"Russian Donbass": Novorossiya goes to the counter-offensive plan


On January 28, Donetsk hosted a representative forum with the name "Russian Donbass", which was also awarded to the document adopted following its results, which received the status of a doctrine. In theory, this is not only (and perhaps not so much) a program for further development of the region, as the first open application for a radical change in the status of the unrecognized Republics and, above all, their tactics and strategy in relations with Ukraine.


How much does all this apply to our country? In truth, a little more than 100%. Indeed, without the most direct participation of Russia in the fate of Donbass, any doctrines and plans of its leaders will remain nothing more than good intentions and good-hearted dreams.

Donbass and Russia: Together, but Separately


First of all, it should be clarified that in the title of both the forum itself and the document that we will discuss below, the wording "Russian" and not "Russian" is used for good reason. Contrary to the emotional speech of Margarita Simonyan sounded at the event, in which she said that Mother Russia should “take Donbass home,” the fact that nothing like this will happen (at least in the near foreseeable future) is well understood in Lugansk , and in Donetsk, and, alas, in Kiev. Moscow's opinion on this matter was quite unambiguously indicated by the press secretary of Vladimir Putin, Dmitry Peskov, who commented on Simonyan's words by indicating that she "cannot act as the official spokesman for Russia's position." According to him, the issue of Donbass joining Russia “is not on the agenda at all”. Dot? No, rather a comma. Or ellipsis ...

Mr. Peskov was quick to add that Moscow, which "takes a consistent position in upholding the rights of the Russian-speaking inhabitants of the region", intends to continue "to continue to protect Russians." This is somewhat encouraging, although not the most pleasant aftertaste leaves confusion with the terms "Russian-speaking" and "Russians" in relation to the people of Donetsk and Luhansk, with whom, as you can see, the Kremlin cannot decide. However, anything said is better than nothing. I would like to believe that the “Minsk Agreements”, which are unpromising for the DPR and LPR, continue to be supported by the domestic authorities solely on the basis of the “protocol” of high international policy and with a real understanding of their impracticability. However, the fact that the residents of the Republics cannot count on the inclusion of the Russian population in the huge and mighty state is extremely clear.

However, according to the provisions set forth in the adopted doctrine, they are ready to be content with less. In this document, the DPR and LPR position themselves as "independent Russian national states", the sovereignty of which they intend to maintain and strengthen. They see coexistence with Russia as building a single "political, ideological, legal and economic space" with our country, however, exclusively in the role of "separate subjects". At the same time, the granting of Russian citizenship to the residents of the Republics on the widest possible scale, of course, is indicated in the doctrine as one of the most important “tools of integration”. Other lines of convergence - educational, cultural, economic, are also mentioned there. Naturally, Donbass hopes for the closest possible cooperation between local enterprises and Russian industry. In fact, all these processes have been going on for a long time. The doctrine only officially voices what everyone already knows and understands. In fact, at the forum it was only openly stated that the DPR and LPR were determined to follow the path of Abkhazia and South Ossetia. These regions, being de jure "unrecognized republics", are de facto territories where Russian citizens live in large numbers - under its care and protection.

Nevertheless, there is one fundamental and vital difference. It consists in the fact that Moscow recognized the independence of South Ossetia and Abkhazia, but regarding Donbass it does not dare to take such a step, continuing to play endless “games” with zero results in the “Minsk” and “Norman” formats. So far, Russia has confirmed its commitment to the prospect of returning the region to Ukraine on the dubious rights of "autonomy." Let me remind you, the same thing happened in the situation with Nagorno-Karabakh ... So in Donetsk and Lugansk they are taking a rather risky step. How risky - it becomes clear when familiarizing with other provisions of the doctrine.

From "Russian Donbass" to New Russia?


The Republicans of Donbass see themselves not just as a former part of the Ukrainian state, whose population "raised an armed uprising in 2014, provoked by Kiev's anti-humane policies" and "made a conscious choice in favor of a future connected with Russia." No, at this forum, Donbass has proclaimed itself nothing less than a "fortress" and "outpost of the Russian world", and intentional not only to defend itself to the last from any attempts to deprive it of its "legal right to self-determination", but also to expand outside! In essence, we are talking about the transition from a defensive defense that will soon last seven years to a counteroffensive. During the forum, for the first time since 2014, the message was clearly voiced that the territories of "independent Donbass" should be considered not only those regions that are currently under the control of the Republicans, but also all Donetsk and Luhansk regions within the borders that were available at the time the beginning of the civil war in Ukraine.

Moreover, the participants in the event designated them as the first lands that should enter Novorossiya - that part of Ukraine, which, sooner or later, will “return to the orbit of the Russian world”. In this case, we are talking about the Kharkiv, Odessa, Dnepropetrovsk, Zaporozhye, Nikolaev and Kherson regions "nezalezhnoy". In fact, about a good half of its territory ... The doctrine does not say a word about how the creation of Novorossiya, which is possible, realistically speaking, only on the ruins of the current Ukrainian state. In any case, the forum participants, displaying commendable prudence, did not call for a military campaign to the West. Nevertheless, everything in the same doctrine clearly states that Donbass should become "a stronghold for the liberation of Ukraine from nationalism and Russophobia." And then begin either, excuse me, fantasies, or indications of something that is still unknown to the general public.

Thus, the authors of the doctrine speak not only about “a refuge for the supporters of the Russian world persecuted in Ukraine”, which they can and should find in Donbass, but also about “political, human rights, social and humanitarian support of the Russians” in the “non-existent” one. Now that's quite interesting. For those who are not quite in the subject, I will explain - at present, on the territory called the Ukrainian state, for any citizen there is no more serious accusation than “cooperation with the separatists”. A more weighty basis for the arrangement of any individual or legal entity "caught" in such, and it is impossible to think of. Well, perhaps the recognition as an "agent of the Kremlin" ... Personally, I know of far from isolated cases when fabricated information about the alleged connections of an enterprise, person, company with the "occupied territories" and "separatist authorities" were used in unfair commercial competition for organizing the persecution of opponents - including by law enforcement agencies. Their action was truly lethal.

So how are the DPR and LPR going to provide someone in Ukraine with "help and support", especially "human rights and political"? In order for this to become possible, at least hypothetically, the situation must change in the most dramatic way - towards the normalization of relations between Kiev and Donetsk and Luhansk. The current reality is that the DPR and LPR themselves in the “nezadezhnoy” are honored with a very similar to the obscene word “ORDLO”, any official representatives there are declared “collaborators” and “employees of the occupation administrations”, and any mention of the Russian World with the exception of an extremely negative context considered a mortal sin. Personally, it seems to me that in such conditions no legal and open opportunities for the "promotion" of his ideas and values ​​on Ukrainian territory are somehow visible.

Donbass can become an "outpost and fortress", a hope for the Russian people of Ukraine. He must play this role! But this will be possible only when Moscow stops supporting empty talk about his "reintegration" into the Ukrainian state, which is completely incompatible with the implementation of such goals. As long as there are streets and squares named after Nazi criminals in the “nezalezhnaya”, Russia is referred to as an “aggressor country”, and Russophobia is the cornerstone of state policy in absolutely any issue, Donbass can only be returned to the military the way that Kiev, in fact, dreams of. There are no other options, and since 2014, to be really honest. At the same time, continuing to look at what is happening in inaction, Russia is increasingly bringing this scenario closer. The trouble is not that Ukraine has been turned into a hostile state to us, but that its people are now being turned into our enemies, absorbing hatred of the "Muscovites" with every word they hear, but with every breath of air.

The forces and means to accomplish this task are simply colossal. The outpost of the "anti-Russian world" has been erected and strengthened every year in front of Moscow and under its very nose. Not so long ago, in Dnepropetrovsk, which in Donetsk is seen as an integral part of Novorossiya, a loud scandal erupted over a primary school teacher who turned classes with second graders into such "lessons of Russophobia" that Goebbels would have been envious. After them, some children, having come home, demanded that their parents speak to them exclusively in "mov", declaring that otherwise they would "be enemies" ...

We should not forget that in this case we are not talking about people living “somewhere out there, far away,” but about our closest neighbors, with whom sooner or later we will still have to solve problems. And if the Russian world exists not only in the speeches of propagandists and statements of politicians, then it is necessary to start defending its positions and values ​​from Ukraine. And the protection of his people - from the recognition of the right to self-determination of the republics of Donbass and the provision of firm guarantees of protection with all the power of Russia.
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  1. Anatoly Babug Offline Anatoly Babug
    Anatoly Babug (Anatol) 1 February 2021 11: 45
    -17%
    You need to take an example from Russia - separatism is welcome there, this is not Ukraine :)))
  2. Valentine Offline Valentine
    Valentine (Valentin) 1 February 2021 11: 54
    +4
    At present, no one from the top political leadership of Russia will even discuss the entry of the LDNR into Russia, and all this is again connected with the notorious "political expediency". We will demand ahead of time that Ukraine fulfill the Minsk Agreements that are not feasible for them, and we will only wait until "Nenka" is the first to "twitch" and take some kind of military action against the LPNR, even the slightest provocation, and only after that, on completely legal grounds , Russia simply recognizes these republics, and will cover them with its military shield, with the possible liberation of the rest of the parts of Donbass occupied by Ukraine, after which they hold a referendum under the supervision of the Russian Federation, the UN, the OSCE, and others on joining to RF, and neither LDNR nor Russia has another way yet. We just need a small "Gleiwitz", and only then the torment of the LPNR will end, and already within Russia.
    1. Serval Online Serval
      Serval 1 February 2021 13: 12
      +2
      Why referendum? The appeal of the Supreme Councils of the Republics to Russia is enough. * during the reunification of Germany (GDR and FRG), no one even thought of organizing a referendum.
      1. Valentine Offline Valentine
        Valentine (Valentin) 1 February 2021 13: 20
        0
        This is to make EuroUSA less hysterical.
  3. Dmitry S. Offline Dmitry S.
    Dmitry S. (Dmitry Sanin) 1 February 2021 11: 55
    +1
    I'm wondering: does the Russian Federation just hand out passports there? Or is there something that they do not tell us about and hide in every possible way?
    1. Valentine Offline Valentine
      Valentine (Valentin) 1 February 2021 12: 11
      +2
      With such a political prostitution in the world, we have something to hide for the time being, otherwise hysterics and squeals from our "partners" will not result.
  4. Uneven Offline Uneven
    Uneven (VADIM STOLBOV) 1 February 2021 12: 19
    -2
    This is precisely the question that

    the Russian world exists ... only in the speeches of propagandists and statements of politicians
    1. Pishenkov Offline Pishenkov
      Pishenkov (Alexey) 1 February 2021 12: 27
      +1
      ... it's you in Donbass and tell me. Let's see how it ends ...
      1. Uneven Offline Uneven
        Uneven (VADIM STOLBOV) 1 February 2021 13: 31
        -6
        The Russian authorities have spoken quite enough on this topic: Donbass is Ukraine.
        1. Pishenkov Offline Pishenkov
          Pishenkov (Alexey) 1 February 2021 13: 38
          0
          Correctly. I agree. It's not very clear what then in Kiev ... wink And most importantly, what to do with it there ...
  5. Pishenkov Offline Pishenkov
    Pishenkov (Alexey) 1 February 2021 12: 39
    +5
    The article is generally correct. It hurts. But there are still nuances that the author himself mentioned:
    - Firstly, Peskov does not voice what he thinks, and not what someone in the Kremlin is really planning, but what needs to be voiced at the moment. Its' his job. Peskov also did not warn anyone in advance about the launches of Caliber, about Syria and the Crimea ...
    - secondly, the "Minsk Agreements" are the only truly international document in which the existence of the LPR and DPR is recognized. Apparently, the Russian Federation is going to use it somehow. As far as it is not clear yet ... But, knowing Putin, one must think, or at least hope that there is still a certain plan.
    - thirdly, what the Ukrainians consider "ORDLom" and what the Donetsk people themselves consider the territory of the LPNR, these are, as they say, two big differences. And the recognition of the DPR and LPR by Russia means their recognition in full territory. The question immediately arises: What to do with the units of the Armed Forces of Ukraine located there? Fight? This should have been done in 2014. And now it makes no sense. Or there is, but then not for the DPR and LPR, but for at least all of eastern Ukraine ... It looks like we are waiting for an excuse ...
    1. Vladimir_ Voronov (Vladimir) 1 February 2021 13: 32
      -1
      Alexey, have you seen anywhere information about the incidence of covid in the units of the Armed Forces of Ukraine? It cannot be that there is a pandemic on the territory of the Outskirts, and there is peace and quiet. They are not vaccinated ... Why is this issue not discussed anywhere?
      1. Pishenkov Offline Pishenkov
        Pishenkov (Alexey) 1 February 2021 13: 46
        +1
        No, I haven't. and not rocks, to be honest. And what are you getting at by this? Like everyone will gather themselves?
        1. Vladimir_ Voronov (Vladimir) 1 February 2021 14: 33
          -1
          No, it is simply impossible not to take this factor into account when predicting the development of events on the outskirts. It can become a "shot in Sarajevo" to turn the Outskirts into a patchwork quilt.
          The fighters of the Armed Forces of Ukraine have weapons, determination, but to die from an invisible enemy ... He has a bulletproof vest, but they and their loved ones are not given. How will the APU behave in this situation?
          1. Pishenkov Offline Pishenkov
            Pishenkov (Alexey) 1 February 2021 15: 57
            +5
            It is likely that you are right, and the vaccine will finally help us better than all the tanks and missiles together - in the Donbass with a creak, but they have already begun to vaccinate. In the rest of the Maidan Ukraine, everything is very shaky in this sense. Maybe the people will finally get it to the right conclusions. But, as can be seen from the experience of other states, and of Ukraine itself, such things do not happen without outside help. And here we are somehow too lethargic, in contrast to the enemies.
            Russia is quite capable of organizing a new "vaccine maidan" there with a reverse coup.
            1. Vladimir_ Voronov (Vladimir) 1 February 2021 16: 14
              -1
              It seems that Vladimir Vladimirovich proceeds from the proverb:

              I will help someone with a wet back.

              How many times, after helping, I have heard: "But we did not ask you!" Therefore, it does not organize "Maidans" anywhere.
              The experience of today's (01.02.2021/XNUMX/XNUMX) covid Germany shows that one has to compromise on political agreements when it gets very hot, and there is a prospect of being left without the indigenous population.
              1. Pishenkov Offline Pishenkov
                Pishenkov (Alexey) 1 February 2021 16: 34
                +3
                We simply listen too much to various agreements, thanks or reproaches. There the "partners" have already "made a couple of countries happy" like this to a complete collapse, everyone hates them there, and they spit on it all - "Vaska listens and eats" - the main thing is that they carry out their own programs, and chuck on the rest. .. And rightly so, by the way ...
                And we will make some happy, then others, then we revel in “gratitude” until the breeze changes and all these “grateful” don't start spitting in our backs.
                1. Vladimir_ Voronov (Vladimir) 1 February 2021 16: 47
                  +1
                  until the breeze changes and all these "grateful" do not start spitting in our backs.

                  The breeze that will change is Those who instigate the "offended and underestimated" - "bulk", and their goal is not to spit, but to take the throne. A kind of endless game of "king of the hill" that goes on forever ... This is the nature of man.
                  And if you do not follow the agreement, then you will be known as a bardul.
    2. Uneven Offline Uneven
      Uneven (VADIM STOLBOV) 1 February 2021 13: 45
      -6
      knowing Putin, one must think, or at least hope that there is still a certain plan

      Drawing up "plans" and especially their implementation is one of his weakest points.
      In truth, Putin has no other ...
      1. Pishenkov Offline Pishenkov
        Pishenkov (Alexey) 1 February 2021 14: 13
        +7
        ...Yes you? And which of his plans did he not realize ???
        From the collapse of the 90s, I literally collected the country in parts and put it back on its feet. It. Without outside help, rather the opposite.
        So far, I see a new army, a revived industry, a restored respect for the country both outside and inside, Crimea, a bridge, new weapons, vaccines ... and a lot of things. Incarnates. The West is shitting again in swaddling clothes, as in the USSR ...
        Where are the weak points ???
        Or are there any candidates for the "tsar" more suitable? You can't see it either ...
        1. Uneven Offline Uneven
          Uneven (VADIM STOLBOV) 1 February 2021 14: 42
          -7
          which of his plans did he not realize ???

          Все.

          So far, I see a new army, a revived industry, a restored respect for the country, both outside and inside.

          Check your eyesight.
          1. Pishenkov Offline Pishenkov
            Pishenkov (Alexey) 1 February 2021 14: 56
            +3
            There was no smarter answer?
            Can you indicate something specific? Huh? ... There is nothing? ... That's all our oppositionists are the same ...
            But that everything was done by his liberal-pro-Western-progressive predecessors - here you can roll out the list so that the monitor will not be enough.
            Is there a better candidate? Dumb too? so what then all this empty ringing of yours ???
            1. Uneven Offline Uneven
              Uneven (VADIM STOLBOV) 1 February 2021 16: 13
              -5
              Can you indicate something specific?

              Only in a personal. This site doesn't like links very much. I have been banned for them more than once.
              1. Pishenkov Offline Pishenkov
                Pishenkov (Alexey) 1 February 2021 16: 40
                +4
                Why links? You by numbers: here's the first, here's the second, and so on ... Type at least five or six about what Putin had planned, but it didn't work out. And at the same time, let's see the reaction of the rest of the audience. I also write my thoughts to you, and do not refer to something somewhere that may well turn out to be complete bullshit ... the Internet, you know, this is the case - it will endure even more than paper. Especially if someone needs it, and even more especially if it is necessary for someone who controls the Internet ...
                1. Uneven Offline Uneven
                  Uneven (VADIM STOLBOV) 1 February 2021 17: 06
                  -5
                  It seems to me that the original is always better than the copy. In this format, I can only cite the headings of EXAMPLES of Putin's failures, the materials on which I have sent you.
                  Briefly: Failure of food import substitution plans. Failure of plans to build a navy. Foreign policy failures. Failure of national projects. Complete failure of Strategy 2020. Comparison of Putin's promises with reality. The Syrian Puzzle: What Is Undermining Russia's Military Reforms.
                  Gaps in space.
                  How the Ministry of Construction failed housing construction in 2020.
                  Why hasn't Russia moved from stagnation to development in 20 years?
                  1. Ulysses Offline Ulysses
                    Ulysses (Alexey) 1 February 2021 21: 45
                    +2
                    Failure of food import substitution plans.

                    Sorry, bananas, coconuts, pineapples, we still could not substitute import. request
                    However, the times of "Bush's legs" are in the distant past.
                    Can you detail what you mean by "failures" ?? belay
            2. Uneven Offline Uneven
              Uneven (VADIM STOLBOV) 1 February 2021 16: 34
              -4
              I sent you in a personal several examples from the sea of ​​material "failures" of the Putin administration.
      2. Ulysses Offline Ulysses
        Ulysses (Alexey) 1 February 2021 21: 36
        +1
        Drawing up "plans" and especially their implementation is one of his weakest points.

        Why then would such an increased attention of the West to Russia during Putin's time ??
    3. Anatoly Babug Offline Anatoly Babug
      Anatoly Babug (Anatol) 5 February 2021 16: 52
      -2
      And what are you waiting for in the Czech Republic, and not in Mother Russia?
  6. Serval Online Serval
    Serval 1 February 2021 13: 16
    0
    Quote: Pyshenkov
    The Minsk Agreements is the only truly international document that recognizes the existence of the LPR and DPR.

    There are no LPR and DPR in the Minsk agreements. There is only ORDLO and the signatures of Zakharchenko and Plotnitsky (and without specifying any positions).
    1. Pishenkov Offline Pishenkov
      Pishenkov (Alexey) 1 February 2021 13: 36
      +3
      ... well, that is, after all? And there are leaders' signatures. And this is all confirmed by the UN.
      There is also Poroshenko's signature, the legitimacy of which, if desired, can also be questioned ... but that's another question. He, apparently, will just come on line soon. Namely: who and where is the "legitimate Ukraine" - in Kiev or in the Donbass ...
      1. Serval Online Serval
        Serval 1 February 2021 14: 26
        0
        Quote: Pyshenkov
        And the leaders' signatures are

        A leader is not a job. Here, generally incomprehensible things happen.
        The Minister of Foreign Affairs of the DPR (Daria Nikanorova) leaves Donetsk, and she arrives in Minsk as a representative of ORDLO. On the way from Minsk to Donetsk, she miraculously turns into the DPR minister again.

        Well, okay, we have not seen this ... but the question arises:
        "Are the authorities of the DPR and LPR obliged to fulfill the agreements signed by the representatives of the ORDLO"?
        1. Pishenkov Offline Pishenkov
          Pishenkov (Alexey) 1 February 2021 14: 34
          +4
          ... there are generally a lot of questions about who owes whom and what and what is called. The Russian Federation is like a "guarantor", but they tell her that it owes something to someone under these same agreements. Germany and France are also in the same position, but somehow no one presents anything to them. This is despite the fact that, unlike the troops of the Russian Federation, NATO troops are actually and officially present in Ukraine.
          Now, it seems to me, all these "international agreements" are all the same so simple, for a catchphrase. whoever has bigger and stronger fists will still decide, and most importantly, who will not be afraid to use them ...
      2. Serval Online Serval
        Serval 1 February 2021 14: 31
        +1
        Quote: Pyshenkov
        who and where is "legitimate Ukraine"

        There is no "Ukraine" in Donbass anymore and will never be.
    2. Ulysses Offline Ulysses
      Ulysses (Alexey) 1 February 2021 21: 49
      0
      There are no LPR and DPR in the Minsk agreements. There is only ORDLO and the signatures of Zakharchenko and Plotnitsky (and without specifying any positions).

      Just present those documents to us, let's see what is actually displayed there.

      After all, it was not a gangster's arrow on Khreshchatyk. repeat

      PS Why lie?
  7. Serval Online Serval
    Serval 1 February 2021 13: 23
    0
    Quote: Pyshenkov
    And what to do with the units of the Armed Forces of Ukraine located there? Fight?

    "To fight" is too loud. If, after breakfast, the Russian Army receives an order to take control of the border of the former Donetsk and Lugansk regions, then by lunchtime everything will be over.
    Well ... maybe dinner will be delayed by 20 minutes .. but the military doesn't like it. Because war is war, and lunch is on schedule.
    1. Pishenkov Offline Pishenkov
      Pishenkov (Alexey) 1 February 2021 13: 43
      +3
      How cool a joke. I also have no doubts about a purely military result. Although, I repeat, it should have been done in 2014. Now, if anything, everything will be more difficult.
      But what to do with the soul and conscience? I grew up in the USSR, like most of those who today command the armed forces of the Russian Federation, so the very fact of the war between Russia and Ukraine does not fit in my head. The people there, in the Armed Forces of Ukraine, are really the same as you and me.
      1. Serval Online Serval
        Serval 1 February 2021 14: 09
        0
        This is not a joke at all. And there will be no losses on either side.
        However, there may be some warrant officer Parasyuk, who will take it into his head to shoot in the direction of the Russian Army ... so it will be revealingly smeared on the asphalt. And for the rest of the VSUshnikov checkpoints will be made: ukro- can go to Kiev (without weapons), the rest to Donetsk (also without weapons). That's where the whole war will end.
        1. Pishenkov Offline Pishenkov
          Pishenkov (Alexey) 1 February 2021 14: 43
          0
          God forbid. The problem is that not even at the front end, but somewhere far away, in the rear, someone strongly "smart and Svidomo" will take and launch something bad towards the Russian Federation. And, unfortunately, they still have a lot of that left. Then the blood will flow.
      2. Serval Online Serval
        Serval 1 February 2021 14: 12
        +2
        Quote: Pyshenkov
        The people there, in the Ukrainian Armed Forces, are really the same as you and me.

        The same??? They have blood on their hands up to the elbows of women, old people and children of Donbass! Go to Donbass, look at the Avenue of Angels ..
        1. Pishenkov Offline Pishenkov
          Pishenkov (Alexey) 1 February 2021 14: 40
          0
          Every family has its black sheep. And we have them - just remember the last terrorist attacks. I'm talking about the majority. And the majority are you and me. My mother is Ukrainian, my father is Russian - who am I? And there in the army 90% are the same ... As in the Russian, in fact ...
          1. Serval Online Serval
            Serval 1 February 2021 15: 03
            -2
            Quote: Pyshenkov
            My mother is Ukrainian, my father is Russian - who am I?

            And what is mother's nationality? * if Russian, then you are Russian.
            1. Pishenkov Offline Pishenkov
              Pishenkov (Alexey) 1 February 2021 16: 06
              -1
              I would say that she is Ukrainian. Although her father is Ukrainian, her mother is Russian. This is the whole point - we are all one nationality. At least Russians, Belarusians and Ukrainians are all one people. There are dialects in languages ​​and regions in Russia and Ukraine, as well as in other countries. Germans in the north and south of Germany also speak differently and sometimes do not even understand each other, like the British from London and East Yorkshire, but at the same time they do not consider themselves to be different peoples.
              This is all artificially created division, and we all know who benefits from it. But not for us for sure.
              1. Serval Online Serval
                Serval 1 February 2021 16: 50
                +1
                Quote: Pyshenkov
                I would say that Ukrainian

                Alexey, what does the Ukrainian have to do with it? I asked - who is she by nationality, and not by place of birth or residence.

                Nationality "Ukrainian" - netuti.
                All who live in Ukraine are called Ukrainians. And by nationality, everyone is different: Russians, Moldovans, Greeks, Tatars, Armenians, Jews ..

                Poroshenko, Groisman, Zelensky - aren't they Ukrainians? Of course, Ukrainians. And by nationality - Jews. And Avakov is not a Ukrainian? (Armenian by nationality).
                1. Anatoly Babug Offline Anatoly Babug
                  Anatoly Babug (Anatol) 5 February 2021 17: 21
                  -3
                  Have Poroshenko already been made Jews? :)))
      3. Ulysses Offline Ulysses
        Ulysses (Alexey) 1 February 2021 22: 03
        +1
        How cool a joke. I also have no doubts about a purely military result. Although, I repeat, it should have been done in 2014. Now, if anything, everything will be more difficult.
        But what to do with the soul and conscience? I grew up in the USSR, like most of those who today command the armed forces of the Russian Federation, so the very fact of the war between Russia and Ukraine does not fit in my head. The people there, in the Armed Forces of Ukraine, are really the same as you and me.

        A critical error, although I understand you. The most is already closer to 60.
        There, several generations of "skakuas" were brought up on alternative history.
        Yes, family education costs a lot, but state propaganda now rules.
    2. Uneven Offline Uneven
      Uneven (VADIM STOLBOV) 1 February 2021 13: 55
      -8
      everything will be over by lunchtime

      Of course. For an inhabitant of the Kremlin and co. for an accelerated ejection from the seats they have occupied, the only thing that is not enough is the lost military campaign ...
      1. Pishenkov Offline Pishenkov
        Pishenkov (Alexey) 1 February 2021 14: 17
        +2
        ... who should they lose this campaign with? Could it be with Ukraine? Or maybe you expect someone to stand up for them more abruptly?
        Yeah ... they stood up for some already ... then the Humvees asked their own back. And in 2008, the Russian army was not at all the same ... and it was not going to fight ...
        1. Uneven Offline Uneven
          Uneven (VADIM STOLBOV) 1 February 2021 14: 40
          -7
          1) You are right - during this time the Russian army has seriously degraded. Now she cannot even cope with the Turkish one.
          2) In Syria, they tried to buck up against the US allies once and everything ended very badly. This is not a bombing raid on the areas of an enemy without air defense systems!
          1. Restless Sagittarius (Vladimir) 2 February 2021 03: 06
            +1
            Go to scare the drunks with Turkey, for the Russian Federation it is not an enemy, but an easy enough target.
      2. Serval Online Serval
        Serval 1 February 2021 14: 45
        -1
        Quote: Uneven
        a lost military campaign ...

        God have mercy, what other "military company" ???
        I already wrote - the whole "company" will be over by lunchtime. And in Kiev they will call the square named after Lytsar Parasyuk.

        In fact, as the classic of Ukrainian literature Mykola Azarov wrote (when he was prime minister): "The rat blowjob later .."
        1. Uneven Offline Uneven
          Uneven (VADIM STOLBOV) 2 February 2021 08: 40
          -2
          You are absolutely right - "the whole company" is from the Russian Federation, if it wanders into Ukraine, "it will be over by lunchtime."
  8. Serval Online Serval
    Serval 1 February 2021 13: 45
    0
    Quote: Uneven
    The Russian authorities have spoken quite enough on this topic: Donbass is Ukraine.

    Correctly expressed. If tomorrow it is necessary to say something opposite, they will express it too. That's why they are politicians. :)
  9. Serval Online Serval
    Serval 1 February 2021 13: 52
    0
    Quote: Pyshenkov
    It's not very clear what then in Kiev ...

    There will be a reserve for Svidomo in Kiev. Someone has to pay Ukraine's debts?
    1. Uneven Offline Uneven
      Uneven (VADIM STOLBOV) 2 February 2021 08: 41
      -2
      Someone has to pay Ukraine's debts?

      Of course. You see this "someone" in the mirror every day.
  10. Seruja Offline Seruja
    Seruja (Sergey Zakhar) 1 February 2021 15: 54
    -1
    Who knows Moscow's plans? We, the people of Russia, cannot declare that the policy of the President and the Government meets Our desires and hopes. A mediocre policy of exacerbating contradictions is being pursued against Ukraine. Our media practice disrespectful and often insulting statements against a sovereign state and brotherly people. The government uses unpopular measures to undermine the Ukrainian economy, and there, in Ukraine, they see it. It is not good for us to become like the fascist nationalists - Russophobes. The support of the LPR and DPR is made with the aim of creating as big problems as possible for Ukraine, and it is not dictated at all by concern for the Russian people living in these territories. Despite all efforts, Ukraine did not collapse and there, in Ukraine, not only Ukrainians, but also Russians, more and more understand that Russia, represented by the current Administration, is an enemy. For almost 10 years we have been helping the same Americans in this understanding.
    1. Serval Online Serval
      Serval 1 February 2021 16: 19
      0
      Quote: Serugia
      We are the people of Russia

      Yeah ..
      Serudzha, you copied it from the TsIPso manual? Or came up with it yourself?
    2. silver169 Offline silver169
      silver169 (Aristarkh Feliksovich) 2 February 2021 00: 29
      -1
      Are you broadcasting from Kiev, people of Russia?
  11. Tektor Offline Tektor
    Tektor (Tektor) 1 February 2021 16: 41
    0
    We need to prepare reserves for fighter aircraft, because at the beginning of hostilities in the Donbass, NATO forces can get involved in the conflict, and this is primarily the aviation of Turkey, Romania and other Italia. To pull up to the borders with the square, keep number 2 ready at alternate airfields, probably.
    1. Serval Online Serval
      Serval 1 February 2021 17: 17
      +1
      Only Americans can get involved. And even then, because the Americans are the only ones whom Russia has not yet beat in the Crimea and on the outskirts.
      The rest - Romanians, Italians and other Turks - are already scientists ...

      And if NATO was going to fight for Ukraine, then Ukraine would have been accepted into NATO long ago.
    2. Uneven Offline Uneven
      Uneven (VADIM STOLBOV) 2 February 2021 08: 46
      +1
      You can - cook. The Kremlin has other tasks. Not everything has been cut in the State yet!
  12. Igor Pavlovich Offline Igor Pavlovich
    Igor Pavlovich (Igor Pavlovich) 1 February 2021 16: 51
    0
    Clowns and clowns in the children's puppet theater ...
  13. went on the offensive
    New Russia
    and cowardly Ukrainians
    the machines were thrown!
    1. The comment was deleted.
  14. silver169 Offline silver169
    silver169 (Aristarkh Feliksovich) 2 February 2021 00: 09
    +2
    As long as the cowardly Putin with his camarilla sits in the Kremlin, innocent Russian people will continue to die in the Donetsk and Luhansk regions.
  15. Restless Sagittarius (Vladimir) 2 February 2021 03: 04
    +3
    Donbass and other territories temporarily occupied by non-Russians suffering from Russophobia is high time to return to Russia, having cleared the Russian Federation of foreign fans who have lost their way on its territory. If for this the Russian Federation needs a new president and a ruling party, so be it !!!
  16. Vadim An Offline Vadim An
    Vadim An (Vadim An) 2 February 2021 17: 30
    0
    Forum passed? ... yeaaa ... Rasiyanam tse ponraitstsa .... hurray - stupid - hurray ... this is all over.
    Are you going to Russia? ... Look, what is going on there .. pensions scanty want to get? Increase your retirement experience?
    The Russians are "protected" ... ahahaha ... how can you speak such words ... defenders ... you traitors!
    At the forum, it was only openly stated that the DPR and LPR firmly intend to follow the path of Abkhazia and South Ossetia ..... Ahahahah ... join ... they turned into clowns, for you already in Moscow, everything was decided ...
    Nooo, guys, you don't need to free us! Grief with you ... enough!
    You have recognized this power! Che is there to say.
    They mocked as they wanted, Biden came to power and "lo and behold" - a counteroffensive is on the agenda !!! Moscow got lost, nothing happened to Ukraine. Donbass will fight for the right to stay in Ukraine. Russians? What kind of Russians? 60% on the father's side are Ukrainians. And do you believe that these people will give up their father ?! Rave. Russian language - yes! Your Russianness - no! Leave it to yourself.
    In plain text you are told in Moscow - Donbass is Ukraine!
  17. Andrey Grad Offline Andrey Grad
    Andrey Grad (Andrey Grad) 2 February 2021 23: 13
    0
    Quote: Uneven
    The Russian authorities have spoken quite enough on this topic: Donbass is Ukraine.

    And the Outskirts are Russia;)
  18. Vlad Belov Offline Vlad Belov
    Vlad Belov (Vlad Belov) 3 February 2021 10: 20
    0
    Yes, Putin will not dare to violate the demands of Washington, he got through with such difficulty to Biden.
  19. DUTY CARE Offline DUTY CARE
    DUTY CARE 4 February 2021 00: 40
    +2
    There is no need to conquer anything there. Let them themselves give up for food, but we'd better think about what to do with all this when the mass exodus begins and there is only one patient left with a grenade in the Armed Forces of Ukraine on the other side. Judging from what was described there is no one else there, but there are hungry freezing soldiers and their drunken commanders, who see their career growth in morodening and that's it. Nobody needs them. Kiev "earned" dollars on Russophobia, but what are these in the trenches doing there? When the food runs out, and it runs out like money, the robberies will begin .. here is the guard. I guess that's how it is. To hold the bags of bones for an infinitely long time, to fool, throwing all sorts of crap in your ears, will not work. As long as there is something to take away from the products of the nearest population, the military of the Armed Forces of Ukraine will still be comatose there to the last soldier, because they are extra mouths for Kiev. In short, everything is clear - the territories burnt down to the Dnieper.
  20. Sergey Freeman Offline Sergey Freeman
    Sergey Freeman (Sergey Freeman) 4 February 2021 12: 56
    +2
    Thimblers from politics have settled in the Kremlin. The solitaire games of the wisest and the whispers behind Simonyanopeskov's comments simply discredit Russia in the eyes of their own citizens, not to mention the citizens of the DPR and LPR. A person does not need the Kremlin's curvilinear policy and, as the engineers say, an "indefinite system", but a "definite" system, with an unambiguous fulcrum and an unambiguous policy vector, and not "write two, three in mind", as in the current Kremlin hucksters.
  21. marciz Offline marciz
    marciz (Stas) 5 February 2021 22: 40
    0
    What Russia did after 2014 is Betrayal !!!!
    So there are brothers in Donetsk and not in Mariupol !? Well, why do we need such brothers who divide us into Donetsk and Odessa brothers !? Why hide behind the defenders of the Russian population of Ukraine if the other regions are tormented by the special services of the West, together with nationalists !?
    Why do we need such double standards !?
  22. marciz Offline marciz
    marciz (Stas) 5 February 2021 22: 47
    0
    Quote: Vadim An
    Forum passed? ... yeaaa ... Rasiyanam tse ponraitstsa .... hurray - stupid - hurray ... this is all over.
    Are you going to Russia? ... Look, what is going on there .. pensions scanty want to get? Increase your retirement experience?
    The Russians are "protected" ... ahahaha ... how can you speak such words ... defenders ... you traitors!
    At the forum, it was only openly stated that the DPR and LPR firmly intend to follow the path of Abkhazia and South Ossetia ..... Ahahahah ... join ... they turned into clowns, for you already in Moscow, everything was decided ...
    Nooo, guys, you don't need to free us! Grief with you ... enough!
    You have recognized this power! Che is there to say.
    They mocked as they wanted, Biden came to power and "lo and behold" - a counteroffensive is on the agenda !!! Moscow got lost, nothing happened to Ukraine. Donbass will fight for the right to stay in Ukraine. Russians? What kind of Russians? 60% on the father's side are Ukrainians. And do you believe that these people will give up their father ?! Rave. Russian language - yes! Your Russianness - no! Leave it to yourself.
    In plain text you are told in Moscow - Donbass is Ukraine!

    Bravo is the only way to take these Curves now !!!!! We are still on Facebook, by inertia, will defend the right to be Russian-speaking and believe in Russia but no more !!!!!!!!!!
  23. Michael Malovichko (Michael Malovichko) 6 February 2021 17: 59
    0
    Lord, what a kindergarten. What congresses, what guarantees. What will be decided in the Kremlin will be. Putin cannot decide what to do with these LPNR, and after him there is complete uncertainty. But given all the horror that is happening there now, it probably makes sense for residents, albeit senseless, to dream of returning to Ukraine. Life in Severodonetsk is better than in Luhansk - the crowds of refugees clearly speak about this
  24. Valery Lyyurov Offline Valery Lyyurov
    Valery Lyyurov (Valery Lyyurov) 6 February 2021 19: 35
    +1
    Due to the results of the vote of the people, this situation of zug-tswang was formed, and in the worst position of the Russian Federation and Donbass. Ukraine has not yet suffered any reckoning for the death, injury, destruction inflicted on the Donbass. In Crimea, the people were unanimous on the issue of joining the Russian Federation, and the result was different. The time was missed when the counter-offensive could lead to a different result. To be afraid of wolves - don't go to the forest. Our sworn partners would not have missed their chance in this situation.
  25. su.1965g Offline su.1965g
    su.1965g (Alexander Chirkov) 7 February 2021 11: 45
    0
    I do not know, but it seems that our leadership is cowardly in some episodes where it is necessary to show a firm hand, it mumbles, so whoever is lazy will paraffin us. Here is not a single infection of the USSR.
  26. pol_pol Offline pol_pol
    pol_pol (Vladimir Nikolayevich) 7 February 2021 18: 54
    +1
    Correctly in Russia they say that Donbass is Ukraine.
    And Ukraine is part of Russia.
    And Russia does not need Donbass. We need Ukraine.

    All of Ukraine is needed, not Donbass.