A veteran of special services reveals the role of PMC "Wagner" in Nagorno-Karabakh


The soldiers of the Russian PMC Wagner played a big role in preventing the Azerbaijani army from advancing in the northern part of Nagorno-Karabakh - a veteran of the special services Viktor Ognev told about their role in this military conflict in an interview with a Novye Izvestia correspondent.


A number of media outlets in Turkey and Azerbaijan have been discussing the likelihood of the participation of Wagnerists in battles on the territory of the NKR since late September this year. According to some reports, about five hundred fighters of a Russian private military company in early November were transferred to the north of the unrecognized republic, after which the advance of Azerbaijani troops stopped, and later an agreement was signed to end hostilities and bring in Russian peacekeepers.

According to Ognev, the role of Wagner's fighters in the Nagorno-Karabakh events is obvious. The Azerbaijanis, who had been preparing for 26 years, fought with the support of Turkish special forces, using modern weapons and drones. The Armenian servicemen were less equipped and had less combat experience. Therefore, it is quite logical that more combat-ready "Wagnerians" were faced with the participation of peacekeepers in the conflict zone.

There are seasoned guys. Of course, they will not be able to hold all of Karabakh. But in their area of ​​responsibility, and this is apparently the north - the Azerbaijanis were not allowed

- noted the veteran of the special services.

It is noteworthy that Russian mercenary servicemen have a wealth of experience in countering enemy combat drones - since the beginning of their participation in the war, the number of videos showing effective attacks by Turkish UAVs has sharply decreased. However, without air support, Azerbaijanis and Turks are not able to successfully fight the Wagner, whose fighters at one time almost hand-to-hand fighting the terrorists of the Islamic State (an organization banned in Russia).
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  1. Cudgel Offline Cudgel
    Cudgel (Dubina) 16 November 2020 11: 52
    -19 qualifying.
    Strangely, 500 Rambos, but only the front was held, our Foreign Ministry must have besieged them, otherwise they would have reached Baku in three days! 500 complete losers in life, forced to be cannon fodder for little money, from some kind of "veteran of the special services", suddenly, at once became super-fighters!

    ... However, without air support, the Azerbaijanis and Turks are not able to successfully fight the Wagner, whose fighters at one time almost hand-to-hand fighting terrorists ...

    - this is probably the chief cook wrote, to promote their defective. At one time these would-be warriors were notoriously hung by the Americans, probably still the mummified remains of a Rambo cook lie in the sands of Syria. And what is interesting, the so-called Wagnerians opposed the Turkish drones, hid from them in dugouts or did they bananally skidded?
    1. Rus Offline Rus
      Rus 16 November 2020 12: 05
      -13 qualifying.
      That's right ...
    2. sgrabik Offline sgrabik
      sgrabik (Sergei) 16 November 2020 12: 49
      +6
      You are truly a complete club if you think that combat experience means nothing in tactical battles. Azerbaijani soldiers can successfully fight against poorly trained and worse equipped Armenian fighters, but one should not compare them with our specials. divisions, and among the "Wagner" there are many real professionals who have passed many hot spots. In Syria, there were losses during a surprise attack by American aircraft at the time of the movement of the convoy, which included not only fighters from the Wagner group, but mostly Syrian military personnel, so you don't have to foolishly misinterpret and trite the facts, presenting the wishful thinking valid !!!
      1. Cudgel Offline Cudgel
        Cudgel (Dubina) 16 November 2020 13: 14
        -13 qualifying.
        Armenian soldiers, good fighters, no worse than Israelis (or almost no worse), only worse armed. And the fact that Azerbaijan defeated them speaks volumes. Our specialists are in many ways a product of the Zvezda TV channel and the like. Worse than NATO and American, possibly worse than Turkish and Iranian. Until the 75th Regiment of Rangers, SAS and other ours, like the moon. Maybe we have some kind of super special forces, but this is a single product, it won't make the weather.
        Well, at least you admit that the Americans beat the Wagnerites with a dry count, or hurray - the patriots do not agree with him.
        Did many Wagnerians fight in Syria or Libya? Drapanuli from both Syria and Libya, as they understood that they would have to fight with the Turkish regular army. And they (Wagnerians) are used not because they are all such super-duper Rambo, but to reduce the losses of the MO.
        1. Ser sash Offline Ser sash
          Ser sash (Ser Sash) 16 November 2020 14: 09
          +1
          I forgot to add my military rank and combat experience to understand the degree of competence.
          By what criteria did you judge?
          1. Cudgel Offline Cudgel
            Cudgel (Dubina) 16 November 2020 15: 00
            -12 qualifying.
            Well, a veteran of military operations, an honorary special forces soldier, a storm for SAS and Navy seals appeared on the scene! His competence is beyond doubt!
            I give up everything in advance, in front of such an authority as you! And tell us, dear comrade, how will the Wagnerians kill the 75th Ranger Regiment or the 82nd US Airborne Division? It will be interesting to listen to, based on your vast experience.
          2. isofat Online isofat
            isofat (isofat) 16 November 2020 15: 31
            +5
            Ser sash. Cudgel very good tongue shake, admirer of the clown Zelensky. As I learned that an information war had begun, I took off the pan and ran here. smile
            1. Cudgel Offline Cudgel
              Cudgel (Dubina) 16 November 2020 18: 03
              -8
              Well, I'll take off the pan. Why are you not in the trenches of Syria, you are our patriot! Running off the couch, clean Idlib from Turkish dishonesty!
              Kaak information war, ordinary PR. The cook wants to sell his Rimbos at a higher price, so they write all sorts of nonsense. Especially about the drones I was impressed with how they (Wagnerians) shoot them down.
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        2. kush62 Offline kush62
          kush62 16 November 2020 20: 06
          +6
          Your specialists, these are cyborgs. What are the potheads doing here?
      2. Baylar Rzayev Offline Baylar Rzayev
        Baylar Rzayev (Baylar Rzayev) 16 November 2020 17: 35
        -8
        Listen, not all Azerbaijani soldiers are 18-year-old recruits, and unlike your PMCs of whip, Azerbaijani specialists are trained and trained in all the best army schools in the world, they were trained by detachments (Bordeaux) Turkish (like maroon berets) your PMCs can only shoot ordinary Syrians in Syria. who are from 14-35 years old ... even today they arrange a competition between the specialists of the Azerbaijani Army and your PMCs and see who is who ..
        1. Cudgel Offline Cudgel
          Cudgel (Dubina) 16 November 2020 17: 56
          -8
          I agree with you. The special forces of Iran, Azerbaijan, Turkey, Kazakhstan are not weaker than ours, and there is nothing to compare with some lousy PMC.
          Turks, Iranians do not get out of wars at all, so they have something to "test" their spaceaz on.
          1. Binder Online Binder
            Binder (Miron) 16 November 2020 18: 22
            -6
            I do not know the level of training of Azerbaijani servicemen, I only know that the army of this state is being built largely according to the experience of the Turkish Armed Forces. And I had to communicate with the Turkish military back in the 90s, when Turkey and Israel were almost allies - joint exercises, training camps, exchange of experience were held. I can say with confidence that Turkish officers are well educated, technically literate, enjoy the well-deserved respect of their subordinates, and the rank and file are well trained, disciplined and perform their duties professionally. If the Azerbaijani servicemen are at least 50% the same, then the Armenians have nothing to catch against them. At the same time, I highly appreciate the courage and dedication of the Armenian soldiers, but the modern army is, first of all, a system, and it is not enough for it to successfully solve the combat tasks of the soldiers' personal heroism. Judging by the results of the current aggravation of the conflict in Karabakh, the Azerbaijanis have managed to build a modern army, while the Armenians have not. Something like this...
            1. Cudgel Offline Cudgel
              Cudgel (Dubina) 16 November 2020 18: 34
              -5
              We have two Azerbaijanis at work, but they are already Russian in spirit. Both in the late 80's, early 90's MAI finished or. Victory was celebrated that Monday. What was extremely surprised, I thought that they were completely Russified. Both spend part of their vacation at home. When Kaarabakh lost, which was surprising for me, expecting resistance, within the borders of November 10th, I began to ask them about Aliyev himself, life in Azeybarjan and their army. They said that there were no conscripts, like ours. And the regular army, yes, according to Turkish patterns, is strong, but everything was decided by technical superiority.
              Both treat Aliyev badly, clannishness, their own in power and the local people do not show off.
              1. Binder Online Binder
                Binder (Miron) 16 November 2020 18: 51
                -10 qualifying.
                I am aware of the current situation in Azerbaijan. The niece's husband told me. He is a businessman, has been doing business with Azerbaijan for a long time and often leaves Israel there. He says that the country has changed a lot since the times of the USSR, Baku has been decorated with modern buildings, the airport is generally amazing. Now we see that the army has also changed for the better since the 90s, when the Armenians managed to win in Karabakh.
                1. Cudgel Offline Cudgel
                  Cudgel (Dubina) 16 November 2020 19: 20
                  -7
                  Baku is a very beautiful city and a road along the Caspian Sea, both said. I have problems with vacation, I have long wanted to visit Azeybarjan, including gastronomic tourism.
                  For me, the news was that the Aliyev clan is roughly like ours. I thought that Aliyev was putting a smaller hand in the state pocket.
                  The question is when exactly their army began to change, 2006, 2008, 2016 or earlier. Our Generalisimo let go of everything for parades, ventures and funderwafli. In reality, in the Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation, old stuff from the late 80s.
              2. isofat Online isofat
                isofat (isofat) 16 November 2020 19: 21
                +4
                Quote: Cudgel
                We have two Azerbaijanis at work, but they are already Russian in spirit ...

                We have an employee at work whose son is a gamer ...

                We have several Belarusians at work, of course, they are not an indicator ...

                Sorry, where do you work? I hope you are not gathering information at the bazaar?
                1. Cudgel Offline Cudgel
                  Cudgel (Dubina) 16 November 2020 19: 25
                  -4
                  Office for the purchase of consumer electronics in China and the sale thereof in federal networks. Well, like most domestic firms. An office in Moscow, branches in the CIS, there were two branches in Ukraine, before the well-known events.
                  As for the bazaar, perhaps I will agree, I will have to go to the local Azerbaijanis and Armenians to ask, so to speak, first-hand about the events.
                  1. bulvas Offline bulvas
                    bulvas (Vasiliy) 17 November 2020 10: 54
                    +1
                    Dubina, stop composing.
                    You spend so much time communicating your "expert opinion" to us that it is not clear how you are kept at work.

                    And why pay so much attention to what you do not believe in, i.e. information from our sites?

                    Read what you think is right. It would never occur to me to waste time reading Ukrainian or Israeli news or articles.

                    Unless you have a job of a certain profile ...
                    1. Cudgel Offline Cudgel
                      Cudgel (Dubina) 17 November 2020 13: 06
                      -2
                      The article contains a clear lie, both about the Wagnerists in Karabakh and about their supposedly super-duper qualities as a soldier.
                2. bulvas Offline bulvas
                  bulvas (Vasiliy) 17 November 2020 10: 53
                  +2
                  It doesn't work anywhere.
                  Rather, writing is his job.
                  Dubina is everywhere, where the word Russia appears, and, moreover, manages to answer instantly.

                  Cudgel on Russian sites - plug from each barrel
          2. bulvas Offline bulvas
            bulvas (Vasiliy) 17 November 2020 11: 12
            +2
            Dubina, how do you know?

            You make a gap like a schoolboy in front of girls.
            1. Cudgel Offline Cudgel
              Cudgel (Dubina) 17 November 2020 13: 07
              -4
              This is an article of nonsense about the losers of the Wageners. They do not take on a normal job, so they go from despair to a PMC. When they are trampled by PMCs, they will be thrown into bandyuk or a panel. And in the little articles they try to make Rimbos out of them. It is high time to send half of them to LTP.
              1. bulvas Offline bulvas
                bulvas (Vasiliy) 17 November 2020 13: 21
                +2
                How do you know what is nonsense and what is not funny?

                Want a minute of fame?

                But what about PMCs in other countries - also losers?

                Do you have a good idea of ​​how much PMC fighters earn?

                Write to check.

                Most of all, you look like a loser - everyone is bad and everyone lies.
                No need to envy, it will be easier to live.
                1. Cudgel Offline Cudgel
                  Cudgel (Dubina) 17 November 2020 16: 02
                  -3
                  If our weapons are junk. Defense Secretary is junk. And the motivation of officers will last until retirement. Even the special forces are junk. Which of the normal people will go to the trash heap, by mistake, called the army? Of course, people from the provinces are coming to get out of poverty. But they go for the money, not for patriotic reasons.
                  I have seen enough of these super - duper rembos, sometimes they come to the guard to arrange, in short, morons, not completely finished, but still morons.
                  The Wagnerian is deprived of 240 and paid 000.

                  Do you have a good idea of ​​how much PMC fighters earn?

                  it is correct to write not "PMC fighters", but PMC-th rabble.
                  1. bulvas Offline bulvas
                    bulvas (Vasiliy) 17 November 2020 18: 48
                    0
                    If our weapons are junk. Defense Secretary Junk

                    Tell us about yourself, how are you so successful sitting among the solid junk?
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        3. Ishtar Offline Ishtar
          Ishtar (Ishtar) 17 November 2020 03: 23
          0
          You overestimate yourself. The Wagnerians have the majority of the commandos. And 14-35 years old, what's the difference, took the machine gun - the enemy must be destroyed.
          1. Peter rybak Offline Peter rybak
            Peter rybak (Patrol) 17 November 2020 17: 33
            +3
            Quote: Ishtar
            You overestimate yourself. The Wagnerians have the majority of the commandos. And 14-35 years old, what's the difference, took the machine gun - the enemy must be destroyed.

            I do not want to get involved in a dead-end dialogue, but it is not a sin to communicate with you, judging by the previous experience.
            I think that most of our troubles arise from underestimating not only the opponent, but also the neighbor. What's in football, what's in everything else))
            I am not sure of the highest professionalism of our PMC employees, since a few percent are paid to patriotism there, in most cases. Just as I'm not sure that there are no worthy rivals for the Wagnerists in the Azerbaijani army.
            500 Wagnerians, for all that they are glorified, were supposed to destroy the Azerbaijani army in the Rimbaud style.
            But this is all speculation.
            The question is: whose funds were used to support the PMCs? Their services are not cheap. The Armenians would hardly have paid. Their diaspora in Russia would not be able to do this, because the Wagner PMC in our country is subject to only one person. And, besides, they are more accustomed to guarding oil rigs, to participate in special operations where complete secrecy is needed. They will not get into a fight between two regular armies.
    3. rauf Offline rauf
      rauf 17 November 2020 02: 24
      0
      A powerful hand-to-hand fight was going on in Shusha and it was lost.
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      1. georgje Offline georgje
        georgje (George) 17 November 2020 08: 59
        0
        In hryvnia !, the ears of such specialists give out, and the nose
    5. bankiryvraginaroda (bankers are enemies of the people) 17 November 2020 07: 14
      +2
      cudgel ... you described yourself well
    6. EvgenKRER Offline EvgenKRER
      EvgenKRER (Eugene) 17 November 2020 10: 08
      0
      Yeah ... Cudgel is cudgel ... It looks like you are a fan of the amerikososov and his "mighty and great" rangers. Immediately to see that you are not familiar with "inquisitive tourists", and I do not advise you to get acquainted with them, but to meet and even more so, they smell people like you a mile away;)))
      1. Cudgel Offline Cudgel
        Cudgel (Dubina) 17 November 2020 13: 10
        -2
        ... Immediately to see that you are not familiar with "curious tourists

        - those who skedaddle from Libya when Erdogan came there. And who are now bypassing the del-az-Zorro area 100 km away, having received from the amerikosov the tinsel? What a cook can collect as cannon fodder is just any rabble that begs for trifles from pubs.
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  3. amateur Offline amateur
    amateur (Victor) 16 November 2020 12: 10
    +2
    According to Ognev, the role of Wagner's fighters in the Nagorno-Karabakh events is obvious.

    Inspired by ...

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  5. Bulanov Offline Bulanov
    Bulanov (Vladimir) 16 November 2020 13: 11
    0
    If there were "Wagnerians" there, it was only in the case that they opposed the Syrian mercenaries from "Ishil" (banned in Russia and on its borders).
    1. Cudgel Offline Cudgel
      Cudgel (Dubina) 16 November 2020 13: 38
      -7
      Hardly. If they were taken alive, it would be an international scandal, and we do not need it at all. And the soldiers, the so-called Wagnerites, are junk, losers, whom our Defense Ministry uses to reduce its losses.
      1. nbv Offline nbv
        nbv 16 November 2020 14: 59
        -8
        Dubina, congratulations! I am glad to meet an intelligent and thinking Russian with critical thinking. I have a feeling that even smart people in Russia are operated on with critical thinking, and your pseudo-patriotic swing is strongly overloaded.
        1. Vladimir Tuzakov (Vladimir Tuzakov) 16 November 2020 16: 11
          +5
          Dubina is clearly not Russian and Troll (it looks like Israeli - typically provocative). According to special forces, they are not bad in all countries, even Filipino, etc. - you can always recruit the best. As for the Russian and American special forces, you still need to look, and with the same equipment, I would give 50-50 to both ...
          1. Cudgel Offline Cudgel
            Cudgel (Dubina) 16 November 2020 17: 51
            -5
            We have an employee at work whose son is a gamer, 16 years old. When he came to her work, I talked to him. He cuts into some kind of network game and there they have a team of the same little girls. They have 7 from Russia and 5 from Israel. Israeli teenagers are very friendly to the Russian Federation. There is harmony between the leaders of the Russian Federation and Israel, they sell weapons to us, and so on.
            And the average salary in Israel is several times higher than in the Russian Federation. Prigogine Troll gets a penny for his "job". Tell me, why does the "Israeli troll" need to write something against the Russian Federation, for money that engineers here never dreamed of. Not cost effective.
            1. Vladimir Tuzakov (Vladimir Tuzakov) 16 November 2020 18: 05
              +5
              A Jew to change any of his dirty tricks into a virtue, you are one of the same ...
              1. Cudgel Offline Cudgel
                Cudgel (Dubina) 16 November 2020 18: 08
                -4
                Is this a quote from Dr. Gebels, who also attributed to the Jews universal "dirty tricks"?
                1. Vladimir Tuzakov (Vladimir Tuzakov) 17 November 2020 14: 09
                  0
                  Actually, Goebbels is from the Jews and probably knew what he was saying, like Eikhman and others, they just found themselves on the other side of the barricades, and the actions were the same ...
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                    1. Vladimir Tuzakov (Vladimir Tuzakov) 17 November 2020 16: 08
                      +1
                      German Nazis were replaced by Jewish Nazis, but the new Nazis do not advertise, but act out of silence. So look at yourself from the outside ...
      2. Ishtar Offline Ishtar
        Ishtar (Ishtar) 17 November 2020 03: 24
        0
        our? is it proto-ukr? ahahaha
  6. nbv Offline nbv
    nbv 16 November 2020 14: 49
    -8
    Before the title it was necessary to write: "Advertising message". Wagnerians probably wear Superman quilted jackets under their uniforms! 500 Wagnerians stopped the offensive of the entire Azerbaijani army and Turkish special forces ?! Yessss! I wonder why 600 Wagnerians in Dar er Zor were defeated by 200 Kurds and Americans with the help of several helicopters ?! Apparently they weren't wearing Superman suits back then. Don't forget important things from equipment, guys!
    1. sgrabik Offline sgrabik
      sgrabik (Sergei) 16 November 2020 15: 44
      +2
      In Syria, the "Wagnerians" were attacked exclusively from the air, there were no Kurds anywhere near there, in almost the same way, several large militant bases were blown to smithereens by our aircraft, they did not expect this at all and did not have time to react and escape !!!
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  9. Petr Vladimirovich (Peter) 16 November 2020 20: 13
    +2
    Well, purely Lieutenant Kizhe! Nobody has seen, but everyone knows that he is ...
  10. Barmaley_2 Offline Barmaley_2
    Barmaley_2 (Barmaley) 16 November 2020 21: 32
    +2
    This "invincible power of the Wagnerites" inspired me with the same advertising brochures about the "invincible-powerful air defense system s300". The army is an army. With its heavy equipment, etc. And no paramilitary, semi-guards, etc. formations are not able to compete with the modern army, while Azerbaijan has a fairly modern army, at least more modern than the Armenian one.
    1. Timur_3 Offline Timur_3
      Timur_3 (Timur Zheldashev) 16 November 2020 23: 13
      0
      As a Muslim, I say that the Armenians have something that neither the Catholics nor the Orthodox have. Armenians will understand me! They need to unite, take this thing to kiss, pray! It's not over yet! Patience, equipping your army like Israel's and don't give up! I wish Armenians all the best! You have this shrine, kiss it and ask God for rebirth, prosperity and victory !!! This is your land, do you know what it is? Well that's it! Let them Shiites live there a little bit. After all, Lenin organized these lands for them, and Ararat presented them to the Turks. What God has given you, no one will take it !!! And I would choose your Katalikos as the head of Armenia! He clearly would not have lost money! Unite, prosper and work for the good of your country! Friendship is strong with Russia and everything will be fine !!! Not everyone supports Azerbaijan and Turkey! Those who plot against Russia will immediately regret it !!! Turks have no place in the Caucasus !!!
      1. Binder Online Binder
        Binder (Miron) 17 November 2020 06: 29
        -2
        Equipping the army with modern means of warfare is very expensive, and Armenia is a poor little country, where can they get money? Azerbaijan has revenues from hydrocarbons, while Armenians have only national pride and an empty pocket ...
        1. Barmaley_2 Offline Barmaley_2
          Barmaley_2 (Barmaley) 17 November 2020 13: 22
          +4
          in the Lebanese war of 2006, Hezbollah very effectively resisted the IDF. The Jews did not fulfill the assigned tasks, having suffered significant losses. Even then, Israel quite massively used different UAVs in combination with art and aviation. TVDs were similar. It is difficult to call Hezbollah a rich organization, but by the way They showed themselves very well in Syria on the side of Assad.
          1. Binder Online Binder
            Binder (Miron) 17 November 2020 13: 42
            -5
            Quote: Barmaley_2
            in the 2006 Lebanese war, Hezbollah very effectively opposed the IDF. Jews did not fulfill their tasks, having suffered significant losses

            She resisted so effectively that its head from that time did not climb out of the bunker, and his militants were even afraid to fart loudly towards the Israeli border. This is with regard to the tasks set, and the losses of the Israelis for 34 days of hostilities - 121 servicemen, compare with the losses in other similar conflicts.
            1. Barmaley_2 Offline Barmaley_2
              Barmaley_2 (Barmaley) 17 November 2020 21: 51
              +1
              In the classical army, it is generally accepted that either the assigned combat mission has been completed or not. The rest is secondary. Then the IDF WAS NOT FULFILLED! They could not free anyone. And I'm not talking about losses here, comparing, but about the tactics of "poor armies "The same applies to the mujahideen in Afghanistan. At the time the US troops entered there, the Taliban were in power in the country with their own army. And today they control huge parts of the country. Although, to be honest, the Americans have fulfilled the officially set tasks. But the Yemeni Houthis are here. , who are also of the type of partisans, but in fact there are also army men who have switched over with equipment, they have been fighting quite well with the whole coalition for several years.
              1. Binder Online Binder
                Binder (Miron) 18 November 2020 01: 21
                -1
                You misinterpret the goals and objectives of the Second Lebanese War. Initially, there was no question of release - after examining the site of the border incident and the remnants of equipment, the military came to the conclusion that the dead bodies of two Israelis had fallen into the hands of the terrorists, the general public was told: there is hope that the reservists are only seriously wounded, but initially it was clear that there were no. The goal of the war was to defeat Hezbollah in order to ensure long-term silence on the northern border, and the tasks were to weaken the organization's infrastructure as much as possible, destroying its missile potential, minimizing damage from missile attacks on Israeli territory and losses among non-combatants. All of the above was carried out, the government and the army leadership after the war were severely criticized by the citizens of the country, but that is another question.
                1. Barmaley_2 Offline Barmaley_2
                  Barmaley_2 (Barmaley) 18 November 2020 03: 00
                  0
                  On the morning of July 12, 2006, the Israeli border village of Shlomi near Nahariya came under rocket fire from Lebanon. Around the same time, Hezbollah fighters infiltrated Israel east of Shlomi, attacked and blew up a border patrol armored vehicle with portable anti-tank missiles. The attack killed three and, as it was believed, two soldiers of the IDF were wounded - Eldad Regev and Ehud Goldwasser, who were abducted and transported to Lebanese territory by militants.
                  Israeli Prime Minister Ehud Olmert said that Hezbollah actually unleashed a new war. "There will be no negotiations with terrorist organizations," he stressed. Defense Minister Amir Peretz said the Lebanese government, which condones Hezbollah, bears full responsibility for the abduction of Israelis and that Israel is ready to resort to "any means" to free its compatriots. On the same day, the military-political cabinet gathered for an emergency meeting, which decided to conduct the operation "Sugar Kholem" ("Worthy retribution") against "Hezbollah". After ten days, during which the operation was mainly conducted by the Air Force, on the night of July 22-23, A. Peretz gave the order to start a large-scale ground operation in Lebanon, aimed at creating a buffer zone between the two countries and preventing Hezbollah's missile attacks on Israeli settlements.

                  https://eleven.co.il/state-of-israel/arab-israeli-conflict/15674/

                  In summary: the Israelis are NOT liberated; rocket attacks were NOT prevented and for the Jews this was an unpleasant surprise for this war.

                  Here is a good, detailed lecture by the Israeli military historian and poet Uri Milstein on a subject with many nuances.

                  http://z.berkovich-zametki.com/2018-znomer7-umilshtejn/

                  His closing words:

                  The IDF showed itself not up to par in this war. We did not cope with the task, we behaved incorrectly, we behaved badly - this concerns not only the inability to neutralize short-range missiles, as Halutz wrote, but also the fact that for 34 days we stupidly fought with a small organization ...

                  So I just interpret the goals and those tasks the way the Jews themselves set them.
                  1. Binder Online Binder
                    Binder (Miron) 18 November 2020 12: 31
                    -3
                    Quote: Barmaley_2
                    I just interpret the goals and those tasks the way the Jews themselves set them.

                    Uri Milstein expressed his point of view, which is not shared by everyone in Israel. And on the northern border for 14 years, silence is the result of the Second Lebanese War.
  11. Timur_3 Offline Timur_3
    Timur_3 (Timur Zheldashev) 16 November 2020 22: 20
    +1
    Time will tell guys whose special forces are better! Let's not talk about birds! As long as I see the Russian better, there is no need to grunt!
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  13. Garri Hakobyan_2 (Garri Hakobyan) 17 November 2020 17: 42
    0
    No one saw any Russian troops, especially Wagner, in Karabakh, don't talk nonsense, the borders of Armenia were strengthened by Russian border guards together with the Armenians and everything, the rest was done by Armenian conscripts, 18-20 years old, mostly and a little from veterans, slightly Armenians from abroad .. Leave this Azeri propaganda, do not justify, we and God know everything, the rest will be judged by the time, it’s a pity that the Kremlin turned out to be a traitor to both Russians and Christians and Armenians, but this was as it should be, because it’s not Russians at all sitting in the Kremlin. ...
  14. Phill phillat Offline Phill phillat
    Phill phillat (Letnab) 18 November 2020 04: 07
    0
    Bredyatina, some kind ...