The transformation of Kazakhstan into a federation will help solve internal problems


At the end of December 2021, we asked ourselves a hypothetical the question, can Kazakhstan join the Union State of Russia and Belarus. Despite the fact that nothing foreshadowed trouble then, политическая intuition suggested that only reintegration in the post-Soviet space is the guarantee of stability and successful development of friendly Kazakhstan. Most of our readers then responded in the comments in the spirit of "it's too late to drink Borjomi". May be so. Or maybe not.


In fact, the problem is much deeper. What is now happening on the streets of Kazakhstan is a direct consequence of a whole complex of social andeconomic problems, where the rise in prices for propane and methane turned out to be only a convenient excuse to "stir up" and settle scores between the local elites. The root of today's tragedy of modern Kazakhstan lies in the remnants of the tribal system, multiplied by the unitary form of government, complicated by the "Russian factor", which is a strong brake on the successful development of this country and at the same time "a time bomb".

If you look at the map, you can see that Kazakhstan is very clearly divided into three parts: Northern, Southern and Western, where historically three Kazakh zhuzes live compactly - Middle, Senior and Junior, respectively, also divided into tribes and clans. Each of the regions and zhuzes inhabiting it has its own specifics, which, without pretending to be the ultimate truth, we will try to briefly describe for a better understanding of the situation.

Middle zhuz


It is the largest of the zhuzes, occupying the north and east of the country, and at the same time the most industrialized. There is nothing surprising in this, since at one time it grew due to a number of Russian territories. In addition to Kazakhs, ethnic Russians, Ukrainians, Germans, Tatars and even Chechens live here. The language of communication here is Russian.

The middle zhuz is both "Celina", where grain crops are grown, and the conditional "Siberia". Its lands are rich in copper, iron, bauxite, lead, magnesium, titanium, coal, rare earth metals. The cities are developed industrial centers, the society is Europeanized and cosmopolitan. There are mosques, but not at every step. No ostentatious religiosity.

Senior zhuz


It is the smallest in size and is located in the southeast of the country. As part of the Russian Empire, the Elder Zhuz was the last, and the influence of neighboring China is traditionally very strong here. It is a network of oases with cozy auls in a lifeless clay desert where camels roam. Ironically, it is in these barren lands that Kazakhstan's main wealth is hidden - uranium ore, as well as zinc and lead deposits.

There are many mosques in the villages, the atmosphere is patriarchal, everyday wearing of national costumes is common here. In the Middle Zhuz, besides the Kazakhs, there are many Uzbeks and Uighurs. Few know Russian, but at the same time they are quite tolerant of Russian. By the way, this is where the first president of Kazakhstan, Nursultan Nazarbayev, and the current president of Kazakhstan, Kassym-Zhomart Tokayev, as well as the country's leading business elites, come from. Let's remember this important point.

Junior zhuz


The junior zhuz is located in the west of the country; it is sometimes even compared to the American “wild West”. This is a huge arid desert with rare intersperses of small auls. The population density is low. Russians have lived here since the 16th century, but they failed to Russify the local population. Instead, they themselves "turned out", turning into steppe dwellers. It is believed that western Kazakhstan has the highest concentration of "mambets" - the Kazakh analogue of our "gopniks". A peaceful traveler can run into problems here, as they say, out of the blue, either with hooligans or with the police.

Kazakhs from other zhuzes themselves are not very fond of visiting the Younger Zhuz. But you have to. It is here that the richest deposits of oil, as well as chromium and uranium are located.


This is such a difficult internal political situation in Kazakhstan. While the country was living on natural resource rent from the export of minerals, everything was relatively safe. But the coronavirus crisis of 2020, which led to a drop in oil prices, and then pandemic restrictions, exposed all the existing contradictions. Three differently directed zhuzes constantly competed among themselves, waging an intraspecific struggle. In January 2022, a summit coup took place, when the Tokayev clan actually deposed the Nazarbayev clan. Such a "ungrateful" successor turned out to be for "Elbasy". At the same time, the "mambets" were actively involved as street militants. What's next?

Russia's active intervention will inevitably lead to increased pressure on the Middle Zhuz, dominated by Russified Kazakhs and ethnic Russians. After the dissolution of parliament, voiced by Tokayev, activists with radical Russophobic views who oppose the "occupiers" may come to it. We have all the prerequisites for a future civil war, as it happened in Ukraine. If the Russian troops leave now, the "zapadentsy" will take over Northern Kazakhstan, in every possible way persecuting the local population. This cannot be allowed in order to avoid the "Donbass scenario". But what can be done to avoid?

Before it is too late, it is necessary to do what should have been done in the home of Ukraine. It is necessary to carry out a reform to change the unitary form of the state structure of Kazakhstan to a federal one, taking into account national specifics. Three such different zhuzes will then be able to comfortably coexist, as Nezalezhnaya had a chance for that until 2014, if Western Ukraine, Central and South-Eastern Ukraine had appeared peacefully. Let us make a reservation that we are not talking about any "annexations", but only about a possible internal political reform within the framework of a united Kazakhstan.

As a federation, this country will gain greater stability and will be able to get closer to Russia and Belarus within the framework of the CSTO, the EAEU and the Union State.
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  1. gunnerminer Offline gunnerminer
    gunnerminer (gunner miner) 8 January 2022 12: 20
    -12
    At the end of December 2021, we asked a hypothetical question whether Kazakhstan could join the Union State of Russia and Belarus.

    And it would be interesting to observe the reaction of Kazakhstanis, who zealously protested because of the price of propane at 20 rubles, and when they get to Russia they will start paying 31, for AI-92 they paid 26-27 rubles, and when they become Russians they will pay 47-48. a noticeable number of migrant workers of Kazakhstani origin. But the Kirghiz, Tajiks, Uzbeks are several million.
    It is not surprising if a referendum is actually held, and it is actually joined. It is well known how we are able to hold elections and referendums. And this would also play into the hands of Tokayev, because his power now essentially rests on foreign "peacekeepers". But it’s not entirely clear why we, the Russians. Amuse imperial ambitions? Are these superpower games going to be expensive?

    It is necessary to carry out a reform to change the unitary form of the state structure of Kazakhstan to a federal one, taking into account national specifics.

    Who dares to carry out this reform? Commander of the Airborne Forces Serdyukov? But he is far from being Marshal MacArthur, the author of the Japanese Constitution. Secretary of the Main Council of United Russia Turchak? They do not know about the zhuzes or the birth of the Kazakh population. We would like to establish elementary order in Dagestan, in the North Caucasus. The project "Resorts of the North Caucasus" collapsed. Youth unemployment is off scale there. There are no social lifts. Like in the former SAR. Are Shoigov millionaires no longer relevant?
    1. Marzhecki Online Marzhecki
      Marzhecki (Sergei) 8 January 2022 12: 36
      +4
      And it would be interesting to observe the reaction of Kazakhstanis, who zealously protested because of the price of propane at 20 rubles, and when they get to Russia they will start paying 31, for AI-92 they paid 26-27 rubles, and when they become Russians they will pay 47-48. a noticeable number of migrant workers of Kazakhstani origin.

      You are substituting concepts. Nobody calls Kazakhstan to Russia. The Union State is a supranational association.

      But it’s not entirely clear why we, the Russians. Amuse imperial ambitions? Are these superpower games going to be expensive?

      In the Cold War and the confrontation with the United States, only another superpower has prospects.
      The only alternative to collecting land, reindustrialization and creating our own internal capacious market is the inevitable defeat and further disintegration of the Russian Federation.

      We would like to establish elementary order in Dagestan, in the North Caucasus. The project "Resorts of the North Caucasus" collapsed. Youth unemployment is off scale there. There are no social lifts. Like in the former SAR. Are Shoigov millionaires no longer relevant?

      This has nothing to do with the issue at hand.
      1. gunnerminer Offline gunnerminer
        gunnerminer (gunner miner) 8 January 2022 12: 46
        -16
        It was already the CIS. It collapsed pretty soon. The level of consumption in Kazakhstan, Russia, Belarus, and Ukraine is about the same. How can Russia attract the neighboring population? With daggers, Zircons, Scythians? It is unlikely. They cannot be put on bread. Kazakhs did not even go to Russia to work in significant quantities.
        This promising superpower is by no means an ally of Russia. If it does away with the United States, it will deal with Russia unambiguously. And then it will be possible to put an end to the history of the titular nation of Russia. The CPC Central Committee believes that only a Chinese can be a communist.

        This has nothing to do with the issue at hand.

        It has. In the state, everything is interconnected. With mountains of unresolved internal problems to climb into a foreign country in military units, to repeat the Afghan adventure of the PB of the Central Committee of the CPSU. A more or less serious military failure, and collapse follows. Military cosmonauts and private traders in the former SAR for the seventh year, peacekeepers in the PMR, in Abkhazia, in South Ossetia, private traders in Africa.
        How will a Russian peacekeeper or law enforcement officer in the Republic of Kazakhstan feel if he has the same shortcomings and problems at home?
        Kazakh rulers have no one to blame but themselves. Played for independence, but others, more economically and socially stable, can really afford it. Everyone else is destined for the role of vassals (to put it mildly). The independence of Kazakhstan is ephemeral and is perceived by the same Washington as "ownerless". It's just that, until recently, the Americans didn’t manage to pick up and assign “what is bad”. And now, apparently, "hands have reached."

        Whether the Russian authorities have drawn conclusions from this now Kazakh lesson will soon be seen.
        1. Marzhecki Online Marzhecki
          Marzhecki (Sergei) 8 January 2022 13: 06
          +2
          It was already the CIS. It collapsed pretty soon. The level of consumption in Kazakhstan, Russia, Belarus, and Ukraine is about the same. How can Russia attract the neighboring population? With daggers, Zircons, Scythians? It is unlikely. They cannot be put on bread. Kazakhs did not even go to Russia to work in significant quantities.

          And how can the Kazakh population be attracted to Turkey? Or China? Abstract ideas of Pan-Turkism? The prospect of a takeover by the PRC? So Kazakhs have long been afraid of the Chinese.

          This promising superpower is by no means an ally of Russia. If it does away with the United States, it will deal with Russia unambiguously. And then it will be possible to put an end to the history of the titular nation of Russia. The CPC Central Committee believes that only a Chinese can be a communist.

          Despite the negative trend, I do not believe that Russia has no future as a future superpower. Rather, it is a question of cadres who decide everything.

          It has. In the state, everything is interconnected. With mountains of unresolved internal problems to climb into a foreign country in military units, to repeat the Afghan adventure of the PB of the Central Committee of the CPSU. A more or less serious military failure, and collapse follows. Military cosmonauts and private traders in the former SAR for the seventh year, peacekeepers in the PMR, in Abkhazia, in South Ossetia, private traders in Africa.

          Resources are small and constantly stretched, this is a problem. Of course, the Ukrainian question should have been resolved long ago. This again speaks of the problem with personnel.
          But it won't be possible not to climb. We will not come to Kazakhstan, Turks and Americans will come.

          How will a Russian peacekeeper or law enforcement officer in the Republic of Kazakhstan feel if he has the same shortcomings and problems at home?

          Who ever cared about a servant's feelings?
          Or do you calculate that a real soldier will do his duty only if he has his own big house with a backyard and two or three personal cars, like a real American?

          The Russian Foreign Ministry and Defense Ministry are lagging behind events and are forced to play according to other people's scenarios.

          Whether the Russian authorities have drawn conclusions from this now Kazakh lesson will soon be seen.

          I interpret events a little differently. The Kazakh script is a consequence of the Ukrainian lesson.
          The question is whether the Kremlin will stop at this or move on.
          1. gunnerminer Offline gunnerminer
            gunnerminer (gunner miner) 8 January 2022 15: 24
            -10
            Turkey attracts with its way of life. I often met students and interns from Kazakhstan in Istanbul. They came to Turkey voluntarily. Draft youth climbs where they feel comfortable. Quite a few Kazakhs study in Russia. In China there are more Kazakhs than in Kazakhstan. Not all fell for the calls of Nazarbayev’s, and did not become oralmans. Turkey and the PRC are attracted by social lifts and a high standard of living.
            We have a problem with personnel. Social elevators slowed down back in the 80s. And now they are not at all. Daughter Shoigu as an example, Fradkov's son, Patrushev's son, and others. No new personnel, no progress. Superpower requires a rapid growth in the birth rate, a technological and industrial breakthrough, the growth of robotization an order of magnitude greater, the development of transport (now imitation), the fight against corruption, not imitation of it, the fight against drunkenness, drugs, HIV , with AIDS.
            Either the Turks or their senior partners will come. NATO needs a major base in Central Asia. In addition to Ukrainian Russia, Russia has nothing to offer the Kazakhs. Therefore, Nazarbayev began rapprochement with the United States, and sent the funds of the National Fund there as a sign of loyalty.
            A soldier will fulfill his duty when the family is provided with housing and food, and most importantly stability. It will be otherwise like in the Republic of Ingushetia, in the First World War, in the DRA, in the North Caucasian campaign. The level of benefits and living conditions of an American or a NATO member, the Russian servicemen will never reach. In his time, Marshal Akhromeev traveled around the United States and NATO. did not believe the Soviet military attaché that a family private could live like that; he believed that they were giving him the house of a senior officer. What can we say about the French or German serviceman. After 1991, a lot of the Russian Ministry of Defense changed. And the soldiers both walked in bast shoes, and they walk. And shoes are the main element of military uniforms. As well as civilian. Even Iranians have shoes of much higher quality than Russian ones. Even Shoigu's shoes are of much higher quality. you can see the cheap, crumpled material of the form.
            The Ukrainian lesson has not been learned in the Foreign Ministry, in the SVR, in the GRU. The same mistakes, chattering in the tail of events. Glances at the Turks, at the State Department. There is no need to change the Tokayev and Nazarbayevs. It is evident that the pro-Russian agents have not been planted there in 30 years, even for money.
  2. Rusa Offline Rusa
    Rusa 8 January 2022 12: 36
    +3
    The root of today's tragedy of modern Kazakhstan lies in
    remnants of the tribal system, multiplied by the unitary form of government ...

    And not only this.
    There is an oligarchic system in Kazakhstan. At the same time, GDP per capita in terms of purchasing power parity of Kazakhstan is on the 54th place in the world. The level of this indicator corresponds to such countries as Panama, Malaysia, Seychelles and Russia.
    In addition, it is necessary to eradicate corruption, theft and nepotism in the leadership, to reduce unemployment, especially among young people in the regions.
    "People want to live like in Norway."
    1. gunnerminer Offline gunnerminer
      gunnerminer (gunner miner) 8 January 2022 12: 49
      -8
      There is no one to eradicate the problems you listed in the Republic of Kazakhstan. Even the Russian exterminators are not up to the task. They also bloom with bright colors.
  3. Bakht Online Bakht
    Bakht (Bakhtiyar) 8 January 2022 12: 43
    +2
    Federation has pros and cons. A tempting offer, but in Kazakhstan there is no clear division by language. And if the country is divided into three zhuzes, then the question "who feeds whom" will inevitably arise. A federation is viable only if the standard of living is high enough. When the neighbor is not looking at your plate. He has enough of his own.
    Or, when the coexistence of two ethnic groups is impossible. In Ukraine, East and West are divided not only economically, but also mentally and linguistically. They have different perceptions of history and culture. In Kazakhstan, such an obvious contradiction between the zhuzes is not visible.
    1. gunnerminer Offline gunnerminer
      gunnerminer (gunner miner) 8 January 2022 12: 54
      -10
      A federation is viable only if the standard of living is high enough. When the neighbor is not looking at your plate. He has enough of his own.

      Yes! good

      In Kazakhstan, such an obvious contradiction between the zhuzes is not visible.

      Not all Kazakhs of the middle zhuz speak their native language well. They are called Russified. Shala-Kazakhs Russian-speaking. Asphalt Kazakhs. Oral mana, Kagas Kazakhs stand apart. Brought from abroad (Iran, China, Afghanistan, Mongolia).
    2. Marzhecki Online Marzhecki
      Marzhecki (Sergei) 8 January 2022 13: 03
      +1
      In Ukraine, East and West are divided not only economically, but also mentally and linguistically. They have different perceptions of history and culture. In Kazakhstan, such an obvious contradiction between the zhuzes is not visible.

      It seems that the Russian language describes that there is a linguistic and cultural problem ...

      an attractive offer, but in Kazakhstan there is no clear division by language. And if the country is divided into three zhuzes, then the question "who feeds whom" will inevitably arise. A federation is viable only if the standard of living is high enough. When the neighbor is not looking at your plate. He has enough of his own.

      The problem of who feeds whom will not become so acute, since the West and South are themselves rich in natural resources, and the North is an industrial and agricultural center. It is just a matter of fair redistribution of financial flows. And then all the people from the same zhus are dragging on themselves ...
      1. Bakht Online Bakht
        Bakht (Bakhtiyar) 8 January 2022 13: 43
        +4
        It seems to me that in Kazakhstan there is a "linguistic and cultural problem", but it is not clearly distinguished geographically, as in Ukraine. For example, in cities this problem is not as acute as in auls. How to divide large cities and auls? After all, they can be in the same zhuz.
        "Fair distribution of financial flows" is not a trivial task. Say, has it been solved in Russia? Is there a fair distribution between, say, Chechnya and Belgorod? I took subjects of approximately the same number. 1,5 million people each. And the subsidies are 30,5 and 2,0 billion rubles, respectively.
        1. isofat Offline isofat
          isofat (isofat) 8 January 2022 14: 18
          0
          "Fair distribution of financial flows", mind me. Let the scientists do it. They have different criteria.
          1. gunnerminer Offline gunnerminer
            gunnerminer (gunner miner) 8 January 2022 15: 46
            -9
            In Ukraine and Kazakhstan, young people shouted that they wanted to live like in Europe, like in Norway, like in Sweden. There were no shouts about life like in Russia.
            1. isofat Offline isofat
              isofat (isofat) 8 January 2022 16: 19
              +2
              It was not so. It was over the hill that they were shouting how good it was with them. smile
              1. gunnerminer Offline gunnerminer
                gunnerminer (gunner miner) 8 January 2022 17: 42
                -12
                Both Ukrainian and local youth do not scream for Russia, and this is after 30 years of being a neighbor.
                1. isofat Offline isofat
                  isofat (isofat) 8 January 2022 17: 54
                  0
                  gunnerminer, for thirty years of continuous efforts, part of the youth fell under the influence of Russophobes. I think this influence will not last long.
                  1. gunnerminer Offline gunnerminer
                    gunnerminer (gunner miner) 8 January 2022 18: 00
                    -12
                    Not a part, but a large part. The Airborne Forces will not be able to educate her.
                    1. isofat Offline isofat
                      isofat (isofat) 8 January 2022 19: 40
                      +2
                      gunnerminer, you see! Even someone like you does not dispute the influence of Russophobes on less part of the Kazakh youth. laughing
                      1. gunnerminer Offline gunnerminer
                        gunnerminer (gunner miner) 8 January 2022 20: 13
                        -9
                        Influenced by local oligarchs, bai and knzyanks, the same as in Russia, in Ukraine, only in a more caricatured form.
                      2. isofat Offline isofat
                        isofat (isofat) 8 January 2022 20: 31
                        +1
                        gunnerminerand Israel, who brought poverty to poverty, is Russia again to blame? laughing
                      3. gunnerminer Offline gunnerminer
                        gunnerminer (gunner miner) 9 January 2022 11: 43
                        -8
                        In Israel, the state is allocated 12 times more for the treatment of citizens than in Russia. 2 million Russians die a year. Since 1945, this is a record. There is emigration to Israel from Russia. And from Israel to Russia, there is no. And in the meantime, you all live with technology developed in Israel. It is right now in your computers, phones, at your Internet providers. And for some reason it is not taken into account where Israel got the money.
                        But this does not fit into anti-Semitic tales, so we will skip such an unimportant aspect.
                      4. isofat Offline isofat
                        isofat (isofat) 9 January 2022 20: 34
                        +2


                        The infamous statistic of the Jewish state

                        According to the Israeli National Insurance Institute (Bituach Leumi) in 2020 below the poverty line were 21% of the country's citizens
                        laughing

                        gunnermine!

                        Sing swallow, sing
                        Sing, do not be silent, ...
                        laughing
                      5. gunnerminer Offline gunnerminer
                        gunnerminer (gunner miner) 9 January 2022 20: 36
                        -5
                        Pot calls the kettle black. There are many more clips about our Russian poverty. In Israel, the climate is also more favorable. Your agitation of the late perestroika type, Gorbachev's.
                      6. isofat Offline isofat
                        isofat (isofat) 9 January 2022 21: 40
                        0
                        gunnerminer, this is not agitation, I needed your reaction. Do not be shy that you are a Jew. There are many good people among them. smile
                      7. gunnerminer Offline gunnerminer
                        gunnerminer (gunner miner) 9 January 2022 21: 54
                        -5
                        Don't make yourself an SSman. I am sorry that I do not belong to this ancient nation.
                      8. isofat Offline isofat
                        isofat (isofat) 9 January 2022 22: 01
                        0
                        О ancient, an extinct nation, I did not say, do not be cunning. smile
  • gunnerminer Offline gunnerminer
    gunnerminer (gunner miner) 8 January 2022 15: 48
    -10
    Chechnya won the right to financial flows with arms in hand. Belgorod is Zamkadia. Overly patient, submissive, unpretentious like a Red Army soldier.
    1. isofat Offline isofat
      isofat (isofat) 8 January 2022 16: 26
      +2
      And life in Kazakhstan will improve. Kazakhs are smart too. yes
      1. gunnerminer Offline gunnerminer
        gunnerminer (gunner miner) 8 January 2022 17: 46
        -11
        И это после 30 лет байства и олигархата с казахским орнаментом?Да еще с делением на жузы, кланы, роды, племена!Один клан передушил другой.Прикрываясь придуманными террористами.В твиттере Токаев стер упоминание про них.
        1. isofat Offline isofat
          isofat (isofat) 8 January 2022 17: 59
          +1
          gunnerminer, you either did not understand me, or you think the Kazakh people are stupid.
          1. gunnerminer Offline gunnerminer
            gunnerminer (gunner miner) 8 January 2022 18: 01
            -12
            All nations are the same and worthy of their leaders.
            1. isofat Offline isofat
              isofat (isofat) 8 January 2022 18: 06
              0
              Zelensky is unworthy of his people.
              1. gunnerminer Offline gunnerminer
                gunnerminer (gunner miner) 8 January 2022 18: 22
                -12
                The people elected. The people laugh. So Zelya was elected. And they didn’t nullify. Kazakhs, Belarusians, Tajiks and Russians cannot choose.
                1. isofat Offline isofat
                  isofat (isofat) 8 January 2022 18: 47
                  +3
                  gunnerminer, sorry, what vaccine against Covid did you get? And were they vaccinated at all? Or maybe you are injured by an information bullet?

                  Once again, I congratulate you on the New Year holidays. Get well and do not get sick.
                2. gunnerminer Offline gunnerminer
                  gunnerminer (gunner miner) 8 January 2022 20: 09
                  -10
                  Colonel-General Serdyukov with half a company of Armenians saves the government of the Republic of Kazakhstan from the wrath of his own people, tired of the feudal order. The CSTO has been turned into a regional police officer. And you don’t get sick. Celebrate. You don’t know where else you will have to send subordinates of Colonel-General Serdyuv.
                3. isofat Offline isofat
                  isofat (isofat) 8 January 2022 20: 42
                  +1
                  Russian peacekeepers take under protection the Russian Consulate General in Kazakhstan, strategic facilities in the country, including the airport and Baikonur

                  We will not let our property be destroyed! yes
                4. gunnerminer Offline gunnerminer
                  gunnerminer (gunner miner) 9 January 2022 11: 31
                  -8
                  It will be seen there.
  • Marzhecki Online Marzhecki
    Marzhecki (Sergei) 8 January 2022 13: 46
    -1
    Quote: Bakht
    It seems to me that in Kazakhstan there is a "linguistic and cultural problem", but it is not clearly distinguished geographically, as in Ukraine. For example, in cities this problem is not as acute as in auls. How to divide large cities and auls? After all, they can be in the same zhuz.

    Tell me, is the language issue the basis for the formation of the United States as a federation? Or did it develop historically on different principles?

    "Fair distribution of financial flows" is not a trivial task. Say, has it been solved in Russia? Is there a fair distribution between, say, Chechnya and Belgorod? I took subjects of approximately the same number. 1,5 million people each. And the subsidies are 30,5 and 2,0 billion rubles, respectively.

    This is a big problem, and its solution depends on the approaches of the Kremlin.
    1. Bakht Online Bakht
      Bakht (Bakhtiyar) 8 January 2022 16: 53
      +2
      The United States has a different story. These are the former British colonies. And they were expanded and created by conquests. Now the situation is different. The state of Kazakhstan exists. As well as the state of Ukraine. I draw parallels because in Ukraine, I think federalization is essential. And the language issue is of great importance there. In Kazakhstan, it seems to me, the language issue is not so acute. Although recently, nationalists have been constantly raising it.
      I don't think the idea of ​​federalization is all that bad. My first post "Federation has pros and cons. Tempting proposal" Whether this idea will take root is unclear. The division into zhuzes is somehow strange. But it is up to the Kazakhs themselves to decide.
  • Marzhecki Online Marzhecki
    Marzhecki (Sergei) 8 January 2022 16: 57
    -1
    Quote: gunnerminer
    In Ukraine and Kazakhstan, young people shouted that they wanted to live like in Europe, like in Norway, like in Sweden. There were no shouts about life like in Russia.

    Nobody forbids wanting
    1. gunnerminer Offline gunnerminer
      gunnerminer (gunner miner) 8 January 2022 17: 44
      -10
      They do not want to go to Russia, because Russia has nothing new to offer them: no social elevators, no decent wages, no prospects for increasing the level of consumption, the same theft, corruption, localism, poverty.
  • Kapany3 Offline Kapany3
    Kapany3 8 January 2022 20: 52
    +3
    Turkey and the PRC are attracted by social lifts and a high standard of living.

    what "standard of living" attracts China? If you call life in fanza "level", then I feel sorry for you. How do you live then? And in these fanzas there is the bulk of the Chinese.
    1. Marzhecki Online Marzhecki
      Marzhecki (Sergei) 9 January 2022 08: 14
      0
      Yes, I also find it funny to read it. It's one thing to get an education and vacation in Turkey, Norway or China. Another thing is that Kazakhstan has no chance of becoming either Turkey or Norway, except perhaps being absorbed by China, which the Kazakhs are really afraid of.
      Kazakhs should be guided by the level of the Baltic states and Ukraine, this is what really shines for them. Russia can give Kazakhstan equal and mutually beneficial relations.
      1. gunnerminer Offline gunnerminer
        gunnerminer (gunner miner) 9 January 2022 16: 57
        -7
        In any case, Ukraine and Kazakhstan do not shine. They are just a springboard and walk the field. The Russian authorities cannot ensure the growth of consumption for their population, and even more so for the Kazakhs. And the American authorities and the EU, British, do not want to spend money on native cheap infantry.
    2. gunnerminer Offline gunnerminer
      gunnerminer (gunner miner) 9 January 2022 17: 05
      -7
      In the PRC, the standard of living is steadily increasing. Now President Xi has set the task of creating a middle class.

      Citizens of many countries see China as a promising country to relocate. It opens up new opportunities for doing business and finding partners, working and studying. The purchasing power index in China has long been much higher. Everyone knows that this republic has no equal in production and consumption of goods. Many international companies have production bases in China, as this significantly reduces costs and allows you to get more profit. In 2015, the PRC's GDP for the first time in many years increased by 5% and has only been increasing since then.

      https://fb.ru/article/381301/uroven-jizni-v-kitae-pokazateli-sravnenie-s-drugimi-stranami
      In Russia, they dare not even dream of such an increase.

      As you can see, the same competencies that are popular all over the world are well paid in China. Recently, special attention has been paid to science, therefore, scientists from different countries have been attracted, offering them very favorable living conditions. An especially large influx of Russian civilian pilots to the PRC.

      https://все-общежития.рф/inostrancam/uroven-zhizni-v-kitae-2.html
    3. gunnerminer Offline gunnerminer
      gunnerminer (gunner miner) 9 January 2022 17: 07
      -7
      China is a big country, prices and needs in each province are different, so the state has acted very wisely and each province sets its own minimum wage (minimum wage). I will give an example of two provinces.
      Guangdong Province. The minimum wage is 1968 yuan (22548 rubles at the current exchange rate). Shaanxi Province - 1950 yuan (22342 rubles). Information about salaries from Russians who were in the PRC. Unfortunately, I did not find official information to attach a link to the source.
      Let's see how things are going in Russia. According to official sources, the minimum wage in the Russian Federation in 2021 is 12792 rubles. Yeah, not a lot compared to China.
      Then you get angry and say, here we have compared, in China the prices are higher for food, etc., etc. But alas, no. Prices here are not much higher than in Russia. If you wish, you can go to the market and buy inexpensive food, rent inexpensive housing, etc.
      So, in terms of the economic component, China has overtaken us!

      https://zen.yandex.ru/media/prokitai/sravnivaiu-uroven-jizni-v-kitae-i-v-rossii-oficialnaia-statistika-i-lichnyi-opyt-60e6fe7a7cfc407282730fb1
    4. gunnerminer Offline gunnerminer
      gunnerminer (gunner miner) 9 January 2022 17: 50
      -6
      The yuan is pegged to the dollar, not the ruble.
  • Marzhecki Online Marzhecki
    Marzhecki (Sergei) 9 January 2022 08: 15
    -1
    Quote: gunnerminer
    They do not want to go to Russia, because Russia has nothing new to offer them: no social elevators, no decent wages, no prospects for increasing the level of consumption, the same theft, corruption, localism, poverty.

    What Turkey has to offer? USA? China?
    Specifically?
    What have the Baltics and Ukraine already received from the West? List all the goodies from their pro-Western course.
    1. gunnerminer Offline gunnerminer
      gunnerminer (gunner miner) 9 January 2022 16: 54
      -7
      Syrian youths, who do not have the means to scramble into the EU, scramble into the Turkish occupation zone. The United States, China, are attracted by social lifts, a high standard of living, including Russians of military age, and Kazakhs, all the more so. The main thing is that the Ukrainian and Baltic young people are an opportunity to leave their country. To earn money in the EU, the USA, Canada, Turkey. From Russia, many women left for Turkey to work in brothels, to work in markets, factories, travel companies. The best standard of living is rose in Estonia. Worst of all in Lithuania.

      If we take the total volume of investments, we can see that more money goes to small Estonia than to huge Russia. Not in absolute numbers, of course, but as a percentage of GDP. In the April World Economic Outlook, the IMF estimated this indicator for Russia at 23,4%, and for Estonia - at 29,6% of the gross product in 2020. That is, Estonia initially had a normal trade balance and self-sufficiency! It was easier for her than for other republics to adapt to her newfound freedom. Yes, and produced there, sorry for the reference to His Majesty, not galoshes at all, but quite popular goods.
      How Estonia disposed of the industries inherited from the USSR is a topic for a separate article. In short, everything that could be used, modernized and made profitable is still working successfully. Estonia has always been among the leaders of the Union in the development of railway and road infrastructure. Estonians were not scattered about what they did not see of commercial importance. But Estonians did not skimp on the development and modernization of roads where it is needed. As a result, the whole country is permeated with a network of highways suitable for freight transport, adapted to the logistics of modern business.
      Estonia is one of the few countries that can be called a net exporter of electricity. It is produced so much that it is impossible to use it up within its own borders ... We have to sell, fill the budget.
      Where does the energy come from? 90% - from the Narva power plants. This is a new name, people remembering the Union know them as Baltic CHP and Estonian CHP. Estonians just thought: why feed an extra staff of managers? And we combined two CHPPs into one company for ease of management and cost optimization.
      And where is the CHP? The USSR built it. The Baltic was built from 1956 to 1959, it worked on high-ash fuel. Estonian has been working on oil shale since 1969.

      https://pulse.mail.ru/article/3-prichiny-uspeha-ekonomiki-estonii-za-kazhduyu-iz-nih-estoncy-mogut-skazat-spasibo-sovetskomu-soyuzu-1770296732821366657-2115965176123944120/

      Approximately 24 thousand Russian businessmen have issued Estonian residence permits and purchased real estate in Estonia.
      Before quarantine, he regularly went to have fun and stock up on food and other goods in Estonia. The standard of living is about the same as in Sweden or Finland. But they do not reach Denmark or Norway. Pensions in Estonia are higher than in Russia. Pensioners are free medicines, as in Israel, Great Britain. All guests from Central Asia and the Caucasus survived from Estonia. In the 90s he met many workers in Denmark at a shipyard in Fredericia.
  • art573 Offline art573
    art573 (Artyom Vladimirovich Yarovikov) 9 January 2022 23: 30
    +1
    This is a proposal that the middle zhuz can join the regions in Russia by referendum. And let the rest continue on horseback ...
    1. Ksv Offline Ksv
      Ksv (Sergei) 11 January 2022 01: 30
      0
      BINGO, although of course it is pointless to hope for it. If only they behave well now
  • viktortarianik Offline viktortarianik
    viktortarianik (Victor) 13 January 2022 12: 30
    0
    And how to do it in practice? To do this, you must first take power into your own hands. And who will this lucky man be? There are no such inside the country. So these "hands" must come from outside, which is possible only on tanks.