Could the old Il-38 of the Naval Aviation of the Russian Navy track down an American submarine


Recent incident in the Pacific Ocean with an American submarine that penetrated 4 kilometers deep into Russian territorial waters, made a lot of noise. It can be assumed that the nuclear submarine deliberately allowed itself to be discovered in order to demonstrate the unpreparedness of the Pacific Fleet of the Russian Federation to counter the underwater threat. What conclusions do we need to draw?


The situation looks extremely unsightly. Judging by the statements of representatives of our defense department, the Marshal Shaposhnikov frigate was forced to chase a submarine for 3 hours, which, if desired, could easily leave Russian territorial waters in less than a quarter of an hour. In this case, we are talking about only one foreign submarine, an American professional "hunter" for other Virginia-class submarines. With a high degree of probability, it can be assumed that other submarines, for example, the latest Japanese diesel-electric submarines, could operate in the area at the same time. If this is true, then the Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation either chose not to politicize this issue without extreme need against the backdrop of the “Kuril problem”, or other submarines simply were not found.

And this is the worst option for us. Who and how was really able to detect the American nuclear submarine?

For example, it could be a diesel-electric submarine of project 636.3 Varshavyanka, which is part of the Pacific Fleet of the Russian Federation. After the discovery, the coordinates of the nuclear submarine were transferred to the frigate Marshal Shaposhnikov, which chased the Virginia for several hours. However, important clarifications soon appeared. A well-informed source in the naval sphere told TASS on this occasion the following:

An American Virginia-class boat was discovered by Il-38 aircraft of naval aviation and one of the Pacific Fleet boats during exercises to search for and destroy mock enemy submarines in areas of their possible deployment.

The Il-38 anti-submarine aircraft appeared in the case. Perhaps he is the main character of that day?

To answer this question, it is necessary to take into account the current state of the anti-submarine aviation of the Russian Navy, which is represented exclusively by a few old Soviet-made aircraft. These are the medium-range anti-submarine Il-38 and the long-range Tu-142.

The Il-38 was developed on the basis of the Il-18V passenger liner for maritime reconnaissance, search and destruction of enemy submarines, search and rescue operations, and installation of minefields. Its anti-submarine equipment consists of an APM-60 or APM-73 magnetometer, a Berkut-38 search and targeting system, RSL-1 omnidirectional radar buoys, RSL-2 passive directional buoys, as well as RSL-3 and RSL autonomous passive-active sonar stations. -sixteen. Strike weapons are represented by AT-16 and AT-1 anti-submarine torpedoes or APR-2 and APR-1 missiles, anti-submarine bombs, sea mines, and potentially Kh-2 anti-ship missiles. The significant disadvantages of the IL-35 include the lack of defensive small arms and cannon weapons, as well as an optical or television bomb sight. Because of this, the dropping of bombs and mines has to be done almost by eye.

The situation was changed for the better by the integration of the new Novella-P-38 search and sighting system, which increased the ability to search and detect potential enemy submarines by 4 times compared to the base Il-38. High-resolution radar, thermal television, radio-hydroacoustic and magnetometric systems, as well as an electronic intelligence system that are part of Novella, allow the modernized Il-38N to detect and conduct not only underwater, but also surface and air targets at a distance of 320 and 90 kilometers , respectively, with a total number of up to 50.

In other words, the modernized Il-38N could indeed track the low-noise Virginia-class nuclear submarine with the help of sonar buoys, if such a combat mission was set before it. But in the message of an “informed source” there is an Il-38 with outdated anti-submarine equipment. Could he actually catch a "sub hunter"? Not a fact, alas. But why, then, was an obsolete aircraft sent to search for the intruder?

The problem lies in the shortage of these aircraft. As of 2018, the Naval Aviation of the Russian Navy consisted of 15 Il-38 and 7 Il-38N, in total, as well as 10 long-range Tu-142MR and 12 Tu-142MK/MZ. Is this enough for the needs of the Russian Navy? Of course not. According to the plans of the Ministry of Defense, by 2025 it was supposed to upgrade to the level of Il-38N up to 30 Il-38. Another problem, in addition to the acute shortage, is the age of the aircraft themselves. Modernization allows you to extend their resource, but it is impossible to do this indefinitely.

The platform needs to be replaced. For example, the Il-114-300 civilian liner, whose production has now been resumed, can be used as a base for a medium-range anti-submarine aircraft. A long-range aircraft for the Russian Navy can be made based on the Tu-204/214 liner.

Aviation is one of the most formidable opponents of submarines. As long as it is weak with us, the submarines of a potential enemy will calmly roam, violating Russian borders.
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  1. Sergey Latyshev Offline Sergey Latyshev
    Sergey Latyshev (Serge) 17 February 2022 13: 58
    -1
    So at VO a similar analysis was like the day before yesterday.
    And IL ... well, he is not lucky, like MIG ...
    1. Alemax Offline Alemax
      Alemax (Ivan) 18 February 2022 04: 23
      -2
      Yes, it's the same article, just edited. All-throwers are indignant.
      I discovered myself and everything.
      1. 2534 Offline 2534
        2534 19 February 2022 15: 10
        0
        Quote from Alex
        I discovered myself and everything.

        no
        INTENTIONALLY came out to be discovered

        Quote from Alex
        All-throwers are indignant.

        Of course, I understand that hamsters have sofas on fire, but this is a PROFESSIONAL assessment
        1. Shaman Offline Shaman
          Shaman (Shaman) 20 February 2022 16: 59
          -2
          Not hamsters, but adequate sober-minded people, unlike you,
        2. Alemax Offline Alemax
          Alemax (Ivan) 25 February 2022 07: 10
          0
          INTENTIONALLY came out to be discovered

          Yeah .. Where there. PROFESSIONAL assessment...
    2. Boris Chernikov Offline Boris Chernikov
      Boris Chernikov (Boris Chern) 18 February 2022 09: 41
      -3
      From the duet of Klimov and Timokhin? This is not an analysis, this is an attempt to show that they did not screw up by posting tons of articles about how bad everything is
      1. 2534 Offline 2534
        2534 19 February 2022 15: 11
        0
        Quote: Boris Chernikov
        From the duet of Klimov and Timokhin? This is not an analysis, this is an attempt to show that they did not screw up by posting tons of articles about how bad everything is

        Boryusik, as always you screwed up
        Here there is, incl. links to docs
        https://topwar.ru/188071-robkaja-nadezhda-est-li-buduschee-u-otechestvennoj-morskoj-aviacii.html
        yes, about the fact that with our MA a specific such ass is the place to be
  2. sH, arK Offline sH, arK
    sH, arK 17 February 2022 14: 18
    +6
    IL-18 is the most convenient platform for PLO. And to invent nonsense that "once they discovered it means they succumbed" - not from a great mind! After all, they found it in territorial waters! So, they could attack! Who in their right mind would take such a risk? It’s easier to let yourself be discovered or just float up in neutral then, on the border with territorial waters! The substrate in foreign waters is always at great risk!
    1. gunnerminer Offline gunnerminer
      gunnerminer (gunner miner) 17 February 2022 18: 42
      -11
      Capitalized "I don't want it at all" Il-38 engines do not pull out modes. It takes about 30 minutes to warm up. The Berkut PPS, which was located as part of the aircraft equipment, was developed based on many scientific achievements of the 50s and 60s of the last century. Already the first years of operation of the IL-38 showed its low efficiency. The reason for this was the underdevelopment of the search and sighting complex. According to the specialists of the 33rd PPI of Naval Aviation, the Il-38 was an order of magnitude (8-10 times) less effective in the search for submarines than its American counterpart, the Orion patrol aircraft.

      https://warbook.club/voennaya-tehnika/samolety/il-38
      1. Mark Offline Mark
        Mark (Mark) 18 February 2022 20: 08
        0
        But that was in the USSR in the 70s
        1. gunnerminer Offline gunnerminer
          gunnerminer (gunner miner) 18 February 2022 22: 04
          -7
          Now it has gotten even worse. Engines cannot be capitalized indefinitely. Yes, and the plane with the fuselage is not eternal. It's time to make new buoys, they are still the same, from the beginning of the 60s.
    2. 2534 Offline 2534
      2534 19 February 2022 15: 12
      +1
      Quote: sH, arK
      So, they could attack!

      good question - WHAT
      taking into account the long overdue NSS APR-2 and UMGT-1
  3. The comment was deleted.
  4. Marzhecki Offline Marzhecki
    Marzhecki (Sergei) 17 February 2022 17: 03
    -4
    Quote: sH, arK
    IL-18 is the most convenient platform for PLO.

    Il-18 is a passenger aircraft for long-haul airlines, made according to the scheme of a four-engine turboprop low-wing aircraft with a single-fin tail. One of the first Soviet turboprop liners. Mass-produced from 1958 to 1978 at the plant number 30 ("Banner of Labor"), located near the Central Airfield on the Khodynka field in Moscow. In total, 719 (according to other sources - more than 850) aircraft were built, including 564 passenger ones (1957-1969), the rest - special ones (for example, ice reconnaissance or meteorological laboratories) and military ones (including Il-38) were built to the end 1970s.

    After all, they found it in territorial waters! So, they could attack! Who in their right mind would take such a risk?

    Well, of course. Attack. yes
    We have been afraid to attack Ukraine for 8 years, we are afraid to recognize the LDNR. Attacking US Navy nuclear submarines is a bullshit question. This is from a very big mind. yes
    1. sH, arK Offline sH, arK
      sH, arK 17 February 2022 18: 58
      +1
      Well, you are not from a great mind, for sure, excuse me! There is a nuance - a submariner - he is like a spy, his strength is in stealth! In peacetime, the boat leaving the database, the same SSBN, and I'm talking about those still years when Tagged was at the helm, and then EBN (duck), when the SSBN went out with an unloaded task to the RGCHIN (in principle, this is half an hour, if it is in the bus cassette) - even then, if surveillance was detected, the SSBN made one attempt to evade, if it failed, it is obliged to attack! There is no "peacetime" for a submariner even in the ocean! And in coastal waters - everything is generally at the "mercy" of their owner! And most importantly - you never know what happened! As with Kursk - they sank it, they paid 10 billion for it, but officially we will never know!
      Therefore, a submariner will never take the risk of unmasking in foreign territorial waters - this is COMPLETE NON-FUCK! And yes, our boat was released, they did not attack ... but in vain ... We had to do it quietly and be silent! Our teachings are not our problems!
      1. Marzhecki Offline Marzhecki
        Marzhecki (Sergei) 17 February 2022 19: 44
        -3
        And yes, our boat was released, they did not attack ... but in vain ... We had to do it quietly and be silent! Our teachings are not our problems!

        I marvel at human inconsistency. smile But that's your opinion, you're entitled to it.
        1. sH, arK Offline sH, arK
          sH, arK 18 February 2022 19: 19
          -2
          You apparently forgot or you were never interested in the constant problems of the 80s, when the Swedes looked for our submarines every month in their territorial waters! They organized exercises, bombed ... But no one saw the result.
          We still do not know for sure what happened to Thresher and Scorpion or Kursk ... And here you can also add the disappeared diesel submarines. This is the nuance of service on a submarine / nuclear submarine - she is not so much a soldier as a special forces intelligence officer, she does not have "world time", she is almost always at war.
          Therefore, there is nothing illegal in attacking submarines in their own territorial waters! If the boat did not surface, as our boats did during the Cuban Missile Crisis, it can be attacked! This is not NK ... There will be no one to complain to ...
          1. gunnerminer Offline gunnerminer
            gunnerminer (gunner miner) 18 February 2022 22: 14
            -7
            Therefore, there is nothing illegal in attacking submarines in their own territorial waters! If the boat did not surface, as our boats did during the Caribbean Crisis, it can be attacked

            Nobody dares. The British destroyer Defender openly violated the border. And nothing, just made some noise in pursuit.

            You apparently forgot or you were never interested in the constant problems of the 80s, when the Swedes looked for our submarines every month in their territorial waters! They organized exercises, bombed ... But no one saw the result.

            The laughing stock of S-363 will last for a hundred years. Swedish Komsomolets. Baltic sea world. One Varshavyanka in Len Naval Base. And it doesn't load.
            1. sH, arK Offline sH, arK
              sH, arK 19 February 2022 10: 04
              -1
              Dear, Defender is NK, he passed competently, hitting the protrusion of territorial waters without changing course, he was visible and clear what he was doing in territorial waters, and NK, in such cases, is driven away only in bulk. And then, there was more than enough warning, he got out of them after walking 4 miles along them. And he did not allow the "second" time.
              Even the bad Ukrainians, your brothers, insolently perverted, while also in the area of ​​\uXNUMXb\uXNUMXba specially protected object, they didn’t even drown! I had to catch it like rats and lock it in a box ... I don’t know, then they took the payment for parking your pelvis or even forgave you ... But I repeat, everything can be done ONCE! The second - the risk will be completely different!
              1. gunnerminer Offline gunnerminer
                gunnerminer (gunner miner) 19 February 2022 11: 03
                -6
                There will be violations of Russian tervods. Now in the Arctic. From what happened in the Black Sea, and near the Kuriles, NATO, like the Japanese, drew very specific conclusions.

                At a round table in the Federation Council, Stanislav Gadzhimagomedov, Deputy Chief of the Main Operational Directorate of the General Staff, stated that Russia simply does not have enough ships and aircraft to resist the Americans in the Far East.

                https://nvo.ng.ru/realty/2022-02-17/1_1177_answer.html
                1. sH, arK Offline sH, arK
                  sH, arK 19 February 2022 12: 04
                  -2
                  Will. And always have been. All countries with terr.vody. What's new in this?
                  But do not confuse violations and provocations. So you, suckers, didn’t just go into violations - after all, when, on your scows, climbed into the Kerch Strait? This is a provocation bordering on a military operation! And this is completely different. And gives quite different moral rights. Until they were used. Well, the key word here is "yet" ...
                  1. gunnerminer Offline gunnerminer
                    gunnerminer (gunner miner) 19 February 2022 13: 36
                    -6
                    They will. Obligatory. They use the provision that I spoke about at the round table in the Federation Council, this is a very popular verb from Gorbachev's time. Deputy Chief of the Main Operational Directorate of the General Staff Stanislav Gadzhimagomedov. It was a gesture of desperation. Six months ago, he would have received a serious penalty for such a statement.
                  2. 2534 Offline 2534
                    2534 19 February 2022 15: 17
                    +2
                    Quote: sH, arK
                    Here you are, fools

                    LOL YOU are here lol
          2. 2534 Offline 2534
            2534 19 February 2022 15: 16
            +2
            Quote: sH, arK
            she has no "world time", she is almost always at war.
            Therefore, there is nothing illegal in attacking submarines in their own territorial waters! If the boat did not surface, as our boats did during the Cuban Missile Crisis, it can be attacked! This is not NK ... There will be no one to complain to ...

            YOU would read at least something on the topic before BOSH to smack
            for example, the Procedure for the use of weapons and military equipment in the protection of the State Border of the Russian Federation in the underwater environment - Decree of the Government of the Russian Federation of November 29.11.1999, 1310 No. 11.03.2015 (as amended on March XNUMX, XNUMX)
            1. sH, arK Offline sH, arK
              sH, arK 19 February 2022 16: 14
              -3
              Another "Cossack-submariner" from the steppes of Durkaina, commander of the Zhoparizhye submarine;))) The phrase "no peacetime" refers to the SSBNs on the database. But you can see the understanding of the Russian language is already insufficient?
              About the use of weapons in their territorial waters: "if the boat did not surface", i.e. did not comply with the order of the KPUG, then she, the KPUG, has the right to use weapons! And what will another lokhol tell me about this? Can't do this? Or has this creature already forgotten how to read and understand what they read?! Or can result excerpts from regulations?
              1. 2534 Offline 2534
                2534 20 February 2022 16: 45
                +2
                Quote: sH, arK
                Another

                you wrong
                I am not Aibolit, so with these "convulsions of thought" - according to affiliation lol
      2. gunnerminer Offline gunnerminer
        gunnerminer (gunner miner) 17 February 2022 20: 14
        -12
        Fairy tales must be written in moderation.
      3. 2534 Offline 2534
        2534 19 February 2022 15: 14
        +2
        Quote: sH, arK
        if it is in the bus cassette

        and not in cassette
        and not a bus ("Omnibus")
        so that ...

        Quote: sH, arK
        SSBNs, in case of detection of surveillance, made one attempt to evade, if it failed, they must attack! There is no "peacetime" for a submariner, even in the ocean

        uuuuuuuuuuu
        however, what fly agaric you have ...
  5. Alexander Klevtsov (alexander klevtsov) 17 February 2022 17: 42
    -2
    Storytellers, the Americans mocked for more than three hours as they wanted, but it was weak to sink, they banged Kursk, I forgot the pancake, they don’t live in Russia, they don’t keep the stolen money, there’s no one to give the order to, traitors all around ...
    1. gunnerminer Offline gunnerminer
      gunnerminer (gunner miner) 17 February 2022 18: 35
      -10
      The US Navy has nothing to do with the death of the K-141.
      1. Alemax Offline Alemax
        Alemax (Ivan) 18 February 2022 04: 27
        -2
        You will now be strongly minused for the lack of patriotism and secret cohesion.
        1. gunnerminer Offline gunnerminer
          gunnerminer (gunner miner) 18 February 2022 12: 47
          -5
          If these disadvantages help to equip the KSF with a rescue vessel with GVK-450, I will only be happy. SS with GVK-450 was promised 20 years ago. KSF submariners can hope, if suddenly something, only on the icons in the CPU. And the maritime solidarity of Norwegian and Scottish colleagues. Like way back in 2000.
          1. 2534 Offline 2534
            2534 19 February 2022 15: 18
            +2
            Quote: gunnerminer
            will help to equip the KSF with a rescue vessel with GVK-450, I will only be happy. SS with GVK-450 was promised 20 years ago.

            he is like a stoplight hare
            1. gunnerminer Offline gunnerminer
              gunnerminer (gunner miner) 19 February 2022 17: 07
              -5
              If anything, the Norwegians will help. By neighborly. Like green grapes.
      2. 2534 Offline 2534
        2534 19 February 2022 15: 18
        +1
        Quote: gunnerminer
        The US Navy has nothing to do with the death of the K-141.

        maybe ....
        HZ
        1. gunnerminer Offline gunnerminer
          gunnerminer (gunner miner) 19 February 2022 17: 09
          -5
          No one dared to provide evidence. Former KKSF Admiral of the Fleet Popov tried to express something on his birthday last year. That's all.
          1. 2534 Offline 2534
            2534 20 February 2022 16: 42
            0
            Quote: gunnerminer
            Nobody dared

            someone took the risk
            1. gunnerminer Offline gunnerminer
              gunnerminer (gunner miner) 20 February 2022 18: 28
              -4
              The retired admiral then lied along with the Civil Code of the Navy, achieved nothing. And now no one even perceives it.
  6. gunnerminer Offline gunnerminer
    gunnerminer (gunner miner) 17 February 2022 18: 35
    -11
    IL-38 has no chance of detecting modern nuclear boats and diesel boats. Especially South Korean and Japanese. PPS Berkut works without failures for an hour and a half, at most. Il-38N has a chance of detecting the above submarines at close ranges, approximately 10-20 miles.
  7. wichera65 Offline wichera65
    wichera65 (Vladimir Baranlv) 17 February 2022 18: 39
    +4
    And our submarines "roam" off their shores, so they are weaklings too?
    1. gunnerminer Offline gunnerminer
      gunnerminer (gunner miner) 17 February 2022 20: 16
      -10
      Our boats are almost gone. Especially at KTOF. Their crews can barely provide a yearly combat training plan. They roamed about 30 years ago.
  8. Marzhecki Offline Marzhecki
    Marzhecki (Sergei) 17 February 2022 18: 50
    -5
    Quote: wichera65
    And our submarines "roam" off their shores, so they are weaklings too?

    So far only you have drooled hi
    Nobody praises amers. This is a very strong enemy, objectively stronger than us, together with the Japanese and NATO - even more so. The main thing is not to engage in capping. And we are constantly doing this, with hypersound and other prodigies.
    So the Americans poked us. Who needs it, got the hint.
    1. Troy Henry Offline Troy Henry
      Troy Henry (Henry) 18 February 2022 10: 25
      -1
      "who needs", who is this? all-weapons?
      thank God there are not many of them, like, by the way, hat throwers, but basically everyone soberly assesses the surrounding reality, so that your decaying seeds rot in the soil without giving alarmist results
      you are trying in vain, replicating libels))
      1. Marzhecki Offline Marzhecki
        Marzhecki (Sergei) 18 February 2022 10: 27
        0
        your decaying seeds rot in the soil without alarming results
        you are trying in vain, replicating libels))

        Ah, well, okay then. Sleep well.
  9. wamp Offline wamp
    wamp 17 February 2022 21: 58
    +1
    Quote: Marzhetsky
    So the Americans poked us. Who needs it, got the hint.

    You are often upside down.
    The fact that the boat was found is not at all surprising. They constantly climb on all the teachings or actions.
    In my opinion, they were waiting for her, quietly discovered and then carefully pulled up the ships: they say we are studying here ourselves, we don’t see anything. And when they got to the "contact", then they turned on the hydroacoustic station and further along the text of the message ....
    The fact that there was a panic on the boat is a fact of a released imitator, which will definitely be found and gutted, clearly identifying the manufacturer.
    Do not forget that the boat was lured into the ter-waters and disobedience to the ascent command is punishable by destruction.
    1. Marzhecki Offline Marzhecki
      Marzhecki (Sergei) 18 February 2022 07: 37
      -1
      In my opinion, they were waiting for her, quietly discovered and then carefully pulled up the ships: they say we are studying here ourselves, we don’t see anything. And when they got to the "contact", then they turned on the hydroacoustic station and further along the text of the message ....
      The fact that there was a panic on the boat is a fact of a released imitator, which will definitely be found and gutted, clearly identifying the manufacturer.
      Do not forget that the boat was lured into the ter-waters and disobedience to the ascent command is punishable by destruction

      Very interesting version smile
      1. 2534 Offline 2534
        2534 19 February 2022 15: 20
        +2
        Quote: Marzhetsky
        Very interesting version

        campaign with a hookah she was "pushed" lol
    2. gunnerminer Offline gunnerminer
      gunnerminer (gunner miner) 18 February 2022 12: 50
      -4
      There was no point in waiting quietly. They would thwart the plan of a long-prepared exercise. For this, the Civil Code of the Navy and the NGSH would not have stroked the head.
      They lure pre-conscripts with a cool smartphone. Submariners are forced.

      disobedience to the ascent command is punishable by destruction.

      Try to give examples of this.
      1. wamp Offline wamp
        wamp 18 February 2022 13: 21
        0
        Quote: gunnerminer
        Try to give examples of this.

        These ... were the first to be caught in the waters.

        Because they didn't:

        United Nations Convention on the Law of the Sea (UNCLOS)

        Article 20 Submarines and other underwater vehicles

        In the territorial sea, submarines and other underwater vehicles must navigate on the surface and raise their flag.

        They not identified themselves as a warship and not fall under:

        Article 30 Non-compliance by warships with the laws and regulations of a coastal State

        If any warship does not comply with the laws and regulations of the coastal state regarding passage through the territorial sea and ignores any requirement that they be complied with, the coastal state may require it to leave the territorial sea immediately.

        and become illegal... negative
        The behavior of an unknown object poses a threat.... am
        1. gunnerminer Offline gunnerminer
          gunnerminer (gunner miner) 18 February 2022 15: 45
          -4
          You did not give an example of the destruction of the destruction of a foreign boat in tervods. One case is known when the crew of a submarine was forced to surface by throwing grenades. It happened in 1966 off the Norwegian coast. The boat was French. But this is not destruction.
          1. wamp Offline wamp
            wamp 18 February 2022 16: 18
            0
            Quote: gunnerminer
            You didn't bring

            I don't have such information.

            Quote: gunnerminer
            One case is known when the crew of a submarine was forced to surface by throwing grenades.
            ...
            But this is not destruction.

            She complied with the requirement to surface and display the flag - therefore she fell under Articles 20 and 30 ... (at that time there were other but similar laws).

            In the current case, this was not the case (the situation is outlawed) and could be qualified as: an unknown object, in ter-waters, posing a threat ...
            1. gunnerminer Offline gunnerminer
              gunnerminer (gunner miner) 18 February 2022 16: 28
              -4
              In the current case, this was not the case and could be qualified as: an unknown object, in ter-waters, posing a threat ...

              It's not the hardest thing to qualify. It is much more difficult to prevent this. The Civil Code of the Russian Navy does not have the strength and operational capabilities to prevent such actions of foreign fleets.
              Such are the circumstances and catastrophes that blow away the smoke of eyewash. They show not advertising and forum, but the actual state of affairs. Only recently, the crew of the British destroyer Defender in the same way (violation of the state border) checked their service in the Black Sea. And revealed many shortcomings. And not the willingness of the Russian media.
              1. wamp Offline wamp
                wamp 18 February 2022 16: 31
                0
                Quote: gunnerminer
                It is much more difficult to prevent this.

                Liability comes only after the fact of violation.
                Or you, for the prevention of banditry, have already been put in a cell for years ....

                Quote: gunnerminer
                recently the crew of the British destroyer Defender in the same way (violation of the state border) checked the service in the Black Sea

                They kicked him out, at first they politely offered him under Article 30, but then ....

                Quote: gunnerminer
                And revealed many shortcomings. And not the willingness of the Russian media.

                More specifically..
                And how is the media?
                1. gunnerminer Offline gunnerminer
                  gunnerminer (gunner miner) 18 February 2022 17: 51
                  -3
                  Liability comes only after the fact of violation.

                  With our fleet and aviation, such actions cannot be prevented. Military personnel are not traffic policemen. The fleet and the Aerospace Forces, together with the air defense, did not fall apart to be in the chamber.

                  The crew of the Defender was not kicked out. He completed the task, and left with impunity. Even a journalist from the Air Force was on board. And our media trailed behind the events. The provocation of the Defender crew showed that they were in vain reducing the Intelligence Directorate of the KChF to the level of a stunted department. That project 22160 was useless. That the organization of decision-making on the attack of the violator of the border is unsatisfactory. That the aviation of the KChF cannot quickly respond to the threat. That the performance characteristics of the Defender correspond to those previously stated. That FAB-250, stated in the reports, was not actually used. Numerous videos show that there is no FAB under the wings of the Su-24M. The media dissembled that there were bombs. On the surface of the sea, no traces of FAB explosions are visible. They are visible in calm for about 20 minutes. The commander of the KChF, knowing about the low speed characteristics of the Project 22160 PC, did not lift the Ka-52 or Mi-28N helicopters into the air.
                  British sailors mock our border guards, knowing for sure that they (the border guards) cannot do anything to them. “The next one will be along the cabin” - this is from a Soviet film, but this is not about them.
                  A good analysis of the actions of the Defender crew was made by blogger Andrey Kostrov in July 2021. With illustrations. Read, be enlightened.

                  https://zen.yandex.ru/media/id/60367d7d80fd9857bd0d5b39/pravo-na-vystrel-kak-i-dlia-chego-streliali-v-defender-60eb1d470f1e1b2a8cddad11

                  In a short time the third incident. The next one will probably happen in the North.
  10. Pishenkov Offline Pishenkov
    Pishenkov (Alexey) 17 February 2022 22: 58
    -1
    Yes, everything is correct with airplanes. Not enough, although they were never enough in a good way.
    I just want to note that in addition to submarines and aircraft, surface ships also have a sufficient set of tools for detecting submarines. It seems that the BOD also took part in the exercises there. Yes, and this Virginia is far from invisible. So our standard means is normally caught. But even on it the crew is not the only cadets - they also stand still until they are bombed ... So I had to chase. So, in principle, normal work is everything, it’s just that now, against the backdrop of all the aggravation, they talk about it like that. And it has happened before.
    1. gunnerminer Offline gunnerminer
      gunnerminer (gunner miner) 18 February 2022 13: 00
      -3
      It's not just the planes that are missing. There are a couple of test pages with a cursory listing of what is missing. The most important thing is missing - trained personnel and anti-submarine officers. 20 years of continuous organizational events have deprived the Navy and KTOF, in particular, of a huge number of senior command staff, as well as experienced operational staff of headquarters and command posts. The PLO department was reduced several times. The crew of the frigate Shaposhnikov had just emerged from the mess of a lengthy repair. Crews of corvettes had recently arrived from another naval theater. Commanders, senior assistants, watch officers and navigators did not really master the local navigation conditions, weather conditions, and hydrological features. They need five years of continuous, most intensive anti-submarine training in order to detect such rafted crews as on American, Japanese, South Korean boats. Who constantly train at sea, on the latest coastal simulators, with all types of aviation support. And not on museum crafts made semi-legally by rare craftsmen.

      And it has happened before.

      And what happened before? For instance?
      1. Pishenkov Offline Pishenkov
        Pishenkov (Alexey) 22 February 2022 23: 28
        -1
        I didn’t come in for a while, but look at it - the smart guy showed up again .... wink
        What happened before - yes, these submarines were also driven in Soviet times, in the Pacific Fleet and in the north. Only so much has not been written about it. And I already told you - well, don’t poke your nose at what you don’t understand a damn thing with your "smart" comments. Although I praise - you are correcting yourself little by little, the language is more normal, at least, corresponding to the level of your marinism laughing otherwise, with these abbreviations a la pros, it looked very stupid ...
        1. gunnerminer Offline gunnerminer
          gunnerminer (gunner miner) 23 February 2022 01: 16
          -5
          So much has not been written about it.

          When there are no real cases, connect the PR department! You have nothing to write to my question. Prepare carefully. Start by studying the history of the Soviet Navy. You are here much more often, and longer than you are trying to tell.
          1. Pishenkov Offline Pishenkov
            Pishenkov (Alexey) 23 February 2022 21: 32
            0
            Prepare carefully

            - so for sure, comrade of the guards newborn, I will definitely prepare. laughing laughing laughing May I go get ready? tongue
            In the meantime, you can enjoy your own greatness and storm waves while lowering your toilet bowl ... closer, you probably haven’t seen the waves and their wild elements? laughing
            1. gunnerminer Offline gunnerminer
              gunnerminer (gunner miner) 23 February 2022 22: 07
              -2
              And this is all on the topic of the post?
              1. Pishenkov Offline Pishenkov
                Pishenkov (Alexey) 24 February 2022 22: 44
                0
                ...do you think you deserve more? Alas...
                Yes, and "post" for this senseless rigmarole is too loud a name. You clearly have delusions of grandeur. Pay attention to this. Dangerous call... belay
                1. gunnerminer Offline gunnerminer
                  gunnerminer (gunner miner) 24 February 2022 22: 46
                  -3
                  On the subject of the post you have nothing. Neither about NATO, nor about Russian. Emptiness.
  11. 1_2 Offline 1_2
    1_2 (Ducks are flying) 17 February 2022 23: 21
    -1
    detects not an aircraft, detects buoys that are dropped from an aircraft
    1. gunnerminer Offline gunnerminer
      gunnerminer (gunner miner) 18 February 2022 13: 01
      -4
      And the operators on board the PLA aircraft drink tea. laughing
  12. Moscow Offline Moscow
    Moscow 18 February 2022 02: 38
    -1
    Found out - well done. Even from binoculars, even from a monocle. About the giveaway from the submarine is ridiculous.
    1. gunnerminer Offline gunnerminer
      gunnerminer (gunner miner) 18 February 2022 13: 03
      -3
      Submariners discovered the KPUG much earlier. The crew of the boat could maneuver to separate more seaward, the boat was at the time of detection from the outside. Read carefully the statement of the Russian Ministry of Defense.
  13. Marzhecki Offline Marzhecki
    Marzhecki (Sergei) 18 February 2022 08: 18
    +1
    Quote: 1_2
    detects not an aircraft, detects buoys that are dropped from an aircraft

    Truth? And I thought that they were just looking out the window belay
  14. Troy Henry Offline Troy Henry
    Troy Henry (Henry) 18 February 2022 10: 20
    -4
    Marzhetsky, as always, is on a roll, in which he succeeded in passing off his delusional conclusions as a professional assessment and supposedly complete awareness of issues in which he is superficially oriented, and sometimes even zero - so, he picked up from Wikipedia))
    1. Marzhecki Offline Marzhecki
      Marzhecki (Sergei) 18 February 2022 10: 30
      +1
      pass off his crazy conclusions as a professional assessment and supposedly complete awareness of issues in which he is superficially oriented, and sometimes even zero - so, I picked it up from Wikipedia))

      By the way, I never built a military expert out of myself. I am a professional journalist, trained to work with large volumes of any information and write on any topic, including military. To do this, I study this information from many specialized sources, periodically consult with military acquaintances, analyze and draw some conclusions. hi
      If you do not agree with my conclusions, no one forbids you to try to refute them with arguments. If you can.
      So far, I see pathetic babble that does not agree, because he does not like the conclusions, but he cannot say anything about the case.
    2. gunnerminer Offline gunnerminer
      gunnerminer (gunner miner) 18 February 2022 13: 04
      -4
      Take the risk to speak on the topic of the post.
  15. Cat Offline Cat
    Cat (Sergei) 18 February 2022 10: 27
    -1
    So the MS-21 300 has already been certified. https://dfnc.ru/aviazcia/irkut-poluchil-sertifikat-tipa-na-samolet-ms-21-300/ What prevents the systematic replacement of the IL-38 from starting? According to Valery Okulov, adviser to the UAC General Director, in 2021 it is planned to build six MS-21-300s at IAP, 2022 in 12, and 2023 aircraft in 25. From 2025, it is planned to enter the production of 72 cars per year.
    1. Marzhecki Offline Marzhecki
      Marzhecki (Sergei) 18 February 2022 11: 31
      -2
      IL-38 - medium radius, Tu-142 - long-range.
      MS-21 to replace Tu-142. But the best solution is the Tu-214 produced in small batches in the same class as the MS-21.
      For IL-38, the replacement is IL-114-300. There are such plans.
      1. Cat Offline Cat
        Cat (Sergei) 18 February 2022 12: 21
        -1
        Well I do not know. the whole world somehow manages with one type of R-8. Already more than two hundred fly. So we need it, otherwise we want both, but there is neither one nor the other. But Tu-214 is said to be difficult to remake, cutouts are needed for weapons bays more than 6 m long. Therefore, it is necessary to immediately build the PLO fuselage. In addition, there are a lot of imported parts there .... and on the MS-21 everything is already ours, even the wing. And at the expense of the IL-114, there are American UAVs that have analogues of it, which I fly for days where I need to. And we already have such UAVs, as it were. One thing is clear, the current government needs this naval aviation like a hare stop signal. Whoever wants to do something finds a means, who does not want to find a reason!
        1. gunnerminer Offline gunnerminer
          gunnerminer (gunner miner) 18 February 2022 13: 05
          -3
          As if. They said exactly. No more. And there are no modern avionics, anti-aircraft weapons.
        2. Marzhecki Offline Marzhecki
          Marzhecki (Sergei) 18 February 2022 14: 01
          0
          But Tu-214 is said to be difficult to remake, cutouts are needed for weapons bays more than 6 m long. Therefore, it is necessary to immediately build the PLO fuselage. In addition, there are a lot of imported parts there .... and on the MS-21 everything is already ours, even the wing.

          Everything is exactly the opposite. This MS-21 is critically dependent on imported components, and the Tu-204 was designed back in the USSR. The entire base of components on it was originally domestic.
        3. 2534 Offline 2534
          2534 19 February 2022 15: 24
          +3
          Quote: Cat
          And they say Tu-214 is difficult to remake

          not difficult
          1. Cat Offline Cat
            Cat (Sergei) 19 February 2022 18: 55
            0
            And then where are THEY Tu-214 PLO? sad
            1. gunnerminer Offline gunnerminer
              gunnerminer (gunner miner) 19 February 2022 20: 51
              -5
              Tu-214 PLO is like a chicken's egg, which is not yet in the nest.
  16. Sergey Offline Sergey
    Sergey (Sergey Berezin) 19 February 2022 03: 34
    -3
    Bullshit. They let themselves be discovered, they are not suicides. And we have no problems with the Kuriles, it is Japan that has them. They will not get anything, like the demoniac Ukraine, our Crimea.
  17. The comment was deleted.
  18. Marzhecki Offline Marzhecki
    Marzhecki (Sergei) 20 February 2022 07: 41
    +2
    Quote: Cat
    And then where are THEY Tu-214 PLO? sad

    This is a question for the competent departments. What are they even thinking about.
  19. saturator Offline saturator
    saturator 20 February 2022 10: 24
    -1
    From the analysis of the posts of a citizen gunnerminer follows:
    1. Russian is not his native language
    2. The main message of his messages is the technical backwardness of the RF Armed Forces. Wants to hear reasoned objections.
    And the Cossack, like, sent, sent ..
    1. gunnerminer Offline gunnerminer
      gunnerminer (gunner miner) 20 February 2022 10: 35
      -1
      You have no such reasoned objections. You show no interest in the life of your country, in the history and present days of the Russian Armed Forces.
  20. dunce123 Offline dunce123
    dunce123 (Charlie) 22 February 2022 11: 18
    0
    hire Tajiks and they will wind the chain-link on the propellers of the "American Submarine" .... give a link to the Mossad ....