Declassified materials on "Kursk": why no one answered for the death of the submarine


Everything secret sooner or later becomes apparent. Therefore, it should not be surprising that on August 29, 2019, the transcripts of his telephone and personal conversations with Vladimir Putin were published on the website of Bill Clinton's digital library. The documents are dated 1999-2001, all of them were classified as "secret". After 20 years, the secrecy label was removed, and they were made public. There is nothing strange in this, it is strange that we noticed it only a year later. The leak was published by Meduza (another resource).


In declassified materials, Putin communicates with American colleagues as director of the FSB and secretary of the Russian Security Council, head of government, etc. about. President of the Russian Federation and already as the head of the Russian state. The topics discussed are different. I was interested in two of them - the sinking of the Kursk nuclear-powered ship and the fate of Yugoslavian President Slobodan Milosevic.

SSGN K-141 "Kursk"


On September 6, 2000, Vladimir Putin and Bill Clinton met in New York in the presidential suite of the Waldorf Astoria Hotel. The meeting was also attended by the deputy. Head of the AP RF Sergey Prikhodko and deputy. US Secretary of State Strobe Talbott, fluent in Russian. Please note that the transcript below (in particular, Putin's speech) has been translated twice: first by a translator from Russian into English, and then by Meduza back from English into Russian (some stylistic inaccuracies are possible, but the meaning is conveyed accurately).

Clinton: “I regret everything that you had to go through because of the loss of the Kursk. When something like this happens, people around the world imagine themselves in the place of the victims and their loved ones, but I also imagined myself in your place. You have probably faced a lot of criticism. It always happens. After Oklahoma City, many asked if the building was well defended and if we had allowed terrorists into the country. So my heart was with the people at the bottom of the sea, and with everyone else too. "

Information: Oklahoma City is the largest terrorist attack in the United States at the time of the Clinton-Putin conversation. On April 19, 1995, a car bomb exploded there. The northern part of the Alfred Marr Federal Building was destroyed. As a result of the terrorist attack, 168 people died and more than 680 were injured.

Putin: “I didn't have a good choice. I was trapped between bad and worse options. I was told that if I had just launched a small submarine there and at least tried to save the guys, my ratings would have increased. You shouldn't be allowed to do something like that for the sake of PR. We must give priority to the real salvation of people. I appreciate your sincere support. Ironically, subsequent polls showed that this incident did not affect my situation. But I am very afraid that something like this could happen again. "

Clinton: “Now we are working in a different environment. If a building explodes in Moscow, it’s like it’s happening at our relatives. Or if people in Mozambique are forced to climb trees to escape flooding ... In many ways this is good. It reminds us that others are people too. It's harder to hate after that. But sometimes it is difficult for a leader to do the right thing because of all these strong feelings. "

Putin: “We felt powerless during this disaster. Now it looks like the entire crew died within 60 or 90 seconds. We could not tell our relatives, but there was a hole in the hull about two meters in size, through which the first three compartments of the submarine flooded. I don't even know how we can get the bodies out. There is a lot of cod in these waters - there may be no flesh on the bones. We tried to slow down all this hype, but some people are weird and they just kept fueling it. It's just a fact of life. "


What you should pay attention to. This conversation took place on September 6, and the accident with the Kursk SSGN occurred on August 12, as a result of which it sank and lay on the bottom in the Barents Sea, 175 km from Severomorsk (69 ° 40 ′ N 37 ° 35 ′ E. at a depth of 108 meters. All 118 crew members on board were killed. In terms of the number of deaths, this is the largest tragedy in the post-war history of the Soviet and Russian submarine fleet.

The official version of the death of K-141 "Kursk"


The investigation of the criminal case was completed on July 22, 2002.

There are no persons guilty of the Kursk SSGN crash, involving the death of one hundred and eighteen people on board the cruiser,

- written in the resolution of the senior investigator for especially important cases of the Chief Military Prosecutor's Office Artur Yegiev.

According to the official version, announced in 2002 by Prosecutor General Ustinov, the SSGN crash was caused by the explosion at 11:28:26 Moscow time of the training torpedo 65-76 PV ("Kit") in the torpedo tube No. 4 of the boat, which led to a fire in the 1st compartment, which in turn after 2 minutes led to the detonation of already combat torpedoes and the second explosion, which buried the boat along with the crew. The cause of the first explosion was the leakage of torpedo fuel components (hydrogen peroxide).

Version of Vice Admiral Ryazantsev


This is the official version, which has not yet been denied. Although there is also a report by the deputy. Chief of the Main Directorate of the Navy for Combat Training Vice Admiral Valery Ryazantsev, who was a member of the government commission to investigate the causes and circumstances of the K-141 disaster, who believes that the reason for the first explosion of the so-called "thick" torpedo 65-76 PV was its replenishment with non-fatty air high pressure on August 11, 2000, produced by the boat's crew, who, due to their incompetence, used incorrect instructions, which provoked an uncontrolled reaction of hydrogen peroxide decomposition after loading a torpedo from a rack into a torpedo tube on August 12, 2000. This became possible as a result of the resupply of the crew of the Kursk SSGN before going to sea due to the shortage of specialists from other submarines who have no experience with hydrogen peroxide torpedoes.

The second explosion, according to Vice Admiral Ryazantsev, did not occur as a result of a massive fire in the 1st compartment, but because of the collision of the SSGN with the ground. According to his version, K-141 "Kursk", with the 1st compartment filled with water after the first explosion, at a speed of about 3 knots, with a nose trim of 40-42 degrees, collided with the ground at a depth of 108 meters, as a result of which torpedo tubes No. 1, 3, 5 and 6 with combat torpedoes equipped with fuses were crushed and destroyed, which led to an explosion and the subsequent death of the crew.

Facts established after the 2001 boat was lifted


Even now, after lifting the boat, it became clear that as a result of the explosion of a training torpedo and detonation after hitting the ground with the rest of the combat torpedoes, not only the 1st torpedo compartment was destroyed, but also the 2nd, where the Central Post was located together with the ship's commander, Caprang Gennady Lyachin. and the senior campaign chief of staff of the 7th division of the nuclear submarine of the Northern Fleet, caperang Vladimir Bagryantsev (and this could not be avoided due to the design features of the 941A Antey project, as Ryazantsev pointed out). The blast wave, crushing the bulkheads, reached the 5th compartment, the aft bulkhead of which bent, but withstood the blow. Most of the crew died immediately, but 23 members managed to escape by being battered in the 9th compartment. They hoped for help, but it did not come because of the criminal inaction of the SF command and personally of the SF commander, Admiral Popov, who directly supervised the exercises. The boat was not declared emergency on time (it happened only 12 hours later), time was lost, rescue work began when, in fact, there was no one to save. The Supreme Commander-in-Chief was not properly informed, as a result he did not even interrupt his vacation in Sochi, which lasted until 17 August. The deceased sailors were posthumously awarded the Orders of Courage, the commander of K-141 caperang Lyachin was awarded the title of Hero of the Russian Federation (but not for the death of the boat, but for the previous campaign, it just happened posthumously).

The fact that Vice Admiral Ryazantsev's version was accepted for execution is clear from the following fact: after Prosecutor General Ustinov submitted his report to the President on November 25, 2001, within three hours a decree was signed on the dismissal of seventeen officers of the Northern Fleet and the General Staff of the Navy , including several admirals, with the wording "for omissions in the organization of combat training." In fact, by doing so, they swept the garbage under the carpet, and the version of Prosecutor General Ustinov was recognized as the official version.

It's clear that it's a dark thing


Every year, the history of the sinking of the Kursk SSGN acquires new details, which, however, do not add any clarity. The commander-in-chief, of course, knows the real picture, but does not consider it necessary to make it public. Only one thing is clear from the declassified negotiations with Clinton - at the time of the conversation with the US President, Putin did not know the real picture of the tragedy, mistakenly believing that the entire crew died literally in the first 1,5 minutes after the explosion. The fact that this is not so is evident from the posthumous notes of Lieutenant-Commander Kolesnikov, Lieutenant Commander Sadilenko and Senior Warrant Officer Borisov, discovered after the boat was lifted, which they wrote in the dark, being battened down along with the other 20 surviving sailors in the de-energized 9th compartment. ... These notes did not help, of course, to establish the cause of the death of the submarine, but from them it is clear that the survivors were waiting for help from outside, being unable to come to the surface themselves. They themselves had no chance to escape. Only the rescuers had a chance to save them. But the first two days were lost, thanks to the Commander of the Northern Fleet. Two days later, there was no one to save. It is clear that there was no talk of saving people then.

Who is more to blame for this, everyone decides for himself. I would not remove some of the guilt from the Supreme Commander, with all due respect to him. An unwritten law has been passed in the fleet - the commander is responsible for everything on the ship. Even if the watchman did not report the incident to him, he is still to blame, and for the fact that he did not report - too! And Putin at that time took control of our common ship. I am sure he himself still feels his guilt for this, he is a decent person. But why the guilty were not punished, the same SF commander is a question! So there was an attempt to play. And this is our big minus. We are all trying to play. Then with "Kursk", a year ago with Losharik. All closed-door - dead heroes, no one is to blame.

What does this practice lead to? To the next accidents! And the fact that VVP revived our Navy, so honor and glory to him, no one denies this. But an attempt to play and hide everything under the cloth is our everything! Nothing has changed since the time of Peter I.

Summary


K-141 "Kursk" crashed and sank almost in full view of the fleet. According to the Instruction, she should have been declared emergency one hour after the ascent report expired. And immediately measures had to be taken to rescue the surviving submariners. But the emergency alert in the fleet was announced only 10 hours later! The blame for the criminal delay was, first of all, the head of the exercises, Admiral Popov (who did not bear any responsibility for this). In addition, there are no rescue vessels left in the fleet specially trained to rescue submarine crews. There were descent vehicles, but there were no necessary, well-trained specialists. All efforts to save the submariners on the part of our rescuers, who nevertheless arrived at the crash site with a great delay, were unsuccessful. As a result, management late turned to the Norwegian government for help, where such rescue devices were available. We lost time, and the surviving sailors died due to the sudden deterioration of the situation in the compartment ...

Eternal memory to heroes!

And in the declassified talks between Putin and the 42nd US President, I was personally struck by the degree of frankness of both. Especially against the backdrop of the details of his confidential telephone conversations with his Russian counterpart, recently leaked by Macron through the French media. I fully admit that the leaders of both countries in private conversations, believing that they will not be made public, may not say that. Only Clinton waited 20 years for the talks to be publicized, and Macron acted ugly, violating the unwritten code of honor. If his surname was Zelensky, I would not even be surprised, but I did not expect it from the president of the 5th republic. Even Lavrov, who had seen a lot, could not believe this.

But returning to Clinton and our deceased Project 949A Antey submarine, I want to say that she owes her life to him. More precisely, his Operation Allied Force, the NATO bombing of Serbia (FRY) in 1999, after which relations between our countries deteriorated, and we suspended the dismantling of the SSGN of this project. It must be said that the Kursk was the twelfth in a series of thirteen Project 949 Granit-Antey submarines, created to combat aircraft carrier strike groups of the US Navy. These "aircraft carrier killers" in the navy were jokingly called "batons" because of their cylindrical design, divided into ten strong compartments (the 9th was the last one from the stern, since, in addition to the 5th, there was also a 5bis compartment). Against the background of Yeltsin's warming of relations between our countries, we managed to withdraw from the fleet and send for disposal two similar cruisers - K-525 "Arkhangelsk" (withdrawn from the Northern Fleet in 1996) and K-206 "Murmansk" (withdrawn from the Pacific Fleet 1998), subsequently disposed of at the expense of the UK at the Zvezdochka enterprise (in 2005). And also to mothball and suspend the construction of two new ones - K-135 Volgograd (laid down in 1993, cut into metal in 2012) and K-160 "Barnaul" (readiness for 2002 - 49%, cut into metal in 2012). The same fate awaited the remaining eleven nuclear-powered submarines, including the Kursk, but friend Bill changed his fate, thereby dooming 118 sailors to death. These are the vicissitudes of fate.
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  1. Monster_Fat Offline Monster_Fat
    Monster_Fat (What's the difference) 14 October 2020 08: 52
    -10 qualifying.
    There are different versions ... There is also a version about the sinking of the boat in view of its capture by terrorists who entered the boat under the guise of "specialists" in torpedo weapons from Dagestan ...
    1. 2534 Offline 2534
      2534 14 October 2020 11: 55
      +9
      Quote: Monster_Fat
      There is also a version about the sinking of the boat in view of its capture by terrorists who entered the boat under the guise of "specialists" in torpedo weapons from Dagestan ...

      - this is not a "version" but nonsense
      1. prelovskij Offline prelovskij
        prelovskij (bone) 30 October 2020 18: 33
        0
        Russia needs to deliver a nuclear strike against the United States and this will end the Great Patriotic War. The United States cannot retaliate with a nuclear strike against Russia, it has already tried it many times. Russia can http://www.litsovet.ru/index.php/material.read?material_id=584764
    2. Sergey Eliseev Offline Sergey Eliseev
      Sergey Eliseev 18 October 2020 14: 42
      0
      You are mad, are not you?
  2. mark2 Offline mark2
    mark2 (Alexander) 14 October 2020 08: 54
    -1
    That's all liberoids need blood. Give them the guilty ones. The author clearly hints that Putin must definitely be the culprit. Otherwise, there was no point in writing this footcloth.
    Or he can appoint the author of the article. So what is not in business. A lot
    1. Volkonsky Offline Volkonsky
      Volkonsky (Vladimir) 14 October 2020 18: 24
      +2
      Quote: mark2
      Flutters

      Uncle, you first learn the Russian language, and then appoint the guilty here! This word is written through E - flutters. And the Supreme's job is to be responsible for everything, or did you not know ?!
      1. Turukhansk Offline Turukhansk
        Turukhansk (Danila) 20 October 2020 11: 48
        +2
        You both need to issue the textbook, because the spelling is correct laughing
      2. The comment was deleted.
    2. margo Offline margo
      margo (margo) 20 October 2020 17: 04
      0
      Who else? Or do you think that any actions took place without his knowledge? He is the first and only person in this history who directly influenced the situation of rescuing sailors. Correctly! Now will they make or have already made everyone to blame, from the Commander of the Northern Fleet to the janitor in the port where this boat was based, but VVP is not to blame, he is a hegemon as possible?
    3. Kamerunec Offline Kamerunec
      Kamerunec (Anatoly) 3 November 2020 22: 04
      -1
      https://www.opentown.org/news/275223?user=33279

      Read who rules the country.
  3. Sergey Latyshev Offline Sergey Latyshev
    Sergey Latyshev (Serge) 14 October 2020 09: 24
    +4
    A good article. And then the version, some in the forest, some for wood.
    And here, briefly, clearly, only at the end I slightly pulled it over the Clinton ...
    1. 2534 Offline 2534
      2534 14 October 2020 11: 56
      -2
      Quote: Sergey Latyshev
      And here, briefly, clearly,

      in Volkonsky - another session PORKY BULBS
      1. Volkonsky Offline Volkonsky
        Volkonsky (Vladimir) 14 October 2020 18: 28
        0
        Comrade major, all claims against Vice Admiral Ryazantsev
        if you have your own version of the death of K-141, you can state it in a letter to the Ministry of Defense, but unlike V. Ryazantsev, you were not part of the government commission, as far as I can imagine
        1. The comment was deleted.
        2. 2534 Offline 2534
          2534 14 October 2020 23: 59
          +1
          Lance corporal Volkonsky, unlike AHINEA Ryazantsev, what is the 949A project and the torpedoes 65-76A I know personally, in practice
          1. Volkonsky Offline Volkonsky
            Volkonsky (Vladimir) 15 October 2020 01: 50
            +1
            my military rank will be higher, I know that you served on the K-150 "Tomsk" of project 949A, it remains only to find out which warhead you commanded, if the BCH-3, then there are no questions, and Ryazantsev commanded the BCH-2, further you can track his passage of service here

            http://podplav.ru/ob-yavleniya/482-biografiya-ryazantseva-v-d.html

            - there is the commander of the nuclear submarine, and the NSh of the division of the nuclear submarine, and the commander of the division of the nuclear submarine, he finished his journey as a deputy. Chief of the Main Directorate of Combat Training of the RF Armed Forces for the Navy. I do not think that the submarine commander knows about torpedoes worse than his subordinate. Ryazantsev answered all your other claims here

            http://www.sovross.ru/articles/372/6167
            1. 2534 Offline 2534
              2534 15 October 2020 11: 01
              0
              Quote: Volkonsky
              the fleet. I don't think

              and YOU don’t think at all, but you are carrying ACHINA wassat - just like Ryazantsev. Something from ROCKY Ryazantsev:

              https://www.vif2ne.org/nvk/forum/0/archive/1936/1936494.htm
              1. Volkonsky Offline Volkonsky
                Volkonsky (Vladimir) 15 October 2020 18: 47
                0
                1) comrade. captri, you have dashed off more text here than in the main article, the reader is not prepared to perceive such specific information on the ax, if you use an abbreviation, then at least decipher it
                2) you have a protracted war with V. Ryazantsev, which has been going on since 2010, I do not participate in it, I just bring different points of view, I am not discussing the technical features of the accident here, I am citing only the official and unofficial versions of the death of the SSGN, nowhere the version of Klimov's captri did not appear in official sources
                3) I asked you in plain text, which warhead commanded on the K-150 Tomsk, if there are no questions about the warhead, you did not answer
                4) academies, I understand, you did not graduate, it means that you have a secondary technical military and higher engineering education - VVMU them. Frunze, anti-submarine warfare, surface ships, at Ryazantsev there are two higher military men - the Academy of the Navy and the Academy of the General Staff, not counting the Officer classes and the profile VVMUP them. Lenkom. You graduated from VVMU in 1998, i.e. in the year of its merger with VVMUPP and the formation of the Marine Corps of Peter the Great SPbVMI, i.e. you have no specialized underwater education. Why should I trust you?
                5) I understand, of course, that any mechanic at the service station is better versed in the engine than his boss, especially since V. Ryazantsev is a missile operator, not a torpedo-miner, but you are not a submariner by education, although the anti-submarine faculty is service on K-150 inspires confidence in your conclusions
                6) therefore, a wish for the future - less trash in statements, then the moderator will not clean you (I have nothing to do with this, I finally don’t care what you call me, but, mind you, I have full respect for you, have you respect for opponents, especially since I'm not your opponent)
                7) and last - which nuclear submarine was commanded by Ryazantsev, do you know? maybe he commanded the SSBN, not the SSGN, then that changes everything, but the war between the major and the colonel-general resembles a plot from Krylov's fable, don't you think?
                1. 2534 Offline 2534
                  2534 16 October 2020 00: 01
                  -1
                  Quote: Volkonsky
                  just give different points of view

                  - Ryazantsev DOESN'T have a "POINT OF VIEW" - what he wrote is ACHINA and "TECHNICAL" nonsense, which has nothing to do with the materiel

                  Quote: Volkonsky
                  Ryazantsev has two higher military men - the Academy of the Navy and the Academy of the General Staff

                  - So what? See another OTmirala - by the name of Zhandarov
                  I'm not even talking about his "pearls" and Akhinea, but this current "specialist in settling Tajiks in basements", by the way, was the SENIOR TEACHER OF THE MILITARY ACADEMY OF THE GENERAL STAFF, and now we are "enjoying the beautiful"



                  Yes, SUCH belay there are deaths
                  So Ryazantsev is not alone in his "woodiness" - with all his "academies"

                  Quote: Volkonsky
                  you are not a submariner of Education

                  Little Johnny, but there are such in general? lol

                  Quote: Volkonsky
                  which nuclear submarine Ryazantsev commanded, do you know? maybe he commanded the SSBN, not the SSGN, then this changes everything

                  1st generation or 627A or 659T, I don't remember now, and it doesn't change anything, because he also had the same torpedoes with fuses of the "I" series (SET-65), etc.
                  Ryazantsev bears just an ILLITERATE trash, "version of this" I was called by people who knew him - "serpent".
                2. Accidentally Offline Accidentally
                  Accidentally 24 October 2020 09: 24
                  -2
                  Volkonskiy- under the current government, we will never know the truth. The admirals are to blame for the torpedo, and the parrots will repeat ............ and the human factor is on the side, why did the Americans wander about in the territorial waters of Russia ?? I carefully watched the photos and videos, explain the reasons for the bend on the right side of the boat, a thick metal with a thickness of about 30 mm (the outer hull of the nuclear submarine) inward with a round smooth hole ?? it looks like a torpedo that has flown in, there are many versions from outside, and the prosecutor's office and other commissions will repeat - the torpedo is to blame, right now we are witnessing the agony of the current government - after the collapse, we will find out the truth (the inner case is the thickness of the metal, I don't know ..... so we'll live but the truth we will find out soon
                  1. Volkonsky Offline Volkonsky
                    Volkonsky (Vladimir) 24 October 2020 17: 58
                    -1
                    there, at the end of the kammentov, your question has already been professionally answered - cmonman (Garik Mokin) October 14, 2020 20:09
              2. Volkonsky Offline Volkonsky
                Volkonsky (Vladimir) 15 October 2020 19: 09
                0
                And once again I draw your attention to the title of the article - Why did no one answer for the death of the K-141 crew? you know?
                1. 2534 Offline 2534
                  2534 16 October 2020 00: 03
                  -1
                  Quote: Volkonsky
                  Why didn't anyone answer for the death of the K-141 crew? you know?

                  Yes, and the OFFICIAL answer is quite accurate.
                  Because there is no causal relationship between the death of people and specific misconduct of officials. And this is exactly a FACT.
                  If the Kursk began to appear IMMEDIATELY, then yes, the dead "above" would be on Popov's conscience ... But instead they began to equip the RDU (which was not necessary)
    2. beeper Offline beeper
      beeper 14 October 2020 12: 14
      +4
      hi Well, yes, at the end of the Article there was an absurd "eye-catching" Clinton-what was it, did not expect such an outright "blooper" from Vladimir (maybe the text was edited against his will? winked ) ??!
      And so, everything was stated in Volkonski sensibly and quite plausibly, and the opinion of Admiral Ryazantsev was voiced! good
      I remember well this day of summer 2000!
      That Saturday, August 12, my family was in the village and went to the Chernobyl forest to pick mushrooms. Our son, just at noon, unexpectedly fell out of the blue and broke his arm (in Chernobyl children, fractures are "in the order of things", since radioactive strontium partially replaced the silicon in their bones and they became fragile) ... and on Sunday 13, upon arrival from the city emergency room, finally turned on the TV and learned from the TV news that yesterday

      the nuclear submarine temporarily lay down on the ground during the exercises of the Northern Fleet ...

      Then he told his wife that this should not be possible, this is only possible with diesel submarines, and the nuclear submarines have reactor cooling water intakes located on the sides at the bottom, and when "laid on the ground" they can be damaged by the rocky bottom relief or clogged with bottom silt ... a serious misfortune has happened!
      And then on the central channels of Russian TV there were guilty eyes and awkward "conspiracy" hints and threats from Admiral Popov, the sly face of "Commissioner" Klebanov and the daily florid lies of Dygalo Jr., appointed "press secretary" .... and regular

      the rescue vehicle was unable to dock to the escape hatch site.

      Then he told his Belarusian relatives and friends that if this, hypothetically, happened to a Belarusian submarine, then Lukashenka, just hearing, would immediately give up all business and all "rest in Sochi", and would rush to the scene of the accident, start doing everything, to save people without stopping at anything! And it was True, the Belarusian "father" then WAS like this, until in 2014 he kissed the Bandera scoundrels and himself became Russophobic! request
      Putin's cheerful Larry Kingu- "She drowned!" it was incomprehensible to me and like a knife in my heart, I thought then: "What a fool!" yes
      I have always remembered the crying sailor at the Naval Cathedral in Leningrad, who said to the NTV telegram filming him: “Gena Lyachin was my friend!” - this phrase has remained in my ears!
      And my beloved, in life, sentence "Do not despair!", after exactly the same was found in the last note of the deceased submariner, a big smiling Russian guy, Lieutenant-Commander Dmitry Kolesnikov, now I forever associate with his image!
      This our ineradicable army (in this case, naval!) And bureaucratic stupidity, a kind of desire to "please the authorities and outside spectators", will not finish one of us, alas!
      Eternal memory to the dead and veneration to the living Defenders of the Fatherland! soldier
      1. beeper Offline beeper
        beeper 14 October 2020 13: 39
        0
        PS I will not keep track of all the "vybrykami" of my "intellectual" smartphone, which I have written in my own way (I apologize for these "misunderstandings"!) - should be read at "laying (not laying))) on the ground "and telegroup(not a telegram!) NTV!
      2. Volkonsky Offline Volkonsky
        Volkonsky (Vladimir) 14 October 2020 19: 19
        0
        You know how, comrade. Pischak, it is beautiful to present the material, you should write novels, but you spend your time on the ax. Regarding your claims. No, this is not an editor, I wrote this myself. This is just a cruel statement of facts, if the K-141, as it was assumed by Yeltsin's associates, had been withdrawn from the fleet for disposal in the 90s, then it would not have gone to the bottom in 2000. Such are the vicissitudes of fate. And Clinton was indirectly involved in this by his bombing of the FRY. Eternal memory to the heroes! VVP simply regretted, apparently, the command of the Federation Council, punished the switchmen and limited himself to this. 23 people are on the conscience of Popov. And I have not yet written anything about Lieutenant-Commander Aryapov, who drowned out the atomic power plant, fulfilled his duty and the Official Instruction to the end, battered in the engine room, and at the cost of his life saved the world from the even worse consequences of the accident. Which ones, you already know, since you went through Chernobyl. Lieutenant-Commander Aryapov Rashid Ramisovich - commander of the TG DD, born in 1971, VVMIU

        https://novayagazeta.ru/articles/2020/08/11/86609-chto-uspel-peredat-kursk

        - here is the whole truth about the death of K-141. If you want to walk on your bones, read this first.
        ZY Comrade Pischak, a personal question - do you have anything to do with the fleet? served urgent? on the Northern Fleet? on which ship? I just see a deep understanding of the subject and who is responsible for what in the Navy. From SW. a certain Volkonsky.
        1. 2534 Offline 2534
          2534 14 October 2020 23: 46
          0
          at the cost of his life saved the world from the even worse consequences of the accident

          Volkonsky, YOU have an amazing mania to "sing" about what YOU are just ABSOLUTE ZERO
          google it lightly:
          1. The natural self-protection property of VVR
          2. Differences in the reactivity coefficient of VVR for the 2nd and 3rd generations
          3. State of PPU K-141
          4. Position of the GTZA speed controllers on the PU GEM
          etc.
          however, for YOU all this is "very difficult" and "incomprehensible", but the "vest" once again "to the public to break" is YOUR
        2. 2534 Offline 2534
          2534 15 October 2020 00: 05
          +1
          Quote: Volkonsky
          saved the world from the even worse consequences of the accident. Which ones, you already know, since you went through Chernobyl

          fool from this moment in more detail, Volkonsky belay
          1. 2534 Offline 2534
            2534 15 October 2020 00: 28
            +1
            explanation ("a bit of hardware"):

            To increase the reliability and safety, the OK-650B unit was made with a sufficiently high level of natural circulation of the primary coolant. This was achieved due to the placement of steam generators above the core, as well as a significant decrease in the hydraulic resistance of the primary circuit, for which OKBM developed a steam generator with the movement of the primary coolant in the annular space. The provision of natural circulation of the primary circuit coolant allowed not only cooling down using a batteryless cooling system, but also operating in running modes without primary circuit pumps at powers up to about 30% of the nominal

            On OK-650, the reactor control and protection system has changed significantly. ... A self-propelled mechanism was installed on the compensating organs, which, in the event of a power failure, ensured the lowering of the gratings onto the lower limit switches. In this case, there was a complete "jamming" of the reactor even when the ship capsized

            http://www.biblioatom.ru/evolution/istoriya-osnovnyh-sistem/istoriya-reactorov/ok-650/
  4. Cyril Offline Cyril
    Cyril (Kirill) 14 October 2020 10: 59
    -5
    Why didn't the author publish Putin's words about how worried he is about his rating in connection with the death of the Kursk?

    Why didn't the author publish Putin's words about how he was not completely against the overthrow of Milosevic and even proposed his own version of removing him from power?

    Why didn't the author publish Putin's words that he would also bomb Iraq?

    And Yeltsin, who was not loved by jingo-patriots, in Yugoslavia pursued a much tougher policy towards NATO than the current Supreme Commander.

    All this is in the declassified negotiations between our and the American presidents. This, by the way, was published by Meduza, which the author considers "still a resource."
    1. Volkonsky Offline Volkonsky
      Volkonsky (Vladimir) 14 October 2020 18: 37
      0
      Putin: “I didn't have a good choice. I was trapped between bad and worse options. I was told that if I had just launched a small submarine there and at least tried to save the guys, my ratings would have increased. You shouldn't be allowed to do something like that for the sake of PR. We must give priority to the real salvation of people. I appreciate your sincere support. Ironically, subsequent polls showed that this incident did not affect my situation. But I am very afraid that something like this could happen again. "

      Uncle who reads Medusa carefully - open your eyes! And I will publish about Milosevic next time, and so I went beyond the limit of signs. No one here is afraid of the truth and does not hide it, just don’t pour soup on our Supreme, we ourselves will praise and scold him, if there is anything for it.
      1. Cyril Offline Cyril
        Cyril (Kirill) 15 October 2020 00: 06
        -3
        Uncle who reads Medusa carefully - open your eyes!

        It’s not good to then add passages that were not there and accuse me of what I supposedly didn’t see :)
        1. Volkonsky Offline Volkonsky
          Volkonsky (Vladimir) 15 October 2020 01: 55
          0
          I thought you had problems only with the perception of printed text, it turns out also with vision. I sympathize! The text after it is posted is not subject to revision. I have no right to this!
  5. Cyril Offline Cyril
    Cyril (Kirill) 14 October 2020 11: 03
    -5
    The same fate awaited the remaining eleven nuclear submarine cruisers, including the Kursk, but friend Bill changed his fate, than doom 118 sailors to death.

    But this passage is not just incorrect - it is absolutely disgusting. Oh, is Clinton to blame for the death of the Kursk submarine and its sailors?)

    It's just interesting how the brain of authors-propagandists works like that, that their "logic" gives out such tricks.
    1. Volkonsky Offline Volkonsky
      Volkonsky (Vladimir) 14 October 2020 18: 42
      +2
      Uncle, this is a cruel statement of facts, if the K-141 had been, as it was supposed, taken out of the fleet for disposal in the 90s, then in 2000 it would not have gone to the bottom. Such are the vicissitudes of fate. And Clinton, with her bombing of the FRY, is indirectly to blame for this.
      1. Cyril Offline Cyril
        Cyril (Kirill) 14 October 2020 19: 36
        -2
        laughing This is not a cruel reality, but an attempt to pull an owl onto a globe :)
        1. Volkonsky Offline Volkonsky
          Volkonsky (Vladimir) 14 October 2020 19: 43
          +2
          if you have problems with determining cause and effect relationships, contact a specialist -

          1. Cyril Offline Cyril
            Cyril (Kirill) 15 October 2020 00: 05
            -2
            No, this is your problem, since you are doing such "cause-and-effect relationships" :)
            1. isofat Offline isofat
              isofat (isofat) 15 October 2020 00: 25
              0
              Cyril... When I found out that you write when you are honest, I thought: What do you write when you lie ...
              Here is your answer:

              So far, you have been noticed for lying. Don't blame me for your sins.

              And here is a screen of your confession that you are passing your sins onto others.


              love
              1. Cyril Offline Cyril
                Cyril (Kirill) 15 October 2020 00: 45
                0
                And here is a screen of your confession that you are passing your sins onto others.

                First, learn not to misinterpret Churchill's quotes when copying from the Internet, then blame me for your sins.
      2. The comment was deleted.
  6. 2534 Offline 2534
    2534 14 October 2020 11: 47
    +2
    Monsieur Volkonsky, YOU again decided to show off on "naval issues"?
    1. Ryazantsev is a deceitful TRAP, with his stupid opus (and the report of the GDP) settling personal scores.
    2. "Ryazantsev's version" is absolutely incompetent and technically it was defeated by specialists (publicly - by me).
    3. Yes, there are very serious questions to the command of the Northern Fleet - personally to Popov. On delay with the announcement of the alarm. But the survivors from the K-141 did not leave (if they came out as a rhinestone - it was absolutely real - they would die upstairs from hypothermia and a delay in the search). However, there was no causal relationship with this misconduct with the death of people, therefore, the responsibility was not criminal but disciplinary.
    1. Volkonsky Offline Volkonsky
      Volkonsky (Vladimir) 14 October 2020 19: 24
      0
      All claims here -

      https://novayagazeta.ru/articles/2020/08/11/86609-chto-uspel-peredat-kursk
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  7. 2534 Offline 2534
    2534 14 October 2020 11: 48
    -1
    K-135 Volgograd (laid down in 1993, cut into metal in 2012) and K-160 "Barnaul" (readiness for 2002 - 49%, cut into metal in 2012).

    LYING. Their hulls are now at 955 pr, they have touched the power plant, most likely in the same place
    1. Volkonsky Offline Volkonsky
      Volkonsky (Vladimir) 14 October 2020 19: 27
      -1
      http://www.deepstorm.ru/DeepStorm.files/on_1992/949a/K-135/K-135.htm,

      http://www.deepstorm.ru/DeepStorm.files/on_1992/949a/K-160/K-160.htm

      Have you forgotten how to read yet?
      1. The comment was deleted.
      2. 2534 Offline 2534
        2534 15 October 2020 00: 01
        +1
        Quote: Volkonsky
        Have you forgotten how to read yet?

        I'm not interested in murzilkas. As in fact - wrote above
        1. Volkonsky Offline Volkonsky
          Volkonsky (Vladimir) 15 October 2020 02: 04
          -1
          your word for me is not a fact that I can refer to, you are a virtual character, and the documents I gave are real, feel the difference ?!
          1. 2534 Offline 2534
            2534 15 October 2020 10: 54
            +1
            Quote: Volkonsky
            and the documents given by me are real, feel the difference ?!

            fool these are not "documents" but "FILKINA GRAMOT" lol
  8. 2534 Offline 2534
    2534 14 October 2020 11: 49
    +1
    And in the declassified talks between Putin and the 42nd US President, I was personally struck by the degree of frankness of both.

    - there is NO "frankness". absolutely ordinary phrases and virtually no meaning
  9. 2534 Offline 2534
    2534 14 October 2020 11: 51
    +1
    We are all trying to play. Then with "Kursk", a year ago with Losharik. All closed-door - dead heroes, no one is to blame.

    In the history of the Kursk, Putin has shown himself quite worthily, both as a state figure and as a person. And even more so in the story with "Losharik"
  10. 2534 Offline 2534
    2534 14 October 2020 11: 52
    +1
    completing the crew of the Kursk SSGN before going to sea due to the shortage of specialists from other submarines who have no experience with hydrogen peroxide torpedoes

    FALSE, especially about SKT, who had vast personal experience in operating such torpedoes
    1. Volkonsky Offline Volkonsky
      Volkonsky (Vladimir) 14 October 2020 19: 34
      -1
      here I can agree, there are doubts on this part in the report of V. Ryazantsev
      1. 2534 Offline 2534
        2534 14 October 2020 23: 53
        +1
        Quote: Volkonsky
        doubts on this part in the report of V. Ryazantsev

        THE WHOLE "Ryazantsev's report" is not "doubts" - but Achinea
        and technically illiterate nonsense
  11. 2534 Offline 2534
    2534 14 October 2020 11: 54
    +1
    The second explosion, according to Vice Admiral Ryazantsev, did not occur as a result of a massive fire in the 1st compartment, but because of the collision of the SSGN with the ground.

    LYING. the real reason is the operation of the UZU in the combat 65-76A
    1. Volkonsky Offline Volkonsky
      Volkonsky (Vladimir) 14 October 2020 19: 32
      0
      and the UZU worked from what?
      1. 2534 Offline 2534
        2534 14 October 2020 23: 38
        0
        Quote: Volkonsky
        and the UZU worked from what?

        from the stream of water (the spinner rolled off) and the subsequent slight shaking
        1. Volkonsky Offline Volkonsky
          Volkonsky (Vladimir) 15 October 2020 02: 13
          -2
          and according to the report of the Prosecutor General Ustinov, as a result of the fire that broke out, for some reason I believe you, but I don’t reject V. Ryazantsev’s version either. Carefully read clause 5 of this report -

          http://www.sovross.ru/articles/372/6167

          It's useless to argue with me, all claims to the original source, you have obvious differences with him
          1. 2534 Offline 2534
            2534 15 October 2020 10: 53
            +1
            Quote: Volkonsky
            http://www.sovross.ru/articles/372/6167

            It's useless to argue with me, all claims to the original source, you have obvious differences with him

            Volkonsky, once again - Ryazantsev - simply carries an ILLITERATE ACHINA, - which has nothing to do with the materiel (MY materiel wink )
            This Experd did not even bother to open the technical description 65-76A and read HOW and AFTER WHAT the locks are REALLY removed!
  12. Playing with Albert (Playing with Albert) 14 October 2020 17: 02
    -2
    And Popov had to be cut !!! And he, it seems, was appointed a senator?
    1. Volkonsky Offline Volkonsky
      Volkonsky (Vladimir) 14 October 2020 19: 30
      0
      Popov resigned - VVP did not accept it, now a senator
      About embedding the GDP - I do not agree, he was not informed correctly
  13. steelmaker Offline steelmaker
    steelmaker 14 October 2020 19: 34
    +4
    There is a film by Karaulov on YouTube, only 9 minutes. But there is a moment when they show a hole. And the edges are bent inward. This means that there was a torpedo or rocket attack before the explosion. And why don't they show us the sawn-off nose? The explosion will immediately show what caused the death of the boat.

    1. cmonman Offline cmonman
      cmonman (Garik Mokin) 14 October 2020 20: 09
      -4
      And the edges are bent inward. This means that there was a torpedo or rocket attack before the explosion.

      The dynamics of an explosion inside an enclosed space is complex due to the difference in the resulting pressure (positive and negative) and multiple reflection of the shock wave. The sides bent inward are created by the vacuum created by the explosion.
      (lane google)

      A blast wave is a region of pressure, supersonic expansion outward from the explosive core. Has a front shock front of compressed gases. The blast is followed by a gusty negative pressure wind that sucks objects back towards the center. The degree of damage caused by a blast wave mainly depends on five factors:

      Initial positive pressure wave peak
      Overpressure duration
      Blast environment
      Distance from incident blast wave
      Focus degree due to limited space or walls

      Blast waves from explosions that occur near or inside hard solid surfaces can be amplified two to nine times due to the reflection of the shock wave, which leads to an increase in their destructive potential (Stewart, 2004). For example, people between an explosion and a building often suffer more extensive injuries than when an explosion occurs in an open area. Because the blast waves are reflected, people exposed to the blast rarely experience the idealized blast waveform as shown above. Even in open field conditions, the primary blast wave is reflected from the ground, generating reflective waves that interact with the primary wave and change its characteristics. In more closed environments, such as a building, urban environment, or inside a car, the blast wave interacts with the surrounding structures, creating several complex waves.
      1. The comment was deleted.
      2. isofat Offline isofat
        isofat (isofat) 14 October 2020 21: 34
        +1
        cmonmanhow can what you write help the USA?
  14. Volkonsky Offline Volkonsky
    Volkonsky (Vladimir) 14 October 2020 20: 34
    0
    Quote: steel maker
    rocket

    epic trash! the boat was submerged, and a friend here, with a blue eye, rubs a missile attack on us!
  15. steelmaker Offline steelmaker
    steelmaker 14 October 2020 22: 43
    -1
    the boat was submerged

    The depth where the submarine sank is 108 m. For a boat like Kursk, this is shallow water. She couldn't technically be submerged!
    1. Volkonsky Offline Volkonsky
      Volkonsky (Vladimir) 15 October 2020 02: 15
      -1
      http://www.sovross.ru/articles/372/6167

      - we carefully read paragraph 2, then we apologize
      1. The comment was deleted.
      2. steelmaker Offline steelmaker
        steelmaker 15 October 2020 11: 30
        +2
        then we apologize

        Mr. Volkonsky, they demand an apology for insults or bodily harm. And I can agree with your information or not. You express your point of view, I am yours. Which of us is right, visitors will appreciate the plus or minus. I do not demand an apology from you for the toadying to Putin that you have arranged here? Therefore, shout less "Halva" and more information with evidence of your innocence.
        1. Volkonsky Offline Volkonsky
          Volkonsky (Vladimir) 15 October 2020 16: 59
          -1
          "Where the mind is lacking, everything is lacking ..." (Savile Halifax George)

          "I know two infinite things - the Universe and human stupidity. However, I have doubts about the Universe ..." (Albert Einstein)

          I have nothing to add to these statements. You have demonstrated the limits of human stupidity. In the article where I scold Putin in plain text, you found a toad-up, and on the proofs of the mathematics professor that I gave that 2 x 2 = 4, you declare that this is not a fact for you, 2 x 2 is still 5 for you, but the professor of mathematics is not an authority for you. I dare not insist.
    2. 2534 Offline 2534
      2534 15 October 2020 11: 02
      +1
      Quote: steel maker
      She couldn't technically be submerged!

      - don't talk nonsense, it hurts. Quite normal depth, even according to documents
      yes, with restrictions on maneuvering
  16. 2534 Offline 2534
    2534 15 October 2020 12: 08
    +1
    Quote: Volkonsky
    For all your other claims Ryazantsev answered here -

    http://www.sovross.ru/articles/372/6167

    fool We read this CLOWN wassat

    I have evidence that combat torpedoes in the submarine's torpedo tubes exploded at the time of the collision. This explosion also detonated some of the torpedoes on the racks in the 1st compartment.

    - this is just a FALSE, because in the TA there were only combat USET-80, with safety fuses I-321.
    despite the fact that all the I-321s "slammed" the detonation transfer to the main charge from them was not in any torpedo (the detonation was "third-party"), and this is fully confirmed by the raised debris

    Submarine collisions with the ground, which were in the history of the submarine fleet, did not lead to explosions of torpedoes in torpedo tubes only because during those collisions the torpedo tubes were not destroyed. Submarines hit the ground, usually with a hull in the keel area. In this case, only the submarine's light hull was destroyed, and the torpedo tubes always remained intact.

    LYING. There were just the destruction of the TA, and there was also a significant risk of explosion - due to the use of DANGEROUS fuses of the UZU (torpedoes are in the TA with the installed UZU), but on the K-141 in the TA there were only combat USET-80 with SAFE SAFE fuses of the I series

    What four levels of protection on torpedoes are you talking about?

    - the question is that Ryazantsev himself does not know ANYTHING about the stages of protection of the ESA and the fuses of torpedoes, - EVEN IN THE TECHNICAL DESCRIPTION he did not look, but is just nonsense about this part:

    I inform you that torpedoes have two levels of protection: mechanical and another (I cannot talk about it in the open press).

    - monsieur Ryazantsev about the "other" (electronic blocking by the command "Volley" BIUS) then "safely forgets" (because it "interferes with his version")

    These two levels are available both on the torpedo warhead and on the torpedo's power plant. When the mechanical level on the torpedo warhead is removed, the warhead can explode if it is severely destroyed without removing another level of protection.

    fool this is a COMPLETE ACHINA, having nothing to do with reality!
    "The detonation channel" I-321 "is being assembled" already ON THE TORPEDA'S TRAJECTORY !!!!
    Ryazantsev is simply or completely incompetent, or blatantly lies

    When loading a torpedo into a torpedo tube, the mechanical level of protection of the ammunition is removed. That is why torpedoes in torpedo tubes exploded, because the warhead was destroyed when the nuclear submarine collided with the ground.

    fool briefly - RADIANCE and LIE of Ryazantsev, because on the I-321 stages they work out ON THE TRAJECTORY OF TORPEDES and there are NO possibilities for this for a torpedo inside the pipe THAT IS NOT!

    Some of the torpedoes on the racks in the 1st compartment were not equipped with detonators. They exploded from the explosions of torpedoes in vehicles

    - this is nonsense and FALSE, because the I-321 are installed internally INSIDE the torpedo BZO (moreover, the chamber type) the reason for the "second explosion" has long been known to specialists - the fuses of the UZU in BOYEVOY 65-76A ON THE RACK

    due to the mistakes made by the design bureau (KB "Rubin") to ensure unsinkability in the design of nuclear submarines.

    fool this illiterate trash wassat Ryazantsev was dismantled earlier

    Completely the bodies of the submariners were found only in the 9th compartment.

    - but this is already an ABSOLUTELY OBVIOUS AND OUTLOOKED LIE of Ryazantsev
    moreover, it is a mass of facts. As a matter of fact, even the above is quite enough to understand what kind of substance it is - VRUN Ryazantsev.
  17. 2534 Offline 2534
    2534 15 October 2020 12: 22
    0
    From the showdown of opuses wassat Ryazantsev. Some of that discussion:

    From 2503 To KGRR Date 24.01.2010 17:41:03
    - I think that the persons mentioned will still speak about this nihilistic opus ..

    Very professional and tough.

    - "professional" lol I will finalize it to the end - I will throw in my "5 kopecks", but for now "a penny" - the author's judgments on torpedo weapons, combat use are largely illiterate, and this can somehow be understood when it comes to the "hardware" of the 3rd generation (the author is from 1), but the "bloopers" take place at the level of "primers" like the G-200 ( at least rack USET-80 "without fuses" is enough)

    From 2503 to Ryazantsev's opus Date 26.01.2010 00:20:56

    Ryaz:

    We have built the world's largest Project 941 nuclear-powered catamarans with nuclear strategic missiles, Project 949 A nuclear-powered cruise missile submarines, Project 971 nuclear-powered submarines with missile-torpedo armament. We were not interested in the combat stability of these underwater monsters, we were interested in how many weapons can be placed on them and how many such submarines can be built.

    The large displacement of our nuclear submarines is just one of the consequences of meeting the requirements for the USS. As an example, we can cite the articles of the ZVO of the early 90s about the design of the Seawolf, where the Americans faced exactly the same thing - a small boat with the given basic performance characteristics could be made only if the strict requirements for the USS were removed.

    Ryaz:

    I don't know if it makes sense in our time to keep conventional military weapons on board ships at a high level of readiness. It seems to me that nuclear weapons on alert are sufficient to prevent a large-scale war, armed conflict or incident from suddenly occurring, and our fleet would have time to bring its conventional weapons into combat readiness. Today it makes no sense to keep torpedoes and rocket-torpedoes in a fully equipped state in the torpedo tubes of submarines, especially if the combat-ready forces are in bases or in coastal waters. Russian sailors must hold powerful modern weapons in their hands, but you shouldn't put your finger on the trigger. Perhaps I am wrong in my reasoning, but if there were no torpedoes with fuses in the Kursk's torpedo tubes, such a tragedy with the crew would not have happened.

    UZU fuses are definitely not safe and should be removed from weapons. The use of UZU fuses in the 65-76A torpedo is a clear design mistake.
    Fuses of the "I" series (safety type) are safe, and have shown themselves, incl. in this tragedy from the most positive side.
    All modern naval underwater weapons come with safety fuses and the author's insinuations are somewhat incomprehensible

    Ryaz:

    The American Los Angeles-class nuclear-powered submarine has an underwater displacement of about 7 tons and carries 000-12 Tomahawk cruise missiles of various modifications. Its missiles can hit any target ashore up to 20 kilometers away and a naval target up to 2 kilometers away.

    Maybe, after all, the author can read smart books ...
    Incl. about why the amas so limited the salvo ranges of the anti-ship "Tomahawk" from the full flight ranges?

    Ryaz:

    The size of the Tomahawk cruise missile makes it very difficult for the anti-missile systems of our ships and aircraft to detect it.

    In this case, size does not play a major role, and there is no direct relationship between size and RCS.

    Ryaz:

    The dimensions of our cruise missile are close to those of a fighter jet.

    Nifiga himself a "fighter" ...

    Ryaz:
    The launch of such a rocket is easily detected hundreds of kilometers away.

    BRED - the "Granita" slide is several times BELOW the "Harpoon" slide

    Ryaz:

    The American submarine commander fires a cruise missile at the target, which is intended to destroy. The Russian submarine commander fires a missile in the hope that the missile's homing system will capture some target.

    the author represents the difference between STATIONARY land and real sea targets?

    Ryaz:

    And the last reasoning about the main combat characteristics of the Project 949 A nuclear submarine, its missile weapons - the Granit missiles.

    Ryazantsev is simply absolutely incompetent

    Ryaz:

    Our esteemed academicians assert to the whole world that Russian nuclear submarines-giants in terms of the level of underwater noise are not inferior to American submarines, which are 3-4 times less than ours in displacement.

    I have never met such a statement. Rather, on the contrary, and even from Spassky ... perhaps only in a few articles from Malachite on 971? - well, he is PR, it is PR ...

    Ryaz:

    They want to convince everyone that Russian nuclear submarines, built according to Russian production technology, have a displacement of 19 tons ... Our nuclear submarine 000A of the Antey-type project has an underwater displacement of about 949 tons ...

    Wrong answer

    Ryaz:

    create the same underwater noise as the American nuclear submarines with a displacement of 7 tons and built using American production technology. Can anyone believe that a Ford car makes the same noise when driving on the road as a Kamaz truck?

    do not confuse warm with soft ... or even better, read something clever, for example, articles or monographs by VN Parkhomenko.
    At all it seems that the article was written not by the vice-admiral of the Russian Navy, but by some "aunt Frosya" from a provincial newspaper

    Ryaz:

    It is possible that the level of underwater noise of our 4th generation nuclear submarines is in absolute numbers and does not differ from the digital indicators of the underwater noise of American submarines. But this does not mean that they make the same noise. You need to know which noise standard is taken as a zero reference point. > In Russia and the USA it is different, and in order to compare our digital indicators of the underwater noise of nuclear submarines with the digital indicators of the noise of American nuclear submarines, you need to apply a correction factor that increases our indicators.

    Naturally. And it has been written about it even in the "censored" "Sea Collection" since 1993. With comparative diagrams, ours and "not ours" decibels.

    Ryaz:

    If the leaders of FSUE CDB "MT Rubin" in the basis of the project to raise the nuclear submarine "Kursk" laid the ideas and design solutions copied from the American experience of lifting our diesel submarine K-129 in the Pacific Ocean in 1974, one can doubt that they have intellectual and technical capabilities for the development of low-noise nuclear submarines of a new generation.

    ... exactly, "Aunt Frosya" wrote ...

    Ryaz:

    In all naval theaters of war, our fleet would have to overcome natural narrows and straits

    - Have the author heard anything about Kamchatka?
  18. 2534 Offline 2534
    2534 15 October 2020 12: 22
    0
    Ryaz:

    When in 1939-1940 tank formations of Nazi Germany were ironing Europe with tracks, cavalry corps were formed in the Armed Forces of the USSR.

    Well, if only I looked into the books ... (decent and reliable)

    Ryaz:

    What do the submariners say about the combat capabilities of the Project 949 nuclear submarine? Advantages: large buoyancy reserve - 30%, powerful rocket weapons and high speed, pop-up rescue chamber, comfortable living conditions. What do the designers of this submarine say? Advantages: in terms of noise level, the submarine is not inferior to the American submarine of the Los Angeles type

    Over the entire period of service, in no serious document did I come across such "concealment and concealment" issues of comparative noise (lagging behind the secrecy of our nuclear submarines in terms of USL), so depicted by the author. The question was described harshly and honestly. Things were called by their proper names. Everywhere and always.

    Ryaz:

    In fact, the construction of the nuclear submarine 949 A of the project was a kind of our second "answer to Chamberlain." The United States built a nuclear submarine of the Ohio type, which carried 24 strategic nuclear missiles. The USSR could not build such a nuclear submarine with so many strategic nuclear missiles. To accommodate our 24 naval strategic missiles, we needed to build a nuclear submarine the size of an aircraft carrier. They built the project giant 949 A submarine to tell the Americans that the USSR also has a nuclear submarine with 24 missiles on board. But the nuclear submarine 949 A cruise missiles of the project do not belong to the class of ballistic nuclear missiles.

    ... "and went to write the province" ...

    Ryaz:

    The Russian Antey-class nuclear submarine 949A of the project has a double-hull architecture, two nuclear reactors, two shaft lines and the level of underwater noise is higher than that of the Ohio-class nuclear submarine. In order for our submarine "monster" to be able to move under water, huge onboard power capacities and massive technical equipment in a double set were required. To place all this on board, it took two hulls: durable and lightweight. The lightweight hull is a kind of float that supports the strong hull of the submarine and prevents it from sinking.
    > Our designers do not design nuclear submarines with a double-hull architecture to provide a large buoyancy reserve. They are forced to design submarines of this architecture, because they cannot accommodate a given number of weapons in single-hull nuclear submarines, they cannot large-sized and heavy military equipment. This requires a robust housing of enormous dimensions. To prevent it from sinking under its own weight and the weight of the weapons, ship supplies and crew placed in it, a pontoon is definitely needed. The role of the pontoon is played by a light hull, which is located around the strong hull of the submarine. The light hull houses ballast tanks and missile silos with missiles.

    ?!?!?!? just nonsense
    PS - "the further into the forest, the thicker the partisans"

    Ryaz:

    Underwater unsinkability is provided mainly by the professional skills of the crew: the correct response to a particular emergency, the ability to quickly increase the stroke, the use of high-pressure air to create back pressure and seal a hole in the emergency compartment, keeping the submarine from sinking to extreme diving depths.

    Without proper constructive support, even the best professional training in the event of a complex emergency related to the flow of seawater will end with "Thresher"

    Ryaz:

    Both in our country and in our potential adversaries, missile-torpedoes fly and move in the water at such a speed that modern submarines cannot escape them.

    The author should read the "primers". And about how the PLR ​​fly, and about how "modern nuclear submarines are leaving" ... at least in the form of a book by "Abramov's grandfather" (rest in peace to him) 30 years ago ...

    Ryaz:

    And the last thing. Nuclear submarine 949 A of the project in time of peace make diving in the Arctic. How can divers use the VSC, if such a need arises, when there is many-meter pack ice on the surface of the sea or ocean? Our designers and naval admirals, since I do not reason, and do not answer questions about the expediency of placing VSK on nuclear submarines. I will answer my own questions.
    > A pop-up rescue camera is needed on the project's nuclear submarine 949 A, not for submariners, but for designers. The fact is that in the aft part of this submarine there is heavy equipment for nuclear power and the inter-compartment bulkheads of the reactor compartment. To balance the stern and bow of the submarine, the same weight load must be placed in the bow as in the stern. > There is no heavy equipment in the bow of the submarine. Nuclear submarine designers have found a solution to this problem. In the first compartment, under the arsenal of combat torpedoes, they placed one of the battery groups, and the central post (CP) of the nuclear submarine was located in the second compartment. In the bow, in a light hull, they placed part of the containers with missiles. Our designers were not embarrassed by the fact that the central post from where the entire submarine is controlled and where about 60% of the crew is concentrated was located on a powder keg. On the right and left sides of the CPU, containers with missiles are surrounded, in the bow behind the bulkhead of the CPU there is a warehouse of combat torpedoes, under the CPU there is a second battery group. In the world practice of submarine building, a submarine control post is not located in the risky zone of its weapons and technical systems.
    > They created an underwater monster, stuffed it with all kinds of weapons, put 80% of the crew in the bow, and still there was not enough cargo in the bow of this giant submarine to balance the aft part, It was then that the ingenious idea was born to place a heavy pop-up rescue chamber there ...

    "Ships are built for guns" SO Makrov. The combat survivability of submarines in real conditions is, by definition, limited to 1 torpedo. Has the author heard anything about the Los Angeles-type submarines? The ahineline about “balancing” the “stern” of the VSK will be left on the conscience of the author ...

    However, this is not even a "conscience" but a DIAGNOSIS. For VSK has POSITIVE BUOYANCE, even "stuffed" with the bodies of the crew. Those. MOMENT concerning CG she has the SAME as the heavy PTU blocks in the stern!
    Those. even in elementary questions of STATIC and submarine control Ryazantsev FULL TREE!
    The question arises as to how SO ILLITERATE AND UNCOMPETENT PERSON could hold such command positions?!?!?
  19. 2534 Offline 2534
    2534 15 October 2020 12: 28
    0
    Ryaz:
    Any emergency situation with torpedoes, missiles or a battery on the project 949 A nuclear submarine leads to the incapacitation of the main command post!

    What a fright?!?!

    Ryaz:
    Only Soviet and Russian nuclear-powered submarine designers have and are placing the submarine's battery under combat torpedoes.

    what is the actual problem? by the way, we look at the Americans on Losi - there is REALLY AB DIRECTLY UNDER THE TORPEDS

    Ryaz:
    Any explosion of hydrogen in the battery can detonate combat torpedoes.

    ?!?!?!?!Rave!

    Ryaz:
    Submarine batteries often explode, but the designers of the project's submarine 949 A did not pay attention to this.

    I think that this is Comrade. the author should have paid at least a little attention to the emergency collections and information messages of the Navy 15-20 years ago
  20. 2534 Offline 2534
    2534 15 October 2020 12: 32
    0
    Ryaz:
    After the second explosion, the battery was destroyed and only emergency lighting from portable battery lights worked in the compartments.

    First of all, KAO - short-term emergency lighting (stationary lamps)

    Ryaz:
    and through the ASB to establish communication with the 9th compartment of the sunken nuclear submarine

    well, sir, you've read Cherkashin ...
    sources (quite open) are available and more decent - for example, "Anti-State Secret"
    and considering some "additional options" of the "buoy" 949A of the project, several it is strange that the vice admiral in the relevant position has no idea about the subject of the conversation

    Ryaz:
    and diesel fuel, which poured into the hold of the 9th compartment from oil and fuel tanks

    the diesel in the 9th compartment was on the "clean" 949 project
    in "az" he "left" for "encore"
  21. 2534 Offline 2534
    2534 15 October 2020 12: 33
    0
    Anyone will find the continuation of the spanking of the liar Ryazantsev - it was on many sites.
  22. lahudra Offline lahudra
    lahudra (Nikolay Kondrashkin) 15 October 2020 22: 45
    +1
    Putin, I remember, called the tear-stained wives of the submariners "ten-dollar s". Well, with whom it does not happen, fervently applied.
  23. Jack clubs Offline Jack clubs
    Jack clubs (Eugene) 17 October 2020 22: 54
    +1
    Thank you, Vladimir, for the article. Hang on, judging by the comments, you are very right, very few people get the honor to have so much human shit poured on him. I mean the comments on the article. But they have value, they can confirm to an intelligent person that your version of events is boring and true as life.
    And not like the stories and fantasies that the web is full of.
  24. Max Abramovich Offline Max Abramovich
    Max Abramovich (max abramovich) 18 October 2020 09: 02
    0
    Remember the main thing and repeat to EVERYONE !!!! Torpedo explosion due to the incompetence of the crew And Putin spoke to Clinton !!!!! Remember !!!!! And the film will be (where the Russian sailors are not very smart) !!!! And in what century they will give money for a rescue operation !!!!! and Putin will even perform on a TV show (after the losharik he did not perform) !!!! And the bow compartment will be blown up so that they will never be raised !!!! Remember and repeat to everyone- torpedo explosion due to the incompetence of the crew And Putin spoke to Clinton !!!!! ....... any questions?
  25. Cemen2 Offline Cemen2
    Cemen2 (Cemen) 19 October 2020 20: 57
    +1
    The captain of the 3rd rank, retired M. Klimov (hereinafter referred to as Masyanya), sat in the research institute as a laboratory assistant where he diligently drew vacation schedules, and in his free time dreamed of "patrolling missiles" over the areas of combat deployment of our SSBNs, and then "noted", the impression arises that he does not sleep, but only climbs without rest on various resources, so that he can bark at someone, or throw his shit ... on this resource, Vice Admiral Ryazantsev got under the streams of mud that Masyanya spewed out, and nothing specific or clever "our" Masyanya, due to his cerebral impairment, could not offer to confirm his rotten bazaar.
    I also disagree with Vice Admiral Ryazantsev's version, but in turn I tried to be as reasoned as possible:

    http://flot.com/blog/katastrofa/vspominaya-kursk-chast-i.php

    http://flot.com/blog/katastrofa/vspominaya-kursk-chast-ii.php

    http://flot.com/blog/katastrofa/vspominaya-kursk-chast-iii.php

    https://flot.com/blog/katastrofa/vspominaya-kursk-zaklyuchenie.php

    https://flot.com/blog/katastrofa/a-esli-podumat-zaklyuchenie.php

    Vice-Admiral Ryazantsev was acquainted with these articles, and in private correspondence we came to the mutual conclusion that no version at the moment can be considered final without significant experimental work on modeling the accident at the Kursk nuclear submarine, but no one is concerned about these experiments ...
  26. ronis.vladronis Offline ronis.vladronis
    ronis.vladronis (Vladimir) 20 October 2020 15: 37
    0
    The guilt may and should be someone's, but this will not bring the guys back.
    But that Popov worked in the government is not right. Let him write his memoirs. As his brother writes good poetry.
    1. Cemen2 Offline Cemen2
      Cemen2 (Cemen) 20 October 2020 22: 13
      +1
      Vladimir completely agrees with you, unfortunately all our bosses are "steaming in the same bathhouse" and accordingly they do not give up "their own", in a difficult life situation they will always offer a warm place, but it all depends on the head of state, as the Russian proverb says " what is the pop, so is the arrival. " In the case of Popov, they secretly "punished" him, but so that he would not be offended, they moved him to an equally warm place, but there is no responsibility, but there are more than enough opportunities.
  27. The comment was deleted.
  28. Linar Urozaev Offline Linar Urozaev
    Linar Urozaev (Linar Urozaev) 25 October 2020 08: 29
    -2
    Is Putin a decent person? Something the author confuses !!!
  29. Vladimir VLvov Offline Vladimir VLvov
    Vladimir VLvov (Vladimir VLvov) 25 October 2020 14: 47
    +1
    As for the terrorists, this is nonsense, but I remember that in the first days after the accident there was information in the media that there was one representative of the torpedo manufacturer on board the Kursk. In the future, this fact was not considered ... Journalists could find out: who it was, what task did this traveler have? could he have connections with Islamist organizations? Did the investigation work out this line in 2000 and beyond?
  30. Iron yuri Offline Iron yuri
    Iron yuri (Iron Yuri) 25 October 2020 16: 32
    +2
    and the fact that the next day the US Secretary of Defense secretly arrived in Russia and held secret negotiations with the "Pasha Mercedes" and members of the then top of the FSB and the Ministry of Defense, and then suddenly, literally almost the next day, the United States allocated an 8 billion tranche. $, which by the way immediately disappeared into an unknown place, why are they silent?
  31. uncle_Andrey Offline uncle_Andrey
    uncle_Andrey (Andrei) 28 October 2020 10: 52
    +1
    Correspondent: "What happened to the Kursk submarine after all?"
    Responder: "She drowned"
  32. The comment was deleted.
  33. Alexander Zverev (Alexander ) 2 November 2020 16: 55
    +2
    You shouldn't be so. Macron did the right thing by publishing the essence of the conversation. The country must know the true attitude of the authorities to the real opposition.
  34. xana Offline xana
    xana (xana) 8 November 2020 02: 03
    -1
    Absolutely, the captain is responsible for the ship and subordinates ... And, even if your unrespected Supreme at that time did not know what happened (which is very unlikely, given his profession), then when he found out, the guilty were not punished. And this fact reduces to zero the assumption that “he himself still feels his guilt for this, he is a decent person.” Precisely because: “... the guilty have not been punished, the same SF commander” The priorities are different. always - others. The guys could be saved, and the responsibility for their death is on the Supreme.