Is a landing operation near Odessa possible without the cruiser Moskva?


From the very first days of the special military operation to demilitarize and denazify Ukraine, one of the highest priority targets for the RF Ministry of Defense was Odessa, a strategically important port city on the Black Sea coast. Judging by external preparations, it was supposed to carry out a landing operation, followed by the transfer of troops by land to help the Marines. Even one threat of a Russian landing near Odessa forced the Armed Forces of Ukraine to keep a significant grouping in the region for a blocking strike. Now, however, the very possibility of such an operation is being called into question.


Read more about why the Russian Defense Ministry is pulling with amphibious assault on the Black Sea coast of Ukraine, we reasoned previously. The main conclusion then was that the very method of landing from outdated BDKs by “sticking” them into the shore is deadly in the face of active opposition from the enemy. At the same time, it is known that the Armed Forces of Ukraine are armed with anti-ship missiles and long-range artillery, and also receive operational intelligence and target designation from the NATO bloc. At the same time, the ability to provide reliable anti-aircraft cover for the landing force by naval air defense forces raised certain questions. Not everyone liked our conclusions, but the reality turned out to be even less rosy.

Lit "Moscow"


March 24, 2022 in the port of Berdyansk there was an emergency immediately with several Russian large landing ships, which were unloading at that time. As a result of a strong fire and explosion of ammunition, the Saratov large landing ship was destroyed and lay on the bottom at the pier. Two more BDKs received less significant damage, were able to cope with the fire and retreated to the sea to a safe distance. What actually happened there - a Ukrainian missile attack, sabotage, or an emergency of a different kind, is still not known for certain, but the fact is that at least one large landing ship of the Russian Navy has been irretrievably lost.

The night before, another emergency occurred, which became a real tragedy for the Russian Navy. Most likely, the missile cruiser Moskva, the flagship of the Black Sea Fleet, was lost. Here is how this event was commented on by the Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation:

As a result of a fire, ammunition detonated on the Moskva missile cruiser. The ship was seriously damaged.

According to the fragments of information available in the public domain, it can be understood that the damage to the ship was so serious that the entire crew had to be evacuated. As usual, versions of what happened diverge. What the Ukrainian media write, we will not give - a lot of honor. What actually happened there, we do not know, therefore we will focus on the statements of our Ministry of Defense.

I would like to talk about an important practical aspect of both of these tragedies of the Russian Navy.

Airborne defense?


It should be noted that immediately after the start of a special military operation in Ukraine, Turkey closed its straits for the passage of warships. And despite the fact that officially there is no war between Moscow and Kiev. Consequently, no replenishment in the Black Sea can come to the Russian Navy. Further, on March 24, 2022, an emergency occurs in Berdyansk, as a result of which two Russian large landing ships are damaged, and the third is lost forever. And now, on the night of April 13-14, under unclear circumstances, the flagship of the Black Sea Fleet of the Russian Federation, the missile cruiser Moskva, dies. This, by the way, is one of the most powerful warships of the Russian Navy, created specifically as an “aircraft carrier killer” to fight against the AUG.

Of course, the question immediately arises, what exactly was he doing near the Ukrainian coast? It is not intended for strikes against ground targets, there are no Calibers on it. The main armament of the cruiser is heavy-duty anti-ship missiles, which cannot be easily reloaded. For the blockade of Odessa and containment of the remnants of the "mosquito fleet" of the Ukrainian Navy, this is clearly redundant. There remains an anti-aircraft cover, since the Moskva was equipped with several air defense systems at once, including the S-300 Fort. True, they are decently inferior in terms of performance characteristics to the more modern Redut.

To understand the overall picture, one should take into account the position of the NATO countries, which so far formally do not participate in the conflict with Russia. On April 3, 2022, British Prime Minister Boris Johnson called for assistance to Kiev with arms supplies so that Nezalezhnaya could keep Odessa:

We probably have the most mature relations of all countries with the Ukrainians. We have a list of what they need and we try to satisfy it to the best of our ability. The Prime Minister is determined to help Ukraine defend itself, and he will support meeting that need.

It was about Harpoon anti-ship missiles. A Times source in London commented on Kyiv's request for arms supplies as follows:

Boris says we don't need another trigger... Anything Zelensky asks for, he'll get if we have it.

Undoubtedly, the British were very offended by Moscow for their bombed base in Ochakovo. And two days ago, the Russian media became aware of the appearance of NATO specialists near Odessa:

In one of the suburbs of Odessa, there is a secret base of the NATO monitoring group with equipment that allows you to determine the exact coordinates of any ship in the Black Sea within a radius of up to 200 km. The main specialists are employees of the Romanian PMC Nordstarsupport Group.

What do we have in the dry residue? NATO categorically does not want to give Russia the Northern Black Sea region, since this will mean a guaranteed strategic defeat of Ukraine. Turkey has closed its straits for us. Numerous AWACS aircraft and reconnaissance drones of the United States and the North Atlantic Alliance are constantly circling over the Black Sea. Near Odessa, a group of NATO specialists appears, having equipment for issuing target designation data to the missiles of the Armed Forces of Ukraine. First, in broad daylight in Berdyansk, the Saratov BDK dies. Then at night something bad happens to the flagship of the Black Sea Fleet of the Russian Federation, which actually makes the Moskva cruiser incapable of combat for a long period of repair, and this is at best.

Is a landing operation near Odessa possible under such conditions? Hardly. Who benefits? Ukraine and the NATO bloc. And what really happened there tonight with the "Moscow", we do not know. In war, as in war, anything can happen. Accidents happen.

PS There is a proposal after the capture of Nikolaev to take away from Kyiv the same type of missile cruiser "Ukraine" as an indemnity instead of "Moscow", having previously repaired it there.
  • Author:
  • Photos used: Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation
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  1. Krapilin Offline Krapilin
    Krapilin (Victor) April 14 2022 11: 47
    +12
    Dear Sergey Marzhetsky!

    Odessa will be taken "from the shore" - by surrounding and pressing the ukrovermacht to the sea.
    And what about the landing operation "on Odessa" in principle?
    1. Marzhecki Online Marzhecki
      Marzhecki (Sergei) April 14 2022 11: 58
      -8
      Odessa will be taken "from the shore" - by surrounding and pressing the ukrovermacht to the sea.
      And what about the landing operation "on Odessa" in principle?

      H once again convinced of your insanity. You are simply not able to understand the meaning of what is written, you do not distinguish between the meanings "to Odessa and" near Odessa ", which is displayed directly in the title. request

      Is a landing operation near Odessa possible without the cruiser Moskva?

      Please don't waste my time by forcing me to write a response to every comment like this. I am a very busy person and my time is worth money.
      1. AndreyVCh Offline AndreyVCh
        AndreyVCh (Andrei) April 14 2022 14: 18
        +4
        It is clear that this was a test of attentiveness, but there is not much difference whether it is to Odessa or near Odessa, the same dispute: to Ukraine or to Ukraine. The landing operation on Odessa or near Odessa was not planned. The cruiser "Moskva" guarded Snake Island - a strategically important territory, and they will guard it, only by other means. What happened in Berdyansk, this probably refers to a military secret, it’s not for you and me to talk about it. You can not answer me, otherwise you will lose money, I don’t want to let you around the world. Yes, and do not insult people, the comrade did not write anything insane to you, he simply expressed his opinion.
        1. Krapilin Offline Krapilin
          Krapilin (Victor) April 14 2022 15: 08
          +1
          Dear AndreyVCh (Andrey)!

          Thank you!

          Yes, you are right - what is "on", what is "under", what is "in" is exactly the same.
          From the point of view of "landing from the sea to the coast" in the designated area of ​​\uXNUMXb\uXNUMXbresponsibility for the operation itself.

          At one time, the landing operation planned by Admiral Kolchak for the spring of 1917 by the forces of the division to provide a springboard for the further landing of the main forces and the subsequent capture of the Black Sea straits was officially announced as the "landing operation ON the Bosphorus."
        2. Marzhecki Online Marzhecki
          Marzhecki (Sergei) April 15 2022 07: 03
          -3
          You can not answer me, otherwise you will lose money, I don’t want to let you around the world. Yes, and do not insult people, the comrade did not write anything insane to you, he simply expressed his opinion.

          This Vitya has been bothering me for a long time with his numerous inadequate comments. Under each article there are a dozen or one and a half comments, each of which contains some kind of inadequacy. I am forced to either ignore it, allowing the comments to become trash, or respond to each one, wasting my time that could have gone to work or school.
          You fit in where you don't know. And I did not insult him, but asked him to stop doing this.

          It is clear that this was a test of attentiveness, but there is not much difference whether it is to Odessa or near Odessa, the same dispute: to Ukraine or to Ukraine.

          The difference Under or On Odessa is fundamental. TO or TO Ukraine is a completely different thing.
          It's not about inattention, but about inadequacy of judgment and biased attitude towards me. Read what this person scribbles in the comments, then start judging me. I answered quite politely, by the way.
      2. NNikolaich Offline NNikolaich
        NNikolaich (NNikolaich) April 15 2022 01: 47
        +3
        Quote: Marzhetsky
        I am a very busy person and my time is worth money.

        lol
        1. Marzhecki Online Marzhecki
          Marzhecki (Sergei) April 15 2022 07: 16
          -4
          And what exactly made you laugh? The fact that other people are doing business without having a minute of free time? It also happens.
      3. Alexander Ponamarev (Alexander Ponamarev) April 15 2022 03: 40
        +2
        That's exactly what you work for money
        1. Marzhecki Online Marzhecki
          Marzhecki (Sergei) April 15 2022 07: 02
          -3
          Do you work for free? I do my job well.
          1. Serg serg Offline Serg serg
            Serg serg (Serge Serg) April 15 2022 08: 35
            +3
            Don't get distracted already. Look how much money you lost.

            who could go to work or school.
      4. Solomon Offline Solomon
        Solomon (alexey salomon) 14 June 2022 14: 32
        0
        Marzhetsky, aircraft carriers are needed near Odessa! Pieces 10-15! Very, very atomic. the most atomic of atomic! Why didn't you write about them?
    2. Kade_t Offline Kade_t
      Kade_t (Igor) April 14 2022 12: 56
      +1
      Quite right, and when pressed ashore, let them blow themselves up on their mines.
  2. Krapilin Offline Krapilin
    Krapilin (Victor) April 14 2022 11: 54
    +3
    It should be noted that immediately after the start of a special military operation in Ukraine, Turkey closed its straits for the passage of warships.

    Dear Sergey Marzhetsky!

    For accuracy, you would need to clarify that this applies primarily to NATO countries and other countries of the "non-Black Sea region."
    Ships of the Black Sea Fleet of the Russian Federation can easily pass through the straits if, for example, they return from the Mediterranean Sea to their "basing points" ...
    And who is more "unlucky" from this closure?
    1. The comment was deleted.
      1. Krapilin Offline Krapilin
        Krapilin (Victor) April 14 2022 12: 16
        -2
        Dear Alexey Davydov (Alexey)!

        If the author talks about the loss of the ship, then what does the closure of the straits by Turkey have to do with it?
        1. Alexey Davydov Offline Alexey Davydov
          Alexey Davydov (Alexey) April 14 2022 14: 03
          +3
          Dear Victor
          And despite the fact that the loss of one of the ships (the flagship), which has a base on the Black Sea, accordingly reduces our grouping there. Due to the closure of the Bosporus for ships not based on the Black Sea, there is no possibility of replenishing this group with such ships. Accordingly, now all the losses of the Black Sea Fleet will reduce the size of this grouping.
          Such is the connection
          1. Krapilin Offline Krapilin
            Krapilin (Victor) April 14 2022 15: 21
            -1
            Dear Alexey Davydov (Alexey)!

            The absence of NATO ships in the Black Sea as a "method of closing the straits by Turkey" for them - in the short term makes the Russian Federation in the Black Sea "the only owner on it" with the available forces of the Black Sea Fleet.

            The issue of replenishment is possible with the release of Nikolaev and the launch / revival of shipyards there.

            Yes, the loss of the flagship of the Black Sea Fleet is a disaster. But not being critical today.
            Especially if he stayed afloat.
            1. Alexey Davydov Offline Alexey Davydov
              Alexey Davydov (Alexey) April 14 2022 15: 38
              +2
              The absence of NATO ships in the Black Sea as a "method of closing the straits by Turkey" for them - in the short term makes the Russian Federation in the Black Sea "the only owner on it" with the available forces of the Black Sea Fleet

              It would be funny if Turkey closed the straits for itself. Then, no one bothers her to open them immediately before the arrival of the AUG of any accessory
              1. Krapilin Offline Krapilin
                Krapilin (Victor) April 14 2022 16: 14
                0
                Dear Alexey Davydov (Alexey)!

                And where does the laughter and whose?

                There is a convention ratified by Turkey in this regard.

                If she skips "AUG of any affiliation" - then the convention "automatically terminates", because the straits become a "passage yard" for everyone. And then Turkey becomes a target for Russia "with the center" of making such a decision in Ankara.

                Who will have fun from this - Turkey?
                1. Alexey Davydov Offline Alexey Davydov
                  Alexey Davydov (Alexey) April 14 2022 18: 17
                  +2
                  Of the 10 signatory countries, 9 will be eager to miss. Turkey will not be a target for Russia, because it will have many other targets, and Turkey is the most useless of them.
                  It takes a cool head to fight our enemy
                  1. Krapilin Offline Krapilin
                    Krapilin (Victor) April 14 2022 20: 47
                    0
                    Dear Alexey Davydov (Alexey)!

                    To ask or not to ask is already variability.
                    And not about passing, about revising the convention: replacing it with another one with different wording.
                    This time. And not fast.

                    But the straits, in any case, are "under the Turks" - and they will have to answer if they unilaterally violate the convention. So the Turks must have a cool head.

                    The issue of targets, yes, there is a place to be. But this does not mean at all that the whole world-with-ukrovermacht.
            2. calagin407 Offline calagin407
              calagin407 (Mechanic) April 15 2022 11: 36
              +1
              Unfortunately, it's already gone...
  3. gorenina91 Offline gorenina91
    gorenina91 (Irina) April 14 2022 11: 58
    +7
    And what really happened there tonight with the "Moscow", we do not know. In war, as in war, anything can happen. Accidents happen.

    - What happened there is not so important !!! - Let the investigating authorities deal with it!!!
    - But the fact that it is high time for the commander of the Black Sea Fleet of the Russian Federation to tear out the admiral's shoulder straps "with meat" and demote to sailors - without any "pension" - this really needs to be done !!!
    - Damn, the High Forces are coming - and the Black Sea Fleet of the Russian Federation is losing in a month - warships one after another - only indirectly taking part in the military operation !!! - With such an admiral - soon Russia will have no warships at the Black Sea Fleet of the Russian Federation !!!
  4. Bakht Offline Bakht
    Bakht (Bakhtiyar) April 14 2022 11: 58
    +3
    And what is the probability of success of a landing operation with UDC?
    The cruiser Moscow, for sure, did not stand near the shore. Removal of 30-40 miles still leaves any ship in the zone of destruction of coastal complexes.
    I agree that the presence of such a large ship at sea was redundant. Especially, next to the enemy shore. But it is clear that the loss of one (!) large ship immediately casts doubt on the conduct of any landing operations.
    1. Marzhecki Online Marzhecki
      Marzhecki (Sergei) April 14 2022 12: 06
      +3
      And what is the probability of success of a landing operation with UDC?

      It's not about UDC. It is safer to land troops with UDC than with BDK, which would be shot at the coast.
      The "Moskva" had an outdated radar and air defense system. Loved two missiles on board.
      This is what I wrote about many times: our ships are suicide bombers against aviation and a massive missile strike. Set up at least hundreds of frigates, destroyers, cruisers and corvettes, they will be swept away in 2-3 calls by AUG aviation. "Moscow" had only 2 missiles. 2 Carl!
      It would be possible to avoid, for example, circling in the air in shifts a Ka-31 helicopter or an AWACS aircraft. They would timely detect fired missiles and give target designation to the ship's air defense system. And we need carrier-based aircraft to preemptively extinguish the enemy's DBK.
      But these obvious things are denied and scolded by aggressive sectarians. As a result - minus the BDK and the missile cruiser, the flagship of the fleet. With which we all and "congratulations."
      1. Bakht Offline Bakht
        Bakht (Bakhtiyar) April 14 2022 12: 30
        0
        Sometimes one missile is enough to destroy a ship. And it might not even explode.
        For the closed Black Sea, carrier-based aviation is not needed. Like an aircraft carrier. And "over-the-horizon landing with UDC" involves a ship approaching 30 miles to the enemy coast. And for coastal complexes it no longer matters whether it is an aircraft carrier or a large landing ship.
        Remember my very first thesis? "Capital ships are a thing in themselves. The loss of even one is unacceptable for any state." Suppose it would be on the Black Sea UDC with a displacement of 20 (or 40) thousand tons. Are you sure that at night he could repel a masked missile attack?
        You are right on only one point. Finding the flagship near the enemy coast is difficult to explain. So "congratulations" should be sent to the command of the Fleet for self-confidence and neglect of the enemy. Even if there was an aircraft carrier, it would also be destroyed.
        1. Marzhecki Online Marzhecki
          Marzhecki (Sergei) April 14 2022 12: 43
          0
          Suppose it would be on the Black Sea UDC with a displacement of 20 (or 40) thousand tons. Are you sure that at night he could repel a masked missile attack?

          You know, it's not about visual visibility, after all. smile And in a modern radar and air defense system. UDC or TAVKR is an excellent platform for basing AWACS helicopters that can work in shifts.

          And "over-the-horizon landing with UDC" involves a ship approaching 30 miles to the enemy coast. And for coastal complexes it no longer matters whether it is an aircraft carrier or a large landing ship.

          An AWACS aircraft or helicopter will be the first to see the DBK, and at the same time the missile fired by it. Carrier-based aircraft can easily destroy the DBK before firing.
          Okay, I'm tired of arguing with you. In the end, you will see for yourself. that i'm right.
          1. Bakht Offline Bakht
            Bakht (Bakhtiyar) April 14 2022 13: 09
            +1
            Helicopter at night? Probably possible. As well as launching an aircraft from an aircraft carrier at night.
            As long as I see that I'm right. Despite the absolute superiority at sea and in the air, there is no landing operation. And the loss of a large ship calls into question the very idea of ​​​​a landing operation. Which is what you put in the title.
            1. Marzhecki Online Marzhecki
              Marzhecki (Sergei) April 14 2022 13: 32
              0
              Helicopter at night? Probably possible. As well as launching an aircraft from an aircraft carrier at night.
              As long as I see that I'm right. Despite the absolute superiority at sea and in the air, there is no landing operation. And the loss of a large ship calls into question the very idea of ​​​​a landing operation. Which is what you put in the title.

              You are drawing the wrong conclusion. Why a landing operation is impossible, I explained already in the second article in a row.

              Helicopter at night? Probably possible. As well as launching an aircraft from an aircraft carrier at night.

              Not probably, but definitely. We do not have carrier-based AWACS aircraft, but we do have Ka-31 (Ka-35). There are also attack helicopters that could demolish the DBK from the shore.
              I already wrote that if only "Admiral Kuznetsov" had participated in the operation, everything could have gone a little differently. Why is he "nothing", but even this would be useful and there would be no such national disgrace.
              1. Scylla Offline Scylla
                Scylla (Faina Kostina(Avzalova)) April 14 2022 14: 07
                +2
                That's for sure, about the national disgrace! Losing a flagship should be worth big star epaulettes, and nothing else, if you also take into account previous losses of the fleet. And do not argue, this is not a sea battle on a piece of paper in a box. It is clear that this is the work of Nato, and they outplayed us.
  5. Krapilin Offline Krapilin
    Krapilin (Victor) April 14 2022 12: 22
    -1
    There is a proposal after the capture of Nikolaev to take the same type of missile cruiser "Ukraine" from Kyiv as an indemnity instead of "Moscow", having previously repaired it there.

    Dear Sergey Marzhetsky!

    Indemnity is the payments of the defeated state in favor of the state that won "in their mutual" war.
    And here is the "same type cruiser" ?!
    This is first...

    Secondly, the war between Russia and Ukraine has not been officially declared.
    And what about contributions at all?

    You have something with terminology and "understanding it" - problems ...
  6. Krapilin Offline Krapilin
    Krapilin (Victor) April 14 2022 12: 27
    -4
    What do we have in the dry residue? NATO categorically does not want to give Russia the Northern Black Sea region, since this will mean a guaranteed strategic defeat of Ukraine.

    Dear Sergey Marzhetsky!

    There are no NATO troops in the Northern Black Sea region.
  7. Sergey Latyshev Offline Sergey Latyshev
    Sergey Latyshev (Serge) April 14 2022 12: 32
    0
    In general, everything is attracted.
    There is no landing yet, Moscow is no more - different things, united only in denial.
  8. Krapilin Offline Krapilin
    Krapilin (Victor) April 14 2022 12: 41
    -1
    Judging by external preparations, it was supposed to carry out a landing operation, followed by the transfer of troops by land to help the Marines.

    Dear Sergey Marzhetsky!

    And in what way - point by point and specifically - were the "external preparations" manifested for the operation plan you described?
  9. Oleg_5 Offline Oleg_5
    Oleg_5 (Oleg) April 14 2022 12: 45
    -2
    Another stretching of the owl on the globe...
  10. Kade_t Offline Kade_t
    Kade_t (Igor) April 14 2022 13: 04
    +1
    Ukraine has ground-based anti-ship missiles "NEPTUN", it is known what the launch range is, not a single ship of the Navy should be in the affected area, if it was a missile, then it is not clear how we set ourselves up like that?
  11. The comment was deleted.
  12. 1_2 Offline 1_2
    1_2 (Ducks are flying) April 14 2022 13: 09
    0
    it has always been surprising why the designers placed the anti-ship missiles on the deck and on the sides, it is enough to swim up at night on a rubber motorboat to give a burst from a machine gun and the missiles will detonate

    about Odessa - they’ll rather be surrounded like Marik and driven to the sea so that Bandera doesn’t have the opportunity to retreat to the north
  13. Cucumbers Offline Cucumbers
    Cucumbers (Cucumbers) April 14 2022 13: 28
    +1
    For some reason, the version of sabotage by the crew is not considered. A certain ukromoryak wormed his way into the team and set fire to the ammunition. Maybe there were several. 500 crew, many don't know each other. It is impossible to exclude the fact that someone, against the background of the SVO, did not inflame with hatred for the Russian Federation
  14. Marzhecki Online Marzhecki
    Marzhecki (Sergei) April 14 2022 13: 33
    -1
    Quote: Cucumbers
    For some reason, the version of sabotage by the crew is not considered. A certain ukromoryak wormed his way into the team and set fire to the ammunition.

    Ukrainian kamikaze?
    1. 1_2 Offline 1_2
      1_2 (Ducks are flying) April 14 2022 15: 41
      0
      no saboteur, set fire to or blew up anti-ship missiles and dumped him overboard, where he was taken at night by a mini submarine or motorboat
  15. dub0vitsky Offline dub0vitsky
    dub0vitsky (Victor) April 14 2022 15: 02
    +2
    Go for mines off the coast? Bump into a mined beach? Substitute under artillery fire, and, already Harpoons, our small and limping fleet, risk landing, hardly, having the ability to support it from the sea? It seems to me that the landing in this case is just a gamble. Block the coast of Ukraine (still Ukraine), driving away any foreigner trying to get there ..... And fled from there .... And at a distance sufficient for the inaccessibility of ukrofascist missiles.
  16. dub0vitsky Offline dub0vitsky
    dub0vitsky (Victor) April 14 2022 15: 10
    +1
    Quote: 1_2
    it has always been surprising why the designers placed the anti-ship missiles on the deck and on the sides, it is enough to swim up at night on a rubber motorboat to give a burst from a machine gun and the missiles will detonate

    about Odessa - they’ll rather be surrounded like Marik and driven to the sea so that Bandera doesn’t have the opportunity to retreat to the north

    The booby of the King of Heaven. And then the warriors do not know and do not know how to deal with it. Boxes of this class do not go alone. He is accompanied by a smaller pack, and, of course, given the capabilities of not only boats. how many underwater predators. Find and see how the squadron is going. accompanying aircraft carrier. Protection from all sides by ships of a lower rank. The protection of these guards by ships of even lower rank. At least two submarines, one is nuclear, the main one, the second is the same, with a lower rank, the main guard. She tries to disguise the main one with her noises. Until the whole order is built, and each unit takes its place, no one goes anywhere. Of course, a missile cruiser is not so significant, but the order, once established, is indestructible for centuries and in any country.
    1. 1_2 Offline 1_2
      1_2 (Ducks are flying) April 14 2022 15: 38
      0
      the warriors know, but they didn’t tell you that the Russian ship is not accompanied like a US aircraft carrier, there is nothing to accompany (it must be admitted) and if it is not far from the coast, it can easily be destroyed, including by saboteurs, it’s easy to do at night in a storm - no visibility
  17. dub0vitsky Offline dub0vitsky
    dub0vitsky (Victor) April 14 2022 18: 03
    +1
    Quote: 1_2
    the warriors know, but they didn’t tell you boobies that the Russian ship is not accompanied as a US aircraft carrier, there is nothing to accompany (it must be admitted) and if it is not far from the coast, it can easily be destroyed, including by saboteurs, at night in a storm it’s easy to do - no visibility

    Accompany. And they guard both on the roadstead and at the pier. Berk. In a combat campaign, any ship is considered an enemy by default. And measures are being taken to determine and identify it.
  18. Valera75 Offline Valera75
    Valera75 (Valery) April 14 2022 19: 01
    +4
    Quote: gorenina91
    - What happened there is not so important !!! - Let the investigating authorities deal with it!!!
    - But the fact that it is high time for the commander of the Black Sea Fleet of the Russian Federation to tear out the admiral's shoulder straps "with meat" and demote to sailors - without any "pension" - this really needs to be done !!!
    - Damn, the High Forces are coming - and the Black Sea Fleet of the Russian Federation is losing in a month - warships one after another - only indirectly taking part in the military operation !!! - With such an admiral - soon Russia will have no warships at the Black Sea Fleet of the Russian Federation !!!

    For the first time, I completely agree with you. Nothing to add, plus your message.
  19. asr55 Offline asr55
    asr55 (asr) April 14 2022 22: 06
    0
    When unloading ammunition from the BDK Saratov, the ammunition detonated due to a T / B violation.
    1. Marzhecki Online Marzhecki
      Marzhecki (Sergei) April 15 2022 07: 07
      -2
      Prove your claim.
  20. asr55 Offline asr55
    asr55 (asr) April 14 2022 22: 11
    0
    Quote: Marzhetsky
    Odessa will be taken "from the shore" - by surrounding and pressing the ukrovermacht to the sea.
    And what about the landing operation "on Odessa" in principle?

    H once again convinced of your insanity. You are simply not able to understand the meaning of what is written, you do not distinguish between the meanings "to Odessa and" near Odessa ", which is displayed directly in the title. request

    Is a landing operation near Odessa possible without the cruiser Moskva?

    Please don't waste my time by forcing me to write a response to every comment like this. I am a very busy person and my time is worth money.

    Well, bullshit! He sits tapping his clave and calls himself a busy man.
    1. Marzhecki Online Marzhecki
      Marzhecki (Sergei) April 15 2022 07: 06
      -1
      And what exactly is nonsense? And yes, I am indeed a very busy person. smile
  21. Pavel57 Offline Pavel57
    Pavel57 (Paul) April 14 2022 23: 25
    0
    PS There is a proposal after the capture of Nikolaev to take away from Kyiv the same type of missile cruiser "Ukraine" as an indemnity instead of "Moscow", having previously repaired it there.

    With the old complex and air defense architecture, and the main armament, it is hardly needed now.

    P.S. If there was a threat of an attack by Neptunes / Harpoons, and air defense was not able to shoot them down, then setting up a cruiser was criminal negligence.
  22. cooper Offline cooper
    cooper (Alexander) April 15 2022 04: 12
    0
    That's it, the "Moscow" sank ... The answer / retaliation simply has to be terrifying for the Ukrainian Reich and his Western friends.
    1. Bulanov Offline Bulanov
      Bulanov (Vladimir) April 15 2022 08: 35
      0
      In one of the suburbs of Odessa, there is a secret base of the NATO monitoring group with equipment,

      Base - a la Ochakov ??? And not afraid?
  23. Yuri Bryanskiy Offline Yuri Bryanskiy
    Yuri Bryanskiy (Yuri Bryansky) April 15 2022 05: 10
    0
    Well done. I consider Nikolaev and Odessa the number 1 goal. These are Russian cities.
  24. consultant Offline consultant
    consultant (Vladimir) April 15 2022 08: 34
    0
    Quote: Marzhetsky
    This Vitya has been bothering me for a long time with his numerous inadequate comments.

    The comments are just adequate, there are no articles to a greater extent, alas.
  25. hlp5118 Offline hlp5118
    hlp5118 (hlp) April 15 2022 08: 52
    0
    Everything was and is possible, only we apparently don’t have commanders, and without them, Moscow or Beijing makes no difference.
  26. Maikl Bomber Offline Maikl Bomber
    Maikl Bomber (Michael Bomber) April 15 2022 08: 53
    +1
    It seems that one outdated ship decides the outcome of the war in Odessa. Odessa is not Mariupol or Donbass, where Ukraine has concentrated 2/3 of its military forces and created a powerful defense in 5-7 years. NATO, the US and Ukraine did not think that Putin would strike all over Ukraine. Today, nothing remains of the vaunted Nazi-Bandera-European-American army of Ukraine. The rest in the cities of Ukraine will themselves surrender or be destroyed. The same will happen in Odessa. (there is an underground). Therefore, the word to take Odessa is loudly said.
  27. Yuri Vishnevetsky-Koribut April 15 2022 09: 26
    0
    There are many other options for taking Odessa. For starters, use the start strategy spec. operations (it was effective). Destroy the NATO target designation point along with the specialists. Eliminate satellites of "unfriendly" countries. Knead the strongholds, without regard to the possible loss of residents (they are the Nazis' reserve). The capture of the airport and the consolidation of the landing force with the pumping up of military equipment by transport aircraft. Further landing, at least by motor ships. Take immediately in ticks from the airport and the sea.
  28. borisvt Offline borisvt
    borisvt (boris) April 15 2022 11: 25
    0
    Timely article, thanks to the author!
    Judging by the rumors from Sevastopol, they still hit Moscow with a rocket. It is symbolic that Kyiv is mockingly, in fact, and promised in response to the threat of our Defense Ministry to beat on the capital of Ukraine.
    Hmm.
  29. Assault Offline Assault
    Assault (Assault) April 15 2022 11: 28
    0
    It may be possible, but it may not be possible, although no, it is more possible than impossible, although under certain circumstances it is possible that it is impossible.
  30. Assault Offline Assault
    Assault (Assault) April 15 2022 11: 30
    0
    Wed like crows on wires and guess: strategists
  31. Vladislav Labinsky (Vlad. Grumpy) April 15 2022 17: 49
    0
    "pick up the missile cruiser" he rusted during this time. To bring it to the condition it will come out in a round sum
  32. Vladislav Labinsky (Vlad. Grumpy) April 15 2022 17: 51
    0
    Quote from Assault
    It may be possible, but it may not be possible, although no, it is more possible than impossible, although under certain circumstances it is possible that it is impossible.

    It's like fortune-telling on a camomile: "loves not to love"?
  33. stitch Offline stitch
    stitch (Steven Seagal) April 16 2022 15: 47
    0
    Former Ukrainians serve in the Navy, among them there are quite a few potential saboteurs. Worst of all, if the air defense overslept a strike from a drone. After denazification, former Ukrainians should not be allowed into any serious enterprise. It will be more expensive for yourself.
  34. Yuriy88 Offline Yuriy88
    Yuriy88 (Yuri) April 16 2022 20: 46
    0
    can i make it simple? Our Navy has always been weak (unless something worked out in the 18th, 19th century) and has never been particularly successful. not that there are some combat tasks to perform on it! How many of them have already burned and sunk in all our fleets!? .. And you can’t count them! Therefore, feet on dry land! What a landing, nothing really!).. And it doesn’t even matter what exactly happened to Moscow .. criminal bungling, sabotage or a missile attack! What to hide if everything is according to the rules and there is no shameful failure ..?! So there is..
  35. Vladimir1155 Offline Vladimir1155
    Vladimir1155 (Vladimir) April 22 2022 10: 19
    0
    it is obvious that Marzheretsky is not versed in naval matters, the very concept of attack surface cruisers "aircraft carrier killers" is vicious and deceitful from the very beginning, these are not aircraft carrier killers, because no one would ever let them into the AUG, and the killer of aircraft carriers is nuclear submarines. All these tales about cruisers are invented to justify to the leadership of the country the very vicious idea of ​​building large surface warships that Gorshkov needs for show-off. They are also not capable of supporting the landing, because they are too large, and do not correspond to specific tasks with weapons. For this, EMs were built, firstly, too large, and secondly, there are no more of them in the Navy, now support can be provided by RTOs and corvettes frigates. The death of Saratov showed that the BDKs are too big, the target is too noticeable, the losses in case of death are too great (all BDKs have long become weapons transports), so the landing can be carried out by Chamois and Dugongs with the support of the IPC RTOs and minesweepers, all this can be transferred from the Baltic, and the North and the Caspian bypassing the straits through the Volgobalt Volgodon Belomorbalt
  36. Vladimir1155 Offline Vladimir1155
    Vladimir1155 (Vladimir) 16 May 2022 18: 45
    -1
    it is obvious that if the entire Russian Navy is not combat-ready, then the Black Sea Fleet is also, we have 5 minesweepers for 7 seas, but we need 70-100, what kind of landing? what are you talking about, if obsolete Ukrainian mines have become an insurmountable obstacle, we have parquet admirals = caretakers dragged the entire fleet to their feeders, there are ships but there is no fleet, .. nowhere, ..... almost all ships are in closed seas, where the enemy has an arsenal of coastal anti-ship missiles with 100 percent of the defeat of Russian ships anywhere in the sea, even flawed Ukrainian missiles hit four large ships in the Black Sea Fleet, ...... why is that? it’s just that the admiral wants to have a couple of stars, and if, according to the mind, then a caprice or, at best, a rear admiral (taking into account coastal means) should command the marine part in the closed sea, only minesweepers and MPK RTOs are needed there, because all ships of the first second rank should cover ours SSBNs, that is, to be in the North and Kamchatka ... but then there will be only four vice admiral posts in the entire Navy, in the north and Kamchatka ... for parquet admirals spitting on the Navy, on the Navy, on Russia, for the sake of personal gain, spitting on the personnel that they made suicide bombers, it is horror for them to lose so many feeders ......