place in the world, it would seem ... but here's another "record":
        Every day, the number of newly infected people in Israel is increasing by 10000 people a day! And this is with only 9 million population!

        Maybe the vaccine is "not very"?

        Please comment on this fact.
  7. Cyril Offline Cyril
    Cyril (Kirill) 18 January 2021 14: 43
    0
    Necropic in its repertoire.

    For example, according to the US federal database Vaccine Adverse Event Reporting System, 55 people have already died in the country as a result of the use of Moderna and Pfizer / BioNTec vaccines.

    Not as a result, but after. These are two fundamentally different things. The VAERS website itself says:

    VAERS accepts reports of adverse events and reactions that occur following vaccination. Healthcare providers, vaccine manufacturers, and the public can submit reports to the system. While very important in monitoring vaccine safety, VAERS reports alone cannot be used to determine if a vaccine caused or contributed to an adverse event or illness. The reports may contain information that is incomplete, inaccurate, coincidental, or unverifiable. In large part, reports to VAERS are voluntary, which means they are subject to biases... This creates specific limitations on how the data can be used scientifically. Data from VAERS reports should always be interpreted with these limitations in mind.

    Thus, whether the vaccine itself caused these 55 cases, or was it a consequence of its misuse or generally left reasons that were in no way related to the vaccine, but manifested themselves after vaccination - the state regulatory authorities and manufacturers must first figure out.

    In Hungary, having received several thousand doses of Sputnik and characterized it very positively, they said that there are "few" vaccines, and therefore will be vaccinated with what the EU will allocate. Again politics ...

    What's the politics? The fact that Russia does not have sufficient production capacity to produce its own vaccine, while Western companies do?

    The local Prime Minister Edi Rama demanded an apology from the embassy of our country for the fact that its representatives ... offered to vaccinate the country with Sputnik V, calling this friendly gesture an "inappropriate provocation."

    I tried to find this news, typed into the search engine the query "Prime Minister of Albania, Sputnik vaccine". Google issued 1 (in words - one) news, published on 1 Ukrainian site, which, in turn, links only to 1 Balkan blog.

    So, four hundred doses of it from those who arrived in Argentina, where the Ministry of Health at the end of last year urgently approved the use of our drug, were irreparably damaged. The reason - an incomprehensible "failure of refrigerators", which, according to the prosecutor of the judicial department of the Olavarria municipality of the province of Buenos Aires, Azul Marcelo Sobrino, who is investigating the case, may well have been caused not by accident, but by someone's malicious intent.

    Maybe Mr. Necropny will first wait for the results of the investigation, and only then will he draw conclusions?

    There is no need to talk about the mass of spiteful articles in the Western media trying to present the case in such a way that in fact Russia has no vaccine at all.

    The Russian vaccine is "accused" of only one thing - that it began to be launched into mass production and, moreover, publicly declaring its safety and effectiveness before this vaccine underwent 3 stages of clinical trials.

    In addition, while Western vaccine manufacturers openly publish detailed research results for their vaccines, the Russian Sputnik developer limits himself only to management statements and press releases. This is indicated not only by Western, but also by Russian (including state) medical specialists.
    1. Dear sofa expert. 19 January 2021 21: 44
      0
      What's the politics? The fact that Russia does not have sufficient production capacity to produce its own vaccine, while Western companies do?

      If you do not know about this, it does not mean that it does not exist.

      Russia has such capacities, and you have a beloved "border" behind you.
      For example, in Germany, a subsidiary of the Russian company "R-Pharm". This is R-Pharm Germany GmbH in the Bavarian city of Illertissen. It was purchased in 2014 from the German division of the American corporation Pfizer (the same one, by the way, which created the coronavirus vaccine together with BioNTech from Germany).

      At least yesterday she could have started mass production of the Russian "Sputnik", but there is still an unresolved legal issue:
      ... does a German pharmaceutical company have the right to produce drugs that are not registered in the European Union on the territory of the Federal Republic of Germany, even if they are only exported outside the EU?

      In whose favor do you think this question will be resolved?

      Here, it's time to return to the title of this article, which we are discussing, namely:

      Strategic challenge: West intends to prevent Russia from winning over coronavirus
      1. Cyril Offline Cyril
        Cyril (Kirill) 19 January 2021 22: 11
        -1
        If you do not know about this, it does not mean that it does not exist.

        Putin probably doesn't know either - https://www.vedomosti.ru/society/news/2020/12/17/851350-putin-otvetil-vopros-neobhodimosti-vaktsinatsii
        1. Dear sofa expert. 19 January 2021 22: 16
          0
          Putin probably doesn't know either

          Well, now, thanks to the sofa expert, you know more than Putin.

          You can tell this to your grandchildren later.
          1. Cyril Offline Cyril
            Cyril (Kirill) 20 January 2021 07: 48
            -1
            no, just a couch expert for that and couch, that his knowledge is so-so
            1. Dear sofa expert. 20 January 2021 09: 04
              +2
              no, just a couch expert for that and couch, that his knowledge is so-so

              That is, against the very fact I have provided:

              Russia has such capacities, and you have a beloved "border" behind you.
              For example, in Germany, a subsidiary of the Russian company "R-Pharm". This is R-Pharm Germany GmbH in the Bavarian city of Illertissen. It was purchased in 2014 from the German division of the American corporation Pfizer (the same one, by the way, which created the coronavirus vaccine together with BioNTech from Germany).

              At least yesterday she could have started mass production of the Russian "Sputnik", but there is still an unresolved legal issue:
              ... does a German pharmaceutical company have the right to produce drugs that are not registered in the European Union on the territory of the Federal Republic of Germany, even if they are only exported outside the EU?

              .. you, as I see, have no objections?

              And what, even your "wickepedia knowledge" did not help you to adequately argue?)
              1. Cyril Offline Cyril
                Cyril (Kirill) 20 January 2021 09: 10
                0
                That is, against the very fact I have provided

                Of course, there was no opposition to the fact that there is some kind of production site in Germany purchased by a Russian pharmaceutical company. I don't argue with facts.

                About the following your conjectures:

                1) that this production site is sufficient to cover the demand for the Sputnik vaccine, at least in Russia.

                2) that this production site will be obstructed.

                I also have nothing to argue - that's what they are speculation.
                1. Dear sofa expert. 20 January 2021 13: 22
                  0
                  About the following your conjectures:

                  1) that this production site is sufficient to cover the demand for the Sputnik vaccine, at least in Russia.

                  Judging by the information from the company itself about the volume of production, they can produce up to 4x billion conventional "pieces". (as I understand it - per year)
                  Naturally, we are talking about different names, but theoretically, if we switch all, or most of the production, to the manufacture of the Russian vaccine, then this number can already be somehow guided by.

                  https://r-pharm.de/Leistungen/Produktion

                  If this is speculation, then at least not my personal.

                  2) that this production site will be obstructed.

                  But this is just trying to solve:

                  The question arises, however, whether a German pharmaceutical company has the right to produce drugs not registered in the European Union on the territory of the Federal Republic of Germany, even if they are only exported outside the EU? However, in the same interview, Kirill Dmitriev said that RDIF had already submitted an application for approval of the Sputnik V vaccine to the European Medical Association (EMA).

                  https://www.google.de/amp/s/amp.dw.com/ru/kto-i-pochemu-mog-by-vypuskat-sputnik-v-v-germanii/a-55726694


                  Whether or not they can, time will tell.

                  But if we discuss this possibility in the context of this article, then most likely they will find an excuse not to allow it.
  8. Vladest Offline Vladest
    Vladest (Vladimir) 18 January 2021 18: 31
    -4
    Quote: Dmitry S.
    I didn't understand the question at all. About love

    I do not understand this endless mention of Ukraine in posts. But, I will clarify. The Russian Federation has done so much good for Ukraine that one cannot expect love from there.
    There are 200 states in the world. Maybe Estonia. Successful and thriving. We must equal the best)))
  9. pvs512 Offline pvs512
    pvs512 (Paul S.) 19 January 2021 09: 27
    0
    She's right, this British Ambassador to the United States is Karen Pearce. Since the "open society" has such politicians, let their population die at an accelerated pace, we are better off.
  10. pvs512 Offline pvs512
    pvs512 (Paul S.) 19 January 2021 09: 41
    +2
    I would not be surprised if the Moscow correspondent of The New York Times, Andrew Kramer, who experienced the effects of Sputnik on himself, will be jailed as a "Russian agent."
  11. Alexzn Offline Alexzn
    Alexzn (Alexander) 19 January 2021 22: 43
    -1
    Quote: Dear couch expert.
    Today, Russia is somewhere in the 13-15th place in terms of vaccination.

    And here's an interesting fact. A quarter of the population has already been vaccinated in Israel. Not the first place in the world, it would seem ... but here's another "record":
    Every day, the number of newly infected people in Israel is increasing by 10000 people a day! And this is with only 9 million population!

    Maybe the vaccine is "not very"?

    Please comment on this fact.

    Some 300 people were vaccinated, and only the first one was made in 000 million. The first does not give immunity, only after the second the number of antibodies increases 2,2-6 times. Let's talk in 20 weeks, when the number of infected is expected to drop.
    Our morbidity is very high, mortality is much lower.
    1. Dear sofa expert. 19 January 2021 23: 58
      0
      Our morbidity is very high, mortality is much lower.

      What are you?) Here is the latest data:

      Israel: 4044 deaths out of 558249 thousand cases = 7,24%
      Russia: 65059 deaths out of 3552888 cases = 1,83%
      1. The comment was deleted.
      2. Diver d Offline Diver d
        Diver d (Oleg) 25 January 2021 19: 08
        -2
        What are you?) Here is the latest data:

        Israel: 4044 deaths out of 558249 thousand cases = 7,24%
        Russia: 65059 deaths out of 3552888 cases = 1,83%

        Current statistics on coronavirus on 25.01.2021/XNUMX/XNUMX
        (Israel)
        Total infections 601
        Fatalities 4 437%
        Recovered 525 773%
        Now 70 859 11,8% are sick
        of them serious
        and critical cases 1 180
        Tests done 10 065 055
        information at 14:58 GMT

        Current statistics on coronavirus on 25.01.2021/XNUMX/XNUMX
        (Russia)
        Total infections 3 738 690
        Fatalities 69 918%
        Recovered 3 150%
        Now 518 009 13,9% are sick
        Tests done 99 700 000
        tests for 1 million 683 017
        information at 14:58 GMT

        https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/ Вот и вся ваша статистика, калькулятор в руки и в школу))) Кстати, по кол-ву тестов на 1 млн у Израиля в два раза выше, чем у России... Мне кажется, вам бы диван с ручника снять не помешало)))
        1. Oleg Kir Offline Oleg Kir
          Oleg Kir (Oleg) 25 January 2021 19: 38
          0
          Ha ha ha :))))) to tears :))) cool answer to an expert :))))))))))
    2. Dear sofa expert. 20 January 2021 00: 14
      0
      ... Some 300 people were vaccinated, and only the first one was made in 000 million. The first one does not give immunity

      It is not.
      BionTech guarantees immunity after the first vaccination - 52,4%, and 8 days after the second - full (more than 93%)

      https://www.aerzteblatt.de/nachrichten/119166/SARS-CoV-2-Impfstoff-von-Biontech-Pfizer-erzielt-schon-frueh-Schutzwirkung-FDA-hat-keine-Sicherheitsbedenken

      Well, if, of course, this promised immunity is generally there.
      Judging by your (Israeli) modest results - very doubtful.
      1. Cyril Offline Cyril
        Cyril (Kirill) 20 January 2021 09: 20
        0
        BionTech guarantees immunity already after the first vaccination - 52,4%, and 8 days after the second - complete (more than 93%)

        Lies. Here is what is written in the link you sent.

        The protective effect began within 10 days, that is, before the second dose of the vaccine. The FDA says the protective effect after the first dose is 52,4%. However, this number is associated with a wide 95% confidence interval from 29,5 to 68,4%. It is also the result of a retrospective analysis that is always associated with question marks. It is impossible to clarify whether a single dose may be sufficient, according to the FDA. The authorities should definitely recommend 2 doses of the vaccine.

        After the first dose, no one "guarantees" anything, as you are trying to imagine. 54% is the average number of vaccinated people who begin to develop a protective effect after the first dose. Moreover, this is an average figure, its real value can vary from 29 to 68%
        1. Dear sofa expert. 20 January 2021 11: 19
          0
          Lies. Here is what is written in the link you sent.

          What's the lie, then that the link about 8 days is worth nothing? Well, it's not scary. This data is in other sources, and does not affect the meaning of the information I submitted.
          The point was to show that the protective effect occurs already (52,4% on average) after the first vaccination, which AleX's colleague denied, and which you, in turn, confirmed by your rejection. The existing range from 29,5 to 68,4% does not contradict what I said, only indicates the difference in the effect of the vaccine by age group. This is logical.

          So what did you mean by that, then?)
          1. Cyril Offline Cyril
            Cyril (Kirill) 20 January 2021 11: 31
            -1
            What's the lie, then that the link about 8 days is worth nothing? Well, it's not scary. This data is in other sources, and does not affect the meaning of the information I submitted.

            It's a lie. what did you write:

            BionTech guarantees immunity after the first vaccination - 52,4%, and 8 days after the second - complete (more than 93%)

            There is nothing about guarantees in the link you specified.

            The point was to show that the protective effect occurs already (52,4% on average) after the first vaccination, which AleX's colleague denied,

            About 52,4% it is not clear exactly what is meant. Either the protective effect occurs in 52,4% of those vaccinated after the first dose, or immunity increases after it by 52,4%.

            But regardless of what was meant by "the protective effect occurs," no one (neither the FDA, nor the vaccine developers themselves) guarantees the formation of full-fledged immunity after 1 dose. And about this in the passage I quoted, it is written directly.
  12. Alexzn Offline Alexzn
    Alexzn (Alexander) 20 January 2021 09: 09
    +2
    Quote: Dear couch expert.
    ... Some 300 people were vaccinated, and only the first one was made in 000 million. The first one does not give immunity

    It is not.
    BionTech guarantees immunity after the first vaccination - 52,4%, and 8 days after the second - full (more than 93%)

    https://www.aerzteblatt.de/nachrichten/119166/SARS-CoV-2-Impfstoff-von-Biontech-Pfizer-erzielt-schon-frueh-Schutzwirkung-FDA-hat-keine-Sicherheitsbedenken

    Well, if, of course, this promised immunity is generally there.
    Judging by your (Israeli) modest results - very doubtful.

    The press loves to thoughtlessly use terms that have a specific meaning. The first vaccination guarantees the appearance of antibodies (their titers in the analysis). What is 52,4% immunity? It's like 2 times more beautiful. Those. the first vaccination triggers a mechanism on the basis of which, after 3 weeks, immunity is created by increasing the amount of antibodies by 6-20 times. There are no miraculous vaccines - injected and everyone is healthy. For a complete picture, let's wait a couple of months to notice the dynamics - a couple of weeks. Until recently, up to 17% of seriously ill patients were with the first vaccination, which is also understandable - most of those are over 70-80, it is foolish to think that after the injection they will become 16.
    According to information in the Russian media, Sputnik is living water, without side effects, with absolute efficiency and action forever. It doesn't work that way.
    1. Dear sofa expert. 20 January 2021 09: 43
      -1
      The press loves to thoughtlessly use terms with specific meanings.

      This is not the "press" - it is Ärzteblatt.
      Arzt is a doctor. Journal for doctors.

      What is 52,4% immunity? It's like 2 times more beautiful.

      This is approximately every second.

      For a complete picture, let's wait a couple of months to notice the dynamics - a couple of weeks.

      A good idea. You use it sometimes too, okay?)
      1. The comment was deleted.
      2. Alexzn Offline Alexzn
        Alexzn (Alexander) 20 January 2021 10: 08
        +3
        This is not the "press" - it is Ärzteblatt.
        Arzt is a doctor. Journal for doctors.

        Look for Weisse Deutsche Sprahe.
        The scientific press is also full of assumptions related to the format of articles, but they usually decipher either the content of the given values, or the calculation method (Cyril pointed out this).
        Nowadays, statistical medicine is used in the world, when a treatment protocol is developed on the basis of statistics. Israel is an ideal country for vaccination break-in - small, high level of medicine, computerization and statistics at a high level.
        Statistics can also be manipulated. Russia is trying to compare the side effects of Sputnik and BP ... BP made tens of millions, Sputnik less than 2x, BP made people over 60, Sputnik up to 60 - will such a comparison be correct. The first few million VRs were generally made for people over 80, and Sputnik started with ... military personnel.
        We are waiting for a large enough sample for a reasonable analysis.
        1. Cyril Offline Cyril
          Cyril (Kirill) 20 January 2021 10: 30
          +1
          We are waiting for a large enough sample for a reasonable analysis.

          Not only large, but also comparable in age and social groups
        2. Dear sofa expert. 20 January 2021 11: 22
          0
          Look for Weisse Deutsche Sprahe.
          The scientific press is also full of assumptions related to the format of articles, but they usually decipher either the content of the given values, or the calculation method (Cyril pointed out this).

          Cyril himself did not know what he wrote.)
          In fact, he confirmed what I said.

          We are waiting for a large enough sample for a reasonable analysis.

          Yes, we are waiting.
      3. Cyril Offline Cyril
        Cyril (Kirill) 20 January 2021 10: 11
        +1
        This is approximately every second.

        In general, it seems that you (and I am following you) are misinterpreting this data.

        Judging by the context of the article, 52% is not the number of people who developed immunity after the first dose, but literally the protective effect itself - that is, the number of antibodies against the virus increased by this percentage.
        1. Dear sofa expert. 20 January 2021 11: 27
          0
          ... Judging by the context of the article, 52% is not the number of people who developed immunity after the first dose, but literally the protective effect itself

          It is the percentage of people (with deviations by age group)
          On average, every second person acquires immunity. (A sufficient amount of antibodies produced)

          but literally the protective effect itself - that is, the number of antibodies against the virus increased by such a percentage.

          No, exactly the first is true.
          1. Cyril Offline Cyril
            Cyril (Kirill) 20 January 2021 11: 37
            +1
            I will not argue about this moment. I fully admit that I am interpreting it wrongly.

            But it doesn't really change the essence.
  13. Alexzn Offline Alexzn
    Alexzn (Alexander) 20 January 2021 09: 24
    +4
    Quote: Dear couch expert.
    Our morbidity is very high, mortality is much lower.

    What are you?) Here is the latest data:

    Israel: 4044 deaths out of 558249 thousand cases = 7,24%
    Russia: 65059 deaths out of 3552888 cases = 1,83%

    It's strange. 4 thousand from half a million is 0,7%, you put a comma in the wrong place ...
    Our lethality is 2 (!!!) times lower than yours. I'm not even talking about the fact that in Israel, 100-150 thousand checks are made per day, and the number of diagnoses is a function of the number of cases and tests performed.
    1. Dear sofa expert. 20 January 2021 09: 48
      +4
      It's strange. 4 thousand from half a million is 0,7%, you put a comma in the wrong place ...

      Yes, I admit a calculation error.
    2. Cyril Offline Cyril
      Cyril (Kirill) 20 January 2021 10: 04
      +1
      It's strange. 4 thousand from half a million is 0,7%, you put a comma in the wrong place ...

      How embarrassing it is for an Expert with mathematics to go oooo ... request
      1. Dear sofa expert. 20 January 2021 11: 29
        0
        How embarrassing it is for an Expert with mathematics to go oooo ...

        Unlike you, I can admit my mistakes.
        Concentrate better on being recognized by you, yours.
        1. Cyril Offline Cyril
          Cyril (Kirill) 20 January 2021 11: 34
          -1
          Unlike you, I can admit my mistakes.

          My mistakes, when they point out to me and prove that these are really my mistakes - I fully admit.

          The problem is that the vast majority of local provers have a problem with logic and work with information to prove my mistakes to me. One has problems with mathematics, another with the principles of evidence-based medicine, etc.
  14. Yurets Offline Yurets
    Yurets (Yuri) 20 January 2021 18: 55
    +1
    The vaccine will still make its way, and the main argument in this will be its effectiveness