The Price of a Wrong Decision: The Day Russia Lost Ukraine Forever


You have to pay for everything in this life and everything in this life has a price. Russia now and all these 6 years is paying for the cowardice shown in 2014. All subsequent events were the result of one wrong decision. Sooner or later, the truth had to surface, and it surfaced. Oleg Tsarev finally said in plain text what we all suspected, but we had no real confirmation of our doubts. Now they are. Oleg Tsarev knows, of course, more than he can say, but, apparently, the time has not come yet. But what has already been said is enough to close the picture of what happened in 2014. It was worse than a crime - it was a mistake!


Bifurcation point


Listen for yourself (from 7:04 a.m. to 8:43 a.m. inclusive). We are talking about the events of March 2014 in Kharkov. I remember them very well, because I was a participant in them myself. The Kharkiv Regional State Administration then passed from hand to hand (and Motorola, which emerged later in Donetsk, took a direct part in this), along Sumskaya (this is the main street of the city) a crowd of 10 thousand carried the Russian flag unfolded 100 meters, at a time when those who seized power in Kiev, the conspirators frantically divided offices, in horror awaiting Moscow's response. In vain they were afraid! Moscow has merged not only Yanukovych, providing him only with evacuation, but also this entire outskirts, out of control. It was then that two of our local "Kermanychs" - Kernes and Dobkin, who had ridden protest moods before, suddenly disappeared from the city for one day. Everyone wondered where they could go when such events are brewing here. They said that they were already in Switzerland, negotiating with Kolomoisky. The truth turned out to be much more prosaic.


As Oleg Tsarev says, Dobkin really went to Kolomoisky, only not to Zurich, but to Dnepropetrovsk (God, then it was still Dnepropetrovsk!), And Kernes moved to the Russian Federation (most likely to Belgorod, but maybe to the capital) with whom he spoke, Tsarev does not say, but most likely it was Surkov. According to Tsarev, Kernes received an unequivocal answer that Moscow would not interfere in the events in Ukraine. Dobkin got guarantees from Kolomoisky that everything would be a "bundle", don't be silly, guys, join us. As a result, the guys returned and joined the conspirators who usurped power in Kiev. This was the very point of no return, after which Ukraine rushed into the abyss, dragging Russia along with it. Those who still do not understand this, never risk it and do not understand it, completely protecting their own refrigerator (not in the figurative, but in the literal sense of the word) until they discover that their refrigerator no longer belongs to them. Because at one time, at a fork in the road, Russia chose the wrong path for itself. Is it any wonder that she led her to hell ?!

Then, returning to Kharkov, Kernes led the protest and blew it up (according to the principle: if you can't ban - lead!), Successfully channeling the protest movement of the masses. Dobkin, not finding himself in the new government, went into its soft opposition, but lost more than gained. Oleg Tsarev also lost, but that's it. But that was his choice, and I respect him for that! Having learned from Kernes that Moscow was winding up Russian Spring, he still managed to call Ben Kolomoisky in Dnepropetrovsk and agreed to release his supporters, whom Beni Filatov and Korban's assistants had already packed into the local pre-trial detention center, and he himself decided to go all the way, and it is not his fault that now he while away his time in Crimea as a political dissident. And Russia got what it deserved - a terry anti-Russian fascist regime in Kiev, real fascism, without any quotes, with which the state does not fight, but on the contrary, cowardly encourages the once fraternal population that hates it, the number of which is growing in proportion to the megatons of nonsense pouring from the zombies -box, a bunch of problems and sanctions. But you would have received sanctions anyway. So were they worth what I listed above ?!

Krymnash


Now I wrote and thought, but nobody knows this, except for the people who took a personal part in the events. For most Russians and even Ukrainians, the events of 2014 are linear. A coup d'etat, Krymnash, Donbass - that's it, the gate slammed shut. Russia lost Ukraine, and Ukraine itself lost its future. Many Russians still naively believe that Krymnash was conceived in advance in the dark corridors of the Kremlin and was quietly lying there in someone's safe, waiting in the wings. The Ukrainians, on the other hand, believe that Putin, taking advantage of a convenient moment, simply stupidly squeezed out Crimea.

The reality is somewhat different. Those. so different that it is just diametrically opposite. I myself learned this only many years later, directly communicating with people who are most directly related to the events of 7 years ago (all have medals "For the return of Crimea" and other state awards). Events in Crimea developed not from above, but from below. The Kremlin intervened only at the second stage. The turning point was the night when unknown people, later called polite, seized the Crimean parliament. Even in the afternoon, the Tatars of Chubarov ruled there, in a frenzy under the influence of the Kiev events dictating their will to the speaker Konstantinov, seriously discussing the demolition of Soviet monuments and other nishtyaks directly related to European civilization. In the evening they, inspired, dispersed, suggesting in the morning to return and continue, but at night the parliament was captured by some armed people. Many Russians believe that these were Putin's people, maroon berets, special forces of the Internal Troops (which later became the basis of the Russian Guard in 2016). In fact, it was Girkin's group. It was she who played a key role in the Crimean events. The Tatars woke up in the morning and to their horror found that the train had left at night, the Crimea swam away from them, waving the Russian flag. And only after that, Vova Putin entered the scene, carrying out a classic takeover of control and taking control of the situation with the help of those very polite people.

Donbass


But Putin's plans did not include Donbass and other regions of Ukraine, where people began to come out to the squares en masse, disagreeing with the events in Kiev. This is the tragedy! There was no political the will to prevent the development of events in Ukraine according to an undesirable scenario. If they had such a will, they would have all the cards in their hands. It was possible to use the request of the then legally elected Yanukovych for help in restoring the constitutional order violated by the conspirators and the permission of the Federation Council of the Russian Federation to use the Russian Armed Forces for this. It was possible to support the reluctance of the local elites in the southeast to lie under Kiev and were looking for Moscow's support in this.

In the first case, it was possible to keep the whole of Ukraine in a pro-Russian wake, while retaining the power of Yanukovych. At the same time, Galicia would risk becoming the Ukrainian Donbass, becoming in opposition to Yanukovych, a kind of European cesspool of separatism, supported by the West, a variant of Ukrainian Kosovo. In the second case, it was possible to keep at least the South-East, splitting it from the rest of Ukraine. But Moscow's decision was made unequivocally - about non-interference in the events in Ukraine. When Kernes and Dobkin learned about this, they changed their shoes right in the air. Kernes left for the Russian Federation while still having pro-Russian views, and returned as a moderate Ukrainian patriot, and did everything so that Kharkiv did not follow the path of Donbass.

The whole tragedy of Donbass lies in the fact that the entire local regional elite fled from there and all power passed into the hands of the rebellious people, who were inspired to do this by the entry of Girkin's (Strelkov's) detachment into Slavyansk. But few people know that it was a personal initiative of the latter. Girkin and his people acted at their own peril and risk, misinterpreting Kremlin policies for themselves, trying to scale the successful experience of Crimea across Ukraine. And if in Kharkov Kernes managed to channel the protest movement of the masses, leading it, then in Donetsk and Lugansk there was no one to do this. The elite fled, all power passed to the insurgent people. As a result, already Putin had to take over control there. Donbass was not at all included in his plans, but the situation got out of control. Now we have a bleeding Donbass. Looking at him and how Russia treated him, Kharkov would not at all want to repeat his fate, and for this the townspeople thank Kernes. It is, of course, hard to live in modern Ukraine under conditions of moral occupation, but we did everything we could (and Oleg Tsarev confirms this).

Reference point


Everything could have gone differently, but the story, unfortunately, has no subjunctive mood. The benchmark point, the point of no return, was Kernes's visit to Moscow (or to Belgorod, I don't know). After that, Ukraine drove in one direction, and the chariot of the Russian Federation in the other. History was written on this very day. If the Kremlin had given the go-ahead to Kernes, the Russian Federation would have retained the entire southeast, and most likely all of Ukraine, except for Galicia. There would be Donbass, but not for Poroshenko, but for Yanukovych (the pastry chef was not yet president, and in this situation, there would be no elections either). The situation would have developed diametrically. But it happened as it happened.
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  1. gorenina91 Offline gorenina91
    gorenina91 (Irina) 4 December 2020 07: 52
    -7
    The Price of a Wrong Decision: The Day Russia Lost Ukraine Forever

    - Well, what else is there to discuss ???
    - In the subject

    The issue of Transnistria and gas can forever embroil Moscow and Chisinau

    - Personally, I have already spoken out in detail about this:

    The indistinctness of Russian policy then, its actions and the indecision of our guarantor ... all this was transferred to Odessa and Kharkov and many other territories, which could really return under the auspices of Russia ... - And there would be no war in Novorossia and all this confrontation. .. with Ukraine and so on.
    - Obviously ... our guarantor was a bad Chekist and could not take advantage of a very favorable situation for Russia ... - Although it would seem ... - everything itself goes into Russia's hands ... - The legitimate Ukrainian president fled to Russia ... - Press him so that he at least once publicly reported to the entire world community at a press conference with world journalists; with all the press; with all world TV channels ... - I would declare to the whole world ... to the whole world ... to the whole world ... - that in order to prevent bloodshed in Ukraine; which became possible after the bandit putsch in Ukraine ... - he ... the legally elected president of Ukraine "such and such" ... - appeals to the Russian leadership with a request to urgently provide military assistance ... - and so on and so on and so on. ..
    - How would it have turned out later ... is one thing ... - And the fact that this statement had to be made ... is just an indisputable fact ...
    - Then Odessa and Kharkov and Mariupol and the entire Black Sea coast of Ukraine and a good half of the territory of Ukraine itself would simply return to Russia ... - after all, the entire Ukrainian police and Berkut and the Ukrainian army were on the side of Russia (or neutral in at least) ... - That's all ... - there would be no war ...
    - But the "American Chekists" had the will, endurance and courage not to miss this moment out of their control and turn everything in their favor ... - Although they had much less chances and opportunities for this; than Russia ... - They managed to reverse this favorable situation for Russia and carry out a coup d'etat in Ukraine; while Moscow was flapping its ears in indecision ...
    - And the "American Chekists" urgently organized a war with Novorossiya ... - such a distraction; to bind their new Ukrainian wards with blood ... and urgently create a split among the Ukrainian people ... - and they succeeded ... - And Novorossia itself ... as no one needed ... - remained. .. - unnecessary to anyone ...
    - Today the whole of Novorossia ... is like a parachute jump ... - just a means of maneuvering ... - And so ... - Novorossia is simply not needed by anyone ... - neither Russia ... - nor Ukraine ...

    - There are my other comments on this topic ... - but the essence is the same ...
    - And all the other "details and particulars" ... - what and how it happened is no longer important ...
    1. The comment was deleted.
    2. Volkonsky Offline Volkonsky
      Volkonsky (Vladimir) 4 December 2020 14: 58
      0
      I agree 100%, Donbass has become a kind of anti-Ukraine, which Putin is now using for his own purposes. But does Donbass agree with this? The British, when they left India, in parting created such an anti-India - Pakistan, these two (already nuclear) countries are still fighting for two states - Jama and Kashmir, to the delight of small-shavens. Donbass was not waiting for such a fate. 7 years blood has been shed there and only one person, whose name you all know, can stop it, but why does he care about these problems? let Zelensky have problems
      1. Dan Offline Dan
        Dan (Daniel) 5 December 2020 11: 14
        0
        Quote: Volkonsky
        Donbass was not waiting for such a fate.

        Don't wait. Need to do. Help is when the main work is done by themselves, but only some helpers. Do you want to sit in the kitchens and watch from the sidelines how the Russians are fighting the Bandera? Are you, comrade, at the end ofigel? Someone has to do everything for you. And then you will cover the rescuers who came in the back during the day and shoot them at night.

        Quote: Volkonsky
        7 years blood has been shed there and only one person, whose name you all know, can stop it, but why does he want these problems?

        Yes, we know his name - the people of Ukraine ... And if in 2 million Odessa one thousand newcomers from the West establish their power, then who is to blame? The same goes for Kharkov and Sumy. You, I mean Ukraine as a whole, twenty-five years after 91, strove to enter heaven on someone else's hump. The whole country, together with the Kharkiv and Donetsk residents, was a complete scam for Russia. Everything that happens there not in 2014, but gradually increased with the 91st efforts, among others, and Azarov, and Yanukovych. Today, who are you showing your own cunning, Russia? No, let's go to the mirror ... Earn forgiveness and trust - we will help. In the meantime, you yourself threw the rudders of the oars and are waiting for the manna from heaven and the Russians, so that they shed their blood for you.
        And yes

        Quote: Volkonsky
        let Zelensky have problems

        and his constituents ...
        1. Volkonsky Offline Volkonsky
          Volkonsky (Vladimir) 5 December 2020 16: 46
          +2
          look at the picture in front of this text - this is Kharkov, its main square, the largest in Europe, by the way. How many people do you see there? thousand 10? 20? thirty? There were even more! Whose flags are flying there? EU? Ukraine? There are flags of the Russian Federation! We did our best. The Vinnytsia Jaguar, sent by Avakov, grabbed 30 people right on the day they liberated the Kharkiv Regional State Administration, which we held, some are still sitting. And after that, your tongue turns to us to present something here? You can't tell an AK-943 from an AK-47, but you suggest that someone should climb with it. Did you climb a little with him in Donbas? What else should they do for Russia to recognize them and thereby end the bloodshed ?!
          1. Dan Offline Dan
            Dan (Daniel) 7 December 2020 07: 24
            +2
            Quote: Volkonsky
            You cannot distinguish an AK-47 from an AK-74, but suggest that someone should climb with it.

            Vova, I lived with him in an embrace for several years. And I have a couple of extra holes. laughing And if you are not capable of organizing against your Banderaites, then why should I do the work of local "masters"? And Putin, he is the president of Russia in the first place, and he should worry first of all about the citizens of Russia, and not about the incapable neighbors. Moreover, he did quite a lot for you, at least by giving you the opportunity to move, who cannot stand it, and in an accelerated manner to obtain Russian citizenship. Yet Ukraine, no matter how ugly, but the state recognized by the UN, and to intervene by force in a foreign state is not our method. Take power into your own hands and disconnect .... This is your country, you made it this way, you have to pull it out of this. In Kharkov, one and a half million inhabitants, in the region - 2,7 million. And you have less than a thousand Westerners all built! And how many people from the east of Ukraine have signed up for the National Battalions? Ask your grandfathers how it should have been.

            Quote: Volkonsky
            Did you climb a little with him in Donbas?

            Few! There were more than 6 million people in two regions. They could put up to half a million people under arms. And from Donbass to Russia, more than 3 million refugees moved, including a huge number of men of military age. If your men moved to the rear, who should sit for them in the trench? So grit your teeth and fight, including with your dodgers. It is our right to help you, but not our obligation. You have done a lot to ensure that Russians are wary of you. Don't forget that until 2014 there were more than 20 years of cooperation with "dubious" successes.
            1. Yuri Kabaev Offline Yuri Kabaev
              Yuri Kabaev (Yuri Kabaev) 8 December 2020 19: 08
              0
              And Putin, he is the president of Russia in the first place, and he should worry first of all about the citizens of Russia, and not about the incapable neighbors

              Cowardice always leads to defeat.
              The law of the border is not to leave it under any circumstances. And you can't leave your own people either, and also under no circumstances. As a result of the cowardice and / or stupidity of the Russian government, our former compatriots and brothers have become our enemies. Because they were thrown under the flag that "he should worry first of all about his citizens."
              But the Ukrainians could be our citizens! And stand with us in the same military formation. And now they are our enemies. Are we feeling better? What is it?
              Why aren't the Americans abandoning their NATO partners? Why are there more and more of their associates? And the worst thing is that our former comrades-in-arms are becoming our opponents!
              And this is already the historical defeat of our capitalist separatist state, Russia, which abandoned its own people.
              1. Dan Offline Dan
                Dan (Daniel) 9 December 2020 06: 59
                +1
                Quote: Yuri Kabaev
                But the UKRAINIANS COULD BE OUR CITIZENS!

                Those who wanted to have already become.

                Quote: Yuri Kabaev
                And stand with us in the same military formation.

                God forbid !!! Remember how an officer, a helicopter pilot abandoned his wounded comrade, having previously taken his weapon from him. In 2014!!! Whom are you calling in the ranks? People brought up on Bandera for 20 years before 2014? And do not forget that Ukraine is whatever it is, but a state recognized by the UN.

                Quote: Yuri Kabaev
                Cowardice always leads to defeat.

                Well, you are a daredevil, when nothing depends on you and you are not responsible for anything ... It's funny ... laughing
                1. Yuri Kabaev Offline Yuri Kabaev
                  Yuri Kabaev (Yuri Kabaev) 9 December 2020 17: 27
                  -1
                  Whom are you calling in the ranks? People brought up on Bandera for 20 years before 2014?

                  They threw their own - our place was taken by the Bandera.
                  The law of the border.
                  1. Dan Offline Dan
                    Dan (Daniel) 10 December 2020 08: 15
                    +1
                    Quote: Yuri Kabaev
                    Abandoned their

                    And what about these "own" children? Or did they not vote for Ukraine to leave the Union? Look at the voting results by region. Or was it not before their very eyes that the presidents elected by them and other branches of government encouraged the heirs of UNA-UNSO and UPA? These, as you say, "abandoned friends" themselves, first of all, sent you and me on a long journey back in 1991, declaring that Ukraine is not Russia. The leaders and deputies elected by them began in 1992, and in 2002, according to a special plan, to cooperate with NATO. They rejected us. And you did not understand this, did not see how we were thrown on all issues. And here I partly agree with you that our leadership has been sleeping for a long time. Ukraine's non-compliance with the friendship treaty began almost the next day after its signing. And all of us at discounted prices ..., like - "they are brothers", kept them afloat. EBN, even when signing the "divorce" agreement, did not try to return what was illegally transferred to these "non-brothers". Then it was necessary to let go of Ukraine in what it came to Russia, without Odessa and the entire left bank of the Dnieper. But we have what we have. It is time to understand that in the near foreseeable future, friendship with Ukraine will not shine for us. Yes, it is not very beneficial for us today. The beginning of friendship with her can fatally sink our already tense situation in the economy. By the way, Belarus has not gone far from Ukraine, in terms of the desire to throw us like the last ones ...
              2. 123 Offline 123
                123 (123) 13 December 2020 22: 09
                +2
                Cowardice always leads to defeat.
                The law of the border is not to leave it under any circumstances. And you can't leave your own people either, and also under no circumstances

                Do you call Yanukovych and his comrades yours? Or an abstract people? So he is a different people, some went to the National Battalions, and the same people chose this bastard.

                As a result of the cowardice and / or stupidity of the Russian government, our former compatriots and brothers have become our enemies.

                That is, they moved into punishers and Putin is to blame? They are good, but they have a fine mental organization and require gentle treatment?

                Because they were thrown under the flag that "he should worry first of all about his citizens."

                Who was he supposed to think about first? About the neighbors? So forgive the cynicism, they "do not stand on the balance sheet," his duties do not include taking care of the citizens of neighboring states.

                But the Ukrainians could have been our citizens! And stand with us in the same military formation.

                Many did so. But by the way, not the majority. The question arises, did everyone want it?

                Why aren't the Americans abandoning their NATO partners? Why are there more and more of their associates? And the worst thing is that our former comrades-in-arms are becoming our opponents!

                First, Ukraine was not our ally. Here is a statement from the Ministry of Foreign Affairs of August 2009.

                Official requests to the Ukrainian Foreign Ministry on the opening of the information center of the Collective Security Treaty Organization have not yet been received.
                This was stated by Acting Foreign Minister Vladimir Khandogiy, commenting on the proposal of the Secretary General of the Tashkent Treaty Organization Nikolai Bordyuzha, the Mirror of the Week reports.
                "The question of opening the CSTO information center is in a hypothetical plane: the Ukrainian Foreign Ministry has no official appeal from either Bordyuzha or other officials. Our reaction will be based on an official appeal," Khandogiy said.
                At the same time, he expressed confidence that Ukraine is not interested in joining the military-political union created by the CIS states.
                "Ukraine is not a member of the CSTO and does not intend to join it," Khandogiy said.

                https://www.pravda.com.ua/rus/news/2009/08/15/4499153/

                They were not our associates or allies.

                And this is already the historical defeat of our capitalist separatist state, Russia, which abandoned its own people.

                These "friends" were strenuously eager for Europe and played in a multi-vector approach and dreamed of NATO.
            2. Yuri Kabaev Offline Yuri Kabaev
              Yuri Kabaev (Yuri Kabaev) 8 December 2020 19: 10
              -1
              It is our right to help you, but not our obligation. You have done a lot to ensure that Russians are wary of you.

              Yes, Russia before the Ukrainians grew its separatism, a form of betrayal of its own.
              Therefore, I slept through fraternal Ukraine.
        2. Yuri Kabaev Offline Yuri Kabaev
          Yuri Kabaev (Yuri Kabaev) 8 December 2020 19: 01
          +1
          Yes, our guarantor got cold feet!
          Either for his savings and the savings of his associates, or simply scared, miscalculated.
          He pretended to be playing a chess game, and they played chapaya with him. And he really wasted ALL of Ukraine. Except for Banderlogy.
          Yes, in no way it would be worse for Russia if she showed her will.
          And so - twenty-five years of complete mess, of which fifteen - it was under Putin.
          And now we have a full NATO offensive and military bases six to ten minutes of flight time from Moscow.
          They puff their cheeks with their underwater drones and nuclear planes with infinite range, but they are?
          Fifteen million victims of political and economic restructuring, more than during the Nazi invasion, but what is the result and what is in the future?
          Biden came and now we are waiting for a military attack, incl. with the use of nuclear weapons.
          Maybe the Americans will die second, but we generally don't want to die from nuclear or non-nuclear weapons, neither the first nor the last.
          And on the state of Russia everyone is wiping their feet.
          Starting with our former compatriots.
          This is how moronic Russian separatism in the early 90s turned into an impending and very likely apocalypse.
          1. Dan Offline Dan
            Dan (Daniel) 10 December 2020 08: 28
            0
            Quote: Yuri Kabaev
            This is how moronic Russian separatism in the early 90s turned into an impending and very likely apocalypse.

            The favorite pastime of our pseudo-patriots is to water themselves with manure. You like? Well, splash, enjoy ... Dull ones don't live long ...
        3. whitebeard Offline whitebeard
          whitebeard 8 December 2020 20: 35
          +2
          You write correctly, except for one point - you, in fact, blame the victim. For the ordinary Russian people of Ukraine, even in the USSR, by repressive methods were taught not to stick their heads out and be khataskraynich, one Leninist-Stalinist story with the violent "indigenization" of Novorossia, transferred as yasak to political Ukrainians from the UPR for their entry into the USSR, it cost what. Therefore, for the most part, these are people who are downtrodden and powerless on the political front, unable to resist the impudent Bandera redneck. It is another matter that, although the victim is not to blame, it is she who will have to solve the problems, it is true that there is no point in hoping for Russia. But they will not fight for their territory either, much more will simply leave for Russia. These are the political and social results of the violence with which the USSR treated its indigenous population, the Russians.
    3. Dan Offline Dan
      Dan (Daniel) 5 December 2020 11: 16
      0
      Quote: gorenina91
      - There are my other comments on this topic ... - but the essence is the same ...

      Shake your tongue - not crawl with a machine gun ...
  2. passing by Offline passing by
    passing by (passing by) 4 December 2020 08: 22
    -3
    Finally, Russia got rid of corrupt Ukrainians. it is not cowardice. it should have been done for a long time.
    1. Volkonsky Offline Volkonsky
      Volkonsky (Vladimir) 4 December 2020 15: 00
      0
      Where the mind is lacking - everything is lacking ...

      Savile Halifax George
      1. margo Offline margo
        margo (margo) 4 December 2020 18: 21
        -5
        he will not understand this, it is very difficult.
      2. The comment was deleted.
  3. Bulanov Offline Bulanov
    Bulanov (Vladimir) 4 December 2020 09: 48
    -1
    Yeltsin's plans were to chop off all the Union republics from Russia in order to stop feeding them. So far, they are tinkering with Belarus only because it was also a donor in the USSR, along with Russia. It was decided to push the rest to free swimming. The capture of Crimea by Russia is only a return to the Stalinist period of the USSR, until Khrushchev began to give away Russian territories. He could have given the Kuril Islands to the Japanese, but he did not have time.
    Is it possible that Yeltsin's policy of separating Russia from other republics, conceived in 1991, continues on its way? Another line of conduct, towards the revival of the USSR does not become the majority?
    1. Yuri Kabaev Offline Yuri Kabaev
      Yuri Kabaev (Yuri Kabaev) 8 December 2020 19: 15
      +1
      Yeltsin's plans were to chop off all Union republics from Russia in order to stop feeding them.

      And to destroy a single defensive space and admit that our real enemy will come and make our compatriots and fellow soldiers our current enemies.
      Is it easier and cheaper for us to create a new defensive space?
      We even abandoned Vietnam and Cuba, where were our strategic bases that ensured our military interests in the Indian Ocean and close to the United States!
      Now American B-52s are advancing on the Crimea from the north! Because brotherly Ukraine became hostile.
  4. molybdenum Offline molybdenum
    molybdenum (Stanislav) 4 December 2020 10: 14
    -2
    Everything is so, but not so. Such things are not done in one day. Ukrainians have been preparing for this turn for more than 20 years, and it would be foolish for Russia to "reunite" with Ukraine through the army scenario described in the article. On the other hand, there is the “strong” side of the Russian government, of all times and leaders, the inability to think strategically and strategically plan. We are waiting for the next June 22. And alas, there are no other options.
  5. Eduard Aplombov Offline Eduard Aplombov
    Eduard Aplombov (Eduard Aplombov) 4 December 2020 10: 37
    +2
    All opinions are subjective and the results of political decisions are not always seen face to face. You can in fact say so that Russia turned its back on the majority of the subjects of the Ussr who did not resist the Bandera regime. one can say that the former ussr has lost Russia, who needs whom more, at least at this stage, the question is obvious to me. After all, no one has counted and will not calculate all the pros and cons of the big war with the former republic, simply because the townsfolk and tribunes are not aware of these layouts, almost all the conclusions of journalists and participants are made on ordinary, emotional principles. Perhaps the power was somewhat cowardly, was not completely decisive, but it should be noted that the supreme power operates with other meanings from the average person, namely, the safety and survival of its own country, its own subjects, first of all, this is its first and main task. Russia is practically single-handedly opposing the entire US Khanate, despite the fact that inside Russia there are many of those who are its enemies at different levels and in the power itself there are many of those who do not serve their homeland, that is, to stay at a certain level without getting involved in civil strife is now the first task, we have an enemy and an enemy is much worse than the Bandera regime
  6. beeper Offline beeper
    beeper 4 December 2020 10: 38
    -1
    hi That's right, dear Author-Vladimir Volkonsky! good
    So I saw it then, in 2014. request
    But the understanding of why the Kremlin missed its chance to build and strengthen the Russian State, and "was content" with the role of a persecuted "neat terpily", came later, when he looked at it from a different angle - this is, after all, the same comradenegates, neo-bourgeois nouveau riches from the ranks of "party members", as well as the "guilds" and criminal "bosses" who have joined them, who also "fed the authorities" in the former Ukrainian SSR! winked
    And you, Vladimir, remember the passionate, anti-bourgeois, anti "privatizator" socialist slogans of our Russian Spring, which are close to tens of millions of Russian workers!
    And it was necessary for the Kremlin bourgeoisie to launch such an Anti-capitalist "infection" to themselves in order to kindle the Russian workers with the idea of ​​the Restoration of Justice ?!
    No, of course, the Kremlin feared this no less than their Kiev colleagues!
    In the canvas of this "bourgeois rejection", precisely for the speedy suppression of our "infectious" Ukrainian Russian Spring-Novorossia, the Russian authorities urgently (although they could not have done this or, at least, so "respectably" did not rush, pull with it!) "returned" to the Ukrainian Armed Forces the most combat-ready military equipment and artillery in the midst of the ATO in the Donbass ??! winked
    IMHO
    1. Volkonsky Offline Volkonsky
      Volkonsky (Vladimir) 4 December 2020 15: 06
      -3
      Here the murder of Alexei Mozgovoy is indicative for me - Moscow does not need such people, Batman and Sandman were killed for other reasons - and Moscow does not need such people, why does she care about Russian fascists? Givi, Motor and Zakhar had already been killed by specialists from the shelter, but Moscow did not need them either, a woman with a cart - it is easier for a mare!
    2. rotkiv04 Offline rotkiv04
      rotkiv04 (Victor) 4 December 2020 19: 06
      -1
      and why so veiled - "the Russian authorities", you can say it all was done with the order of Putin himself, especially since in an interview with V. Solovyov he himself said that everything was done under his complete control, so let the Donetsk residents say thank you to him for returned the APU equipment
  7. kriten Offline kriten
    kriten (Vladimir) 4 December 2020 10: 44
    +1
    Putin was always afraid of the reaction of Europe and went to outright betrayal. Then it continued with the Minsk agreements, by which he essentially gave the fascists an indulgence for the unpunished murder of Donbass citizens.
  8. Kuramori Reika Offline Kuramori Reika
    Kuramori Reika (Kuramori Reika) 4 December 2020 10: 45
    0
    We can only be glad that we got rid of Ukraine and put this bag of holes in the hands of Europeans. Ukraine lost Russia, and Russia got rid of the country of thieves and inadequate people.
    1. Uneven Offline Uneven
      Uneven (VADIM STOLBOV) 4 December 2020 11: 09
      +2
      According to Colonel-General L. Ivashov, with the loss of Ukraine, Russia lost 5 trillion. $. And this is only the material component. In addition, NATO received the largest (after the Russian Federation) European country with its enormous economic potential. And Russia acquired initially a kindred, but "thanks" to the Crimeanash, a hostile state directly adjacent to the borders of five Russian regions.
    2. Volkonsky Offline Volkonsky
      Volkonsky (Vladimir) 4 December 2020 15: 08
      -1
      And before that, like, Ukraine was in the pocket of the Russian Federation? Toko pocket was full of holes, that's lost!
      1. Dan Offline Dan
        Dan (Daniel) 9 December 2020 07: 04
        0
        Quote: Volkonsky
        Toko pocket was full of holes, that's lost!

        This is your head full of holes, so you slept through your own country. Now you are looking for the guilty. Typically Ukrainian style. Nothing has changed ...
    3. Ivan Ivanov_21 Offline Ivan Ivanov_21
      Ivan Ivanov_21 (Ivan Ivanov) 4 December 2020 20: 34
      -1
      a huge country humiliated in its expectations of the miracle of the ** Russian spring ** just waiting in the wings to take revenge - the one who does not understand this is just Reika ...
    4. Object.F7 Offline Object.F7
      Object.F7 (Object.F7 TV) 5 December 2020 18: 23
      +3
      Well done for getting rid of. Stalin left the borders from the Kuriles and Sakhalin to western Berlin ... And now the results of the 1943-45 campaigns have been reset. Operation Bagration is still going on, but there is a feeling that it won't be for long. East Germans, Czechoslovakians, Poles, Hungarians, Romanians and Balts turned from allies into enemies precisely because they “got rid of the leaky sack”. Now Ukrainians have been added to the list ... Belarusians are next in line. At the same time, Zuleikha is removed from state funds so that the Tatars know the whole truth about the bloody Russian oppressors. You will be blown away by 2050 into the borders of the Muscovite principality, having reset all five-century achievements. After all, it is necessary to get rid of bags of holes. Thirty-five year wise Kremlin politics from great leader Gorbachev, keep on don't stop
      1. Kuramori Reika Offline Kuramori Reika
        Kuramori Reika (Kuramori Reika) 5 December 2020 20: 09
        +1
        Large infrastructure projects are being implemented in Russia, each of them as valuable as the aggregate budget of all post-Soviet republics. We are building factories, introducing new products, and slowly but surely everyone gets used to it. In comparison with the bandit and impoverished post-Soviet principalities, we live quite tolerably. I prefer such a slow, forward movement than the maidan of criminals. And having removed all these breakaways from feeding, we not only restore respect for ourselves, but also see a clear example of what happens when the population has learned nothing but to sew embroidery and steal.
        1. Object.F7 Offline Object.F7
          Object.F7 (Object.F7 TV) 5 December 2020 21: 41
          +2
          Yes, yes, "enough to feed them" was the slogan under which the ideologists of Ukraine's independence from the USSR were campaigning. They said, look how rich we are, we have everything, both factories and fertile land, we will be the second France. I am sure that this slogan was sounded in 91 in all republics at once and in Russia itself. And the further disintegration of Russia will follow the same scenario: the Far East, the Urals, Tatarstan (Reidzhep's friend has already taken aim), Ingermanland, everywhere they will repeat "enough to feed them." Then the Moscow principality will be left without oil and gas, it is difficult to say who will feed you. Moscow has been continuously losing influence over the territories for 35 years, and if you don’t see it, then either blind or naive. In 2014, all the cunning planners assured that Ukraine was about to end financially, everything would fall apart, they repeated this tale for several years, and now they understood their fail and changed into the old slogan "enough of them ...". What infrastructure projects? Money was thrown into the Turkish stream, but it is empty, there are sanctions in the pipes of Nord Stream-2 instead of gas, the power of Siberia also does not shine with indicators, the Chinese for some reason prefer to buy from the Arabs ... But in general, as elsewhere, the decaying Soviet legacy, when the containers rot from old age and there is no end to environmental disasters. The country rich in resources has a penny economy on a global scale, the legendary Chubais gets another appointment. For 10 years, Navalny was untouchable, and now, after being poisoned with the most dangerous poison and sanctions, he will still return on a dashing horse, and he will also submit a candidacy for the president, because everything in the Kremlin and special services has long been rotten, a traitor drives a traitor to
  9. Sergey Latyshev Offline Sergey Latyshev
    Sergey Latyshev (Serge) 4 December 2020 11: 06
    +4
    Briefly about the article:
    1) Strelkov-Girkin is a hero, he himself took Crimea, Donbas, LDNR.
    2) "Vova Putin" (right under the article) merged Ukraine and then pushed aside the hero Girkin.
    3) Russia has betrayed everyone and therefore even pro-Russian activists changed their colors.

    Looking at him and how Russia treated him, Kharkov would not at all want to repeat his fate, and for this the townspeople thank Kernes.

    4) And now Russia is in hell.

    .... she brought her to hell

    Interesting position
    1. Volkonsky Offline Volkonsky
      Volkonsky (Vladimir) 4 December 2020 15: 11
      -2
      Serge, do you like your place, where everyone wipes their feet about Russia? I do not like it either! But in order to be respected, it is not enough to express extreme concern and call obvious enemies partners, sometimes you have to give it to the jug!
      1. Sergey Latyshev Offline Sergey Latyshev
        Sergey Latyshev (Serge) 4 December 2020 16: 23
        +1
        So that you don't wipe your feet, you need 3 things: a strong economy, a strong economy, a strong economy,
        Until that happens, there is simply nothing to give to everyone in the jug.
        Maybe some little Georgia.

        And if we are to give in the forehead, then start not with distant Kievans or Endogans.
        And from close Chubais.
        Is there it? No.
        Chubais is not allowed. Sobchachek - you can't. Poroshenko is not allowed.
        Who can you? Who will not answer and who will not stand up for. Pensioners and hard workers
        So it arrives for them.
        1. Volkonsky Offline Volkonsky
          Volkonsky (Vladimir) 4 December 2020 16: 49
          -1
          Chubais was removed from the Nano-position, sent to the scrap, why don't you know ?!
          Look at the FRG, a strong economy? Why is Trump wiping his feet about her? Because she is weak! Why didn't you wipe your feet about Kim? Because it's scary! Can fly into the jug !!
          1. Sergey Latyshev Offline Sergey Latyshev
            Sergey Latyshev (Serge) 4 December 2020 17: 50
            -2
            1) Junk? by age? or a new position? Also by age?
            Have you left Chubaysikov subordinates?
            It's not clear yet

            2) Germany? Where? For 5 years they have been writing that we are on a par in the economy. If so, where is she strong?
            And the legs ... The USA was recently the # 1 trading partner. And Russia is not included in the top 10? AND? Throw YUS to pump more gas? Fairy tales.
            And so NATO was openly dynamic. They say 2% for NATO - let's go nafig, we won't.

            3) And Kim is not worried about everything. And we are included. Since, by and large, everything is clear to everyone, a little scary, and do not care. But they wipe their feet regularly.
            We managed to make nuclear missiles, and now the main thing is not to accidentally hit our Far East.
            Sankiyas are there from everyone, even from China. And people also die regularly.
          2. Dan Offline Dan
            Dan (Daniel) 7 December 2020 07: 30
            +1
            Quote: Volkonsky
            Chubais was removed from the Nano-position, sent to the scrap, why don't you know ?!

            You, it turns out, are completely myopic ... You have the whole world in one article of a semi-literate blogger fit laughing It is useless to explain to you even the apparent motives of the rotations in the Kremlin. No knowledge base of related events. That is why you are so categorical in your statements, almost adolescent ...
          3. 123 Offline 123
            123 (123) 13 December 2020 22: 32
            +1
            Look at the FRG, a strong economy? Why is Trump wiping his feet about her? Because she is weak!

            A true addition to "strong economy, strong economy, strong economy" is also needed with a revolver. yes
        2. Semens Offline Semens
          Semens (Semen) 5 December 2020 17: 41
          0
          No need to whistle about the economy. Did Tatarogol have an economy? Or did the Macedonian have a strong economy? And they captured half the world.
          The Roman Empire had a very good economy, but it fell under the pressure of motivated to rob the barbarians! The united fascist Europe had a more powerful economy than the USSR ...
          1. Sergey Latyshev Offline Sergey Latyshev
            Sergey Latyshev (Serge) 5 December 2020 18: 44
            +1
            If you don't want to, don't whistle.
            At the United ... and so on, the economy was 3 times weaker than that of the Allies .... only for hurray-patriots, this is garbage.
            The Mongols had, they had. It is only the new chronologists who deny everything. And they captured it only because there is a civil war in China. (the dynasty of Koreans then also pinned ...), in the east - they are also loaded, on the caliper - the same. If there was a powerful emperor in China, he would have hung such people on them ... (which they did from time to time ...)
            And Rome by that time was filled with the untouchable Chubais, and the army - for a long time already consisted of these barbarians
  10. Mihail55 Offline Mihail55
    Mihail55 (Michael) 4 December 2020 12: 02
    +4
    For some reason, Brezhnev was not afraid to refuse the trip of the national football team to Santiago after the seizure of power by the Pinochet clique ... and we recognized Poroshenko
    1. gorenina91 Offline gorenina91
      gorenina91 (Irina) 4 December 2020 13: 32
      +3
      For some reason, Brezhnev was not afraid to abandon the trip of the national football team to Santiago after the seizure of power by the Pinochet clique.

      - Yes, Brezhnev even spent his Olympics in response to the machinations of the Americans ... - he wanted to sneeze at the Americans ... and all the people of Russia (USSR) then just sneezed at the Americans ... - And anyway; but the whole world remembers this Olympics in Moscow today ... - And the Americans could not do anything then ... - they were forced to hold their tail for a long time ... - But then there was already a war in Afghanistan, which the world condemned ... - but even that did not stop ... - Because then the whole world respected Russia (USSR) ...
      - And our guarantor conducted whatever costly events ... - Olympiads (in Sochi) and expensive football championships ... All the "newcomers" praised them too ... - "Oh, what good Russians"; and two or three months after that they started talking about Russia ... - And our athletes today are forced, like partisans, "under any guise" to make their way to the world sports championships; to take part there "NOT as representatives of Russia", but as modest "private persons" ... - Here we have lived it ... - Because today Russia is not considered for anything in the whole world ... - And Russia only knows that is justified before everyone ...
      1. Moskal 55 Offline Moskal 55
        Moskal 55 5 December 2020 20: 15
        +2
        We lost the USSR, not some kind of GDP! He was not in power then !!! He tries both ours and yours. Sometimes it even works out. And in the shit we sit in comparison with the times of the USSR, almost all, except for a million rich people. And they themselves are mainly to blame for this!
    2. 123 Offline 123
      123 (123) 13 December 2020 22: 36
      +1
      For some reason, Brezhnev was not afraid to refuse the trip of the national football team to Santiago after the seizure of power by the Pinochet clique ... and we recognized Poroshenko

      And why did dear Leonid Ilyich limit himself to the national football team? Why did you not support your own people, how are they suggesting us in Ukraine?
  11. nikolaj1703 Offline nikolaj1703
    nikolaj1703 (Nikolai) 4 December 2020 13: 20
    0
    It was not Russia that lost Ukraine, but Ukraine that lost Russia. What can these understates offer Russia? They can only bargain and blackmail - don't let us, you won't feed us; we will go west.
    1. Volkonsky Offline Volkonsky
      Volkonsky (Vladimir) 4 December 2020 15: 14
      -2
      the strong, as a rule, does not ask the desire or unwillingness of the weak, this is how he differs from him (see on the USA)
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            1. Volkonsky Offline Volkonsky
              Volkonsky (Vladimir) 4 December 2020 17: 31
              0
              there is such a Ukrainian proverb - dummy bagacy! I think no translation is needed here.

              You probably think that you have some special rights to Russia by the fact of your birth in it, and I mean some kind of bereft of rootlessness, who should be lying at your feet because of your belonging to the Great Country? So I inform you that there is no merit in your being born in the Russian Federation. I was born in the USSR, and Russia is my homeland, just like Ukraine, as well as Georgia, Belarus, Moldova, Armenia, Azerbaijan, etc. republics, including the Baltic ones. Unlike you, I don’t scatter my lands, and I will probably have more merit to our common Motherland than yours. I honestly fulfilled my military duty behind the river, when you were not yet in the world, and did not hide behind other people's backs, and in Kharkov, where I was born, the floor of the city cemetery has plaques with my year of birth (1983-85 were the years of our most heavy losses in the DRA, and Kharkov, together with Rostov, was in the lead in those years in terms of cargo 200). It is not customary for us to rattle with medals, but I have the right to present no less than yours with claims to my big Motherland, and it is certainly not for you to tell me what to write about and what not!
              1. Volkonsky Offline Volkonsky
                Volkonsky (Vladimir) 4 December 2020 17: 58
                -2
                there is such a Ukrainian proverb - dummy bagacy! I think no translation is needed here.

                and the program erased the word "do-uren", it's funny! do-uren dumkoy bagatie
              2. Sergey Tokarev Offline Sergey Tokarev
                Sergey Tokarev (Sergey Tokarev) 4 December 2020 18: 32
                -1
                repeating. Ukraine, Georgia and other non-states are not my homeland. enough that Russia has been lying at the feet of the Ukrov for 70 years. Putin destroyed all the factories at ukrov? Has Putin stolen 250 billion of investments? You overslept, you and recover. Ukraine is one of the largest states in Europe with one of the stupidest population in the world. no one will take on such a present!
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  12. white gentleman Offline white gentleman
    white gentleman (Ivan) 4 December 2020 14: 01
    +1
    Rusinformburo summary for December 4, 2020.

    Local battles continued on the Russian-Ukrainian border.
    Russian border guards thwarted an attempt to illegally cross the border from Ukraine. During the shootout, one of the attackers was killed, and two managed to escape, the FSB's Public Relations Center (DSP) said.
  13. steelmaker Offline steelmaker
    steelmaker 4 December 2020 14: 06
    -2
    It was worse than a crime - it was a mistake!

    There is another word - betrayal! And this is already in Putin's blood!
  14. molotkov60mkpu Offline molotkov60mkpu
    molotkov60mkpu (Yuri) 4 December 2020 14: 14
    0
    It was not Russia that made the mistake. At that time, one GDP was making decisions. And the motivation, under the pressure of the selfish interests of the oligarchs with interests related to Ukraine, is not to lose money.
    And no matter what happens. And the whole of Russia (and all Ukrainians, including the highest DL and the army) were waiting for our troops to enter after the Olympics. Everyone was sure of that. At Internet forums on this issue, battles were fought against those who were confident in the drain of spring. But that’s what happened. Everyone knew that we would free Ukraine at least along the Dnieper from Bandera. And then for years there was hope for HPP, but we are already reaping such costs due to indecision. And then there will still be.
    1. gorenina91 Offline gorenina91
      gorenina91 (Irina) 4 December 2020 15: 31
      -8
      It was not Russia that made the mistake. At that time, one GDP was making decisions. And the motivation, under the pressure of the selfish interests of the oligarchs with interests related to Ukraine, is not to lose money.

      - Yes, the author of this topic is clearly interesting ... - tries to look like a kind of historian-timekeeper .. -gathered absolutely everything ... ... - Yes, it took place; but who needs it today and then ???
      - There was a clear and clear situation ... - There was a clear threat of bloodshed (and it has already begun); riots in the capital of Ukraine and in its large cities; the legally elected president of Ukraine was forced to leave Ukraine itself in order to save his life and the lives of his family; a very large mass of the population of Ukraine could have suffered ... - All Ukrainian police; the Berkut units and the army could not cope with the riots and were completely paralyzed !!!
      - At that time, there were tens of millions of Russians living in Ukraine (now they are no longer Russians; everyone has already "become" Ukrainians "... -Hahah) ... - And then there were still entire Russian industrial cities and villages in Ukraine ... - And Russia then had super, super super opportunities and reasons to simply send its troops; at least in order to save the Russian population in these Russian cities from bloodshed !!! - And then not only Russian cities and the Russian population would have met the Russian army with flowers !!! ... - With flowers !!! - And most of the population of Ukraine !!!
      - And what kind of war is there, what kind of New Russia, what mass bloodshed ??? - None of this would be in sight ...
      - But our timid Kremlin did not dare to do anything ... - And the Crimea just miraculously returned to Russia ... - And only because there were already Russian troops ... - And the Russian military themselves took the initiative ... - And so everything would have died out there ..., waiting for instructions from our guarantor from the Kremlin ... - And there they would have found their own "Kernes" and would have arrived in Crimea on buses from Western Ukraine, Bandera militants ... - and they would quickly "build" everyone ... as in Kharkov ...
      - That's the whole "chronology" of those events ... - Hahah ...
      1. Volkonsky Offline Volkonsky
        Volkonsky (Vladimir) 4 December 2020 17: 43
        -1
        - Yes, the author of this topic is clearly interesting ... - tries to look like a kind of historian-timekeeper .. - he collected absolutely everything in heaps ... - both the Crimean Tatars and yaryzhku-Kernes and the "aspirations-excitement" of the people, which never took place ...

        What do you look like? I am writing about what I myself was a participant in. Where did you participate? Sitting at home in front of the TV? Here, paper - write better!
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  15. Phill phillat Offline Phill phillat
    Phill phillat (Letnab) 4 December 2020 15: 25
    -2
    What are some personal thoughts .... Go sir to Solovyov, let the bubbles there!
  16. Gennady1959 Offline Gennady1959
    Gennady1959 (Gennady) 4 December 2020 15: 32
    +1
    This is not a mistake, this is a crime of Putin and Lavrov. As L.P. Beria said, each problem has its own last name, first name and patronymic.
    Who appointed a freak as ambassador to Ukraine, who flunked Ukrainian-Russian relations? ? Putin, at the suggestion of Lavrov.
    Who kept A Surikov, the old morazmatist of the Belarusian ambassadors for 12 years? Putin, Lavrov. Etc. etc.
    1. Volkonsky Offline Volkonsky
      Volkonsky (Vladimir) 4 December 2020 15: 45
      -4
      Only the one who does nothing is not mistaken!

      Each mistake has its own name and its own surname!

      Sergo Ordzhonikidze

      Confused the author, but also a Georgian
      1. Gennady1959 Offline Gennady1959
        Gennady1959 (Gennady) 4 December 2020 15: 51
        0
        Quote: Volkonsky
        Only the one who does nothing is not wrong

        For 20 years, only mistakes and everything in favor of the oligarchs. Why not a single mistake in favor of pensioners, ordinary people.
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  17. Gennady1959 Offline Gennady1959
    Gennady1959 (Gennady) 4 December 2020 15: 48
    +1
    Quote: gorenina91
    our timid Kremlin did not dare to do anything

    The Kremlin itself is a bunch of bricks. These are the names of those who sit in the Kremlin and sell Russia wholesale and retail should be called, do not be shy.
  18. Gennady1959 Offline Gennady1959
    Gennady1959 (Gennady) 4 December 2020 16: 01
    0
    Quote: gorenina91
    And Crimea just miraculously returned to Russia

    Crimea just fell on the head of the GDP like an overripe apple. It's just that the circumstances, the reaction of society did not allow the GDP to chatter the topic of Crimea's entry into Russia. If everything had not happened so rapidly in Crimea, the GDP would have chewed snot there for years about Western partners, international law, etc. crap. I think VVP understood perfectly well, had he refused Crimea to join Russia, the next day he would have had to write a letter of resignation.
    Another scar on the heart of VVP from a difficult choice "who will serve the people of Russia or the Cypriot-Israeli oligarchs and Western partners?"
  19. Gennady1959 Offline Gennady1959
    Gennady1959 (Gennady) 4 December 2020 16: 05
    0
    Quote: gorenina91
    Because today Russia is not considered for anything in the whole world ... - And Russia only knows that it justifies itself in front of everyone ...

    Thanks to Putin and Lavrov. This is their diocese foreign policy. It is scary to imagine what will happen to Russia if these old grandfathers are in prison until 2036.
  20. mironov-1954inbox.ru (sergey mironov) 4 December 2020 18: 02
    -1
    Eh Putin, Putin, when for your mistakes or intentions you will be held accountable to the Power ...
  21. boriz Offline boriz
    boriz (boriz) 4 December 2020 19: 06
    +4
    Russia did not lose Ukraine. Ukraine finally lost itself, went into oblivion.
    I just lost myself back in 1992.
    Listen to Napoleonic plans to seize Ukraine in 2014. That's just funny. We were bred for this. And the sanctions would be much steeper and the economy on feed 404 would immediately overstrain. Then the general mood there was Russophobic. I remember the broadcast, somewhere in November 2013, where those rygs and communists who are now angrily stigmatizing the coup d'etat of the Maydaun coup d'etat, together drowned against Russia. And Symonenko and Oleinik and Karasev and Bondarenko and the late Berezhnaya ... Well, all everyone who is now at Solovyov, Norkin, Babayan (if he is still doing this, I don’t watch TV for 2 years at all) and feed for 60 minutes. I remember very well how my friends back in 2013. there were contradictions with relatives, friends and colleagues, like, you are Muscovites and rob us. In the last year alone, some enlightenment has come. Well, nothing, hunger (as well as cold and lack of a roof over your head) is not aunt, enlightenment will go at an accelerated pace.
    It was the madness of the zombie herd. Worse than now in Belarus. It's just that in Belarus the siloviki are doing business, and then instead of the siloviks, our boys would be on the streets of Kiev. Do we need it? And then it would be impossible to prove something. And so it would have gone: they would have considered the occupiers and demanded to feed them not for free.
    And Donbass - yes, an unplanned excess from Strelkov. Zeal is not in the mind. So there, for the first at least six months, people could not be recruited to the front line. Have you forgotten everything? It seems that only 7 years have passed.
    Russia is being selected. Soon Ukrainians will weep with bloody tears. Those who are smarter have long been dumped.
    And Crimea was surrendered as a result of collusion. Like the Donbass, they pushed it out. The junta did not need such an electorate, from the word "absolutely". In Ukraine, they have been talking openly about this for a long time and are looking for someone to appoint as extreme. Now everyone is waiting for Zhvania to once again open his mouth and enlighten and expose everyone.
    1. Semens Offline Semens
      Semens (Semen) 5 December 2020 14: 28
      +1
      Then the general mood there was Russophobic.

      Boris, you're wrong.

      E. Ligachev
      Political prostitutes should not be confused with the people of eastern Ukraine. Look in the chimney for hundreds of thousands of pro-Russian demonstrations in Dnepropetrovsk, and is the rebellious Donbass itself Russophobic? So do not cast a shadow over the fence ... Article in the "bull's-eye" ... Putin is a master of judo - this is a high ability to instantly assess the situation, capture, throw! In this logic of action, he is an unsurpassed master ...
      But decades of practically marking time in the economy and endless "concerns" in foreign policy speak of his not very high strategic thinking and economic knowledge, unfortunately ... And the results in Ukraine speak about this best ... But "Don't shoot pianist, he plays as he can "... Maybe one day people will be at the head of Russia more sighted and as smart as VVP.
      1. boriz Offline boriz
        boriz (boriz) 5 December 2020 14: 47
        +2
        Right now, before your eyes, significant changes are taking place in the Russian Federation. You just don't notice them yet.
        And the east of Ukraine is not all of Ukraine. And the very people who went on demonstrations in defense of their language would then go on demonstrations against the occupation of Ukraine by Russia.
        Of course, now the LPNR (and the Donbass controlled by Ukraine) are quite ready to be included in the Russian Federation. The question is whether the economy of the Russian Federation will pull this accession?

        So do not cast a shadow over the fence ... Article in the "bullseye"

        Whether it's an apple or a pear, you have the right to your opinion. I am on my own.

        In this logic of action, he is an unsurpassed master ...

        Putin is a master precisely in long-term thoughtful work. Politics is the art of the possible.
        About the work of the head of state in the "fast" I have already given an example in the comments to the article

        https://topcor.ru/17608-kogo-predala-rossija-za-20-let-pravlenija-putina.html#comment

        (at the end of the comment).
  22. Ivan Ivanov_21 Offline Ivan Ivanov_21
    Ivan Ivanov_21 (Ivan Ivanov) 4 December 2020 19: 53
    0
    the fact that the processes in the Crimea were chaotic and unexpected for Moscow was clear from how the number and agenda of the referendum changed. From timid ** expansion of powers ** to ** joining the Russian Federation **. And Donbass is finally enchanting - it's just a meat grinder of fresh minced meat, etc. Minced meat from ruskag meat, so no one cares. In the end, everything will be ** as always ** - the dam of silence will break after the departure of the MOST - and all ** unexpectedly ** will know HU FROM VOVA ...
  23. Elena Ushkova Offline Elena Ushkova
    Elena Ushkova (Elena Ushkova) 4 December 2020 19: 57
    -1
    Russia did not lose anyone; it was the non-states that lost Russia. So let them think what to do. Looking at what Ukraine has become, and even with its debts .... there is no desire to make Ukrainians happy against their will.
  24. DeGreen Offline DeGreen
    DeGreen 4 December 2020 20: 07
    -3
    Blank article. It was clear to the fool that Ukraine could not be held. And we do not need this fascist country. The Armed Forces of Ukraine officially sent their military: A large number of active officers of the Armed Forces of Ukraine fought in the First and Second Chechens, in the army of Dudayev and others. (everything is on the Internet). In Karabakh, in the past wars, Ukrainian military personnel fought against the Armenians. Ukraine sold air defense systems to Georgians. Plus she gave her operators. As a result, Russian planes were shot down. Modern Ukraine is one big gangway of fascists
  25. bubasa Offline bubasa
    bubasa (Konstantin) 5 December 2020 01: 07
    0
    Has Russia lost Ukraine? So we have lost? But in general, events say that Russia did not lose anything, threw away the freeloaders, which should have been done for a long time ... Why are we constantly being asked to care about those who are of no interest to us? Allied relations are built on a mutually beneficial basis. What was the benefit in Ukraine? No. Even under the USSR, Ukraine was a subsidized region. Brothers? What kind of definition is that? I know my brothers and there are no svidonut among them. Ukraine is a neighbor, and as a neighbor has always been bad. Have we lost the Baltics too? Or maybe the ballast has fallen off again? Why do we need them? Transit to subsidize them? Ukraine to drive gas through their territory? And from where should we do this? Why do we need this? They want to Russophobia ... so let it feed them. Vladimir Vladimirovich said "Real politics" and so it is. We did not lose anything ... But they lost everything ... the borders with them would be blocked and any trade relations.
    1. Semens Offline Semens
      Semens (Semen) 5 December 2020 14: 15
      +1
      The allocation of colossal resources for import substitution of Ukrainian military products threw away other important directions in industry and social policy, and hindered the overall development of the country. Only very limited people can not understand this, and only the new Vlasovites can propagate such views ... And the approach of a hostile bridgehead to the center of Russia? Flight time matters and is very big ...
      1. boriz Offline boriz
        boriz (boriz) 5 December 2020 14: 57
        +1
        Import substitution had to be done in the 90s. We gave Ukraine the jobs that should have been ours. And they set up their defense industry, because even then it was clear how it would end.
        And the flight time will not change. Ukraine will not join NATO, the situation is changing just before our eyes.
  26. cooper Offline cooper
    cooper (Alexander) 5 December 2020 01: 34
    0
    The author was wrong. This agonizing Ukraine has lost Russia. Which is not at all scrappy, rather the opposite. A woman with a cart .. how to grit.
  27. ODRAP Offline ODRAP
    ODRAP (Alexey) 5 December 2020 11: 21
    -5
    How can you lose what is never yours?
    Ukraine has never been part of the Russian Federation (rSFSR), and the USSR, oe, both republics were, on equal terms.
    Phantom pains, bun crunch ...
  28. Semens Offline Semens
    Semens (Semen) 5 December 2020 14: 10
    -3
    And there is a hole in the old woman ... From the shame of 2014, the GDP will not wash even our Crimean ...
    Akella missed and sticks his muzzle in this sump of fascism created by him ... In 2014, I wrote a famous phrase somewhere

    If a country, choosing between war and shame, chooses shame, it receives both war and shame.

    ... Moreover, a war on worse conditions than it could have been ... I believed that both Dnepropetrovsk and Mariupol were the result of direct bribery of Putin's advisers in Ukraine ...
    1. Moskal 55 Offline Moskal 55
      Moskal 55 5 December 2020 19: 58
      +1
      We all will not wash off the shame of the collapse of our country - the USSR. And Ukraine is a delayed investigation. It is not necessary to hang everything on the GDP. He made something more viable from Yeltsin's Russia. And then you need, as they say, to look in the mirror more often. Did the majority vote for Yeltsin and capitalism? Was the shooting of the Armed Forces in 93 approved? And what do we want now? !! And what the propaganda says about our power, that's their job. Navalny says about corruption, he is being treated for it in Germany ...
      1. Semens Offline Semens
        Semens (Semen) April 3 2021 20: 53
        0
        And I don’t hang everything up ... It just turned out that VVP is not the Lord God, but I really wanted it ..
  29. Moskal 55 Offline Moskal 55
    Moskal 55 5 December 2020 19: 42
    +2
    Russia, as it were, did not climb directly, after all, there is international law. Girkin was then part of Malofeev's team, which was given the mandate to carry out "Russian intervention." With the simple part of this, in Crimea, Girkin, or maybe not he alone (or maybe mostly not he), coped with it, but failed the more difficult one in the DPR. Exactly! I handed over half of the territory! It was obvious from the column of tanks and vehicles that was leaving Slavyansk that the help from Russia was substantial. But Girkin didn’t. And then there were boilers, Debaltsevo, but this is without Girkin. And Russia? And she, in the face of her elites, stands vskoryaku, t. tries not to abandon Europe from Lisbon to Vladivostok, and our western friends offer it only one way to enter Europe - in parts! LDNR help and help a lot, and this cannot be denied. And the half-heartedness of the steps is explained by the fact that the idea of ​​"entering Europe" has not yet been abandoned. Something like this.
  30. Semens Offline Semens
    Semens (Semen) 6 December 2020 01: 14
    0
    If anyone doesn't like something in the article, read this

    http://www.imperiyanews.ru/details/71c7811e-fa35-eb11-811e-020c5d00406e
  31. cpecpc1 Offline cpecpc1
    cpecpc1 (A B) 7 December 2020 12: 08
    0
    Nanogenius was just a coward
  32. Logan Offline Logan
    Logan (Sergey Rebrov) 10 December 2020 14: 59
    +2
    Yes. Putin got into a mess in 2014 with Ukraine. It was necessary to organize an alternative government there, headed by the still legitimate at that time President Yanukovych (with a headquarters in Kharkov, for example) and the army of Novorossia subordinate to him, with the active support of Russian arms. forces.
    And Putin, unfortunately, chickened out and limited himself only to the "annexation" of Crimea. This was Putin's historic mistake, which could still cost Russia dearly. If Putin hoped in this way to avoid drawing Russia into the war, then he only postponed this war, and it will still happen (the war between Russia and Ukraine over Crimea and
    Donbass), but only in conditions much worse for Russia. Because now Ukraine is covered by the United States and NATO tank divisions are already ready from Poland to come to Ukraine's aid in a matter of hours. In 2014, Ukraine could not count on such assistance.
    And if Putin, by his non-intervention in 2014, hoped to avoid sanctions from the West, then he did not succeed. There are sanctions and no end in sight. On the contrary, in 2014 the West became convinced that sanctions are exactly the instrument that can (and should) contain Russia, and will now use sanctions for any reason. What we are now seeing. I am sure that if Putin had sent troops to Ukraine in 2014 and established order there, then there would have been an order of magnitude fewer sanctions, because the West respects strength, but the West does not respect the weak and hits the weak many times harder. The weakness and indecision of Russia will continue to provoke US aggression, and I do not exclude a regional NATO war against Russia on the territory of some third countries. Putin's indecision in 2014 will cost Russia dearly in the future and will become a source of new conflicts, including armed conflicts in the post-Soviet space. And no one is going to lift the sanctions.
    In general, Russia has returned to the state in which the Soviet Union permanently existed, but only in a weakened state without allies, but with NATO bases on its borders (possibly in the future in Ukraine). Russia has never been in such a hostile environment throughout its history, and this is extremely dangerous.
  33. svarga911 Offline svarga911
    svarga911 (Sergei) April 12 2021 13: 18
    +1
    We lost Ukraine much earlier! Crimea, according to the proverb - from a thin sheep, even a tuft of wool. And in all conscience, he was never yours.
    By and large, we did not lose Ukraine at all. Since the end of the 80s, she behaved like Ivan, who does not remember kinship. As perestroika, glasnost and acceleration began, so there were conversations, they say we feed the whole union, but if we only disconnect, we will live like this!
    And I must say that they really could heal. Powerful agriculture. The saturation with industry was, as it were, not more than in Russia. Nuclear weapons, the army grouping is comparable to the Russian one, was .... But, fool, glass x_y not for long.
    These rotten conversations have been conducted for a long time. And at the first opportunity, Ukraine immediately wagged its tail. We tried independence, but for some reason every year it got worse and worse and conversations began again ... Again, Russia is to blame ... Who does not jump that Muscovite! Moskalyaku to Gilyaka! Lace panties ... This was all before the Crimean events, gentlemen, Ukrainians!
    It was not we who lost you, but you who lost us !!! We will live without you, and now you are doomed, like this Baltic micronesia, to receive handouts for barking at Russia with food.
    You lived and were full-fledged citizens in a state stretching from the Pacific to the Atlantic, a fifth of the land, respect in the whole world, everyone reckoned with us, and who are you now? The mongrels under the fence of the Great Country!