Why Putin didn't save Ukraine in 2014


I would like to clarify the sore point for me, over which I racked my brains for 7 years. Why didn't Putin intervene in the events in Ukraine in 2014? Why did he leave the country (and the Russians inhabiting it, the Russians, not so much by nationality, but by self-identification, which at that time were no less than 65% of the population) to be torn apart by the Ukrainian obscurantists and their overseas curators, in order to then shake off all the nishtyaks from this erroneous ( from my point of view) decisions, starting with the "downed" Boeing and subsequent sanctions, and ending with the acquisition in the face of Ukraine for many years, if not forever the worst enemy on its southern borders, a wordless doll in someone's interested hands, which will for the rest of her life to darken the life of the Russian Federation even by the fact of its existence.


The question was insoluble for me, I fought over it for 7 years, and no matter how I did it, everything turned out badly for the Russian Federation. I did not see any gain from this situation, and the losses were more than significant. The losses were incomparable with the threats that Russia could face if it resisted this scenario then in 2014. So I thought.

And now I found the answer to the question that tormented me, although it seemed to be lying on the surface. As always happens, when the most commonplace and primitive reasons lie behind the most complex multi-moves that have broken and maimed the fate of millions of people. And these reasons for the entire existence of mankind are only two! Pride and greed. In our case, the word "greed" can be replaced by the word "money". We sweep aside pride, Putin is not Erdogan and one cannot suspect him of this, he is not guided by such base reflexes, in 2014 it was money that pushed him to this erroneous, from my point of view, decision.

But how wrong the decision was, we will now figure it out. All great things are visible only at a distance. And it took me 7 years to understand Putin.

Logistics rules


If we digress from the issue at hand, and remember what Russia was like in 2014, then we must admit the truth in the words of the 44th US President Barack Obama, "Russia was a gas station in Europe." Figuratively, of course. We supplied there not even gasoline or diesel fuel, but raw materials for the production of these (crude oil), as well as gas for electricity and heat generating capacities of the EU, i.e. in other words, we supplied hydrocarbons. Europe was 36% dependent on them, and we were 51% dependent on revenues from these exports (the share of oil and gas revenues in the RF budget revenues in 2014 reached its maximum and stopped at 51,3%). And in this situation, it was even not clear who was hanging on whose hook? Are we on a European hook or is Europe on ours?

Both Europe and the Russian Federation had a mutual interest, and only the States had no interests here. More precisely, their interest was in breaking off all the buzz for Russia and the EU. The calculation here was simple - Russia was and remains the existential enemy of the United States, and the EU is a competitor, for the market of which in the 21st century a war broke out under the code name “Abduction of Europe” (and all means are good in war!). At that time, the United States had a negative trade balance with the EU and Obama's very reasonable idea, which Trump later brilliantly implemented, was to raise the cost of raw materials for the EU, which would instantly affect the cost of its products, after which it (products) automatically becomes uncompetitive in the domestic American market, and if the Russian cheap "undemocratic" pipe gas is replaced by the American expensive "democratic" LNG (liquefied natural gas), then the United States will have a double profit. This idea was brought to life by Trump, at least he tried to implement it, until he was "eaten" by Biden at the "democratic" presidential elections in the fall of 2020. Biden has a different plan now, but about that next time.

Why Putin didn't save Ukraine


At the time of 2014, there was no SP-2 at all. The capacities of the JV-1 available at that time (design capacity 55 billion cubic meters / year), the Ukrainian GTS (142,5 billion cubic meters / year) and the Yamal-EU gas pipeline (32,9 billion cubic meters / year) were quite enough in order to fulfill all of Gazprom's obligations to its European consumers. With only one amendment - Poland and Ukraine in every possible way obstructed the modernization of their GTS (Poland under the influence of American friends, and Ukraine, then with Yanukovych, bargaining with the Russian Federation, who will carry out this modernization and at whose expense). As a result, the idea of ​​bypass routes to Ukraine and Poland appeared - South Stream and SP-2. But South Stream was buried due to the efforts of Bulgaria, standing at gunpoint by the United States. We were also lucky that Erdogan took the time to hurry up and replaced South Stream with Turkish, with a capacity of 31,5 billion cubic meters of gas per year, half of which goes to Turkey, half to Southern Europe (Bulgaria is now biting its lips, but late - her train has left irrevocably). What was Putin to do when a coup d'etat happened in Ukraine in 2014? Let me remind you that 51% of the RF budget was at stake!

There was one small chance to keep Ukraine in his sphere of influence by supporting Yanukovych, but Putin then did not take advantage of it, limiting himself to Crimea. How this was justified was shown by subsequent events. I believe this was the Kremlin's fatal mistake. Indirectly, he recognized it, without repeating it in August 2020, when a similar threat arose in Belarus. Then Putin came out in support of Lukashenka, even despite his contradictory actions the day before (with the arrest of Wagner's fighters), concentrating his force fist on the borders of the Republic of Belarus. This was enough for the old man to keep power in the country. The security forces of the Republic of Belarus did not flinch and did not betray their "mustachioed tyrant". The security forces of Ukraine in 2014 were also ready to stand up to the end, the only problem was that Yanukovych was not Lukashenko at all. The scoundrel escaped! One could have used him as a president in exile, but then Putin did not risk it. Because the gas transit to the EU was at stake. And you can understand Putin.

Let's imagine, purely hypothetically, that Putin would use the permission of the Federation Council of the Russian Federation for the use of troops outside the Russian Federation and the request of the fugitive President Yanukovych for help in restoring the constitutional order violated by the conspirators, and would send troops to Ukraine. Even with the overwhelming support of the local population (except for the western regions, everyone would have greeted the Russian "tired battalion" with flowers) and minimal opposition from the "rebellious" opposition (which, most likely, would have fled before the appearance of Russian tanks), what is the reaction to all this could be in the West? Don't go to a fortune-teller here, Putin would be accused of suppressing democracy, an armed invasion, and would impose sanctions on the transit of Russian gas and oil to Europe. What else would you like to do with the aggressor? No, let's write him food stamps. And even Putin's last sympathizers in the EU could not do anything about this in the face of the obvious fact of "crushed Ukrainian democracy." They themselves would doomedly shut off the valve on the hydrocarbon pipe of the "aggressor" to Europe, even realizing that after that they themselves are the "pipe" business. As a result, Obama could have written his name in the annals of American history - so beautifully, bloodlessly for the United States, with one blow, no one has succeeded in putting both of America's opponents on the shoulder blades! But Putin did not give him such pleasure, having avenged Ukraine already in Syria, after which the life of the overly tanned leader of the American pale-faced Comanches lost all colors, and he moved on to the favorite work of all American presidents - writing a memoir under the general title “I and the Genius of Villainy Putin ".

Therefore, summing up what has been said, I can summarize that for all the resentment of the Russian-speaking and pro-Russian-oriented Ukrainians against Putin, he did not have much choice in the events of 7 years ago. He acted according to the circumstances, playing back and minimizing the risks for the Russian Federation with the second number. The first number, as it is not sad for me to admit it, was our sworn "friends and partners". There was a small chance to keep Ukraine in the orbit of Russian influence right at the time of the coup (December 2013 - January 2014), but the Kremlin then showed indecision, from the sidelines watching from the side how everything would end, and Yanukovich showed cowardice and political shortsightedness, succumbing to the persuasion of Western observers and making a deal with the conspirators. How it ended for him, you know. What ended for Russia - too. The Kremlin and Putin in particular drew the appropriate conclusions from this. The main conclusion is that under no circumstances can the West be trusted, they will deceive, smile and deceive again, and then they will say that you simply misunderstood them. 6 years later in Belarus, Putin has not repeated his past mistakes. And that was the main lesson he learned from the Ukrainian events.

The next two articles will be devoted to debunking the next myths that have developed over the past 7 years. The first will debunk the myth about the possibilities of the Americans to transfer the EU to their own LNG and why they have not done so yet. It will also remove some of the issues that have arisen with the implementation of Gazprom, which has become a stumbling block for the SP-2 project over the past 2 years. The second will focus on Biden's plans to decarbonize the world economics and will remove the myth about the maintenance of Ukraine at the expense of the Russian Federation by transit through its GTS of Russian hydrocarbons. You yourself, at your leisure, think about what kind of money we are talking about? 2-3 billion dollars maximum - you can survive with this money (you personally!), A country the size of Ukraine - hardly (from the word at all!). Then what are we talking about? Why shoot yourself in the foot and refuse Ukrainian transit? What is our reason for this? What does the SP-2 have to do with it? If you want to kill Ukraine, stop supplying it with electricity, gas, diesel fuel and coal. In a month there will be no such country. In its place will be European Somalia. If you don't want to, then say so - the Kiev regime suits us and stop fooling your own people. Okay, I won't get ahead of myself.

Not saying goodbye.
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  1. Just a cat Offline Just a cat
    Just a cat (Bayun) 9 February 2021 07: 54
    +5
    PRIVATE PERSONS provide electricity to primates at the expense of primates. You will also pay for your funeral! laughing Why did they bring out the worms, why did they not save the plague pigs, why did they not save Ukraine ... laughing
  2. Just a cat Offline Just a cat
    Just a cat (Bayun) 9 February 2021 07: 58
    +11


    For some reason, the inhabitants of Russia do not want to save the Ukrainians laughing
    1. Volkonsky Offline Volkonsky
      Volkonsky (Wolf) 9 February 2021 18: 50
      +2
      I'll reveal a big secret - Ukraine does not buy gas from the Russian Federation, in general, it buys Russian gas from the Slovaks, overpaying for fictitious transit, the difference was put on the population, the population grumbles, but pays. Why does the Russian Federation supply the Kiev regime with solarium, coal and electricity is an open question. Private traders, you say ... Well, well ... The Kremlin cannot explain to its private traders what to do and what not? Do you yourself believe in it?
      1. Just a cat Offline Just a cat
        Just a cat (Bayun) 10 February 2021 07: 08
        +2
        And why not take off the last panties from the Ukrainian? laughing bills on receipts and credits are not enough for you ... Coal is also from private traders. They write that the price has almost doubled. And you can buy Russian gas even on Mars with a surcharge. What they put on your population is not interesting to ANYONE.
        1. Volkonsky Offline Volkonsky
          Volkonsky (Wolf) 10 February 2021 08: 45
          -1
          Uncle, have you already decided who you are fighting here? with the Ukrainians or with the regime? that's what you can prove to me a Ukrainian? I myself know that we have ur * dy in Kiev, what can I do about it?
          1. Just a cat Offline Just a cat
            Just a cat (Bayun) 10 February 2021 13: 50
            -2
            For me, you are ALL different varieties of the same substance. Therefore, nothing happens with elections laughing Thievish, dull, cunning, venal, but kind and asleep ... And with a surcharge such "GOOD" is not necessary.
            1. Volkonsky Offline Volkonsky
              Volkonsky (Wolf) 10 February 2021 18: 40
              +5
              You probably think that you have some special rights to Russia by the fact of your birth in it, and I mean some kind of bereaved, rootless, who should be lying at your feet because of your belonging to the Great country? So I inform you that there is no merit in your being born in the Russian Federation. I was born in the USSR, and Russia is the same homeland to me as Ukraine, as well as Georgia, Belarus, Moldova, Armenia, Azerbaijan, etc. republics, including the Baltic ones. Unlike you, I don’t scatter my lands, and I will probably have more merit to our common Motherland than yours. I honestly fulfilled my military duty behind the river, when you were still ... and did not hide behind other people's backs, and in Kharkov, where I was born, the floor of the city cemetery has plaques with my year of birth (1983-85 were the years of our most difficult losses in the DRA, and Kharkov, together with Rostov, was in the lead in those years in terms of cargo 200). It is not customary for us to rattle with medals, but I have the right to make no less claims to my big Motherland than yours, and it’s certainly not for you to tell me who is right and who is right ...
              1. Just a cat Offline Just a cat
                Just a cat (Bayun) 10 February 2021 21: 09
                0
                In the Donbass, it would be better if he fulfilled his military duty and not earned his tantrums for a communal apartment in Kharkiv. Russian sergeant Arseniy Pavlov was the only officer from all over Donbass. On the muzzles, he was going to beat ... as the bullets whistled so all the heroes together became refugees. You are capable of hitting grandmothers in the face when you take away your trousers. Do not forget to make Mark Twain laugh with your quotes. He did not like blacks.
                Worms are not brothers to me, but do whatever you want among yourself.
                1. Volkonsky Offline Volkonsky
                  Volkonsky (Wolf) 10 February 2021 22: 13
                  0
                  you, uncle, would not have survived in Afghanistan. Are you a typical couch warrior who has never seen anything farther than his couch and refrigerator, which is not in the Donbas then?
                  1. Just a cat Offline Just a cat
                    Just a cat (Bayun) 11 February 2021 06: 11
                    0
                    Hundreds came from Russia to do what YOU had to do! This is YOUR country and YOUR people! All you are capable of is sitting in a T-shirt as an alcoholic in the kitchen and telling fairy tales ... "Rambo" from Afghanistan ... or maybe a dealer? A survivor from the homeland of policemen, informers and marauders.
              2. Just a cat Offline Just a cat
                Just a cat (Bayun) 10 February 2021 21: 22
                0
                I was also born in the USSR, but I don’t consider the ukrosyannik my homeland ...
                1. Volkonsky Offline Volkonsky
                  Volkonsky (Wolf) 10 February 2021 22: 15
                  0
                  you are no different from our maydauns
                  1. Just a cat Offline Just a cat
                    Just a cat (Bayun) 11 February 2021 05: 58
                    0
                    You have the same Russian as a European from Maydaun. would be silent. They decided in one night that Russia owes them and Europe owes them. Nobody owes you anything.
                    1. Volkonsky Offline Volkonsky
                      Volkonsky (Wolf) 11 February 2021 07: 32
                      +1
                      Once again I am convinced that we are one country - I have half of the country sitting hating Russians, scribbling them on Facebook and Twitter, here is the same copy of Toko with the opposite sign, sitting scribbling to me how he hates Ukrainians. America can sleep well - it's done! Moreover, judging by the time of appearance, this subject lives far from Moscow-Petersburg, somewhere beyond the Urals, closer to Siberia, there is a lot of time, life is good, in his 35-40 years he is not busy with anything, only scribbles like a machine gun. There is apparently no work. It's time to find the enemy. The Ukrainians are to blame. And the vocabulary is all from the tyrnet - pigs, seluks, ukrosvinyarnik, the homeland of the police. Uncle, my father was at war! 17th year of birth. In 43 at the front he joined the party. Been through the whole war! So he died as a communist in 96, did not see all this horror in my country. His older brother was killed in the first days of the war, on the Lithuanian border, he was the deputy technical officer of the border detachment, we still do not even know exactly when and where. Only a letter - Missing. In my father's room there is still a photo of him, enlarged from a military ID, young, handsome, in a harness, without a headdress, with a tie in his buttonholes. That's all that's left! And our memory! And you're making me a hunchback! It can be seen that he did not smell the smell of human fried meat, so you are raving about war. And I smelled! And I wish nobody! And he buried the boys in closed sealed coffins.
                      1. Just a cat Offline Just a cat
                        Just a cat (Bayun) 11 February 2021 08: 41
                        0
                        Zeltsman's grandfather also fought ... when your fellow tribesmen to Arkhangelsk robbed Russian monasteries, there were no Americans in the plans. The happy owner of a Turkish robe and a Polish saber also swore allegiance to Russia. But at the same time, he did not disdain to turn to the Tatars and pay them with Russian slaves. And before he died, he was thinking under whom to lie - under Russia or Sweden ... If someone did not understand, then this is B. Khmelnitsky. There is no faith in YOU !!!! Boys from Russia, Dagestan, Abkhazia, Serbia, Ossetia were being transported from Donbass in closed coffins ... Even former officers of NATO countries fought ... Don't talk about your heroism. The military commissar gave a magic pendal and flew away, otherwise he would have huddled under the skirt of his mother. How Strelkov raised resistance ... But drugs are actively rushing to Russia thanks to the Ukrainians. Your memory is the happy freebie moments of the union times. Your time has passed, Russia has brought out helminths and there will be no return. If you don't like it, apply for permanent residence and earn a pension with a shovel to a construction site ... And then he rolled his lips ... Putin, rape me and feed me by force .... I am not going to fight for Ukrainians and instead of Ukrainians, especially I am a signalman.
                      2. Just a cat Offline Just a cat
                        Just a cat (Bayun) 11 February 2021 09: 00
                        -1
                        My father is older than you (in 1982 he was in the rank of captain) and, when he was retired with the rank of lieutenant colonel, he traveled across Russia and started factories as an engineer, assembling equipment with his own hands. In the heat, in the cold and at altitude. And you know! And he did not say a single positive word about his fellow Ukrainians. I know him personally and trust him, and you are just a letter on the screen.
                      3. Wint Offline Wint
                        Wint (Romz) 12 February 2021 13: 27
                        0
                        Comrade, in the Russian Federation there are more and more dumb cattle that "feed" Ukraine, Donbass, Crimea, workers from Central Asia, etc. etc. Which are "robbed" by social programs, and not by a gang of thieves that have settled in the Kremlin.
                        They have no idea that they are already enemies to themselves, to their homeland.
                        Not everyone is like that, believe me!
                        About your article, it is obvious that Putin and his entourage do not care about any "trifles" like geopolitics. Except for shameless theft and keeping the current situation.
              3. Mikhail Alekseev (Mikhail Alekseev) 11 February 2021 21: 30
                0
                you are a coward and there is no need to hide behind Afgan, Svidomysh))) The fact that you were born in the USSR does not give you any rights - you profuked everything. Those who wanted to - they stood up for the defense of Donbass with weapons. And shove your claims into a dupu)
                1. Volkonsky Offline Volkonsky
                  Volkonsky (Wolf) 12 February 2021 05: 30
                  0
                  Uncle, you’re here the first day and you’re rude right away ... what do you even know about me? You, as I understand it, did not climb out of Donbass ... And where did you see the claims here? It is easy to love Russia, sitting on my couch in Samara or Rostov, and for every word I say here, I have a term of 5 years in Ukraine, I have already been frightened more than once by the SBU and the Nazis who will come to my house. But you haven't even read the text, I'm not sure that you even know how to read ... I noticed that those who only saw the war in the movies are going to fight, because you can't tell the AK-47 from the AK-74, but still there. ..
      2. Just a cat Offline Just a cat
        Just a cat (Bayun) 10 February 2021 07: 17
        0
        The decision of the Russian government to ban the import of Ukrainian-made railroad wheels, bogie frames and wheelsets could be a response to the closure of three opposition television channels in Ukraine.

        This opinion was expressed by the Ukrainian political scientist, expert on economic issues Alexander Dudchak in a comment to the Nation News news agency.
        Here is your salvation from Putin laughing laughing laughing
        Another hundred more will go to Poland for strawberries.
      3. Sasha71 Offline Sasha71
        Sasha71 (Alex Bryn) 11 February 2021 01: 08
        0
        Think for at least 7 years, at least 107, and if there is no high-quality political science education, an understanding of the factors influencing public administration (internal, clan and external, including global politics), then understanding the motives of the leaders of world powers will not be close. Blaming Putin for their troubles is some archaic mental deviation of Ukrainians. Blame someone for their troubles, in general, infantilism. The article is not worth a damn.
  3. Dust Offline Dust
    Dust (Sergei) 9 February 2021 08: 32
    +5
    The biggest mistake was made by Putin in 2014. When the East of Ukraine revolted. When the Lugansk, Kharkov, Donetsk, Zaporozhye, Odessa regions began to rise ... It's no secret that all these areas are mainly populated by Russians, since these areas were primordially Russian ... But when Putin began to talk about drunken Donetsk miners dismissively .... With this he alienated the Russian world. They won't forgive him. Yes, Putin returned Crimea, but he could return the whole of Novorossia! He didn’t want to, too many of him are surrounded by liberal advisers who receive a second salary in the US State Department.
    1. The comment was deleted.
    2. Denis Malygin Offline Denis Malygin
      Denis Malygin (Denis Malygin) 9 February 2021 11: 44
      -7
      This is your country, who was chosen - that is what you got. And your forgiveness? What?
      1. Dust Offline Dust
        Dust (Sergei) 9 February 2021 13: 59
        +9
        And yours, I understand 404 ...! You answered us for Sevastopol ...! Now answer for Novorossia! Rogue not grateful!
  4. gorenina91 Offline gorenina91
    gorenina91 (Irina) 9 February 2021 08: 36
    -4
    Why Putin didn't save Ukraine in 2014

    - Well, and the article ... - no sequence ... - sheer confusion ... - "Putin could ...; Pudding did not dare ...; Putin did not repeat" ... and so on ...
    - Damn ... - there is world politics; there is government policy; but there are state politicians ...
    - And when you are a statesman and strategist ... - here you are simply forced ... - to be able to ...; take risks ..., extract. and so on .... "... - Otherwise ... - you are neither a political strategist, nor a state strategist, nor a" global state leader "...
    - Generally ... 2014 was a tragic year for Russia; it was 2014, and not all the previous years of this century ... - not even 2008, when there was a war with Georgia, namely 2014 ... - Russia then faced a choice:
    1. Take a tough direction and begin to pursue an independent policy ... - to begin to implement and implement, in the entire "world system" ... - its "purely Russian policy" ... For this, Russia already had serious reasons and reserves;
    2. Continue to go with the flow, "listening to advice"; constantly “give in to pressure” and fulfill “all kinds of demands” under these pressure; or even altogether - to become an instrument in the hands of a foreign state and begin to carry out all its instructions and fully fulfill everything that concerns the interests of this state (meaning relations between Russia and China) ...
    - Well, Russia chose the "second way" ... - There was no global change in Russian foreign policy ... - And the situation happened ... - this is when "The mountain gave birth to a mouse" (the situation with the Crimea and the LDNR). .. - That's all...
    - But ; seeing such weakness and indecision of Russia in foreign policy ... - this was immediately used by "all and sundry":
    1. Zap Europe has dramatically changed its attitude towards Russia and ... and from (in fact) dependent on Russian supplies of hydrocarbons in Europe ... - this Zap Europe ... - itself made Russia its servant with the most humble humble phrase "It is served "...
    2. Turkey, too ... when it saw the weakness of Russia ... - then immediately threw its "lasso" on Russia and sat astride Russia ... - Well, then already ... - no comment ..;
    3. And dictating to Russia and supervising Russia ... - China managed to create a great reserve for itself for all occasions with the hands of Russia (and for Russian money) ... - this is the Power of China gas pipeline ... - oh, what am I here I am writing ... - "Power of Siberia", of course ... + timber supplies from Russia; the latest weapons and technologies ... - in exchange for the supply of all kinds of consumer goods, junk and used shnoy equipment to Russia ...
    - Oh, yes ... the theme is that Putin did not save Ukraine ... - Well, yes ... - But how could it have been saved; when Russia did not dare to use its life-saving means, which it had ... - quite effective means ... - then Russia was frightened of simple fake publicity ... - Well, and to be afraid of publicity ... - "don't go to the forest." ..
  5. amateur Offline amateur
    amateur (Victor) 9 February 2021 08: 58
    +6
    Unfortunately, all people who know how to run the state already work as taxi drivers or hairdressers.
    (Francois Mitterrand)

    In addition to taxi drivers and hairdressers, journalists also know how to manage the state.
    1. steelmaker Offline steelmaker
      steelmaker 9 February 2021 20: 15
      -3
      And suitcase carriers, for Sobchak!
  6. Uneven Offline Uneven
    Uneven (VADIM STOLBOV) 9 February 2021 09: 31
    -16%
    Why didn't Putin intervene in the events in Ukraine in 2014?

    1) Intervened. Within the corridor assigned to him by the Western curators.
    2) The Russian Federation is not a SUBJECT of politics, it is only an object that fulfills the will of those countries that are a SUBJECT.
    The events in Ukraine fully reflect this.
    1. 123 Offline 123
      123 (123) 9 February 2021 09: 55
      +12
      1) Intervened. Within the corridor assigned to him by the Western curators.
      2) The Russian Federation is not a SUBJECT of politics, it is only an object that fulfills the will of those countries that are a SUBJECT.
      The events in Ukraine fully reflect this.

      1) What about the Syrian Corridor? And the Belarusian? Shouldn't Assad and Lukashenka leave? Yes, Maduro also sends you ardent revolutionary greetings. He just laughs out loud at your theses. laughing
      It's simple, you can't save someone who doesn't fight for himself. Yanukovych is a rag.
      2) You are not a SUBJECT, you are only an object, you fulfill someone else's will, what they say, then you do. Otherwise, you would not write such nonsense. Your comment confirms this in full.
      1. Uneven Offline Uneven
        Uneven (VADIM STOLBOV) 9 February 2021 10: 03
        -13%
        I can substantiate my point of view, but with one condition - all links to sources only in the PERSON. They do not like references to the opinion of experts and statistics, or historical and technical calculations, or citing representatives of the authorities of the Russian Federation. I get banned for these sins.
        Are you ready for this format?
        1. 123 Offline 123
          123 (123) 9 February 2021 10: 10
          +3
          Ready. Write.
          1. Uneven Offline Uneven
            Uneven (VADIM STOLBOV) 9 February 2021 11: 33
            -13%
            1) The Russian Federation and Syria have a difficult relationship (link in a personal).
            2) That is why "Russia does not hold on to Assad" (link in a personal).
            3) The reason for the appearance of the Russian contingent in Syria is NOT the plans for the Qatari gas pipeline, which did not exist (link in a personal).
            1. 123 Offline 123
              123 (123) 9 February 2021 11: 51
              +8
              The Russian Federation has not easy relations with Syria

              And who is simple with whom?

              That is why "Russia does not hold on to Assad"

              And no one claims that Russia is holding on to him. This was talked about publicly and more than once. This is the choice and internal affair of the Syrian people. "Valuable instructions" like Assad must leave; those who wish can turn into a tube.

              The reason for the appearance of the Russian contingent in Syria is NOT the plans for the Qatari gas pipeline, which did not exist

              And I argued that the reason for the introduction of troops "pipe"?

              I still don't understand the rationale for your thesis that Putin is acting "within the corridor assigned to him by the Western curators" and that Russia is not a subject of politics.
              In general, I do not see anything worthy of attention or confirming your point of view on the links request
              If you intend to continue in the same spirit, do not. Don't bother yourself. It is boring to shovel information trash.
              1. Uneven Offline Uneven
                Uneven (VADIM STOLBOV) 9 February 2021 11: 59
                -16%
                If I understood you correctly, do you think that the Russian Federation has left the corridor outlined by the West in Syria or elsewhere? About one attempt and how it ended is known (link in a personal).
              2. Uneven Offline Uneven
                Uneven (VADIM STOLBOV) 9 February 2021 12: 02
                -10%
                And I argued that the reason for the introduction of troops "pipe"?

                Do you want to say that you do not agree with the hypothesis broadcast by the Russian agitprop?
                What about your personal version?
          2. Uneven Offline Uneven
            Uneven (VADIM STOLBOV) 9 February 2021 11: 35
            -17%
            The Americans did not overthrow Lukashenka and Maduro, and the EU is not a SUBJECT of politics.
            1. 123 Offline 123
              123 (123) 9 February 2021 11: 58
              +12
              The Americans did not overthrow Lukashenka and Maduro, and the EU is not a SUBJECT of politics.

              The presence of sanctions pressure, the seizure of property and accounts, the recognition of Guaido, the landing of the "brigade of American filibusters" on the Venezuelan coast ... sad Does the US not support the "protesters" in Belarus and insist on Lukashenka's departure?
              You haven’t told the public who is actually the "SUBJECT of politics"?
              Surely you consider the United States and Ukraine as such? laughing
              In short .... if you have something to say on the case, you are welcome, there is no flag in your hands and a drum around your neck. be healthy hi
              1. Uneven Offline Uneven
                Uneven (VADIM STOLBOV) 10 February 2021 10: 46
                -5
                1)
                The presence of sanctions pressure, the seizure of property and accounts, the recognition of Guaido, the landing of the "brigade of American filibusters" on the Venezuelan coast

                a) Do you see the difference between marking a position and implementing a coup plan?
                b) Can you substantively prove that the United States will not have enough resources to change power in ANY country, if there is such a task?

                2)
                You haven’t told the public who is actually the "SUBJECT of politics"?

                Only the United States fully meets this definition.
        2. magma Offline magma
          magma (Tatyana) 10 February 2021 08: 47
          +5
          Quote: Uneven
          They do not like references to the opinion of experts and statistics, or historical and technical calculations, or quotations from representatives of the authorities of the Russian Federation. I get banned for these sins.

          They don't like stupid people here.

          There is no value in your comments. Throw in links to other resources and think it will work ... but no. Most likely you will be banned for this. Personal thoughts and arguments are valued here.
          1. Uneven Offline Uneven
            Uneven (VADIM STOLBOV) 10 February 2021 10: 40
            -6
            1)
            They don't like stupid people here.

            a) Do you want to say that in your search for love you made the wrong address?
            b) You don't have to worry about me, I am not here in search of love, but only to share thoughts and information.

            2)
            There is no value in your comments

            Can you clarify - what exactly do you mean by the term "value"?

            3)
            Throw in links to other resources and think it will work ... but no

            The position "I don't need to read anything, I already know everything"
            familiar to me. It is popular among those for whom knowledge is completely replaced by emotion.

            4)
            Personal thoughts and arguments are appreciated here

            a) How exactly do you distinguish "personal thoughts and reasons" from "non-personal"?
            b) You can give an example of your "personal" thoughts (Of course, if any).
            1. isofat Offline isofat
              isofat (isofat) 10 February 2021 10: 59
              -1
              Quote: Uneven
              How exactly do you distinguish "personal thoughts and reasons" from "non-personal"?

              There are two troubles in Russia - fools and roads.
              1. Uneven Offline Uneven
                Uneven (VADIM STOLBOV) 10 February 2021 11: 03
                -5
                There are two troubles in Russia - fools and roads

                Judging by your answer, at least the first Russian problem has not gone anywhere ...
  7. Digital error Offline Digital error
    Digital error (Eugene) 9 February 2021 10: 00
    -5
    myth about the possibilities of Americans to transfer the EU to their own LNG

    Interesting. Especially in light of the fact that I do not consider this a myth - "a holy place is never empty" (I mean the replacement of Russian 36% in the event of a full-fledged entry of troops in 2014).

    How it ended for Russia - too

    It is not over but continues.

    1. 123 Offline 123
      123 (123) 9 February 2021 10: 28
      +8
      It is not over but continues.

      You are absolutely right. It's not over yet. There will be many more interesting things in Ukraine. The spring has compressed and it will inevitably straighten.

      You have a rather curious choice of arguments. Curly analyst with a hippo is strong laughing We will do without the Soloviev-Kiselevs. Enjoy watching "in-board" showdowns and more. hi



      1. Digital error Offline Digital error
        Digital error (Eugene) 9 February 2021 10: 50
        -4
        Quote: 123
        You have a rather curious choice of arguments

        You are our curious, but what are your arguments?

        Quote: 123
        Curly analyst with a hippo

        Well yes. The country is free (so far Volodin hasn’t regulated Google with YouTube), why not?

        Quote: 123
        We will do without the Soloviev-Kiselevs

        yes

        Quote: 123
        Enjoy watching the "in-board" showdown

        stop not interested. An interesting fact is that they exist and that living people participate in them. Maybe they even agreed about this, so that the loot from views on YouTube was cut - the audience is cunning good Can you imagine a public showdown between the same Soloviev and, say, Simonyan? Yearning smile hi
        1. 123 Offline 123
          123 (123) 9 February 2021 11: 01
          +9
          You are our curious, but what are your arguments?

          Arguments for what? I didn't see anything from you request In addition to advertising curls laughing

          Well yes. The country is free (so far Volodin hasn’t regulated Google with YouTube), why not?

          Google with YouTube and others do just fine without Volodya, "regulate" as they want. Do not believe me, ask Trump. Or is it just their prerogative? Are they intelligence, honor and conscience?

          not interested. An interesting fact is that they exist and that living people participate in them. Maybe they even agreed about this, so that the loot from the views on YouTube was cut - the audience is a cunning Tosca

          What a tolerant approach smile So everyone should watch your video, but not others? But what about a free country? In general, I'm a little sorry. The second video is more of a provocation, a test for sense of humor and clarity of judgment.

          Can you imagine a public showdown between the same Soloviev and, say, Simonyan? Yearning

          Do you think the showdown between Curly and Navalny is more interesting? winked
          1. Digital error Offline Digital error
            Digital error (Eugene) 9 February 2021 11: 47
            -4
            Quote: 123
            I didn't see anything from you

            Naturally, because we are talking about you - what are your arguments in favor of the prosperity of the LPNR?

            Quote: 123
            In addition to advertising curls

            And why not? wink

            Quote: 123
            What a tolerant approach smile So everyone should watch your video

            Whoever doesn't like Varlamov doesn't watch him, does he?

            Quote: 123
            showdown between curly and Navalny more interesting?

            This is no longer a basement, but a sailor-quiet one, as far as I know.
            But I'm much more interested (September is not far off) the showdown within the current political party - between Katz (a member of the Yabloko party) and Yavlinsky (its founder):



            The good news for you is that the legal opposition is still in a state of disarray, we must admit this, and it will "fly by" again in these elections. Bad news for you - the new always inevitably replaces the old. And the new one is not Comrade Zorkin, who has not found anything shameful in the pension reform, but such curls, whether you like the cut of their hairstyles or not laughing
            1. 123 Offline 123
              123 (123) 9 February 2021 12: 16
              +7
              Naturally, because we are talking about you - what are your arguments in favor of the prosperity of the LPNR?

              Did I talk about prosperity? It is rather strange to argue about this when part of the territories are occupied by punishers, they are constantly fired upon, and an economic blockade is staged.
              Everything is relative. They can live without Natsik on the street, speak and write in their native language. Evil clowns don't close TV channels. Utility bills, gas, electricity, they are lower. On the "other side" everything would be much sadder.

              But I'm much more interested (September is not far off) the showdown within the current political party - between Katz (a member of the Yabloko party) and Yavlinsky (its founder)

              Storm in a teacup. Will two well-known people in narrow circles share a portfolio?

              The good news for you is that the legal opposition is still in a state of discord, we must admit it and it will "fly by" again in these elections. Bad news for you - the new always inevitably replaces the old.

              The opposition is really "bullshit", whether it is in disarray or not, does not matter. I hope the new will be better than the old. Why do you think this is bad news for me?

              And the new one is not Comrade Zorkin, who did not find anything shameful in the pension reform, but such curls, whether you like the cut of their hairstyles or not

              Who is Zorkin? Like Oleg again, you ascribe a certain point of view to me, and then expose it? smile
              It's not about the hair, remember ...

              For example, I'll shave off my beard, but what to do with my cleverness?

              So, in this case, there is a problem with the "mind". If you hope for such a future, I am simply sorry for you. You will remain marginalized.
              1. Digital error Offline Digital error
                Digital error (Eugene) 9 February 2021 13: 41
                -3
                Quote: 123
                On the "other side" everything would be much sadder.

                Well, with the coronavirus vaccine, for sure, ours is being delivered to the LDNR yes .
                Plus - LDNR is not obliged to pay% to the IMF. Minus - is obliged to pay to the Russian Federation (at least - by loyalty). With regard to housing and communal services, I am convinced that the low prices for housing and communal services in the LPNR of the Russian Federation are sponsored by its taxpayers. As for the "Natsiks" - they are there, of course, but there are not so many kakbe of them, as propaganda broadcasts, separating our peoples. Ask Shariy - he has enough people of his own there, he will confirm (yes, first you need to find out who Shariy is lol )

                Quote: 123
                Will two well-known people in narrow circles share a portfolio?

                This is an example of the inevitable replacement of the old with the new. Yavlinsky is tired of the political struggle, but does not want to leave selfish interests. He thinks about himself, not about the country. A kick in the ass, but human rights get in the way request

                Quote: 123
                The opposition is really "bullshit", whether it is in disarray or not, does not matter.

                Do not dissemble stop This is of paramount importance for the stability of the state. The presence of a powerful opposition is the very system of checks and balances that prevents the authorities from “losing their shores” and ensures that they respect the civil rights of ordinary people.

                Quote: 123
                You are like Oleg again

                Who is Oleg? Sorry, but I don't really follow your verbal battles with other commentators.

                Quote: 123
                in this case with the "mind" of the problem

                And about "woe from wit" have you heard? There are far fewer fools than you think (you want?). And even if so, the adopted practice of "think for fools" will not lead to stability - fools have as many rights as you - let them live as they want, why are you attached to them? lol

                Quote: 123
                You will remain marginalized

                What horror and shame, I’ll go rather dissolve in an all-embracing crowd laughing
                1. 123 Offline 123
                  123 (123) 9 February 2021 14: 07
                  +5
                  Minus - is obliged to pay to the Russian Federation (at least - by loyalty).

                  What is the disadvantage? Isn't that required on the other side? Would you like them to try to stage a coup in Moscow or just talk through your lips?

                  With regards to housing and communal services, I am convinced that the low prices for housing and communal services in the LPNR are sponsored by the Russian Federation at the expense of its taxpayers.

                  Are you against? Do you want to make their life as difficult as possible? On the other side, "the whole world is with us," but only in words, but here, like all "progressive people" PUTINVSESLIL.

                  As for the "Nazis" - they are there, of course, but there are not so many of them, as propaganda broadcasts, separating our peoples

                  And no one says that there is every second, but they have leverage. It's not about quantity. The bug is small and smelly. Are you trying to write it down for them too? They say it's okay, there are not many of them, bear with me? How you treat them liberally. You can't do that with them. All jackals for a count. Don't you think that the prohibition of the Russian language is separation by chance?

                  Ask Shariy - he has enough of his own people there, he will confirm

                  Let's leave the party leader alone. Can we listen to his wife?



                  And about "woe from wit" have you heard?

                  Do you think the worse the better?

                  There are far fewer fools than you think (you want?). And even if so, the adopted practice of "think for fools" will not lead to stability - fools have as many rights as you - let them live as they want, why are you attached to them?

                  Am I attached? belay You posted it yourself.
                  Let them live as they want, and I suppose the rest should live as they want. It is not necessary to impose on the sane majority of fools in power.

                  What horror and shame, I’ll go rather dissolve in an all-embracing crowd

                  I'm afraid it will be difficult to do and changing the hairstyle will not help here.
                  1. Digital error Offline Digital error
                    Digital error (Eugene) 9 February 2021 14: 48
                    -3
                    Quote: 123
                    What is the disadvantage? Isn't that required on the other side?

                    This is also a minus - they declared independence from one country and became dependent on another. Underestimated the degree of attraction, so to speak. But this is the reality for all quasi-state entities.

                    Quote: 123
                    Are you against?

                    Vs. Let's pay for Ukraine% of the IMF - Russian people live there.

                    Quote: 123
                    Do you want to make their life as difficult as possible?

                    Of course not. I want them to prosper at the expense of their taxpayers, not ours. Probably, it was so (to be friends, not to depend) originally conceived by those who are already in the ground ("field" commanders of the "first draft"), but the results of the revolution were once again used by the villains.

                    Quote: 123
                    Don't you think that the prohibition of the Russian language is separation by chance?

                    This is a violation of human rights - a person must decide for himself what language he speaks. The propaganda, acting as always clumsy (this is where the mind is lacking), overdid it, turning the "Ukrainians" into "Natsiks."

                    Quote: 123
                    Not worth the sane majority of fools

                    So a sane majority won't vote for fools, right? lol
                    Here the thing is - no matter how and for whom the majority votes, it is more comfortable for him to believe that it is it who is sane. Themselves, I suppose, sanely at one time voted for Yeltsin? lol

                    Quote: 123
                    I'm afraid it will be difficult to do

                    Do not be afraid. Free people in a free country should not be afraid smile
                    1. boriz Offline boriz
                      boriz (boriz) 9 February 2021 15: 44
                      +5
                      The propaganda, acting as always clumsy (this is where the mind is lacking), overdid it, turning the "Ukrainians" into "Natsiks."

                      That is, all this is kurtosis of the performer? Do you remember when Bandera streets began to appear in Ukraine? Here in Kalush she appeared on 25.12.1990/14.10.1990/XNUMX. Under the USSR, the Communist Party and the Communist Party of Ukraine. And the first monument to Bandera was in the village of Stary Ugrinov in Ivano Frankivsk region on XNUMX/XNUMX/XNUMX. Was this what the propaganda department of the Ivano Frankovsk regional committee of the Communist Party of Ukraine was doing? Although, this is very likely.
                    2. 123 Offline 123
                      123 (123) 9 February 2021 19: 16
                      +3
                      This is also a minus - they declared independence from one country and became dependent on another.

                      What do you mean, is this addiction? Non-availability is rather a trend in Kiev. Donetsk is not forced to refuse the vaccine, they do not require the export of timber, and so on.

                      Underestimated the degree of attraction, so to speak. But this is the reality for all quasi-state entities.

                      Tell it to Kiev "patriots" laughing they consider themselves extremely independent.

                      Vs. Let's pay for Ukraine% of the IMF - Russian people live there.

                      You never know where the Russian people live, they are in Australia too. Ukraine goes to Europe, even if it "grunts" there. Moreover, the Russian language is prohibited there. This is not a friendly state and only extremely narrow-minded people can support this. Is it about you? Fortunately, your opinion is not decisive, due to the small number of like-minded people.

                      Of course not. I want them to prosper at the expense of their taxpayers, not ours.

                      Then we need to help them get back on their feet in another way, for example, to stop the shelling from Ukraine. True, for this you have to hang garlands of Nazi admirers on the lanterns. As for me, this is not a big price for the peaceful life of Donbass children.
                      Or do you still want to throw them and let them flounder themselves? You understand that they themselves will not survive in these conditions.

                      Probably, it was so (to be friends, not to depend) originally conceived by those who are already in the ground ("field" commanders of the "first draft"),

                      How do you know? Wasn't it spontaneous? People did not accept the Bandera coup, and then how it went. I doubt that someone was planning the future of Donbass in the long term.

                      but the results of the revolution were once again used by the villains.

                      And don't tell me, this Maidan bastard continues to plunder the country.

                      This is a violation of human rights - a person must decide for himself what language he speaks. The propaganda, acting as always clumsy (this is where the mind is lacking), overdid it, turning the "Ukrainians" into "Natsiks."

                      Come on, Nazis, Nazi accomplices, the difference is not great. It is not necessary to lay out feces according to varieties. All Ukrainians are not called Natsik by any official propaganda. Be kind enough to give an example, or I'm starting to think that you, how would it be softer ... tend to tell the truth. smile

                      So a sane majority won't vote for fools, right?

                      Exactly yes

                      Here the thing is - no matter how and for whom the majority votes, it is more comfortable for him to believe that it is it who is sane. Themselves, I suppose, sanely at one time voted for Yeltsin?

                      Was the case yes I confess. It's young green ... Lack of information ... In the army, you know, a ballot box was put in the tent for voting, who knows what was going on in the country. We didn't even have a TV at that time. They were interested in more pressing issues, for example, to find drinking water and firewood for a potbelly stove. laughing Everything was seen in a slightly different light, the President of the RSFSR is just an official, as the head of state he was not considered. “Her Majesty the CPSU” was not particularly interested in the personality of the next “great helmsman” then in the opinion of the people, so the outcome of her reign is natural.
                      That's all, I didn't vote for him anymore. The Bialowieza Agreement and other arts this bastard created at their own discretion. I have huge doubts about the honesty of the next elections. The only male act of EBN, the transfer of power and departure, did not wait for the gun carriage.
                      1. Digital error Offline Digital error
                        Digital error (Eugene) 9 February 2021 20: 18
                        -1
                        Quote: 123
                        Is it about you? Fortunately, your opinion is not decisive, due to the small number of like-minded people.

                        Sometimes it's better to be silent when there is nothing to say laughing good

                        Quote: 123
                        Young green ... Lack of information ... In the army, you know

                        And let's this ... that ... deprive young people (under 50 ... no, under 60!) Of voting rights? For they do not know what they are doing lol

                        Quote: 123
                        EBN's only male act, transfer of power and leaving

                        Not the only one, although undoubtedly important (as far as I know, the Duma during his presidency did not pass laws on his immunity after his resignation). At first, he was not afraid to take this power - they hindered him and could destroy both physically and politically. But he took a chance.
                      2. 123 Offline 123
                        123 (123) 9 February 2021 22: 00
                        0
                        And let's this ... that ... deprive young people (under 50 ... no, under 60!) Of voting rights? For they do not know what they are doing

                        Not worth it. You just need to work with young people, take them out of the influence of foreign propaganda and its local representatives and agents. Well, it's a good idea to pre-select candidates. I believe the development of science allows you to do this. But the question is rather complicated and it is a subject for a separate discussion.

                        Not the only one, although, undoubtedly, important (as far as I know, the Duma during his presidency did not pass laws on his immunity after his resignation).

                        He didn't need it. As practice has shown, the receiver's word of honor is a reliable guarantee. Who will be next is not known, but many have a tooth.

                        At first he was not afraid to take this power - they interfered with him and could destroy both physically and politically. But he took a chance.

                        Take? He stole it and destroyed the country. This is the price of his ambition.
              2. Dear sofa expert. 10 February 2021 13: 29
                +1
                With regards to housing and communal services, I am convinced that the low prices for housing and communal services in the LPNR are sponsored by the Russian Federation at the expense of its taxpayers.

                What are your beliefs based on?
                The utilities tariff is regulated by the following utilities scheme:

                The first link - RSO:

                (Resource supplying organizations) - legal entities and individual entrepreneurs who provide utility resources and supply them directly to places of direct consumption.
                https://uslugi-gkh.ru/zhilishhnye-uslugi/rso-v-zhkh/

                The next link is IKU (Utility Service Provider) HOA / UO.

                Housing legislation provides that one of the parties to the management agreement is the management organization, but the second party can be both the owners and the HOA or housing cooperative. That is, if an HOA is created in a house, this HOA has some "freedom of maneuver" - it can either manage the house independently, or conclude a service agreement with any organization, or conclude a management agreement with a managing organization, transferring management functions to it. That is, even if the owners refuse to manage the house by the managing organization and they choose the method of managing the homeowners' partnership, there is no guarantee that the created HOA will not enter into a management agreement with the MA, and the house will not be managed by the managing organization, despite the existence of the HOA.

                https://acato.ru/articles/20160126/vzaimodejstvie-tszh-s-uo

                And the last link is consumers.

                It's all.

                Explain, please, where did you see the "space" for "robbing" Russian taxpayers ???
                1. Digital error Offline Digital error
                  Digital error (Eugene) 10 February 2021 15: 54
                  0
                  Quote: Dear sofa expert.
                  Where did you see the "space" for "robbing" Russian taxpayers ???

                  In previous decisions of the Russian government:

                  Russia will help the self-proclaimed LPR, whose territory on the night of April 25, Ukraine cut off the electricity supply. This was announced on April 25 by the plenipotentiary representative of Russia in the contact group for resolving the situation in eastern Ukraine, Boris Gryzlov: "In accordance with the actions of the Ukrainian authorities, the Russian government made a decision to provide electricity from the Russian Federation within the framework of humanitarian support." To whose account these costs will be attributed, he did not say ... The Russian authorities back in 2015 found a way to reflect the supply of electricity of this kind in the official data, RBC sources say. After Ukraine refused to pay for the supply of Russian electricity to the LPR and DPR in the summer of 2015, their debts were actually "smeared" on industrial consumers in Russia, one of the authors of this scheme and a federal official told RBC. Formally, the volume of supplies was attributed to the normative losses of FGC (owns the trunk networks in Russia), they explain. These losses are covered by the tariff for industrial consumers, says Sergei Pikin of the Energy Development Fund.

                  https://www.rbc.ru/newspaper/2017/04/26/58ff22ad9a79475ba750b653
                  What do you think - at whose expense the incurred losses are compensated by Russian industrial consumers - are they engaged in charity work or include them in the cost of production? request
                  1. Dear sofa expert. 10 February 2021 16: 08
                    +1
                    their debts were actually "smeared" on industrial consumers in Russia, one of the authors of this scheme and a federal official told RBC.

                    Well, it's not serious, really, to refer to the opinion of RBC (see media - foreign agents).

                    one of the authors of this scheme and a federal official

                    - this is vaasche, cool.)

                    You would still have the "authoritative" and "objective" opinion of the gn. Navalny was voiced.)))
                    1. Digital error Offline Digital error
                      Digital error (Eugene) 10 February 2021 17: 12
                      0
                      Quote: Dear sofa expert.
                      Well, it's not serious, really, to refer to the opinion of RBC

                      What are you, apologists for stability, predictable laughing
                      https://www.interfax.ru/russia/559956
                      https://minenergo.gov.ru/node/3027
                    2. Dear sofa expert. 10 February 2021 18: 22
                      +1
                      What are you, apologists for stability, predictable laughing
                      https://www.interfax.ru/russia/559956
                      https://minenergo.gov.ru/node/3027

                      And apologists of instability, themselves delve into the links that they send?)

                      Regarding Pikin, director of the NPO Energy Development Fund, as well as a member of the NPO Leaders Club for the Promotion of Business Initiatives (NPO ASI) ... Well, everything seems to speak for itself.
                      These are not government organizations. The one who pays is the one who dances. Here is RBC in your hand. )

                      Regarding the article in "Iterfax": where is it from the text that it can be seen that Russia made free supplies of electricity?

                      It says that:

                      Gryzlov.
                      "In accordance with the actions of the Ukrainian authorities, the Russian government made a decision to ensure electricity supply from the Russian Federation within the framework of humanitarian support," Gryzlov said.

                      Within the framework of humanitarian support, not within the framework of "gratuitous aid".
                      And further, it is already being specified:

                      ... for residents of Donbass, in the conditions of a deliberate economic blockade by Ukraine, there is no opportunity to pay for electricity. This issue, of course, will be discussed tomorrow at the contact group and its economic subgroup, "Gryzlov stressed.

                      Yes, the issue was discussed, some kind of joint and acceptable decision was made, and electricity supplies began.

                      Where did you come to the conclusion about "shifting the payment onto the shoulders of Russian taxpayers"?

                      This could be, for example, credit financing, or the use of funds from special funds to finance humanitarian operations (yes, at least the same UN fund, a permanent shareholder, and therefore a user of which, is Russia.
                      (https://www.unjiu.org/sites/www.unjiu.org/files/jiu_rep_2012_11_russian.pdf)

                      It could have been some other solution. Who should report to you about this ???

                      So bawlers like you appear, who, after reading "pike & Co", carry this heresy "to the people."
                    3. Digital error Offline Digital error
                      Digital error (Eugene) 10 February 2021 19: 02
                      0
                      Quote: Dear sofa expert.
                      These are not government organizations

                      Yeah. This is what the minenergo link address says.gov. Ru
                      Something tells me that "gov" is from the word "government", doesn't it?

                      Quote: Dear sofa expert.
                      As part of humanitarian support, not as part of "grant aid"

                      I didn’t claim that. I argued that I was against the banquet at the expense of Russian taxpayers, of which (the banquet) I was personally convinced. If you want to dispel my doubts - go ahead. Not convincing yet.

                      Quote: Dear sofa expert.
                      This could be, for example, loan financing

                      Which confirms another my thesis about the change of addiction from one to another. I wanted friendship request Let's do it - do you want to be dependent or free? The answer, I think, is obvious smile

                      Quote: Dear sofa expert.
                      Who should report this to you?

                      I do not need it. I am able to compare the cause with the effect myself, thanks to the Soviet education.

                      Quote: Dear sofa expert.
                      So these bawlers appear

                      "Intraspecific" (citizens of the Russian Federation) distinctions have not been canceled. Whatever you call me (propaganda always resorts to derogatory epithets - apparently, for the absence of stronger arguments), I have the same right to represent my interests in parliament as you do. The problem is that, unlike you, I have no choice. And this is not normal in the proclaimed democratic state system. Have a nice evening dear hi
                    4. Dear sofa expert. 10 February 2021 19: 52
                      +1
                      I didn’t claim that. I argued that I was against the banquet at the expense of Russian taxpayers, of which (the banquet) I was personally convinced. If you want to dispel my doubts - go ahead. Not convincing yet.

                      Don’t get out! Approved. What are the ".. banquet at the expense of ..")?))
                      Here is - literally what you said:

                      With regards to housing and communal services, I am convinced that the low prices for housing and communal services in the LPNR are sponsored by the Russian Federation at the expense of its taxpayers.

                      This is a belief based statement

                      Prove your "beliefs" first.

                      Not convincing yet.)

                      Which confirms my one more thesis about the change of addiction from one to another. And I wanted friendship request Let's do it - do you want to be dependent or free? The answer, I think, is obvious

                      Demagogy. Don't agree that the supply of electricity to the DPR / LPR could have been financed with the loan provided? If not, justify the impossibility.

                      I do not need it. I am able to compare the cause with the effect myself, thanks to the Soviet education.

                      Well, if it is not necessary, then why are you spreading the discussion here?
                      Sit and passionately admire your Soviet diploma, and silently compare the cause and effect relationships. )

                      I have the same right to represent my interests in parliament as you do.

                      Nobody disputed them with you.

                      And all the best to you this evening.
                      Think more about the good!)
                    5. Digital error Offline Digital error
                      Digital error (Eugene) 10 February 2021 20: 21
                      0
                      Quote: Dear sofa expert.
                      Don’t get out! Approved

                      Despair, I suppose? "Shot" of the last resort? laughing

                      Quote: Dear sofa expert.
                      Here is - literally what you said:

                      And I'm ready to repeat - how can you refute? wink

                      Quote: Dear sofa expert.
                      Prove your "beliefs" first.

                      Already proven by links to the press. You are not enough - you and refute lol

                      Quote: Dear sofa expert.
                      Don't agree that the supply of electricity to the DPR / LPR could have been financed with the loan provided?

                      I agree. In doing so, you become dependent on the lender. You should take financial literacy courses, otherwise you will ... be mistaken laughing

                      Quote: Dear sofa expert.
                      why are you making discussions here?

                      To ensure that the sediment remains before the elections. Isn't it obvious? Or maybe it's forbidden? wink

                      Quote: Dear sofa expert.
                      No one disputed them with you

                      And they could not, even if they wanted to. For this it is necessary to amend the Constitution, and for this, as practice shows, it will take another 20 years - until the children of the current "leaders" grow old and do not want "guarantees of immunity" smile request

                      Quote: Dear sofa expert.
                      Think more about the good!

                      Thinking is not enough. You need to do it - then it will come faster. The Yabloko party is well aware of this, and Dmitry Anatolyevich strongly supports:

                    6. Dear sofa expert. 10 February 2021 20: 40
                      +2
                      Despair, I suppose? "Shot" of the last resort?

                      I don't know, you know better.)

                      I agree. In doing so, you become dependent on the lender. You should take financial literacy courses, otherwise you will ... be mistaken

                      Well ... the beginning was good. It would be smarter to stop at the first word.

                      And they could not, even if they wanted to. For this it is necessary to amend the Constitution, and for this, as practice shows, it will take another 20 years - until the children of the current "leaders" grow old and do not want "guarantees of immunity"

                      Again ... the same demagoguery, chatter, idle chatter ...

                      Have a nice evening dear

                      Your words?)
                      Get some rest for today. Collect your thoughts. Tomorrow will be a new day.)
                      Good luck!
                  2. Digital error Offline Digital error
                    Digital error (Eugene) 10 February 2021 21: 06
                    0
                    Quote: Dear sofa expert.
                    Think more about the good!

                    So I think - how to pick up a rhyme for the name Zavalny? Anal'ny? Oval? Rectangular parallelepiped? laughing
                  3. Digital error Offline Digital error
                    Digital error (Eugene) 10 February 2021 21: 22
                    +1
                    Quote: DigitalError
                    like a rhyme to the name Zavalny

                    Although no, what am I talking about. Respected person. According to Wikipedia, in 2011, Zavalny's and his wife's income amounted to more than 250,6 million rubles. The family owns 4 land plots with a total area of ​​6 thousand square meters, a residential building with an area of ​​706 square meters, an apartment, Bentley Continental Flying Spur, Porsche Cayenne and Mercedes-Benz cars.
                    In the ranking of incomes of State Duma deputies for 2011, Zavalny took 10th place. Not the beneficiary, by any chance, Inter RAO? Although no, they (deputies) are not allowed to do business by law. Of course not - the most honest person. I confess that I thought badly about him - seriously. I won't do it anymore.
                  4. Dear sofa expert. 10 February 2021 23: 09
                    +2
                    doing business is not legally allowed.

                    Can you tell me who elected this rich man a State Duma Deputy? After all, he already had the condition you indicated?
      2. Digital error Offline Digital error
        Digital error (Eugene) 10 February 2021 18: 00
        0
        Quote: Dear sofa expert.
        Would you still be here

        By the way, since I'm here smile and it's about electricity.
        On August 13, the head of Inter RAO complained to the president that electricity costs four times cheaper for Russians than for Europeans:
        https://iz.ru/1047894/maksim-khodykin/svetovoi-razbor-rossiiane-platiat-za-energiiu-vchetvero-menshe-evropeitcev
        And here's a coincidence -

        Capacity prices for 2020 jumped above inflation: in the first price zone by 14,3% at once, up to 888,4 thousand rubles. per 1 MW, and in the second - by 7,1%, up to 652,2 thousand rubles.
        Capacity payments include mandatory non-market surcharges, mainly for the construction of power plants under the Capacity Supply Agreement (CSA) mechanism. Last year, the total payment increased due to the commissioning of a power unit at Novovoronezh NPP-2, Zaramagskaya HPP-1 and new renewable energy sources, as well as an increase in the price of some new TPPs under the CDA program. Moreover, due to a decrease in demand, the total payment was distributed to a smaller number of consumers, which was the reason for the increase in unit prices.

        https://www.kommersant.ru/doc/4681667
        Well, that is, demand is growing - prices are rising. Demand is falling, but prices are still rising laughing I'm afraid to imagine what will happen to electricity prices after the elections. lol
        Well, but what - I pay 400 rubles, and if the cost of a kilowatt is increased by 1000%, I will pay 4000 rubles a month. Key word - I WILL PAY. Otherwise, what - to live in darkness, like ancestors, without a kettle and the Internet? In general, the groundwork here for Doing Business is fantastic request

        Today, Inter RAO is one of the most successful holdings on the domestic electricity market, according to the Russian parliament. - This is a modern company that understands what sustainable development is. She is engaged in modernization, new energy, including solar. This company good potential and great future- Pavel Zavalny, head of the Duma Committee on Energy, told Izvestia.

        yes
      3. Dear sofa expert. 10 February 2021 23: 34
        +2
        demand grows - prices rise. Demand is falling, but prices are still rising

        Well, yes, everything is logical. Capitalism, market economy, inflation.
        Demand grows - prices rise.
        Prices are rising, wages are rising.
        Wages are growing, demand is growing,
        Demand grows - prices rise.

        But it also happens: demand falls - and prices still rise, because those who produce what the demand has temporarily dropped also want their wages to rise, along with those where demand is growing, prices are rising, they are growing prices - salaries are rising ... etc.

        Well, what about - I pay 400 rubles, and if the cost of a kilowatt is increased by 1000%, I will pay 4000 rubles a month.

        400 rubles? How do you do it? Do you have a kettle?)
  • Ar-Deko Offline Ar-Deko
    Ar-Deko (Ar-Deko _) 9 February 2021 10: 43
    -7
    There is no need to invent any excuses for the Kremlin's actions - everything has long been clear. In 2014, in the eyes of the whole world, Russia proved to be a cowardly, patient country. From Lavrov's appeals to "partners" to start a "substantive dialogue", one wants to puke.
    1. boriz Offline boriz
      boriz (boriz) 9 February 2021 15: 12
      +4
      Politics is the art of the possible. The one that does not understand this - they fly out like Trump.
      And the actions of both Russia and Lavrov are changing noticeably. And in the new year, the changes in the world will be simply dizzying.

      ... I feel like throwing up.

      Maybe that's why you are not Lavrov?
  • Ivancarafuto Offline Ivancarafuto
    Ivancarafuto (Ivan) 9 February 2021 11: 01
    +3
    If nobody wanted to "SAVE" and does not want to, then why would Russia and Putin need it?
  • BMP-2 Offline BMP-2
    BMP-2 (Vladimir V.) 9 February 2021 12: 26
    +2
    If a country, choosing between war and shame, chooses shame, it gets both war and shame

    (c) Winston Churchill.
    In general, the situation resembles an explanatory note:

    I didn't come to school yesterday because I didn't want to. If I want to - and tomorrow I won't come!
  • Victor Yakushev Offline Victor Yakushev
    Victor Yakushev (Victor Yakushev) 9 February 2021 14: 03
    -5
    Everything is very simple, I would take it and there is nothing to feed, who knows how Donbass lives now? He lives poorly, there is no money, and drunken militants squeeze out everything that is possible in lawlessness, but start feeding them all hard, so there may not be money left for the Byalorussians, and there is still a lot of money for which money is needed, let America feed, they have a lot of money ...
  • boriz Offline boriz
    boriz (boriz) 9 February 2021 14: 23
    +8
    Well, another person appeared who wanted to tell Russia how she is guilty before Ukraine and what she was wrong about.
    It is not enough for us Montyan, who, with her eyes widening, paints the historical guilt of Russia before Ukraine and rejoices how soon this Russia will be very bad right now (the videos were written in early summer and autumn). Now Volkonsky has joined her. Ask for forgiveness and repent! Yeah, right now! Putin did everything right. And in 2014. with Ukraine and in 2020. with Belarus.
    Volodya, you are in the wrong place. Not in a commentary format to repeat what I have written here many times. But you wrote this post in vain.
    And there is no need to write the next two posts.
    For years, only Marzhetsky and some all-fledged people have been broadcasting about the victory of the "American" LNG. The bulk of this was laughing. The United States will not have enough gas (and now it will decrease, God forbid), nor the number of gas carriers in the world. Also, the chemical composition of LNG will not significantly squeeze the Russian pipeline gas. And that's not to mention the price difference and logistics.
    And speaking about GTS, you forget about GDS. Both of these systems are now supported by Russian transit.
    Moreover, GTS and GDS do not exist separately. GDS is tied to GTS. And this system can exist normally only when the gas constantly flows from east to west, creating normal pressure in the pipe. When this flow and gas pressure is gone, the life of this system will remain a maximum of 6 - 3 years. And its content will completely fall on Ukraine, from where within 5 months the last gas specialists will flee to Poland, who will have a salary of 3 euros or more.
    If they still remain by then.

    Why shoot yourself in the foot and refuse Ukrainian transit? What is our reason for this?

    And you take a closer look at the Baltics. No thoughts arise?
    Putting in place of fucking transiters is Putin's long-term policy. And I agree with that 200%.
    Either we criticize him for his weak reaction to the dirty tricks towards Russia, then, suddenly, we must feel sorry for everyone.
    For 29 years of independence, Ukraine has drunk a lot of blood from Russia. Those $ 100 billion that Medvedev called are small splashes. They got so used to freebies that they put Tymoshenko in prison for an agreement in which gas prices for Ukraine were brought to the European level.

    Want to kill Ukraine ...

    And I do not like the state of Ukraine in its current form. And I have my own vision of the question of why Putin has not yet included the LPNR in the Russian Federation. And I think he's right.
    And about Biden. It's not about its green program. Biden has come to kill the United States and is coping with it successfully. His green program is scary for Americans. Let me not, I will not cry. And the EU's green program is terrible for Europe. And here, too, I see no reason to be upset.
    1. Victor Yakushev Offline Victor Yakushev
      Victor Yakushev (Victor Yakushev) 9 February 2021 15: 03
      -10%
      All of you are correct, LNG GTS ... But without Kiev, Russia is Asia with slanting and what I don’t remember with Mayakovsky’s eyes for a long time. Kalmyk, Chinese and Buryat your friend now for a very long time ...
      1. boriz Offline boriz
        boriz (boriz) 9 February 2021 15: 06
        +6
        First, Block.
        Secondly, Kiev, as a beacon of culture for Russia, is a heavy, painful delirium.
      2. 123 Offline 123
        123 (123) 9 February 2021 19: 27
        +4
        Asia with slanting and what I don’t remember with the eyes of Mayakovsky for a long time has not been reread by Kalmyk, Chinese and Buryat your friend is now for a very long time ...

        How did the Buryats displease you? Do you consider yourself better?
        Russia and without Kiev Russia, Ukraine without Russia, slaves and hicks.
        1. A.Lex Offline A.Lex
          A.Lex (Secret information) 10 February 2021 12: 54
          +1
          123, no, they are not hicks ... You think too highly of them. They are what the psheks called them, well, you remember - cattle (what's the Pshek language?). Let them get used to their old name.
        2. Victor Yakushev Offline Victor Yakushev
          Victor Yakushev (Victor Yakushev) 12 February 2021 06: 39
          -1
          How can you even say that your food is bad, everyone knows about it, the clothes are bad or I made it up myself? You only have good mythical missiles, but you need to take it on faith, the Chinese is your brother for a century, but in this century he will buy you all, if he has not already bought it ... How can you not see this
      3. A.Lex Offline A.Lex
        A.Lex (Secret information) 10 February 2021 12: 52
        0
        Vitenka, do you consider yourself an "enlightened Gayer"? Oh well...
    2. Volkonsky Offline Volkonsky
      Volkonsky (Wolf) 9 February 2021 19: 40
      -2
      It's not enough for us Montyan, who, with her eyes widening, paints the historical guilt of Russia before Ukraine and rejoices how soon this Russia will be very bad right now (the videos were written in early summer and autumn). Now Volkonsky has joined her. Ask for forgiveness and repent! Yeah, right now! Putin did everything right. And in 2014. with Ukraine and in 2020. with Belarus.
      Either we criticize him for his weak reaction to mean things in the direction of Russia, then, suddenly, we should feel sorry for everyone.

      Don't attribute to me what I didn't say! This time! Find the bold one in my article! Not? Does not work? Then you have obvious problems with the perception of printed text, at best, the block responsible for tracking causal relationships is damaged. I advise the comrade, hiding under the guise of boriz (boriz), to reread Samuel Clemens (better known as Mark Twain) more often before giving advice to Volkonsky what to do and what not. You don't need to tell me what to do, then I won't tell you where to go!
      1. boriz Offline boriz
        boriz (boriz) 9 February 2021 21: 23
        +6
        I did not single out the words highlighted to you as quotations. This is the general meaning. And quotes:

        Why didn't Putin intervene in the events in Ukraine in 2014? Why left the country ...

        First of all, Putin has the country of the Russian Federation in his hands. He took care of her.

        And these reasons for the entire existence of mankind are only two! Pride and greed. In our case, the word "greed" can be replaced by the word "money". We sweep aside pride, Putin is not Erdogan and one cannot suspect him of this, he is not guided by such base reflexes, in 2014 it was money that pushed him to this erroneous, from my point of view, decision.

        That's right, money. Not the ones you think about.
        You place the blame on Putin, therefore, our president was wrong, guilty and must repent.
        Those who have lived all their lives in Russia felt very well the money that went to help the LDNR and Crimea. And the people reacted with full understanding to these losses. And Putin perfectly calculated what an attempt to hang on the neck of the Russian people all 28 million (at that time) Ukrainians would lead to, who would quickly stand in a pose occupied by evil Muscovites and would demand to feed them and restore the merged and plundered industry and infrastructure.
        Even in the LPNR then they were not ready to defend their independence on their own.
        They are ready to vote, but not really to do something. I remember very well. how long they could not recruit people to the cutting edge. It was only later that they realized what would await them in the controlled territory.
        That is, we had to feel sorry for and support these 28 million. It certainly would have destroyed our country.
        Thank God, you are not our president, but Putin.
        And we have already supported them enough, only they do not remember this and do not feel gratitude.
        Yeltsin simply gave Ukraine Sevastopol, and then paid the rent. Ukraine paid pennies for gas, as a result of which Russia simply created competition on its own markets in the face of Ukrainian enterprises, which received gas cheaper than Russian ones. At first, Ukraine received gas practically free of charge. This has long been forgotten. And last year Gazprom signed, to put it mildly, a strange transit agreement, taking into account Zelensky's promises in the Donbass. Putin kept his promise, and Ukraine, as always, threw it off.
        Putin was absolutely right. And you, like Montyan and the rest of Ukraine, are sick with Ukrainians. And Putin wants to knock it out of all of you. As well as dependency (rooted in the times of the USSR) from all the former "fraternal" republics. And he is 100 times right.
      2. boriz Offline boriz
        boriz (boriz) 9 February 2021 21: 31
        +2
        Somehow I’ll figure it out without you when to be silent and when to speak.
        And it is necessary to object not with emotional outbursts, but in fact. If in fact there is nothing to object, splashes will not correct the picture of general helplessness.
        1. Volkonsky Offline Volkonsky
          Volkonsky (Wolf) 9 February 2021 22: 11
          -2
          The one who knows does not speak; the one who speaks does not know.

          I do not accuse Putin of anything, on the contrary, I explain why he could not have acted otherwise. At stake was 51% of the country's budget. But you read between the lines, the Ukrainians are to blame for everything. This is no longer for me!
          1. boriz Offline boriz
            boriz (boriz) 9 February 2021 22: 18
            +1
            Are you really that, or are you pretending? Don't you understand the meaning of the word "error"?
            1. Volkonsky Offline Volkonsky
              Volkonsky (Wolf) 9 February 2021 23: 06
              -3
              The psychiatrist one floor up! I pass! Not my profile. I don’t communicate with people who cannot see the forest behind the picket fence. Are you able to perceive the general meaning of the text or only individual sentences? You take the word out of context, at most a phrase, the paragraph is no longer subject to you. Special fo yu, below I summarize what was said, read it again. You can use the syllables. If it doesn't, then it's definitely not for me, in medicine such a case is described as dyslexia

              Therefore, summing up what has been said, I can summarize that for all the resentment of the Russian-speaking and pro-Russian-oriented Ukrainians against Putin, he did not have much choice in the events of 7 years ago. He acted according to the circumstances, playing back and minimizing the risks for the Russian Federation with the second number. The first number, as sad as it is for me to admit it, was our sworn "friends and partners". There was a small chance to keep Ukraine in the orbit of Russian influence right at the time of the coup (December 2013 - January 2014), but the Kremlin then showed indecision, from the sidelines watching from the side how everything would end, and Yanukovych showed cowardice and political shortsightedness, succumbing to the persuasions of Western observers and making a deal with the conspirators. How it ended for him, you know. What ended for Russia - too. The Kremlin and Putin in particular drew the appropriate conclusions from this. The main conclusion is that under no circumstances can one trust the West, they will deceive, smile and deceive again, and then they will say that you simply misunderstood them. 6 years later in Belarus, Putin has not repeated his past mistakes. And that was the main lesson he learned from the Ukrainian events.
              1. boriz Offline boriz
                boriz (boriz) 9 February 2021 23: 31
                +6
                Even trickier. Putin made it clear that Obama asked him to persuade Yanukovych not to use force and promised that everything would be fine. And then he threw him. Where is detachment, where is indecision? Are you holding Putin for an idiot?
                That is why he saved Yanukovych and now contains. And this is also not a mistake. He could not directly express disbelief at Obama's words.
                And there is no need to hide behind the quotes of the classics and verbiage.

                Wrong ... decision

                - this is the fault of the person who made this decision. Putin was not mistaken in this situation.

                ... left the country ...

                He is not obliged to this country and is not responsible for it in any way. And why - I explained.
                Say one thing, mean another. Bipolar disorder.
                This is for a psychiatrist.
                1. A.Lex Offline A.Lex
                  A.Lex (Secret information) 10 February 2021 13: 00
                  -1
                  That's it, he was offended and wrote such that he was "edited" ... But in fact, you said correctly (as, by the way, and 123) ...
                  I wrote to one here (Tolik was his name):

                  laughing That's right, Tolya, smart girl! There is no need to disguise! Show all your vile essence of a Russophobe and anti-Soviet! All of you there are smeared with one world. You only Russia has collapsed into ndtsat small principalities. DO NOT WAIT, bastards ... You still go to war with us (as you threaten). Then we will arrange for you to laugh - TO DEATH! Let's remember everything - and how the country was ruined in the early 90s, and how YOU lay down under the Yankees (and never got out of their bed), and watched themselves - as if to claim a piece from Russia. What yenga you from the Yankees do not require loot and everything else for the maintenance? Buy gas from them, that you whine that Russia ALWAYS owes you something? You bastards sat on the neck of Russia with almost ALL CONSCIOUS HISTORY, dangling your legs and demanding something-there-yes-more! And here, blah fly, in the Urals, in stores, sweets were brought in on BIG holidays (I'm not talking about melted caramel sticking together without wrappers) and ice cream TWO TIMES A WEEK (I just remember that time). There was no meat in the stores (praise the Lord, the collective farmers even sold at the agricultural market), so that the children had to be dressed for school, they had to go to the regional center (THERE WAS NOTHING WAY IN THE DISTRICT CENTER) - only there the uniform could be taken IN SEPTEMBER (when the school was already full). It was not possible to buy a car, a motorcycle, or a TV with a refrigerator (only in millionaire collective farms, collective farmers signed up for many years to come ... and bought it for retirement). To go to the sea - wherever there! No vouchers, all vacation to the top of the ass in the gardens - so that even in the winter there was something to eat. ..........
                  I know how YOU lived there in the Baltics and the Ukraine: I drove by myself (when my father was a military man), and my wife told me (her relatives lived there - in the Ukrainian SSR). And how you hated RUSSIAN RELATIVES, who came to visit you, ONLY !!!
                  And now - YOU SEPARATED-SO !!! WHERE IS YOUR VOLGOTNAYA LIFE (as in the USSR) ??? Where are your factories and factories with shipyards? Where am I asking you? After all, you BUILD them ALL UNION !!! And you? YOU'RE EVERYTHING ABOUT ... EVERYTHING !!!!!!!!!!! And for what ??? For the sake of yelling now - RUSSIA, give ???
                  Well, here you are - THREE-FINGER FIGURE !!!!!!!!!!!!
                  Go to those to whom you have been striving for all these years (including the time of the USSR) - to the west. Let them now support you. We already see today how they contain you - they ripped you off as sticky, like the last suckers, and your fellow citizens-oligarchs also help them - RIP YOU!
                  Bon voyage, relatives! Do not remember it dashingly, gayropeans.

                  The main thing is about the Ukrainian SSR there.
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  • bobba94 Offline bobba94
    bobba94 (Vladimir) 9 February 2021 18: 32
    +1
    All are on fire, they are debating and debating ..... It is easier to think. In 2014, there was a clear understanding of such a simple fact that Russia simply would not physically digest such a large and fatty piece ... volvulus would have occurred. Therefore, we took a bite, moved away and began to wait for the right moment ...
    1. A.Lex Offline A.Lex
      A.Lex (Secret information) 10 February 2021 13: 08
      +1
      Not quite so, Volodya. There is also such a disease as "Bandera Nazism" too widespread. But in Russian they balak no worse than you and me! Now imagine what would happen at the "anal protests" TODAY ??? It's good that VVP did not hang them around his neck!
  • Sergey Latyshev Offline Sergey Latyshev
    Sergey Latyshev (Serge) 9 February 2021 20: 00
    -1
    Funny.

    .... over which I racked my brains for 7 years. ...

    there was something to break ...
    All this spreading runs counter to actions, politics and even the words of Himself. I remember - "We must rejoice" (about the growth of trade with Ukraine in the midst of sanctions).

    If we look at everything from the position of politics - money does not smell - then everything more or less converges. No conspiracy theories
  • Restless Sagittarius (Vladimir) 9 February 2021 20: 32
    +1
    If only, if only. Yes, Europe would not shut off the valve, because this is a complete collapse of the Euro and all the ambitions of Berlin and Paris ... Who prevented Putin from listening to the Ukroinsky servant - Chernomyrdin, not placing orders for power plants in Ukraine, but developing domestic production? So VVP didn’t make any conclusions now, calling the icebreaker after this ghoul sold to UKROP ...
    1. A.Lex Offline A.Lex
      A.Lex (Secret information) 10 February 2021 13: 10
      -2
      Then the "invisible hand of the market" ... which "will put everything in its place" ...
  • Vladest Offline Vladest
    Vladest (Vladimir) 9 February 2021 21: 17
    -6
    According to some versions, Putin then saved himself.
    1. boriz Offline boriz
      boriz (boriz) 9 February 2021 22: 44
      +4
      He did not save himself, but Crimea for Russia. And he did not go to Ukraine for purely economic reasons. Too much money would be required to put things in order. And the Ukrainians would immediately sit on their necks. The people of Russia would not understand.
      It was you who were taught from childhood to believe that Russia wants to take over all of you. And the question does not occur to you: why are you to Russia?
      Only one thing was required of all of you: not to create problems and risks for Russia. Like Finland. That is why neither the USSR nor Russia touches Finland? Because the Finns are smarter than you.
      1. Vladest Offline Vladest
        Vladest (Vladimir) 10 February 2021 11: 56
        -4
        Quote: boriz
        He did not save himself, but Crimea for Russia.

        That's for sure . But why didn't he save Donbass?
  • Ivan Ivanov_21 Offline Ivan Ivanov_21
    Ivan Ivanov_21 (Ivan Ivanov) 9 February 2021 21: 23
    +2
    do not make ends meet in the end, why did not they close off for the Crimea, but for the Donbass would be blocked and why not for Navalny and for Syria, etc. and so on and the like. In short, the author is delusional / this is nonsense and nonsense in English bread / 7 years did not help.
  • Kofesan Offline Kofesan
    Kofesan (Valery) 9 February 2021 23: 06
    -2
    We must not forget that at the turn of 2013 and 2014, the president seriously feared for his life. Attempts (overt or fictitious, with the aim of intimidating the almost sole leader of the country) came in a stream. His initial intentions to send troops to Ukraine (remember, in March 2014, the Federation Council allowed Putin to use the Russian Armed Forces on the territory of the Maidan-ridden country) disappeared after several visits by emissaries from London ...
  • Robot Bobot Offline Robot Bobot
    Robot Bobot (Robot Bobot Free Thinking Machine) 9 February 2021 23: 45
    +5
    Putin did not save Ukraine in 2014 because no one needs such a sweetheart for nothing.
  • cooper Offline cooper
    cooper (Alexander) 10 February 2021 06: 14
    +1
    Our high power then faced the question - which is more important for Russia - either Ukraine or Syria (which implies control over the Middle East). Russia simply would not have pulled both options. Of course, Syria was chosen. And what happened happened. Well, the author seems to be a complete amateur in matters of geopolitics.
  • shinobi Offline shinobi
    shinobi (Yuri) 10 February 2021 06: 22
    +2
    But why did Russia have to save? The economic situation in our country is still not something that would be very good to put a huge subsidized area around our neck. And this is based on the assumption that there would be no war. Russian-speaking Ukrainian, this is not the same I was convinced of this on my own skin even during the union. And their attitude towards us is purely consumer. It was and is. Russia should serve us, and we will also screw it up for that. No thanks, no need. Ukraine just quickly figured out how their love with the West would end for them, but their attitude towards us at the same time did not change at all.
  • oracul Offline oracul
    oracul (leonid) 10 February 2021 09: 11
    0
    The reasons for what is happening must be sought not from the head, but with the help of the head in the factors of material production around us. Most likely there was no indecision, but there was a need for import substitution, strengthening the defense capability and the economy, even more so.
  • Leonid Varenko Offline Leonid Varenko
    Leonid Varenko (Leonid Vaenko) 10 February 2021 13: 51
    -1
    In the course of the struggle for his rights, he actually received a law degree. I have more than 10 court proceedings in which I myself represented my own interests, the interests of other people. On January 20, he filed a complaint about the fraudulent actions of MOSENERGOSBYT JSC against the Government of the Russian Federation, the General Prosecutor's Office of the Russian Federation, and the Investigative Committee.
    1. The comment was deleted.
  • Leonid Varenko Offline Leonid Varenko
    Leonid Varenko (Leonid Vaenko) 10 February 2021 14: 14
    +2
    Russia is Rome, Ukraine is Carthage. Carthage must be destroyed. After the collapse of the USSR, Ukraine inherited the wealth created by the entire USSR and for the needs of the USSR (factories, gas pipelines, oil pipelines, etc.). After the collapse of the USSR, the elites of Ukraine enriched themselves exclusively on this legacy. And Russia is forced to pay currency, and be dependent and vulnerable. After 2014, almost everything that Ukraine produced for Russia is now produced in Russia itself. Bypass logistic tracks have been created. This explains the actions of Russia (as it seems to me).
  • Mikhailov_2 Offline Mikhailov_2
    Mikhailov_2 (Mikhail Sterkhov) 10 February 2021 20: 28
    +2
    To save an ordinary Ukrainian ... and hang the outskirts around his neck, an amazing plan for the collapse of Russia, first of all, we would become an aggressor for the whole world, this is not to go to the grandmother, then we, having liberated the outskirts from the Banderaites, had to marry her like a decent man , that is, to contain her, I'm not guilty, he came himself. Again, as in the USSR, Russia (RSFSR) would feed the outskirts without developing its regions, and most likely our economy would be bent in the same way as the USSR. Putin did everything right, he saved the country and bought time ...
  • Indifferent Offline Indifferent
    Indifferent 10 February 2021 21: 27
    0
    Poor Putin! Always guilty! Such a capercaillie sits on a nashest, and sings about what he sees! And everything is many times more complicated and we just don't know a lot. For example, why didn't they take Mariupol? In fact, the issue with him was resolved, but stopped? Just as they once stood at the road sign with the inscription Tbilisi, but did not go to the city. Why? They could have arrested Mishiko and imprisoned him for many years, but they did not. Why? Big politics is not our level. A lot of things are left behind the scenes. Perhaps in 30 years we will find out about it. In the meantime: "The cat abandoned the kittens, it's Putin's fault"!
  • Alexander Veniaminovich (Alexander) 10 February 2021 23: 57
    -1
    the author thought for seven years and came to the wrong conclusion. In fact, only Putin and his very loyal friends know why he did not send troops to Ukraine, canceling his own order, but sent troops to Syria.
    The order to send troops was canceled after a meeting in April 2014 with a Swiss, I do not remember his name, unfortunately. Putin left the office, lost and trembling with fear after speaking with this guest. And then he unexpectedly cancels one correct order and soon issues an absolutely "stupid" order to send troops to Syria.
    Interesting isn't it. The author does not really know anything and no one except Putin and those with whom he talked and negotiated knows what happened and is happening, in fact, only Putin himself can tell the truth, and then in the face of a military tribunal after being injected with a serum of truth. This secret of the Kremlin and Putin will take it with him to the grave. If he is not removed and properly interrogated.
    Don't write articles about what you don't know.
  • Radziminsky Victor (Radziminsky Victor) 11 February 2021 02: 43
    +1
    To understand the mistake of the Russian authorities in 2014, you need to try to understand why the CIA and MI6 need Ukraine. Just as the western regions of Ukraine have been eating away at Ukrainian society and power for decades, right up to the burning of Odessa residents and the rout of Kharkovites, so now the pro-NATO ALL! Ukraine will eat away at Russian society and power inside Russia.
    Millions of Ukrainians work on the territory of Russia in all regions and in all industries. The CIA is actively recruiting Ukrainian officers with the Russian language, plus Bender's scumbags ready for feats and meanness on the territory of Russia. This means there will be bloody acts of terrorism, industrial accidents, active rallies and riots. There will be destabilization and BLOOD. And also, - work in the police, in the media, on TV shows, in local authorities, etc. Subversive work. And all this will happen for the sake of the construction of the Nord Stream by Gazprom to the delight of Germany ?! MONEY?
    Just think - are there analytical centers and intelligence in Russia? if I, a simple man in the street, understand this? Don't count on Medvedchuk! - The United States will never let him come to power! Are the actions of the Russian authorities in 2014 a mistake? For the sake of Gazprom? Money? And the future losses ?!

    It should be added that Ukrainians are not enemies of Russia. But the intelligence services of the United States, Britain, Germany and the new special services of Ukraine are working very aggressively, ready for any provocation - for the sake of important, long-term, promising goals-plans in Russia. This is why the CIA and MI6 need Ukrainians. We look no different ... We are all Russians outwardly ...
  • Radziminsky Victor (Radziminsky Victor) 11 February 2021 07: 18
    0
    PS
    From all my reasoning, the conclusion follows - Putin was not allowed, not allowed to save Ukraine.
    The question is about something else - how will Putin save Russia ?! How will the Russian authorities cope with the inevitable consequences of Ukraine's activation within Russia? The Ukrainian Navalny is a small fragment of future inevitable "incidents" - and there is already so much dust. Western intelligence services pay well enough. And Ukrainian activists are not very rich people.
  • Tramp1812 Offline Tramp1812
    Tramp1812 (Tramp 1812) 11 February 2021 13: 25
    -1
    If we ignore the emotional component and claims to the ultimate truth, then the publication, as for me, is very relevant. And the questions posed by the author will remain so for the foreseeable future, if not always. The abundance of comments is an objective confirmation of this. Like any product of this kind, the author's article has caused a lively controversy. Sometimes on the verge of a foul. It seems that neither the author nor a single one of the sorrowful discourses and hearts of sorrowful remarks that responded to his "souls" can give an exhaustive answer in essence. For the reason that he does not have all the information, mostly top secret, on those events. And information, as Getty wrote, is the mother of intuition. I can only express my version, which does not pretend to anything. In a nutshell.
    1. Russia, roughly speaking, simply did not have the money to send troops, along with other power structures, to hold and then maintain the largest territory of Europe (analogous to France).
    2. It is not possible to agree with the author that only tiny western regions of Ukraine would not accept the introduction of Russian troops. The country at that time was approximately equally divided into a pro-Russian and anti-Russian population. It is enough to look at all the results of the elections to the Verkhovna Rada since 1991 to be convinced of this. Claims to Lenin-Stalin - artificially sewn "pull-push". From the most diverse and not only in the past Russian territories. But over time, the Ukrainian nation, under the influence of various factors, will become political, and not ethnic in its essence. And here I agree with the author - he will be the eternal and convinced enemy of Russia. Unless, of course, it falls apart from the inside, which is not necessary, but possible. With external pushing on the one hand, with the obligatory condition of not opposing the other. But with this option, a number of states are formed according to the Yugoslav scenario. This will weaken the threat on the Russian borders. However, completely within the boundaries that exist, it is unlikely that Russia will return Ukraine. And united Ukraine will not die of hunger. Estonia and the Czech Republic are not prosperous, of course, but it will be better than Romania, somewhere on the level of Poland and Slovakia.
    3. The most important question. What happened - an accident from which the Russian Federation gained territorially? Or a long-term trap set in the United States? And in which Russia fell?
  • Victor Yakushev Offline Victor Yakushev
    Victor Yakushev (Victor Yakushev) 12 February 2021 06: 54
    -1
    Without Kiev, you are uncountable, Golden Horde, Tartar Bulgarian yoke ...
    1. Victor Yakushev Offline Victor Yakushev
      Victor Yakushev (Victor Yakushev) 12 February 2021 07: 10
      -1
      Bogatyrs served the Kiev prince, and with whom did they fight? With slanted and greedy eyes, tartar Mongols ... Forgive the block ...
  • Victor Yakushev Offline Victor Yakushev
    Victor Yakushev (Victor Yakushev) 12 February 2021 07: 30
    -1
    In general, we have never attacked anyone, the line of Stalin and Molotov is a worthy example ...
  • Victor Yakushev Offline Victor Yakushev
    Victor Yakushev (Victor Yakushev) 12 February 2021 07: 41
    -1
    Here's China, rejoice, as much as I do not love the Americans, but it was they who squeezed China in Ukraine ... dream comers, who survived?
  • Victor Yakushev Offline Victor Yakushev
    Victor Yakushev (Victor Yakushev) 12 February 2021 07: 47
    -1
    You do not have the opportunity to keep the tera that you occupy, I ask you to voluntarily rewrite half of the tera to my mother-in-law ...
  • Wint Offline Wint
    Wint (Romz) 12 February 2021 13: 39
    -1
    Quote: Just Cat
    My father is older than you (in 1982 he was in the rank of captain) and, when he was retired with the rank of lieutenant colonel, he traveled across Russia and started factories as an engineer, assembling equipment with his own hands. In the heat, in the cold and at altitude. And you know! And he did not say a single positive word about his fellow Ukrainians. I know him personally and trust him, and you are just a letter on the screen.

    You are worse than the last Nazi! You are a product of Brzezinski's decomposition. This Russophobe would be glad that Russia has nurtured a layer of "small Russians" who will drive their brother out into the cold for a bowl of moonshine.
  • Victor Yakushev Offline Victor Yakushev
    Victor Yakushev (Victor Yakushev) 12 February 2021 14: 22
    0
    There is white and red Russia and you will not pass, you have never passed ... Friend of the steppes ...
    1. Victor Yakushev Offline Victor Yakushev
      Victor Yakushev (Victor Yakushev) 12 February 2021 14: 31
      0
      That passed already ... everyone is afraid ...
  • Victor Yakushev Offline Victor Yakushev
    Victor Yakushev (Victor Yakushev) 12 February 2021 15: 58
    0
    We will accept the fight, even if you pass it will not be beautiful ...
  • Victor Yakushev Offline Victor Yakushev
    Victor Yakushev (Victor Yakushev) 12 February 2021 23: 25
    -1
    Which Officer is ready to shoot right now?
  • Denis Chernosov Offline Denis Chernosov
    Denis Chernosov (Denis Chernosov) 13 February 2021 13: 26
    0
    Politics is the art of the possible. Putin does not calculate impossible combinations.

    But, in the main, I do not agree with the author. Economic and political considerations were secondary. Sociological polls were primary. And these polls showed that only Crimea definitely wants to go to Russia. Even in Donbass it was about 60%. Have half the country of partisans for your own kindness ...

    It was then that Mikhalkov issued his address "The Russians will not come". Because the Russians are already there - you are Russians. Nobody on bayonets will bring you freedom - you have to go in the forefront of this fascist bastard. As it was in the Crimea, by the way. Polite people came a little later.

    Well, or move to Russia for permanent residence. I myself left Kazakhstan in 96 ...
  • Teacher Offline Teacher
    Teacher (Wise) 13 February 2021 19: 37
    0
    No one on bayonets will bring you freedom - you have to go in the forefront of this fascist bastard

    In Transnistria it was so. Before A.I. Lebed soldiers sat in the barracks and did not interfere in anything. Yeltsin's cowardly neutrality. All were taken out by the Pridnestrovians themselves. Yes, Lebed put a fat point at his own peril and risk, but this was already the last act of the tragedy. Everything as you say: yourself + interest for Russia (96%). So what? For the Kremlin, the Moldovan authorities are partners, united Moldova and everything else. For the Russians of Transnistria, there are obstacles in obtaining a passport of the Russian Federation (the year since the consular department in the PMR was closed), assistance to pensioners of the Russian Federation = $ 9 per month, thanks even for gas (90% burned at an electric power station owned by RAO UES of Russia), you do not require payment.
  • All clear. Offline All clear.
    All clear. (Alexander) 14 February 2021 12: 42
    0
    VVP knows everything perfectly. All the post-war years, Ukraine was kept in a light tone. In fact, over the past 70 years, the Westerners have been preparing a revenge with the help of Canada and the United States. In 1914 they succeeded. The Russians in this country have come to terms with this otherwise they would not have allowed this. The Russians were simply betrayed. And how does it feel. Everyone needs to understand for a long time this country is not friendly for us. And gas, not gas, will still be deceived and substituted. They will never be brainwashed and loyal to us. And this is the main thing ... At the beginning of the 90s in Kiev, even the tour guides called the Russians invaders. It says something. And we are brothers ...
  • Alejandro Coto Offline Alejandro Coto
    Alejandro Coto (Alexander Koto) 15 February 2021 12: 11
    0
    No, I cannot agree with the author of this article. Putin in 2014, so to speak, half chickened out. The fact that he did not support Yanukovych is more likely not his mistake, but his understanding that Yanukovych is not the politician who can defend his legitimate power, relying on the power structures of the Ukrainian state. But he did not understand the coup d'état
  • Barmaley_2 Offline Barmaley_2
    Barmaley_2 (Barmaley) 18 February 2021 01: 34
    +1
    Somewhere in the same way, in the 14th year, I reasoned and, after about 7 years, I can say that I am no longer sure that the Russian Federation did not completely intervene at that time and turned over the chessboard called Ukraine. also often explained to many the approximate logic of Putin and Co., as in this article, in fact, defending him and, to tell the truth, there was a feeling that the arrival of the new president of Ukraine, which the Russian Federation could well have counted on at that time, would change the situation and the Russian Federation would recoup completely. This was the case after the 2004-5 Orange Revolution.
    To some extent, you can understand Yanukovych. For him and the same Prime Minister Azarov they really hunted and wanted to bang. Humanly, you can understand him somewhere. His delay in dispersing the Maidan is also understandable for a number of reasons. But this is not what I would like to consider.
    The main point of the author of the article, as I understand it, is the "fear" of the Russian Federation to send troops - this is sanctions and the loss of sales markets in the EU from the Russian Federation of hydrogen, first of all. But! The EU did not have any special alternative in terms of supplies at that time. There are no sufficient LNG storages. Iran is also under sanctions and has limited supplies. Issues of supplies from other regions could not be resolved quickly and cheaply. So everything is under the sign. The same question raised with SP2 by the author is also very controversial. Whether the Russian Federation will receive it in the end and how it will all work today is still not completely clear.
    Further, at that time, the Armed Forces of Ukraine were a bunch of people with weapons and were very remotely similar to the army. And everything would be exactly the opposite, but in Western Ukraine, which would be very powerfully supported, but already by the West. ATO and the SAME APU would have fought there, but on the other side. And any help from the Russian Federation would be about the same as now its help to the so-called. LDNR, but to Kiev. And for some reason it seems to me that just the losses of the Russian Federation in people in the so-called vacationers and volunteers would be an order of magnitude lower than in the Donbass. And there would be no downed Boeing over Donbass in the summer and with it total demonization and so on. The sanctions would have been imposed all at once and at once, and not stretching out a little bit - yes, but I think that it is better to have a terrible end immediately than horror without end and the gradual formation of an extremely aggressive and rather large anti-Russian country. you can get a territory completely torn off for a very long time from the Russian Federation, with a long common border and NATO bases, etc. There are already statements that the war in the Donbas will not hinder Ukraine's entry into NATO.
    Of course, we do not know all the information and the full ins and outs to definitely and unequivocally say Putin did the right thing or not then. But personally, I have a lot of faith in the "correctness" of his choice recently. And the stuffing can't be twisted back.
  • colyanpirogov Offline colyanpirogov
    colyanpirogov (Nikolai Pirogov) 12 March 2021 09: 28
    0
    Vladimir Volkonsky turned everyone up again !!! Well done Volodya !!! Keep up the good work! Some at least start to think a little, otherwise at first they carry such nonsense in the comments ... wink