The USA compared their fleet with the Russian one and chuckled


The Russian navy does not pose any serious threat to American warships on the open ocean. This is the opinion of Bradford Dismukes, a retired political scientist and captain of the US Navy, writes Forbes.


Rusting Russian ships are not dangerous for us and our allies in the ocean. Therefore, in the event of an open military conflict, America should not worry about protecting our convoys from Russian ambushes - their ships are not capable of attacking

- the retired American military man grins.

According to Dismukes' data, the Russian Navy has only one not very safe and reliable aircraft-carrying ship, which rarely takes part in combat maneuvers. Other large military vessels of the Russian Federation can be counted on one hand.

In total, the Kremlin has about 360 ships at its disposal. Washington has 333 of them, but American warships are larger than Russian ones. The total displacement of the US fleet is 4,6 million tons, of Russia - about 1,2 million tons

- notes the commander of the US Navy Keith Patton.

The Russian fleet is becoming more and more regional, unable to operate in wide sea spaces. Small rocket ships are not enduring and cannot cross the oceans - they have to huddle up to the shore. The US Navy can carry 12 attack missiles on board, while the Russians can carry only 3300. Moreover, over time, large Russian ships, when they fail, give way to smaller ones.
Photos used: GAlexandrova / wikimedia.org
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  1. Tektor Offline
    Tektor (Tektor) 19 August 2020 17: 45
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    And yet, we have 16 submarines in service at the moment, which can create difficulties of an unacceptable level for any transoceanic crossings. And besides them there is also the Harpsichord and the Knight ...
  2. We will melt them with Daggers from the air - why arrange "sea battles" in the style of the years of Ochakov and the conquest of Crimea? We will cover al with hydrogen if the targets are sufficient to pay off the thermonuclear ammunition. We'll see. Inshallah.
  3. King3214 Offline
    King3214 (Sergius) 19 August 2020 19: 05
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    Major General Fritz Schliper, commander of the 45th Infantry Division of the Wehrmacht, chuckled when he learned about the number of garrisons in the Brest Fortress.
    He looked dull afterwards.
    1. Vladimir Tuzakov (Vladimir Tuzakov) 20 August 2020 12: 47
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      Along the Brest Fortress, the garrison was numerous (up to 4000 soldiers), more than enough for the fortress. The fortress held out for several days, then there was focal resistance, which the Germans did not press against, they waited for exhaustion (most of the defenders surrendered in the first week) ... All the heroism is that some of the defenders did not surrender for a very long time ... On naval affairs, time it also works against the large US fleet, their fleet is also rusting and aging, so for the money, we win big :)) ... And keep our nose downwind on new trends and directions in the fleets, quickly identify and develop promising areas of shipbuilding and weapons. ..
      1. tagil Offline
        tagil (Sergei) 20 August 2020 13: 18
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        Along the Brest Fortress, the garrison was numerous (up to 4000 soldiers), more than enough for the fortress. The fortress held out for several days, then there was focal resistance, which the Germans did not push against, they waited for exhaustion (most of the defenders surrendered in the first week) ... All the heroism is that some of the defenders did not surrender for a very long time ...

        With all this, the Germans under the Brest Fortress lost more than 1100 dead and wounded, this is without taking into account the losses of the attached units to this division, which were no less numerous. So the brave Aryans were greatly discouraged by these losses, there was a question about changing the 45th division and withdrawing it to the rear for replenishment and putting in order. Well, as for the fleet, you can have more, only in our time this issue is not solved by the number of pennants, but by the number of means of its guaranteed destruction. We have them.
      2. Rinat Farkhitov Offline
        Rinat Farkhitov (Rinat Farkhitov) 21 August 2020 11: 03
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        The Brest Fortress lasted longer than the whole of Poland and France, together with England.
  4. zz811 Offline
    zz811 (Vlad Pervovich) 19 August 2020 19: 49
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    There is also China.
    1. boom Boom Offline
      boom Boom (Bum) 20 August 2020 07: 18
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      What does China have to do with it? What kind of kindergarten? Then take all NATO and the countries of Finland, Sweden, Norway, Japan, South Korea, etc.
  5. KYYC Offline
    KYYC (OXOTHuK) 19 August 2020 19: 55
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    There is no need for bravado on either side.
    It is all about the determination to die for victory.
    Think of Tsushima. Then the Japanese had a small number of pure ships, but the Russian fleet was ravaged in the bud.
    Then the Russians boasted too - we will shower these monkeys with hats.

    But it turned out differently.
    Boasting does not lead to anything good. A sailor sitting in readiness in a Russian nuclear submarine does not write brave lines like "oh, how we fry amers" ... and so on. etc. Since the enemy is very strong, cunning and persistent.
    The mash will be 100500.
    We will lose many.
    God grant that at that time there were the best admirals of the fleet in the Russian Federation, not boastful, not brave. God grant.
    1. Aleksey Glotov Offline
      Aleksey Glotov (alexey glotov) 20 August 2020 09: 48
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      So far, the Americans are bragging.
      1. KYYC Offline
        KYYC (OXOTHuK) 20 August 2020 13: 28
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        This is yes.
        They dream of bombarding us with pizzas from the AUG, but torpedoes will punish them.
        1. free_flier Offline
          free_flier 20 August 2020 21: 56
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          One MiG-31 with a Dagger = 1 aircraft carrier.
          In any currency, the cost ratio is 1 / 1.000.000.
      2. margo Offline
        margo (margo) 20 August 2020 17: 02
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        Show me where? Throw off the link to at least one article.
    2. Alexander Ratskevich (Alexander Ratskevich) 21 August 2020 14: 16
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      It's like with dogs. You need to be afraid not of those who bark, but of those who are silent.
  6. Oyo Sarkazmi Offline
    Oyo Sarkazmi (Oyo Sarkazmi) 19 August 2020 20: 06
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    Come on, no aircraft carriers. And it is not necessary.
    The aircraft carrier is for squeezing out different delicacies from the Papuans. And to fight seriously is a blow to the infrastructure of the state. Ports and power plants can be broken with one submarine.
    1. Alexey Sergeev Offline
      Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 20 August 2020 14: 36
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      You forget that there is little MPS to protect our "strategists". And some will be disabled before launches. Speech about the hunt for "Ohio" does not go at all - to the United States under a hundred nuclear submarines. And they will all shoot.
      The question is: why should we burn Washington, knowing that we will not survive the started war?
      We must by all means avoid such a situation.
      And develop the economy.
      1. Oyo Sarkazmi Offline
        Oyo Sarkazmi (Oyo Sarkazmi) 20 August 2020 18: 43
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        Quote: Alexey Sergeev
        Why should we burn Washington, knowing that we will not survive the started war?

        Well, they won't survive either. It only seems that the United States is rich and powerful. Quack Dow Jones' server and Americans are beggars. That Bill Gates, that the farmer in Oklahoma. Americans are dependent on imports - oil, steel, aluminum, labor. Destroy ports and power plants - there is simply no structure in the United States for the flow of even available resources. These are not hundreds, these are 30-50 warheads.
        There is no point in giving them a chance to survive. Better to let the Mexicans and the Chinese rule the world.
        1. Alexey Sergeev Offline
          Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 4 September 2020 09: 48
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          Well, they won't survive either.

          Spit. I need my children to be alive, at least. Do you have them?

          There is no point in giving them a chance to survive.

          I assume you are mistaking reality for a computer game?
          I have already written about the price of such a step. It is unacceptable. (Not religious)
      2. Rinat Farkhitov Offline
        Rinat Farkhitov (Rinat Farkhitov) 21 August 2020 11: 20
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        As Zhirinovsky said, we will not bomb America, but we will bring all the ammunition to the Kuril Islands and blow up. We ourselves will die and not notice, but the Americans will suffer.
        1. Alexey Sergeev Offline
          Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 4 September 2020 09: 48
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          As I imagine, it must be embarrassing to repeat blatant nonsense.
  7. Sergey Latyshev Offline
    Sergey Latyshev (Serge) 19 August 2020 20: 37
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    In principle, it is true, alas. Small ships do not keep speed and excitement.
    Hide in the bay and shoot from there with Caliber and anti-ship missiles.

    According to interviews with various amers, they are only serious about our submarine.
    1. Rum rum Online
      Rum rum (Rum rum) 20 August 2020 01: 07
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      In principle, it is true, alas. Small ships do not keep speed and excitement.
      Hide in the bay and shoot from there with Caliber and anti-ship missiles.

      Okay, let's say. Where will these convoys sail? Is it to the shore? Or they will hang out in the middle of the Atlantic, like a known substance.
      (joke)
      1. Sergey Latyshev Offline
        Sergey Latyshev (Serge) 20 August 2020 09: 27
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        What convoys?
        Native media reported 5 times recently, YUSA AUG flooded into the Mediterranean Sea, but never - docked to the coast of Syria ...

        That is, where they want, they do it, far from the coast.
      2. Alexey Sergeev Offline
        Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 20 August 2020 14: 39
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        Say, will we seize control of the coast with small patrolmen? There is a nuance: a first class ship can effectively repel an attack (and protect neighbors), but a patrol boat cannot.
        1. Rum rum Online
          Rum rum (Rum rum) 20 August 2020 19: 58
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          Watchman, he's for defense.
          And RTOs can walk along rivers (this is a way to bypass the RIAC), such a mobile system.
    2. Alexey Sergeev Offline
      Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 20 August 2020 14: 37
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      The range is not so great, there are great distances in the oceans.
    3. Alexander Ratskevich (Alexander Ratskevich) 21 August 2020 14: 21
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      Why does Russia need warships capable of crossing oceans? We are not going to attack anyone (unlike the USA).
      1. Boris Arbel (Latuha) 21 August 2020 19: 07
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        So you will defend yourself. And here we need aircraft-carrying ships for the offensive. In addition, you need to fight wisely, not in numbers. I think that even couch generals and admirals will agree with me on this.
  8. 123 Offline
    123 (123) 19 August 2020 20: 44
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    Passions are boiling. laughing
    And just some kind of note in the wall newspaper. If we wrote something like that, the author would be nailed on the head with a carnation the label "ur-patriot" and would have showered with tomatoes, and not fresh.

    Rusting Russian ships are not dangerous for us and our allies in the ocean... Therefore, in the event of an open military conflict America shouldn't worry about protecting our convoys from Russian ambushes - their ships are not capable of attacking

    1) Russian ships, by definition, are not dangerous not only for the United States and its allies, but also for anyone in general, since ships are passenger, cargo, research, and so on. They are not intended for combat operations, unlike ships. Or is it translation difficulties?

    2) Rightly noted:

    Small rocket ships are not enduring and cannot cross the oceans - they have to huddle up to the shore.

    Indeed, they cannot, they are not intended for this, they are just created for the defense of the coast. Convoys in the Atlantic should not worry about them, such tasks are assigned to our submarines.

    3) A very curious place was chosen, the Atlantic, a huge area controlled by NATO fleets with bases on the coast. Russia does not have a single port there, of course, corvettes have nothing to do there, although they can do something there too. What will be the alignment if the American fleet, albeit with allies, comes to our coast, for some reason is not specified.

    You can just as well write that the rusty NATO junk is not capable of anything, they are powerless against our fleet in the Arctic, and in the Caspian, by the way, too. The public, after reading such an analysis, will be pleased and go to sleep in high spirits. Obviously, the author of the article was striving for a similar effect.

    In total, the Kremlin has about 360 ships at its disposal. Washington has 333 of them, but American warships are larger than Russian ones. The total displacement of the US fleet is 4,6 million tons, Russia - about 1,2 million tons

    Our submariners are undoubtedly happy with this fact, especially for the huge tonnage; in which case it will be much easier for them to break the record for Marinescu. That is to say - a large cabinet falls louder.
    1. Alexey Sergeev Offline
      Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 4 September 2020 09: 40
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      Our submariners are undoubtedly glad of this fact, especially the huge tonnage, it will be much easier for them to break the record for Marinescu, in which case it will be much easier. That is to say - a large cabinet falls louder.

      Let me remind you that this tonnage has 70+ nuclear submarines and dozens of destroyers with powerful anti-submarine defense (including helicopters on board). There are also Poseidons. Our submariners will probably do some damage before their inevitable death.
      1. 123 Offline
        123 (123) 4 September 2020 10: 51
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        Let me remind you that this tonnage has 70+ nuclear submarines and dozens of destroyers with powerful anti-submarine defense (including helicopters on board). There are also Poseidons. Our submariners will probably do some damage before their inevitable death.

        Much depends on where the conflict will unfold. The Russian "coastal" fleet will not go to the open ocean, their fleet will not approach our coast. For example, there was an article recently where they are going to intercept our fleet in the Arctic ... and recently a fire happened ... 50% of the American icebreaker fleet is now "ALL".

        https://news.usni.org/2020/08/25/coast-guard-icebreaker-healy-suffers-fire-on-arctic-mission-all-arctic-operations-cancelled

        This article is just an attempt to please the American man in the street, it makes no sense to count the total number of ships. We, for example, have "Kuznetsov" and they have 11 aircraft carriers. In reality, only 2-3 of their aircraft carriers can go to sea.
        It is no coincidence that they compared it with Russia, because a different comparison may not be so appealing to hamburger givers. This is from the Pentagon report:

        The PRC has the largest fleet in the world with a total of about 350 ships and submarines, including more than 130 main surface ships.
        For comparison, in the US Navy at the beginning of 2020 there are approximately 293 ships.

        https://media.defense.gov/2020/Sep/01/2002488689/-1/-1/1/2020-DOD-CHINA-MILITARY-POWER-REPORT-FINAL.PDF

        By the way, the nuclear submarine is no longer 70 + (at least -5), and the destroyers have no protection from hypersound yet, so the inevitable death will be not only for our submariners.

        Do you like to compare? Look at the rating, we get some interesting data. hi

        https://www.globalfirepower.com/countries-comparison-detail.asp
        1. Alexey Sergeev Offline
          Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 5 September 2020 06: 29
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          50% of the US icebreaker fleet is now ALL.

          The submarines will float for themselves. And - to intercept our "strategists". It turns out a "plug": to go out to the patrol area is dangerous, to stand at the pier is to be a static target.
          And all because of the lack of MAPL.

          and the destroyers have no hypersound protection yet

          How many boats are hypersonic? There are still no photos of Zircon. Again, it flies to the target high, is visible from a distance, which means that the interception will start working NOT at the last moment.
          And to fly at hypersonic speed at sea level is impossible (maximum 2M).
          We've had a lot of dust in our eyes lately, IMHO. You can recall the promised 2000 T-14 by 2020. Where are they? Etc..
          1. 123 Offline
            123 (123) 5 September 2020 07: 45
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            The submarines will float for themselves. And - to intercept our "strategists". It turns out a "plug": to go out to the patrol area is dangerous, to stand at the pier is to be a static target.

            You have some strange logic. what So they will swim and intercept, but ours will not ... Shy?

            And all because of the lack of MAPL.

            What is MAPL?

            How many boats are hypersonic? There are still no photos of Zircon. Again, it flies to the target high, is visible from a distance, so the interception will start working NOT at the last moment.
            And to fly at hypersonic speed at sea level is impossible (maximum 2M).

            Apparently, so far on none, but they are not far off, as long as there are Onyxes. Compared to the 1976 subsonic Harpoon development, and this for the eyes. Are you joking? Is it visible from afar? This is the last thing they see. If at all it is possible to consider something at that speed. Flip through at your leisure, the publication is not "pro-government".

            https://www.gazeta.ru/army/2019/09/27/12691417.shtml

            And for interception, there is this miracle of hostile technology, which "perfectly" proved itself in Saudi Arabia.

            https://vpk.name/news/439743_akela_promahnulsya_
            amerikanskii_patriot_provalil_ispytaniya.html

            We've had a lot of dust in our eyes lately, IMHO. You can recall the promised 2000 T-14 by 2020. Where are they? Etc..

            Maybe in the same place as the latest American aircraft carrier and hypersonic missiles? smile They have something serious, no dust in their eyes, right? winked
            1. Alexey Sergeev Offline
              Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 6 September 2020 08: 40
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              If at all it is possible to consider something at that speed.

              Maybe. Ask about the Max speeds of intercepted targets in the latest versions of the S-300 and S-400.
              AEGIS (Tiki, Burke) is also capable of intercepting high-speed targets using SM-6 missiles.

              subsonic Harpoon developed in 1976

              Now there is an active rearmament at the LRASm. And the harpoon itself, with a star-shaped raid and dozens of launches, is very dangerous.

              So they will swim and intercept, but ours will not ... Shy?

              And all because of the lack of MAPL.

              What is MAPL?

              Multipurpose nuclear submarine. For which the United States has a great advantage. In reality, there will be losses on both sides, and someone will run out of boats earlier. There is no reason to doubt about the preparation from the "other" side (in the spirit - one of ours in ten "them").
              1. 123 Offline
                123 (123) 6 September 2020 16: 03
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                Maybe. Ask about the Max speeds of intercepted targets in the latest versions of the S-300 and S-400.

                I know, I read it. yes But there is one caveat .... the Americans are not yet purchasing these complexes. request And what they are doing ... in general, ask the Saudis. lol

                AEGIS (Tiki, Burke) is also capable of intercepting high-speed targets using SM-6 missiles.

                Well, of course, on the coast they don't get a fig, but at sea everything goes just wonderfully, not otherwise, the clean sea air contributes. laughing
                Speed ​​targets, you say? I didn't dig far ...

                On October 24, 2014, during the exercise, a massive attack of low-flying subsonic and supersonic targets, imitating the corresponding anti-ship missiles, was successfully repelled using SM-6 missiles. At the same time, a successful interception of the GQM-163A supersonic training target (corresponding in characteristics and flight profile to the P-270 Mosquito rocket and the BQM-74 subsonic training target) was performed.

                https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/SM-6#%D0%98%D1%81%D0%BF%D1%8B%D1%82%
                D0%B0%D0%BD%D0%B8%D1%8F

                P-270 "Mosquito", speed 200-470 m / s (speed of sound 333 m / s) Caliber speed (export, which means underestimated) 2,9 M, that is, about 965 m / s. This is three times faster than what they seem to have learned to intercept. In the meantime, they "use" the good old SM-2. Here it is imposingly and slowly, with a sense of dignity, leaving the "container" (in this case, the Canadians are launched, but this does not change the essence of the matter):



                For clarity, see how modern weapons are leaving the start.



                Now there is an active rearmament at the LRASm. And the harpoon itself, with a star-shaped raid and dozens of launches, is very dangerous.

                Here the rearmament will take place, then talk about it, by that time the Zircons will appear. yes Again you are with this - "star-shaped raid", as I understand it, "star-raid" is a simultaneous strike from different directions. What makes you think that one Russian ship will go somewhere into the open ocean, where a whole "flock" of the enemy will surround it and strike from different directions. In my opinion, you come up with some hypothetical conditions under which they can realize their advantage.
                I told you more than once that there is a lot of envy from the "theater of military operations" and the ability to use existing weapons.

                Multipurpose nuclear submarine. For which the United States has a great advantage.

                Here you are again .... They have more multi-purpose boats, which means ... And that doesn't mean anything. Part of their role in our country is performed by diesel-electric submarines, which the Americans do not have at all. Yes, they cannot be under water as much as atomic ones, but off their coast this is also a force that should not be underestimated.

                In reality, there will be losses on both sides, and someone will run out of boats earlier.

                In the reality? I think you make it up .... In your imagination, it looks something like this:
                Our boats and theirs are gathered from all fleets in one place, in the open ocean, and "knightly duels" begin and ours, naturally, will end faster. smile You will probably be surprised, but in terms of the total number of submarines, we are not much inferior to the Americans.

                There is no reason to doubt about the preparation from the "other" side (in the spirit - one of ours in ten "them")

                Yes, the total number of ships they have is greater, and the advantage over the ships of the oceanic zone is overwhelming, so what? The fleet is being restored gradually, the turn has come to the ships of the oceanic zone. The frigates went, laid the UDC. What now to rip out hair and beat in hysterics? For example, in terms of the number of tanks, they lag behind pretty well. Show me where they are hysterical about this?
                1. Alexey Sergeev Offline
                  Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 6 September 2020 16: 35
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                  Caliber speed (export, means underestimated) 2,9 M

                  A strange assumption. They underestimate the range. In addition, the rocket you mentioned is two-stage, most of the way goes on subsonic.

                  Then the rearmament will take place and talk about it

                  So they are already standing. Shown many times. And there are no Zircons yet, and photos of only American X-51s are displayed (sometimes even under the wing of a B-52).

                  probably be surprised, but in terms of the total number of submarines, we are not much inferior to the Americans.

                  Not at all, but some of ours are diesels. They are limited in use, especially at a distance from the coast.

                  The frigates went, laid the UDC. Now what, pulling out your hair and hysterics? For example, in terms of the number of tanks, they lag behind pretty well. Show me where they are hysterical about this?

                  The fleet needs a different economy. China spends the entire budget of the Russian Federation on armaments. And the total is 10 times more.
                  1. 123 Offline
                    123 (123) 6 September 2020 17: 05
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                    A strange assumption. They underestimate the range.
                    In addition, the rocket you mentioned is a two-stage one, most of the way goes on subsonic.

                    You have an equally strange assumption. Export samples generally have lower specifications. What makes you think that only the range is underestimated? Moreover, the characteristics indicated it was the export sample. hi
                    What difference does it make at what speed the rocket travels "most of the way"? There they will not even see her, it is much more important at what speed she flies up, because it depends on this how difficult it will be to fight her. They will try to shoot it down not on takeoff.

                    So they are already standing. Shown many times. And there are no Zircons yet, and photos of only American X-51s are displayed (sometimes even under the wing of a B-52).

                    We were talking about the fleet. Airborne LRASm missiles have been adopted. If anything, Daggers are worse?
                    As for the X-51 under the wing of the B-52, this is aviation again. Zircon has already flown from the Admiral Gorshkov. What can the Americans say to this? Throw a bunch of photos from the X-51?

                    The fleet needs a different economy. China spends the entire budget of the Russian Federation on armaments. And the total is 10 times more.

                    What other economy? Do you mean volume? Can you tell us more about capitalization? You can spend crazy money on defense, but the problem is that you can't buy such technologies. China spends more on defense, but where are its hypersonic missiles? Where are the aircraft engines? Where are the new generation submarines?
                    The same applies to the United States, their budget is much larger, but they are lagging behind in missiles, and this is a fact. The vanguard is on duty, and before the elections they show a photo with a -51 model under the wing ...
                    1. Alexey Sergeev Offline
                      Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 6 September 2020 18: 49
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                      Airborne LRASm missiles have been adopted. If anything, Daggers are worse?

                      The big difference is in flexibility.

                      Where are the aircraft engines? Where are the new generation submarines?

                      You can compare the number and rate of commissioning of ships of the first rank.

                      before the elections, they show a photo with a -51 layout under the wing ....

                      So it is in our media and VO (in particular) that they talk about zircon, and show the X-51 with the erased signs of the US Air Force.

                      You can spend crazy money on defense

                      The MO budget already reaches 1/4 of the total. (The Chinese spend 10-11%). You need more money and a bigger economy.
                      How does China earn them?
                      1. 123 Offline
                        123 (123) 6 September 2020 20: 01
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                        The big difference is in flexibility.

                        What is the flexibility? Can they look at the stern? In general, the conversation is about the fleet, you are bringing in aircraft missiles here. negative

                        You can compare the number and rate of commissioning of ships of the first rank.

                        Can. What for? Everything is clear anyway. Our fleet is just recovering, shipbuilding is gaining momentum. Are you looking for something better there to groan?

                        So it is in our media and VO (in particular) that they talk about Zircon, and show the X-51 with the US Air Force signs erased.

                        You are like a child. Nobody will show secret missiles, especially with details. Let them show your layout as they want.

                        The budget of the MO already reaches 1/4 of the total (the Chinese spend 10-11%).

                        Are you seriously? belay Was the head damaged by falling? fool Where does the data come from, if not a secret? Otherwise, two conclusions arise: either you are mistaken, and so much so that doubts arise about your adequacy, or you are simply lying on purpose. Have you read Navalny's memoirs?

                        You need more money and a bigger economy. How does China earn them?

                        Who needs more money and a bigger economy? You? So go and make your dreams come true, everything is in your hands. fellow
                        China makes money on the transfer of industry, it was turned into an industrial zone and all dirty industries were transferred here. And in order to sell all this, he is forced to bow to the United States, because the increased demand is provided for the light of debts and unsecured Fed notes.
                        Do you want this for Russia?
                      2. Alexey Sergeev Offline
                        Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 6 September 2020 21: 31
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                        Our fleet is just recovering, shipbuilding is gaining momentum. Are you looking for something better to groan?

                        It takes a long time. Large volumes require a larger budget. Disadvantages need to be noticed, not just shouting hurray.

                        What is the flexibility? Can they look at the stern?

                        Is it too hard to think? - More media can apply.

                        Nobody will show secret missiles, especially with details. Let them show your layout as they want.

                        LRASM and Caliber show everyone. And reduce your self-importance.

                        Where does the data come from, if not a secret?

                        At the same time, the share of the budget of the Russian Ministry of Defense in the country's budget in 2017 was 19,3%, in 2018 - 17,3%, in 2019 - 17%.

                        https://m.gazeta.ru/amp/army/2019/12/25/12883340.shtml

                        You? So go and make your dreams come true, it's all in your hands fellow

                        Have you done a lot yourself ?? And a lot depends on the given conditions.

                        Do you want this for Russia?

                        The budget is more than $ 260 billion, with a proportional increase in all items of expenditure. Villainy, in your opinion? smile
                      3. 123 Offline
                        123 (123) 6 September 2020 22: 25
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                        It takes a long time. Large volumes require a larger budget.
                        Disadvantages need to be noticed, not just shouting hurray.

                        The fleet is not built quickly at all. First of all, we need shipyards, ships cannot be built with a single budget. I screamed hurray? belay

                        Is it too hard to think? - More media can apply.

                        What carriers? What are you talking about? The conversation is about the fleet, they have adopted missiles that can be carried by bombers, there is information that they planned to adopt missiles for carrier-based aviation. Accepted or not - I do not know, the information did not come across. That's all. What kind of flexibility and what media are we talking about?

                        LRASM and Caliber show everyone. And reduce your self-importance.

                        Well, let them show, since they are not there. What does this even mean?

                        I looked at your link, there is not a word that the budget of the Moscow region is 1/4 or 25% of the Russian budget. request
                        It is not entirely clear what exactly Khodarenok means when he talks about the budget. request
                        Do you want to say that we have a terribly militarized country and every fourth ruble is spent on defense? Let's compare. yes
                        It is written there:

                        The share of the budget of the Ministry of Defense of Russia in the gross domestic product in 2017 was 3,4% (USA - 2,9%), in 2018 - 2,9% (USA - 3%), in 2019 - 2,9% (in the USA - 3,1%).

                        In general, the military budget of the Russian Federation is currently $ 46 billion.

                        As I understand it, 46 billion is the Russian military budget for 2018.

                        https://www.kommersant.ru/doc/3507257

                        At the same time, the budget of Russia for 2018 amounted to 1,658 trillion. Roughly speaking, one and a half trillion and 46 billion .... What is 25%? belay At the same time, our expenses are 2,9% of GDP, in the USA - 3%.

                        At the same time, it is argued that "the share of the budget of the Russian Ministry of Defense in the country's budget" is "in 2018 - 17,3%, in the United States with the same in 2018 - 14,7%.
                        In general, I did not understand what it was about. request It is argued that in Russia the share of the Defense Ministry in the total budget is higher, while military spending is less than GDP. If you can clarify, I would be grateful. In any case, there is not a word about any 1/4 of the budget.

                        Have you done a lot yourself ?? And a lot depends on the given conditions.

                        No, not a lot, but I don't sit and demand - give me a bigger budget than everyone else, quickly make the economy bigger than everyone else, and so on.

                        The budget is more than $ 260 billion, with a proportional increase in all items of expenditure. Villainy, in your opinion?

                        What's this? What are 260 billion? belay Who spends so much and collects more? If about Russia, then in 2019 it was 65 billion, in the United States - 730 billion 260 - who is this?
                        Do not be offended, but it was not self-conceit, you just start to say rather strange things, indicate incomprehensible data, it is somewhat annoying, I do not like it when they slip "I get on". hi
                      4. Alexey Sergeev Offline
                        Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 7 September 2020 02: 44
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                        260 - who has it?

                        We have. ~ $ 260 billion budget of the country. 65 billion exactly and will be 25 +%. But where does this figure come from? Of course, I was mistaken and it was about ~ 20% in 2017.

                        No, not a lot, but I don't sit and demand - give me a budget more than everyone else, quickly make the economy bigger than everyone else, and so on.

                        But in vain. Look at the brain drain map by country. All this is interconnected with the standard of living of future scientists and not only. And these are items of expenditure on science.
                      5. 123 Offline
                        123 (123) 7 September 2020 12: 33
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                        We have. ~ $ 260 billion budget of the country. 65 billion exactly and will be 25 +%. But where does this figure come from? Of course, I was mistaken and it was about ~ 20% in 2017.

                        Apparently "share in the budget" is the share of budget spending on defense. I don't know where you got the numbers from and how you thought 65 billion is 2019. The link you gave indicates - 17%. You can see what kind of pictures German propaganda is drawing:



                        16,2%, sorry, not 25%, for comparison, in the USA - 14,9%, the difference is 1,3% (if you count by reference, then 2,1%) why it is so shocking to you is not clear request

                        But in vain. Look at the brain drain map by country. All this is interconnected with the standard of living of future scientists and not only. And these are items of expenditure on science.

                        Can you suggest looking at a specific map or do you suggest choosing it yourself?
                        As a "leak" do you propose to transfer defense spending to science? Or will you give the budget the most immediately? The three leaders in terms of GDP - the United States has ridden world trade and is supported by the dollar, China and India have slightly larger populations. How do you propose to wedge ourselves into this trio? On Monday to announce that now the ruble will be instead of the dollar, or will the population increase to the level of India in six months? Or what other magic recipe is there?
                      6. Alexey Sergeev Offline
                        Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 8 September 2020 06: 42
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                        Or will you give the budget the most immediately? The three leaders in terms of GDP - the United States has ridden world trade and is supported by the dollar, China and India have slightly larger populations.

                        The position of the conformists. What is being done for development?
                        You can see the top ten. 4 economy - Germany 1250 billion, the third - Japan 1500 (not India, that budget is not very different from ours, hence millions in terrible poverty). Next - Britain 970.
                        R. Korea 360, at least take it as a landmark.
                      7. 123 Offline
                        123 (123) 8 September 2020 12: 19
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                        The position of the conformists. What is being done for development?

                        Interest Ask. yes In short, the economy is developing, in detail, it will be published on several pages. Are you interested in a specific area?

                        You can see the top ten. 4 economy - Germany 1250 billion, the third - Japan 1500 (not India, that budget is not very different from ours, hence millions in terrible poverty). Next - Britain 970.
                        R. Korea 360, at least take it as a landmark.

                        Again the same rake ... and you go there ... Honestly, I'm tired of this topic too much ...
                        A simple comparison of GDP has no practical sense, because it does not reflect the real state of affairs. Unless they will measure themselves "with someone longer." Countries have different pricing levels. GDP should be viewed in terms of purchasing power parity.
                        For example, you cite Britain as an example, urge to strive for its level, but in relation to our topic, its fleet is weaker, it simply cannot contain more. And according to the numbers O-ho. fellow
                      8. Alexey Sergeev Offline
                        Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 8 September 2020 15: 45
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                        Simple GDP Comparison

                        Therefore, I compare the budgets of countries, not GDP.

                        For example, you cite Britain as an example, urge to strive for its level, but in relation to our topic, its fleet is weaker, it simply cannot contain more.

                        I urge you to strive for the level of the RK, for a start.
                        Fleet Britain can build and maintain (there are shipyards, technologies), but does NOT want to, shifting the load to Big Brother.
                      9. 123 Offline
                        123 (123) 8 September 2020 17: 26
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                        Therefore, I compare the budgets of countries, not GDP.

                        It doesn't matter, the pricing mechanism is different. The cost of building and maintaining a ship varies greatly from country to country. We must look at parity.

                        I urge you to strive for the level of the RK, for a start.

                        I suggest not to look for excuses for groans, like - everything is bad with us, nothing is being done and nothing is being done, we cannot do anything. Is RK Korea, or what?

                        Fleet Britain can build and maintain (there are shipyards, technologies), but does NOT want to, shifting the load to Big Brother.

                        Well, of course. laughing The former mistress of the seas just doesn't want to. belay The old ragged British cat simply cannot support the navy and the army.
                        Technology? Without the Americans, they are unable to build submarines, missiles, by the way, are also American. If "big brother" takes offense, England will be left without a navy.
                        The events described on the link were 3 years ago, but since then, little has changed.

                        https://www.mk.ru/politics/2017/02/10/ekspert-o-neispravnykh-britanskikh-podlodkakh-srazhenie-uzhe-proigrano.html
                      10. Alexey Sergeev Offline
                        Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 9 September 2020 02: 18
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                        The former mistress of the seas just doesn't want to. The old ragged British cat simply cannot support the navy and the army.

                        I mentioned about ideological turns, try to keep from meaningless turns.

                        If "big brother" takes offense, England will be left without a navy.

                        Not offended, family all the same. And in the relationship there are no hysterics, in English even. request
                        Be that as it may, they have in service 6 modern destroyers (built in a fairly short and inaccessible time to us now) and a couple of aircraft carriers.
                      11. 123 Offline
                        123 (123) 9 September 2020 08: 17
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                        I mentioned about ideological turns, try to keep from meaningless turns.

                        I will try, but then I ask you too - not to broadcast your stereotypes about the state of affairs "there" and "here" and about the landmarks to which we should strive. hi

                        Not offended, family all the same. And in a relationship there are no tantrums, in English even

                        Will not be offended, these are all emotions. England is dependent on military technology and that's a fact.

                        Be that as it may, they have in service 6 modern destroyers (built in a fairly short and inaccessible time to us now) and a couple of aircraft carriers.

                        You are still trying to find a diamond in their dung heap and give us an example.
                        Something is better with them, something with us. Do you put them as an example for us?

                        https://vz.ru/world/2019/9/3/995712.html

                        https://oko-planet.su/politik/politikarm/507575-flagman-britanskogo-flota-snova-protek-srazu-posle-remonta-kotorogo-dolzhno-bylo-hvatit-na-mnogo-let.html

                        The British are unable to maintain the financing of the fleet and armed forces at the required level, and this is also a fact. What's their budget, you say? winked
                    2. Alexey Sergeev Offline
                      Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 9 September 2020 02: 29
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                      It should be borne in mind that the news was published by the Tkhe Sun newspaper, which is on the list of yellow tabloids. But the medal also has a second side. The subtext is this: we have no combat-ready submarine forces, because we have no money. Such techniques are used. This was the case in Sweden when they stubbornly searched for a non-existent Russian submarine near their shores. There and then a request went to parliament for the hobby of the military budget, including the naval component.

                      A fragment of your own article. It is necessary to read not only the title ...

                      Technology? Without the Americans, they are unable to build submarines, missiles, by the way, are also American.

                      On destroyers: own air defense system, cannon, engines, 2 radars (AFAR and CAR, better than on most Berks). Tomahawks? Saved, It's good to have such a "brother".
                      Submarine Astyut. Turbines, a reactor, and so on.
                    3. 123 Offline
                      123 (123) 9 September 2020 09: 12
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                      A fragment of your own article. It is necessary to read not only the title ...

                      That's why I leave the link, so that you can read not only the title. hi The motives of "groans" do not cancel the presence of a technical problem, the problem, by the way, is old ... And it does not seem that something has changed for the better.

                      https://vpk.name/news/131965_izdanie_express_
                      pyat_iz_shesti_britanskih_apl_stoyat_na_remonte.html

                      On destroyers: own air defense system, cannon, engines, 2 radars (AFAR and CAR, better than on most Berks). Tomahawks? Saved. It's good to have such a "brother".
                      Submarine Astyut. The turbines, the reactor, the hook are ours.

                      Come on, you already have with your destroyers, the fleet consists not only of them. Saved, you say? Big Brother?

                      British Defense Secretary Ben Wallace said in an interview with the Sunday Times that the country must prepare to fight wars without relying on the support of the United States, as it may cease to be a world leader .......
                      The minister pointed out that Britain is highly dependent on US military support. “We are very dependent on American air cover, on American reconnaissance and tracking equipment. <…> We need to diversify our assets,” he said.

                      https://ria.ru/20200112/1563329328.html

                      They are not in a position to make rockets on their own, the "economy" is forced.
                      Do you use them as an example? Should we strive for this? Do you dream to lie under the "big brother", like the British?
                    4. Alexey Sergeev Offline
                      Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 9 September 2020 11: 18
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                      Do you use them as an example? Should we strive for this? Do you dream to lie under the "big brother" like the British?

                      In the example, they were with the Germans and the Japanese, as the 4th country in terms of budget. And you have an unhealthy wind vane of the search for enemies. Press down, if not hard.

                      They are not in a position to make rockets on their own, the "economy" is forced.

                      Because 20-30 years ago, no relevant R&D was carried out. Which are still within their power.
                      Britain has succeeded as a country to which money and investments are brought, I do not think that this threatens us.
                      Therefore, an example is the Republic of Korea, with a budget of $ 360 billion and non-resource exports, IMHO.
                    5. 123 Offline
                      123 (123) 9 September 2020 11: 49
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                      In the example, they were with the Germans and the Japanese, as the 4th country in terms of budget.

                      Why did you run into the budget - I do not understand at all. request You have an original approach. As a rule, they compare GDP and the share of military spending as a percentage of it. Moreover, the GDP (PPP) is much better suited for this. A simple comparison of GDP gives nothing, in my opinion, the example of England is considered in some detail.
                      England is much better for comparison than Japan or Germany, because these are occupied countries, the economy of Japan is larger than ours, even if we count on PPP, we are practically on par with Germany. But militarily, Japan is much weaker than it could be, while Germany is militarily a dwarf.

                      And you have an unhealthy wind vane of the search for enemies. Press down, if not hard.

                      And you have a search for "shining ideals" to which we supposedly need to strive. Let's agree that you are not telling how good it is to be under Big Brother, and I am not saying what I think about this.

                      Because 20-30 years ago, no relevant R&D was carried out. Which are still within their power.

                      Well, of course, if they don’t do something, it means that everyone may simply don’t want to, or they save money, if we have it, it means that they have no money and can do nothing. laughing

                      Britain has succeeded as a country to which money and investments are brought, I do not think that this threatens us.

                      As you might think, your stereotypes will collapse. smile The British themselves prefer to bring money to Russia. laughing

                      According to the Russian leader, this year most of the direct foreign investment in Russia came from the UK - $ 22 billion.

                      http://www.finmarket.ru/news/4912078

                      The number of new projects related to foreign investment in the UK fell by 2018% in the fiscal year 2019-14, which ended in March, to 1782, the lowest level in six years.

                      EY published its own data on foreign direct investment, according to which in 2018 the number of such projects in the UK fell by 13% to 1054.

                      https://www.kommersant.ru/doc/4012825

                      According to the agency, more than 400 companies are currently negotiating the transfer of offices from the UK. We are talking about both British business proper and legal entities from North and South America, as well as from Asia.

                      https://rg.ru/2020/02/19/iz-za-brexit-mnogie-kompanii-perenosiat-ofisy-iz-anglii-v-niderlandy.html

                      UK GDP in the second quarter of this year decreased by 21,7% in annual terms and by 20,4% in quarterly terms. At the same time, in the first quarter of this year, the drop in GDP was 1,7% in annual terms and 2,2% in quarterly terms. Thus, the country's economy entered a recession for the first time in 11 years.

                      https://www.vedomosti.ru/economics/news/2020/08/12/836466-ekonomika-velikobritanii-sokratilas

                      Therefore, an example is the Republic of Korea, with a budget of $ 360 billion and non-resource exports, IMHO.

                      What does the budget have to do with it, can you explain? (It was said above, I will not repeat myself). Your claims are strange, the business must be developed extremely small, export is not raw materials. What a finicky you are. Countries that are poor in natural resources do not export raw materials, which is why they do not export raw materials. Maybe you have in mind a country with the entire periodic table in the bowels and exclusively non-commodity exports?
                    6. Alexey Sergeev Offline
                      Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 9 September 2020 12: 51
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                      Maybe you have in mind a country with the entire periodic table in the bowels and exclusively non-commodity exports?

                      USA? Exports of raw materials ~ 10% of the total ..

                      Countries that are poor in natural resources do not export raw materials, which is why they do not export raw materials.

                      No, the fact that the richest countries have predominantly non-resource exports. Coincidence?

                      most of the direct foreign investment in Russia came from the UK - $ 22 billion.

                      In comparison with the British, this is a "tip". smile

                      you are not telling how good it is to be under "Big Brother"

                      It's not about Good, but about things that are not critical for Britain personally (what you emphasized).

                      Japan or Germany, because these are occupied countries, the economy of Japan is larger than ours, even if we count by PPP, we are practically on par with Germany. But militarily, Japan is much weaker than it could be, while Germany is militarily a dwarf.

                      What is the manifestation of the occupation? It is somehow beneficial, atypical ..
                      In terms of PPP, India is not far behind China. But a comparison of budgets (2500 and 270 billion) clarifies everything: both terrible poverty and the difference in spending. And yes, in India a conventional Solaris costs the same as in the whole world. And the average Indian has to plow several times more than the average Russian to buy it.
        2. Alexey Sergeev Offline
          Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 8 September 2020 16: 01
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          In short, the economy is developing

          This requires a lot of faith. In the words of a number of officials. One of them said it was crazy to buy $ 36r in 2014.
        3. 123 Offline
          123 (123) 8 September 2020 17: 40
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          This requires a lot of faith. In the words of a number of officials. One of them said it was crazy to buy $ 36r in 2014.

          I don't care what some official said 6 years ago. Maybe it was insane at the time. The economy is not a currency rate and stock quotes.
          You still don't want to consider anything in particular, and prefer to get off with vague hints of someone else's statements? For such a point of view, one must have a strong faith in the "hand of the market".
        4. Alexey Sergeev Offline
          Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 9 September 2020 02: 22
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          Maybe it was insane at the time. The economy is not a currency rate and stock quotes.

          But then I did not believe him. I asked a friend of the economist, he said - if this person is trying so hard to convince from the screen, then it is better to do exactly the opposite. And 900 thousand turned into 2 million for me. smile Not that he won a lot - the prices, which are in rubles, for some reason rushed after the rate. But at least the savings have not depreciated.
          About the specifics: what is being done to support small business in our country?
        5. 123 Offline
          123 (123) 9 September 2020 08: 53
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          About the specifics: what is being done to support small business in our country?

          First, the conversation was about the development of the economy, small business is only a small part of it. The emphasis is rather on the development of large enterprises in industry and agriculture.
          By the way, due to this, the economy sagged less than in the EU, Japan, China or the USA. I believe that in terms of GDP (PPP), following the results of 9 months, Russia will be in 5th place, displacing Germany. But you are surely sure that we need to follow the example of these countries and develop small business more?
          Secondly, measures to support small businesses should probably be divided into two groups, common and related to the coronavirus.
          The usual, "pre-coronavirus" programs should include support programs for small and medium-sized businesses, for more details follow the links:
          Federal level:

          https://corpmsp.ru/finansovaya-podderzhka/

          http://www.gp.specagro.ru/

          http://fasie.ru/

          Programs operate at the level of subjects and municipalities, for example:

          https://dubnainvest.com/s-and-m-business

          Here you can see the support measures for the "second group" related to the coronavirus.

          https://www.advgazeta.ru/ag-expert/advices/polnyy-spisok-mer-podderzhki-biznesa/

          https://xn--90aifddrld7a.xn--p1ai/anticrisis/perechen-federalnykh-mer-podderzhki-malogo-i-srednego-biznesa

          What kind of support do you expect? What do you expect from the state?
        6. Alexey Sergeev Offline
          Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 9 September 2020 11: 29
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          I believe that in terms of GDP (PPP) for 9 months, Russia will be in 5th place,

          Look, we are very dependent on imports (no matter what we say about the success of import substitution). And if you need to buy a solaris, it is bought not taking into account the RFP, but quite at world prices. Also with medical and scientific equipment (Siemens tomographs, mass spectrographs), software for enterprises (MS Windows, Word, AutoCAD), medicines, vaccinations, vaccines, seed grain of a number of varieties (durum, wheat, for example) and many others. We save on the most "valuable" - on people. Those who feel this and, possessing talents, can vote with their feet.
          My friend moved from Novosib to the States. Programmer, his own small company with an income of over 2 million.
        7. 123 Offline
          123 (123) 9 September 2020 12: 30
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          Look, we are very dependent on imports (no matter what we say about the success of import substitution). And if you need to buy a solaris, it is bought not taking into account the RFP, but quite at world prices. Also with medical and scientific equipment (Siemens tomographs, mass spectrographs), software for enterprises (MS Windows, Word, AutoCAD), medicines, vaccinations, vaccines, seed grain of a number of varieties (durum, wheat, for example) and many others.

          Quite right, no country can do without imports in our time. Gradually imported products are being replaced, there is no other way. Or will you order your fingers to snap and everything will appear? We have been doing tomographs and so on for a long time.

          http://www.amico.ru/production/tomograph/mrt_amiko450/

          Windows and Word, almost the whole world sits on this, I agree, it is necessary to do, but it is difficult to replace what everyone is used to. If anything, on a spare disk I have an Axis on Linux written, if suddenly the "partners" chop off that, I will survive. To say that this area is not developing at all in our country, the language does not turn. Vaccinations .... should we talk about the Vector? Sowing grain and genetic material in livestock farming will also be replaced, everything moves in stages.
          In any case, this argument does not work in the defense industry. The share of imports is minimal there.

          We save on the most "valuable" - on people. Those who feel this and, possessing talents, can vote with their feet.
          My friend moved from Novosib to the States. Programmer, his own small company with an income of over 2 million.

          Whatever one may say, capitalism is in the yard. The development of production requires a cheaper labor force. Not to say that I like it, but this is a fact and there is no other way.
          I am very happy for your friend, I hope he lives happily ever after and does not kiss black shoes.
          Whether he is doing so well - in fact, I don't know, people tend to exaggerate their achievements. Why didn't you vote with your feet? Is there a problem with talent?
          From memory (there is no time to look now), 12 million have left Russia, 10 million have come to us.The population in 2019 is 146,780: in 2020 - 146,748. The difference is not that big. Where are these crowds of migrants fleeing Russia?
        8. Alexey Sergeev Offline
          Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 9 September 2020 13: 07
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          lives happily ever after and does not kiss black shoes.

          He is not a leftist Democrat .. And has a small arsenal at home (member of the shooting club). BLM is bypassed.

          Whether he is doing so well in reality, I do not know, people tend to exaggerate their achievements.

          House in Washington (which is DS), three children, wife is a housewife. Garage for 3 cars.
          They were invited to visit, but ... the virus appeared. request

          From memory (there is no time to search now), 12 million left Russia, 10 million came to us.

          You understand that among those who have arrived there is a large proportion of illiterate residents of the former republics ?? And often much more valuable personnel leave. Earning more and paying more taxes.
        9. 123 Offline
          123 (123) 9 September 2020 19: 31
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          He is not a leftist Democrat .. And has a small arsenal at home (member of the shooting club). BLM is bypassed.

          I have nothing against your friend, but luck accompanies him, but this is still bypassed. If a serious turmoil begins, you can't shake off the shovel in the corner. And the probability of such a development of the event is present.



          House in Washington (which is DS), three children, wife is a housewife. Garage for 3 cars.
          They were invited to visit, but ... the virus appeared.

          I have nothing against it, I got a job, well done. Not everyone succeeds in this, especially the emigrants.

          You understand that among those who have arrived there is a large proportion of illiterate residents of the former republics ?? And often much more valuable personnel leave. Earning more and paying more taxes.

          And you know, not a fact. Somehow I didn’t come across a serious analysis of the situation with migration.
          Remember your map? Judging by it, all the "geeks" mainly go to the USA, Canada and Australia.
          The migration picture looks like this:

          The United States, where 51 million foreigners live and work, remains the most attractive country for migrants. The second and third places in this list are occupied by Germany and Saudi Arabia, each receiving 19 million migrants. Russia is in fourth place: 12 million international migrants. In fifth place is Great Britain, where there are 10 million. Canada, France and Australia each have eight million migrants, and Italy - six million.

          https://news.un.org/ru/story/2019/09/1363082

          The method by which "brains" are isolated from the total mass is not known. And you?
        10. Alexey Sergeev Offline
          Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 10 September 2020 04: 06
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          And you know, not a fact. Somehow I didn’t come across a serious analysis of the situation with migration.

          We see the results of this migration around us. And in reports on crime, as well.
          I understand that I don't want to admit to myself, but still ..

          Not everyone succeeds in this, especially the emigrants.

          He went straight away with a contract to work with one of the partners of the company where he had worked earlier in Novosibirsk. And there is insurance and housing. Smart, capable. And a specialty that is in demand in many developed countries (programmer).
          Similarly, a distant relative moved to Sweden in the 00s. (Only there is the sphere of construction)

          If a serious squabble begins, you can't shake off the shovel in the corner. And the probability of such a development of the event is present.

          Ar-15 is not a shovel. smile In addition, the percentage of the black population is small (12,65%, against
          73% of "whites"), especially in the US Army and National Guard (!). Which are not built by African Americans (at the core), as some BLMs are trying to claim.
        11. 123 Offline
          123 (123) 10 September 2020 08: 28
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          We see the results of this migration around us. And in reports on crime, as well.
          I understand that I don't want to admit to myself, but still ..

          Come on, just say - everyone knows this, all civilized mankind understands this. laughing This means that barbarians and criminals go to us, and there is exclusively "the flower of the nation." Maybe you should get back to reality?

          Crime bulletins? For some reason, Seattle remembered .... there, they say, growth of more than 500% ..
          Here are the results of the "brain drain" to France ... there is a funny comment:

          All these women and children! I see so many doctors and engineers! They assimilate so well!



          Sweden, you say? Here they are the "Vikings" in Sweden on strike .. Surely highly qualified designers are jumping on the roofs. laughing


          They took hostages in the migration service, Stockholm, probably a programmer or engineer ..


          Ar-15 is not a shovel. In addition, the percentage of the black population is small (12,65%, versus 73% of "whites"), especially in the US Army and National Guard (!). Which are not built by African Americans (at the core), as some BLMs are trying to claim.

          Well, it’s good for him to defend his citadel. Surely fighting off bandits with a gun in hand is the dream of any programmer. winked Was he going there for this? smile
        12. Alexey Sergeev Offline
          Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 10 September 2020 18: 47
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          Well, it’s good for him to defend his citadel. Surely fighting off bandits with a gun in hand is the dream of any programmer. Was he going there for this? smile

          I went for an interesting job and a standard of living. Got it all. AR-15 - for shooting range in the field. But skills can come in handy if something happens. I repeat: in the case of really serious riots, the majority that I mentioned will be suppressed. By force of arms if required.

          Sweden, you say? Here they are the "Vikings" in Sweden on strike .. Surely highly qualified designers are jumping on the roofs. laughing

          Yes, residents of third countries also tend to prosperous countries with a developed social system. AND?

          Come on already, just say - everyone knows this, all civilized mankind understands this. This means that barbarians and criminals go to us, and there is exclusively "the flower of the nation." Maybe you should get back to reality?

          No need to juggle. It's just that our talented people go there. In return, we get residents of the former southern republics of the USSR, in many ways. They have advantages / they are ready to do simple work for little money.
        13. 123 Offline
          123 (123) 10 September 2020 19: 41
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          Yes, residents of third countries also tend to prosperous countries with a developed social system. AND?

          What does I mean? I can remind ..

          We see the results of this migration around us. And in reports on crime, as well.
          I understand that I don't want to admit to myself, but still ..

          Here are the results of migration around them. But for some reason you are sure that such orcs are coming to us, and only elves to the West. So what did you want to admit there? winked

          No need to juggle. It's just that our talented people go there. In return, we get residents of the former southern republics of the USSR, in many ways. They have advantages / they are ready to do simple work for little money.

          Again twenty-five. What data do you have, aft of that coloring map? Is this a matter of faith for you? Migration is the same everywhere, those who come and go are not homogeneous in terms of education level, labor skills, etc. We get "in many ways" the inhabitants of the southern republics, they are Africans and Arabs. What is the difference?
        14. Alexey Sergeev Offline
          Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 12 September 2020 11: 32
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          Let me explain it more simply: our educated go there, but their people do not come to us. Difficult to understand? Or inconvenient?
          And they all get the appendage of people for simple work.
        15. 123 Offline
          123 (123) 12 September 2020 12: 31
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          Let me explain in a simpler way: our educated people go there, but their people do not come to us. Difficult to understand? Or inconvenient?

          No, not at all difficult and very convenient. Once you stopped talking in slogans about the shining West and moved on to specific things, everything became extremely simple. It is not entirely correct to say that educated people go there and do not come to us at all. They also come to us, probably in smaller quantities, because the level of salaries there is higher, but they still go. For example, Depardieu, I think, cannot be called an uneducated "makeweight for a simple job." He found his advantages in moving, he was satisfied with the level of taxation. I guess he's not the only one. What the real numbers are is a mystery. I have not seen a serious analysis on this topic. How many migrants go there, what is the educational level of migrants, how many of them manage to get a normal job and put their knowledge into practice, how many of them return. We do not know any of this. Instead, we are offered coloring cards and aspirated tales of how wonderful it is. I remember about your friend, but how many of those who left settled just as well? And the reasons why our "brains" leave are different, for example, the following:

        16. Alexey Sergeev Offline
          Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 13 September 2020 14: 07
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          They also come to us, probably in smaller quantities, because the level of salaries there is higher, but they still go.

          Conformist position. Someone is coming to us too.
          I already wrote, the problem is that we are losing people. The standard of living is affected. To increase it, you need to "grow" the economy.
        17. 123 Offline
          123 (123) 13 September 2020 14: 16
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          Conformist position.

          You yourself are a opportunist.

          I already wrote, the problem is that we are losing people. The standard of living is affected. To increase it, you need to "grow" the economy.

          In order to "grow" the economy, it is necessary to develop production; in order to develop production, one also needs a cheaper labor force, otherwise no one will transfer production here. The development of production leads to an increase in the standard of living.
          Or do you have another recipe?
        18. Alexey Sergeev Offline
          Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 14 September 2020 05: 53
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          otherwise no one will transfer production here

          Suggest those wishing to transfer production here. Turks, Chinese?
          Let me remind you about the difference in climate with the same China and Turkey.
          The question is: what production facilities are there, say, in Switzerland (where are the high salaries)?
          For example, in the German metro - Swiss trains.
        19. 123 Offline
          123 (123) 14 September 2020 09: 28
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          Suggest those wishing to transfer production here. Turks, Chinese?

          I did not delve into the topic, the Chinese are already building an automobile plant in Tula, the Japanese carry engines from the Far East to them. What kind of production do you expect from the Turks? Sewing jeans? Found an advanced industrial power laughing They are trying to drag production to themselves and their salaries to the Swiss. Industrial production in Russia is growing, including due to the transfer of production to our territory by foreign companies. It is a fact. If it's a problem for you to check this information, write, it will be time to answer in more detail.

          Let me remind you about the difference in climate with the same China and Turkey.

          Climate? Egypt, Laos or Namibia is warmer than Belgium and how does this affect the industry? Are you talking about agriculture or what?

          The question is: what production facilities are there, say, in Switzerland (where are the high salaries)?
          For example, in the German metro - Swiss trains.

          Production is developed there yes Machine tools, watches ... a lot of things. Of course, you can compare with Switzerland .. just remind me when there were "cataclysms" like ours? We fought there for the last time, if I am not mistaken during the time of Suvorov, revolutions, coups, divisions, collapse, I don’t remember. The production has been preserved, it works for itself. That's just with the development .... they themselves go looking for where to mark. I didn’t specifically track it, until the recent events a delegation came to Lukashenka from them. The task of transferring production to your place in Switzerland is not worth it. Can you give an example of what kind of production has been moved to Switzerland recently? As for the Swiss trains .. Surely they have been doing this for a long time. What does this have to do with the transfer of production? In Russia, the production of wagons, diesel locomotives, electric trains, and almost the entire spectrum has been established. Previously, much of this was not produced in the Russian Federation, now it is exported. In this case, the example is not entirely correct, because it is rather its own production, but the cost of production is important, especially at the stage of starting production.
        20. Alexey Sergeev Offline
          Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 15 September 2020 06: 45
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          including due to the transfer of production to our territory by foreign companies. It is a fact.

          the Chinese are already building an automobile plant in Tula

          Mainly for domestic consumption. We and Ford have a plant (was). Ready parts are taken and assembled.

          Of course, you can compare with Switzerland .. just remind me when there were "cataclysms" like ours?

          I think the main cataclysm is our officials (elite real estate, cars and yachts that do not correspond to income, elderly billionaire parents, etc.).
          This is what noticeably affects the pace of development.

          In Russia, the production of wagons, diesel locomotives, electric trains, and almost the entire spectrum has been established.

          Established .. But high-speed trains are purchased by Sapsans, which are Siemens.
          An example with Switzerland is to make products of such quality and technical level that developed countries buy them.
          Another example: the business jet market. Embraer was able to log on to it. What's stopping us ?? Lack of initiative by giant UAC?
        21. 123 Offline
          123 (123) 15 September 2020 08: 52
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          Mainly for domestic consumption.

          Believe it or not, many factories are focused specifically on the domestic market, and that's why they are being built. Trump, for example, very lucidly explained to the Europeans and the Japanese that factories should be built in them and not in Mexico. By the way, exports from Russia are growing.

          The total export of products of the Russian automotive industry (cars, assembly kits, components) grew in 2019 by 17% to $ 4 billion, according to an EY study. The growth of foreign supplies has been observed for the third year in a row.

          https://www.vedomosti.ru/auto/articles/2020/02/06/822361-rossiiskih-avtomobilei

          We and Ford have a plant (was). Ready parts are taken and assembled.

          Are you out of ignorance or are you denigrating it in principle? All car factories in Russia go through several stages, starting with assembly and then increasing their localization. If I am not mistaken, the requirement is not less than 80% of components manufactured in Russia. That is why engines and other things began to be produced here. That things are not going very well at Ford, it mainly affected passenger cars. If the "curse of the rust belt" has reached Ford, that's not our problem. Opel, which by the way the Americans refused to sell to us at one time, also somehow curled up .... They are not doing business. What to do, there are many problems in the USA.

          I think the main cataclysm is our officials (elite real estate, cars and yachts that do not correspond to income, elderly billionaire parents, etc.).
          This is what noticeably affects the pace of development.

          You can think whatever you want, but this does not mean that you correctly understand the reasons. The whole difference between us and Switzerland is the presence of officials who, of course, have yachts and foreign real estate? Let's not take into account such trifles as the collapse of industry in the 90s? Not to mention such "minor" events as wars and revolutions. Countries have developed in completely different conditions. Do you recall when the sanctions were introduced against Switzerland?

          Established .. But high-speed trains are purchased by Sapsans, which are Siemens.

          How fastidious you are. Not so long ago, and this was not. High-speed trains? Do not worry, there will be your own, not all at once. They even buy from us, in the USA, for example, do you know how many kilometers of high-speed railways?

          An example with Switzerland is to make products of such quality and technical level that developed countries buy them.

          To make products such that developed countries would buy them? Is it like China? smile After all, all these "developed" Chinese are rowed with a shovel. laughing
          Why can't the Germans do trains for themselves? Are they not that advanced? Why can't the Swiss themselves build Tokomak and the Russians are building their components? Are they crooked or underdeveloped?
          In general, it is not so important who exactly buys, the money for the products is paid the same. But give it to you in "developed" countries. What would be beautiful, buyers in tailcoats winked
          The United States takes from us only what they are not able to produce themselves, trade ties are deliberately cut off, the European market is quite closed, everyone is on quotas and they are not welcome there. You can only enter these markets if you play by their rules. For Russia, there is only one way to get there - to crawl on all fours with your head down. In this case, you will have to give up your market. Do you want this? Will not wait no If you want, crawl yourself, no one holds.

          Another example: the business jet market. Embraer was able to log on to it. What's stopping us ?? Lack of initiative by giant UAC?

          Want another example? As you put it, "the market of the executive class car", Aurus was able to enter it, which prevented the Brazilians? Lack of initiative? This awful and clumsy Brazilian car industry. And what about the Canadians? What is not? And the advanced Swiss? It turns out that God himself ordered them ..... What is also not present? I am directly surprised at how callous they are, for sure they have corrupt officials and real estate abroad. repeat
        22. Alexey Sergeev Offline
          Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 15 September 2020 18: 48
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          By the way, exports from Russia are growing.

          Well, yes, we bought 2400 VAZ cars in Germany last year. And 400+ thousand Volkswagen.

          Aurus was able to reach him, what prevented the Brazilians?

          Log off? Is this a joke? smile

          The United States only takes from us what they are not able to produce themselves; trade ties are deliberately cut off

          Well, we wanted to enter into contradiction with them. (Consequences of propaganda in the Union and the complex for defeat in the Cold War). This is the result. We must take it for granted.

          For Russia, there is only one way to get there - to crawl on all fours with your head down.

          This is what the propagandists are trying to sell us. Like, it is impossible for good. Perhaps, their employers with an imperial mindset don't want to.

          Why can't the Germans do trains for themselves? Are they not that advanced?

          Swiss are better. You will not be able to produce the entire range of high quality goods, you will get mediocrity in the majority, sometimes expensive. (Remembering Soviet cars and their availability). The world division of labor did not just appear.
          It makes sense to focus on a few areas, buy the rest.

          But give it to you in "developed" countries. What would be beautiful, buyers in tailcoats winked

          Wrong logic. To produce goods of such high quality that they will be ready to be bought well in developed countries, not just in third countries.
          Remind me if there are many orders for Aurus (except Russia and Turkmenistan)
        23. 123 Offline
          123 (123) 15 September 2020 19: 35
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          Well, yes, we bought 2400 VAZ cars in Germany last year. And 400+ thousand Volkswagen.

          Impressive good
          Well, yes, there were 360+ thousand VAZ cars in Russia last year. And 93 thousand Volkswagens made in the Kaluga region.

          https://auto.vercity.ru/statistics/sales/europe/2019/russia/

          Log off? Is this a joke?

          What kind of jokes are there? sad

          Well, we wanted to enter into contradiction with them. (Consequences of propaganda in the Union and the complex for defeat in the Cold War). This is the result. We must take it for granted.

          No need to juggle. USA snickering boors. China didn’t seem to want to "enter into contradiction" with them, and Merkel doesn’t want to, as she’s spinning in a frying pan, only it does not help much. They are fined, forced, etc. Russia did not agree to this. If you dream of licking Americans' shoes, you can do it individually. What to do, we still have such individuals with slave complexes, you know the consequences of the propaganda of foreign agents. This must be taken for granted.

          Swiss are better. You will not be able to produce the entire range of high quality goods, you will get mediocrity in the majority, sometimes expensive. (Remembering Soviet cars and their availability). The world division of labor did not just appear.

          What are you saying? belay Can you demonstrate this in figures using the examples of the same Germany or Japan?

          It makes sense to focus on a few areas, buy the rest.

          Have you already heard. yes In the 90s they said so. It is enough for Russia to extract oil and gas, we will buy the rest. We are still trying to disentangle the results. However, I am not surprised by such a formulation of the question. Hostile propaganda distorted many minds.

          Wrong logic. To produce goods of such high quality that they will be ready to be bought well in developed countries, not just in third countries.

          I may have an erroneous one, you do not have it at all. Who cares? The same money is paid for the goods.
          In recent years, there has been a downward trend in the quality of goods. The faster the purchased product breaks down, the faster they will buy a new one. This also applies to German cars.

          Remind me if there are many orders for Auris

          It is not clear what the sales have to do with it, because they could, did. yes In 2020, they plan to sell 50 cars, 600 pre-orders. They will not work at the warehouse.

          https://www.autonews.ru/news/5da076ef9a7947b1aa584941

          In my opinion you are just dodging the answer smile So what prevented the Brazilians (Swiss, Canadians, etc.) from making a car of this class? winked so your example with business jets is extremely unfortunate no
          By the way, in the case of Germany, you think that you need to focus on the production of several types of goods, the rest can be bought and immediately poked into Russia, they say why it does not make business jets. Can't you buy from? There is less and less logic in your words.
        24. Alexey Sergeev Offline
          Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 16 September 2020 00: 02
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          If you dream of licking Americans' shoes, you can do it individually.

          Demagogy. You are trying to pull a statement that does not suit you to an absurd form.
          They wanted to behave in the style of the 19th and early 20th centuries, at the same time wiping their noses on everyone who disagreed (don't tell the Iskander people). "Dissenters" have limited our participation in the large part of the world economy they occupy. Was it impossible to foresee?
          Officials and oligarchs do not need to worry about the sanctions at all, it was said that they should take this as a medal.

          No need to juggle. USA snickering boors. China didn’t seem to want to "enter into contradiction" with them, and Merkel doesn’t want to, as she’s spinning in a frying pan, only it does not help much. They are fined, forced, etc. Russia did not agree to this.

          Examples of similar sanctions against Germany? And, so she herself participated in their introduction ..

          Have you already heard. In the 90s they said so. It is enough for Russia to extract oil and gas, we will buy the rest.

          Love to juggle, so especially for you: focus on a few high-tech areas. I have never considered selling oil and gas a priority, unlike our officials in the 00s. It was then, in the wake of the dizziness from high prices, that the concepts of an “energy superpower” began to emerge, and not in the 90s, with oil at $ 10 each.
          Observation: in the top ten economies of the world, there are no those whose main exports are hydrocarbons. Coincidence??

          It is unclear what the sales have to do with it, because they could, did. yes In 2020, they plan to sell 50 cars, 600 pre-orders. They will not work at the warehouse.

          For domestic consumption and the President of Turkmenistan. Rolls Royce (and our presented samples are not up to the mark) is already preparing to lose part of the world market (2500 cars sold last year). smile
          We'll see. Now it looks unconvincing.

          Immediately you poke into Russia, saying why she does not do business jets.

          Just an example of a tech niche in which you can try to take a place.

          The same money is paid for the goods.

          Only different in quantity and good product occupies a large market share. What is the most popular car we have? (As an example)

          What are you talking about? Can you demonstrate this in figures using the examples of the same Germany or Japan?

          There was an example - Soviet goods, say radios, in comparison with Grundig and Panasonic.
        25. 123 Offline
          123 (123) 16 September 2020 14: 21
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          Demagogy. You are trying to pull a statement that does not suit you to an absurd form.

          Why then? I just call a spade a spade.

          They wanted to behave in the style of the 19th and early 20th centuries, at the same time wiping their noses on everyone who disagreed (don't tell the Iskander people). "Dissenters" have limited our participation in the large part of the world economy they occupy. Was it impossible to foresee?

          Was there another option? Participation in "the considerable part of the world economy they occupied" was possible only in a subordinate position. Russia tried to integrate into the system, right up to joining NATO. In response, they received a refusal, that is, the position is clear - there will not be any equal cooperation, Russia is mining and it will be pulled out. You think you should have crawled there in a knee-elbow position.

          Officials and oligarchs do not need to worry about the sanctions at all, it was said that they should take this as a medal.

          Oh yes, again officials and oligarchs ... And where did you get the idea that with a different development of events, not officials and oligarchs would have lived better? Don't you have enough ham?

          Examples of similar sanctions against Germany? And, so she herself participated in their introduction ..

          Yes please

          Deutsche Bank Trust Company Americas (DBTCA, a subsidiary of the German Deutsche Bank) agreed to pay a fine of more than $ 582 for violating US sanctions imposed on Russia over Crimea.

          https://eadaily.com/ru/news/2020/09/10/ssha-oshtrafovali-dochku-deutsche-bank-za-narushenie-sankciy-protiv-rf

          There have been similar cases in Iran. Nord Stream 2, Germany is forced to slow down the project under the threat of sanctions.

          Love to juggle, so especially for you: focus on a few high-tech areas. I have never considered selling oil and gas a priority, unlike our officials in the 00s. It was then, in the wake of the dizziness from high prices, that the concepts of an “energy superpower” began to emerge, and not in the 90s, with oil at $ 10 each.

          Am I twisting? belay
          This is from an article published after Gaidar's death, about the same thing, almost word for word Luzhkov said about him. So let's not talk about the officials of the 90s. This is Gaidar's concept and it was embodied earlier, in the XNUMXs.

          For competition - and without it there is no market - there was no material base. It took years to create the material base of a competitive market structure. In the meantime, according to Gaidar, everything should have been bought for the oil sold. Thus, a market for foreign suppliers was created, the tasks of the country's internal development were ignored.

          By the way, you are proposing about the same thing, with one amendment. Your offer will focus on several high-tech industries. This is impossible in the current conditions because the rest will have to be bought abroad, which means the sanctions, that is, they simply will not be sold. From here comes dependence and the same subordination to the West.

          Interestingly, we have priority sectors. Defense, space, energy, especially nuclear. By the way, oil and gas production is a fairly high-tech industry, especially offshore production. Only a few countries have similar technologies. Petrochemistry is developing. You think only iPhones are high-tech?

          Observation: in the top ten economies of the world, there are no those whose main exports are hydrocarbons. Coincidence??

          This is not an observation, a speech designed for youngsters running around with Navalny. So far, the first US economy is not export-oriented at all and has a trade deficit in international trade. In addition, as I have already told you more than once, a simple comparison of GDP does not give anything, it is only suitable for "measure the length", like this case. It is necessary to consider it in terms of purchasing power parity (PPP) and, which is typical of the top ten, there is Russia.
          The following system exists in the top ten you are talking about. The sales market is limited, the United States creates excess demand at the expense of debt (to a lesser extent, this is characteristic of other participants in the "cartel"), which allows increasing production. But this is a pyramid and a path to disaster. such a system cannot exist indefinitely.

          For domestic consumption and the President of Turkmenistan. Rolls Royce (and our presented samples are not up to the mark) is already preparing to lose part of the world market (2500 cars sold last year).
          We'll see. Now it looks unconvincing.

          Fall short in quality? belay Will you be so kind - "FACTS IN THE STUDIO" or stop lying.
          Full-fledged production will begin only next year, this is only the beginning and it is too early to compare the sales volume.
          But you consistently (for the third time) ignore the question:
          So what prevented the Brazilians (Swiss, Canadians, etc.) from making a car of this class?

          Just an example of a tech niche in which you can try to take a place.

          But what about "focusing" on a few high-tech industries? As the Brazilians made a business jet, they are great, and the Russians are bony and not agile. If Russia made a luxury car and others did not, then in response, silence ...

          Only different in quantity and good product occupies a large market share. What is the most popular car we have? (As an example)

          You will not believe request LADA yes Here are the sales statistics:

          https://abreview.ru/stat/aeb/

          There was an example - Soviet goods, say radios, in comparison with Grundig and Panasonic.

          Also our example for me laughing The USSR is gone for 30 years and you are all at war with it. Do we have a Soviet economy? Was there no more recent example?
          Nobody is trying to produce the entire range of goods, Russia is trying to get away from critical dependence on imports. In the absence of a free market and constantly applied restrictions, this approach is quite justified.
        26. Alexey Sergeev Offline
          Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 16 September 2020 15: 30
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          Russia is mining and it will be derailed. You think you should have crawled there in a knee-elbow position.

          Who ripped us off in 2006 or 2014? Yes, it was not possible to enter NATO then. And it is necessary, by analogy with a schoolboy or kindergartener, to spoil relations with a company of guys that has not accepted (at the moment), but is ready to communicate? Now or never?

          I just call a spade a spade.

          Oh, a lot is presented to the biased consciousness, through the prism of ideology often.

          By the way, oil and gas production is a fairly high-tech industry, especially offshore production.

          Well yes. And after the departure of Exxon and a number of other companies due to sanctions, offshore projects were abandoned. There was no high technology of its own.

          You think only iPhones are high-tech?

          Why, Huawei, One Plus (Snap 865 Rocket), Samsung smile

          This is impossible in the current conditions because the rest will have to be bought abroad, which means the sanctions, that is, they simply will not be sold. From here there is dependence and the same submission to the West.

          Unable to buy PC accessories? Cars? Tomographs? Aircraft? Submission to the West through the use of Intel products. How can such a scorn be sustained?
          You are too busy, you see everything through the prism of "opposition".

          Was there no more recent example?
          Nobody tries to produce the entire product range

          And the Union is the most striking example. True, there was still isolation from the outside world.

          But what about "focusing" on a few high-tech industries? As the Brazilians made a business jet, they are great, and the Russians are bony and not agile. If Russia made a luxury car and others did not, then in response, silence ...

          No controversy. Aurus appeared quite recently, when the president needed a Russian-made executive car. Not without the help of Porsche Engineering, of course (no reproach). What happened before that? Where are the private initiatives?

          You won't believe request LADA yes Here are the sales statistics

          https://m.autostat.ru/infographics/

          The positions are not bad, but the share in the general market is not very large. In addition, there is a secondary market for foreign cars.
        27. 123 Offline
          123 (123) 16 September 2020 16: 23
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          Who ripped us off in 2006 or 2014? Yes, it was not possible to enter NATO then. And it is necessary, by analogy with a schoolboy or kindergartener, to spoil relations with a company of guys that has not accepted (at the moment), but is ready to communicate? Now or never?

          You are like a child. In spite of spoiling relations .... There were no normal conditions for Russia in this company. So we went our own way. And there the tailbones burned. If according to your kindergarten terminology. The puncher clings to a passerby.

          Well yes. And after the departure of Exxon and a number of other companies due to sanctions, offshore projects were abandoned. There was no high technology of its own.

          Did not have. But now there is. And with your approach, there would be nothing.

          Why, Huawei, One Plus (Snap 865 Rocket), Samsung

          Tell Rosatom about smrtfonchiki. laughing

          Unable to buy PC accessories? Cars? Tomographs? Aircraft? Submission to the West through the use of Intel products. How can such a scorn be sustained?
          You are too busy, you see everything through the prism of "opposition".

          PC accessories? Are there no more needs? On electronics restrictions, they do not stupidly sell.
          Cars? Why buy? They do it here. Tomographs do just as well here. The same applies to aircraft, everything will be different. Like Gaidar again, you want to buy everything for oil? We do not need our own industry?
          It is submission through Intel and so on. At any moment they can cut off everything. We are their competitors. It is addiction. And you see everything through the prism of inferiority and subordination. It is foolish to deny the existence of opposition, why should this factor be ignored?

          No controversy. Aurus appeared quite recently, when the president needed a Russian-made executive car. Not without the help of Porsche Engineering, of course (no reproach). What happened before that? Where are the private initiatives?

          Before that there was ZIL, then nothing, because you can buy in the west laughing Now there is, is it bad?
          I don’t know where private initiatives are. Why don't you show it? Who's stopping you? Do not play on the couch, but exercise. Or is Putin again to blame for the lack of initiative in our bourgeoisie?

          The positions are not bad, but the share in the general market is not very large. In addition, there is a secondary market for foreign cars.

          But what about ..

          Only different in quantity and good product occupies a large market share

          It turns out LADA is the best in quality? Or not? But then your theory is wrong. winked

          I remind you that you consistently (for the fourth time) ignore the question:
          So what prevented the Brazilians (Swiss, Canadians, etc.) from making a car of this class?

          Make an effort on yourself, tell us about the clumsy auto industry in the "developed" countries that you set for us as an example. Where is their private initiative? What they turn out to be corny, unhurried and uninitiated. winked

          And more, about:

          Does the aurus fall short in quality?

          Will there be facts? Or do you prefer to lie to pass by as if nothing happened? sad
        28. Alexey Sergeev Offline
          Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 16 September 2020 18: 13
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          On electronics restrictions, they do not stupidly sell.

          For military equipment? Not surprising. For a citizen, everything is no problem.

          Cars? Why buy? They do it here.

          Many motorists will disagree.

          It is submission through Intel and so on. At any moment they can cut off everything. We are their competitors.

          Chop off what? Shopping for civilian PCs and components?

          It is foolish to deny the existence of confrontation, why should this factor be ignored?

          You are like a child

          Just recently, only a person told me the same thing when I tried to dissuade him from a conspiracy that has existed since ancient times. smile It seems like a hackneyed trick when there is not enough convincing arguments. Any transition to personalities in an argument is a sign of weakness.

          So what prevented the Brazilians (Swiss, Canadians, etc.) from making a car of this class?

          I have already given the answer. With regard to them: prime ministers and presidents do not have enough ambitions, desire, to have a representative car of their own production. And the car industry does not have its own. But Embraer and Bombardier are among the leaders in civil aviation. With incomparable profits.
          The question is why the Tu-204 and Tu-334 did not go, at least in our 00s (you can't blame Gaidar).

          Tomographs do just as well here.

          Worse. Our capacity is up to 0,7 T. Siemens - up to 2,4 T. All major MRI centers have closed-type tomographs with a capacity of 1,5+ Tesla.
        29. 123 Offline
          123 (123) 16 September 2020 19: 19
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          For military equipment? Not surprising. For a citizen, everything is no problem.

          For satellites. Why don't we need military space? Is it just for Americans? In any case, you have to do your own thing.

          Many motorists will disagree.

          Many agree. Statistics confirm. However, you cannot please everyone, take what you want, no one forbids.

          Chop off what? Shopping for civilian PCs and components?

          You are still offended by the child laughing Except for a home PC, nothing else exists? Power plant management, industry, communications, banking and so on. This is all the Internet and computer technology. You cannot depend on "partners" in this.

          Just recently, only a person told me the same thing when I tried to dissuade him in a conspiracy that has existed since ancient times. It looks like a hackneyed technique when there is not enough convincing arguments. Any transition to personalities in an argument is a sign of weakness.

          Well then, try to be strong and support your point of view with arguments, and not talk about kindergarten and stuff like this:

          And it is necessary, by analogy with a schoolboy or kindergartener, to spoil relations with a company of guys that has not accepted (at the moment), but is ready to communicate?

          I have already given the answer. With regard to them: prime ministers and presidents do not have enough ambitions, desire, to have a representative car of their own production. And the car industry does not have its own. But Embraer and Bombardier are among the leaders in civil aviation. With incomparable profits.
          The question is why the Tu-204 and Tu-334 did not go, at least in our 00s (you can't blame Gaidar).

          Come on laughing Well then, our president has no ambitions to fly business jets. winked
          You can't blame everything on ambition. The argument is extremely weak. Putin needs a dozen cars in the garage, 600 pre-orders and this is just the beginning. Moreover, on this basis a whole line of machines is being made, on the basis of the engine an aircraft engine is on the way. Is this all because of Putin's ambitions? If so .. yes, let the ambition be immeasurable yes
          Embraer and Bombardier - one of the leaders in civil aviation? Well, Aurus is one of the leaders in the production of executive cars. By the way, not all of their products fit the definition of "business jets" By the way, following the link you can:

          "Rent a Sukhoi Business Jet"

          https://jetvip.ru/chastnie-samoleti/suhoj-superdzhet-100/

          Or TU-204 VIP (yes, yes, the same Tu-204)

          https://jetvip.ru/chastnie-samoleti/tupolev-tu-204-vip/

          The question is why the Tu-204 and Tu-334 did not go, at least in our 00s (you can't blame Gaidar).

          It may surprise you, but the aviation industry that was destroyed during Gaidar's time cannot be restored at the snap of your fingers. This takes a lot of time, money and effort. And both aircraft were made using obsolete technologies. The Tu-334 also has Ukrainian engines. Don't worry, MC-21 is on its way and everything will be fine with the Superjet. The latter, by the way, is an example of "successful" cooperation with partners. You can only sell to those countries that Americans like.

          Worse. Our capacity is up to 0,7 T. Siemens - up to 2,4 T. All major MRI centers have closed-type tomographs with a capacity of 1,5+ Tesla.

          Are you again for yours? belay Either Aurus falls short in quality, or our tomographs have the wrong power.
          I already gave you the link

          The power of the gradient system of the magnetic resonance imager is 25 mT / m, the rate of rise of the gradients is 60 mT

          http://www.amico.ru/production/tomograph/mrt_amiko450/

          You lie shamelessly and do not blush. sad Shame on you? angry
        30. Alexey Sergeev Offline
          Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 17 September 2020 09: 21
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          You cannot depend on "partners" in this.

          Reasons to believe that Intel is planning to conduct sabotage in civilian life?
          For the military, I don't argue. Although there will be a gold chip for the price, it is not critical here.

          The Tu-334 also has Ukrainian engines. Don't worry, MC-21 is on its way and everything will be fine with the Superjet.

          MC21 was originally planned for PW engines. Translated into Russian. Was 334 impossible?
          Not all is well with SSJ. The reliability is not up to par, the entry to the foreign market was not particularly successful. (Compounded by problems with the supply of spare parts, and who needs problems?)

          Putin needs a dozen cars in the garage, 600 pre-orders and this is just the beginning.

          There is a prime minister, a number of top officials and governors. I even know who will order for sure (so as Putin had) smile And Gurbanguly will really hit his face in the mud?

          Embraer and Bombardier - one of the leaders in civil aviation?

          https://dcenter.hse.ru/data/2018/11/19/1141804200/

          Market% 20 products% 20 civilian% 20 aircraft construction% 202018.pdf
          Top ten in terms of income.

          If so .. yes, let the ambition be immeasurable yes

          Of course, at our expense smile

          Come on laughing Well then our president has no ambitions to fly business jets winked

          So he has. IL-96.
        31. The comment was deleted.
        32. 123 Offline
          123 (123) 17 September 2020 11: 18
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          Reasons to believe that Intel is planning to conduct sabotage in civilian life?
          For the military, I don't argue. Although there will be a gold chip for the price, it is not critical here.

          Do you think the fears are unfounded and the good name of the company is a guarantee? Intel may not have conceived, other organizations like the NSA are engaged in this and they have access to the entire volume of information and the production process of American companies.

          https://lukatsky.blogspot.com/2016/06/intel.html

          MC21 was originally planned for PW engines. Translated into Russian. Was 334 impossible?

          It was not only planned, it flies on them. Buyers will be offered a choice of two engines.
          It was not possible to do this with the Tu-334, there was simply no engine.

          Not all is well with SSJ. The reliability is not up to par, the entry to the foreign market was not particularly successful. (Compounded by problems with the supply of spare parts, and who needs problems?)

          Not everything is going smoothly with SSJ. In fact, this is the first "trial balloon" in the restoration of the civil aircraft industry. Don't worry everything will be fine. Take the time, watch the video (there is a whole series), the guy made a very detailed analysis without any propaganda. Very informative good



          There is a prime minister, a number of top officials and governors. I even know who will order exactly (so that Putin has it) Will Gurbanguly really hit his face in the mud?

          Are you claiming that all 600 pre-orders are from officials? There will be facts or wet dreams again ... winked
          Would you like to ride Zelensky or Guaido on Aures? Look at what Kim skates, that the Germans are not trying to strangle themselves out of shame request

          Embraer and Bombardier - one of the leaders in civil aviation?

          Top ten in terms of income.

          I am very happy for them and I have no doubt that they are one of the leaders, the question was rhetorical. Let me explain. After the collapse of the Soviet aircraft industry, the market was divided by Boeing and Airbus, all other more or less large manufacturers fit the definition, "one of the leaders" and "are in the top ten." Moreover, these are practically branches of American companies. The dependence on the USA is total, it is practically an assembly shop of American spare parts. Do Embraer and Bombardier have their own engines?
          There are not many premium car manufacturers either, and the situation is comparable. I will not delve into the statistics, the sale of Aurus is just beginning, but it is probably also in the top ten.

          This does not allow us to understand the reasons and answer the question - why the Brazilians, Canadians and Swiss do not produce cars of this class, but the first two produce business jets. By analogy with Gurbanguly, I can suppose in response that such airplanes are used by all kinds of swindlers and drug dealers. It turns out that they are mentally close to the leadership of Canada and Brazil?

          Of course, at our expense

          Well, of course sad And business jets Embraer and Bombardier are building at the expense of poor Canadians and Brazilians. I'm afraid to even think about Boeing winked
          I suppose you are exaggerating the amount on your account, it is hardly possible for this money to start the production of a car.

          So he has. IL-96.

          He has a whole fleet (squadron), ranging from helicopters. I meant that if the ambitions of the president for a new limousine allowed the creation of a new modern production of a whole line of cars, I'm all for it. good Brazilians are out of luck with ambition.
        33. Alexey Sergeev Offline
          Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 17 September 2020 11: 57
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          And business jets Embraer and Bombardier are built at the expense of poor Canadians and Brazilians.

          No, at the expense of customers' money, most of them are private.

          The dependence on the USA is total, it is practically an assembly shop of American spare parts. Do Embraer and Bombardier have their own engines?

          There are no engines, but there is a global market and the ability to choose the one you want.
          An example with MS-21. After all, the PW1000G was chosen for availability (including service, parts) and high performance.

          It was not possible to do this with the Tu-334, there was simply no engine.

          There were no engines in the early 00s? Didn't they want to sell them to us? And you can always find an analogue.
          There was a somewhat outdated layout, in the style of the Tu-134, yes.

          Would you like to ride Zelensky or Guaido on Aures?

          Zelensky - as an option, Lukashenka can smile
          Guaido is far away and uninteresting.

          Intel may not have conceived, other organizations like the NSA are engaged in this and they have access to the entire volume of information and the production process of American companies.

          Well, yes, the NSA is preparing to turn off the lights and hack our personal archive with a photo of a friend in a negligee. smile This is from the category of fear of "seeing the brain" and wearing foil hats.
          They can get access by court order, but not by phone call.
          I am more afraid of our own, special services in terms of access to personal data. Let me explain: the market for selling this data is doing well, and guess who is feeding it? - Enterprising servicemen.

          https://lukatsky.blogspot.com/2016/06/intel.html

          The fabrications of a conspiracy blogger, without any serious links.
        34. 123 Offline
          123 (123) 17 September 2020 12: 28
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          No, at the expense of customers' money, most of them are private.

          Will Aurus be sold exclusively to the state?
          Are you not satisfied with the form of ownership? I understand correctly?

          There are no engines, but there is a global market and the ability to choose the one you want.
          An example with MS-21. After all, the PW1000G was chosen for availability (including service, parts) and high performance.

          The PW1000G was chosen due to the lack of its counterpart. The characteristics of the PD-14 are not worse. The buyer himself will choose what suits him. What do you want? To close the production and "integrate" into the market as the owner says? The global market is a myth, it is being segmented right now. Iran can buy planes on the global market? By the way, he will not be able to sell the MS-21 with the PW1000G because the states will not allow it.

          There were no engines in the early 00s? Didn't they want to sell them to us? And you can always find an analogue.

          See the paragraph above. In the 00s, the state of the economy simply did not allow making competitive aircraft. Everything was destroyed in the 90s.

          Zelensky - as an option, Lukashenka can
          Guaido is far away and uninteresting.

          A paddy wagon is more suitable for both.

          Well, yes, the NSA is preparing to turn off the light for us and hack into the personal archive with a photo of a friend in a negligee. This is from the category of fear of "seeing the brain" and wearing foil hats.
          They can get access by court order, but not by phone call.

          Tell Venezuelans this to those left without electricity or Iranians with exploded centrifuges. you will not believe in black transplantologists until your kidney is cut out personally. The West is good, honest and noble right? So what do you think?

          I am more afraid of our own, special services in terms of access to personal data. Let me explain: the market for selling this data is doing well, and guess who is feeding it? - Enterprising servicemen.

          So go to your friend, enjoy, do not suffer.
        35. Alexey Sergeev Offline
          Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 17 September 2020 12: 55
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          Iran can buy planes on the global market?

          Forgot to mention the DPRK. smile Iran is a country of victorious fundamentalists supporting terrorism.
          What do you compare the Russian Federation with such a guano?

          A paddy wagon is more suitable for both.

          Zelensky for what? President-elect .. And who will arrest him? Military commandant?

          want to? To close the production and "integrate" into the market as the owner says?

          Talk nonsense and try to ascribe to me (a hackneyed trick).
          Engine building (aviation) is one of the areas that you can focus on.

          So go to your friend, enjoy, do not suffer.

          Again demagoguery. Is there anything to say about the essence of the problem?
          There is a market for personal data, specialists replenish it. And my or your ill-wisher has the opportunity to get them. And the specialists .. they just want to earn extra money ..

          you will not believe in black transplantologists until your kidney is cut out personally.

          I'm not inclined to believe in anything at all. The Reptilians, the World Conspiracy ..
        36. 123 Offline
          123 (123) 17 September 2020 14: 08
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          North Korea forgot to mention Iran - the country of the victorious fundamentalists, supporting terrorism.

          And the United States is a country of victorious militarism that supports terrorism. Find the differences.

          What do you compare the Russian Federation with such a guano?

          US guano no less. And for them all countries are second class.
          I do not compare Russia with Iran. I'm talking about the global market.

          Global - Covering the entire globe, worldwide; complete, comprehensive.

          As you can see, this term is not appropriate. And it's not just Iran or the DPRK, examples can be found besides Cuba, Venezuela and Syria. Together with Iran and the DPRK, the United States also included Russia and China in the "axis of evil".
          We can talk about a significant segment. And we have a choice, to integrate into it on someone else's terms (like Ukraine) or create our own segment.

          Zelensky for what? President-elect .. And who will arrest him? Military commandant?

          I'm not interested in this clown, we go aside from the topic. Yanukovych was also an elected president.

          Talk nonsense and try to ascribe to me (a hackneyed trick).
          Engine building (aviation) is one of the areas that you can focus on.

          If possible, clarify which industries you consider necessary to develop and how to deal with others.

          There is a market for personal data, specialists replenish it. And my or your ill-wisher has the opportunity to get them. And the specialists .. they just want to earn extra money ..

          This risk exists and not only with us. Does this cancel the bookmark problem?

          I'm not inclined to believe in anything at all. The Reptilians, the World Conspiracy ..

          Well, you believe in a free global market and in the honesty of the West (that they will not refuse to sell anything), you are only one step away from the Reptilians.
        37. Alexey Sergeev Offline
          Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 17 September 2020 15: 49
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          Find the differences.

          US guano no less.

          Let's compare the contribution of the USA and Iran to the development of the modern world? By technology, scientists? Just to say ...

          country of victorious militarism

          You can tell right away - world imperialism (or plutocracy), which our advanced communist system will bury (modern ideological attitudes are not far from the Soviet ones) smile

          Together with Iran and the DPRK, the United States also included Russia and China in the "axis of evil".

          Not even close. Consider, I have a prejudiced attitude towards Islamists.

          And we have a choice, to integrate into it on someone else's terms (like Ukraine) or create our own segment.

          Authorship will not work. There won't be enough people, industrial opportunities. Isolation will lead to stagnation.

          If possible, clarify which industries you consider necessary to develop and how to deal with others.

          In which there is a competitive groundwork. And most should pay for themselves.
          Obviously, there is no point in supporting the production of Lysva plates (if it survives, it survives) smile

          Yanukovych was also an elected president.

          Do you prefer embezzlers or oligarchs to honest comedians? smile
        38. 123 Offline
          123 (123) 17 September 2020 16: 33
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          Let's compare the contribution of the USA and Iran to the development of the modern world? By technology, scientists?
          Just to say ...

          Let's compare. Mesopotamia ... Remember that word? Writing in the III millennium BC. The USA is younger than the Bolshoi Theater, their whole history is slavery, extermination of the indigenous population, endless wars. If I'm not mistaken, Trump is the only president who hasn't unleashed a new war. However, he still has time. Do you want to measure everything by technology and scientists? Are you a scientist? What technologies have you come up with? What is not? It turns out you are guano ..... and who is interested in your opinion? How do you like this turn? sad

          You can tell right away - world imperialism (or plutocracy), which our advanced communist system will bury (modern ideological attitudes are not far from the Soviet

          I do not know who and what will bury me, I will not be classified as a communist. Don't like the definition of imperialism? Here's a definition for you ... Tell me what I'm wrong about? winked

          The highest stage of capitalism, characterized by the dominance of large monopolies, the struggle between large capitalist countries for sources of raw materials and sales markets, for foreign territories and the exploitation of other peoples, which leads to aggressive wars for a new redivision of the world.

          I understand that a liberal is offended when the "beacon of democracy" is called by its proper name, but why Iran is worse than the United States in this respect is absolutely not clear.
          By the way, how about supporting terrorism? There is nothing to object?

          Not even close.

          How is it not? belay It is these four countries (Russia, China, North Korea, Iran) that are enshrined at the legislative level as opponents of the United States. Didn't you know this or are you just lying? smile

          Consider, I have a prejudiced attitude towards Islamists.

          I noticed this yes however, to the imperialists, it is also far from being objective.

          Authorship will not work. There won't be enough people, industrial opportunities. Isolation will lead to stagnation.

          Autocria and getting rid of critical addiction are not the same thing. They are trying to isolate us, but fortunately they have a problem with the tape.

          In which there is a competitive groundwork. And most should pay for themselves.
          Obviously, there is no point in supporting the production of Lysva plates (if it survives, it survives)

          So you don't have an answer? Competitive groundwork ...... Until recently, there was no such groundwork in agriculture and gnawed on Canadian grain or "bush legs". Is the production of Lysva plates such an industry in your opinion? laughing

          Do you prefer embezzlers or oligarchs to honest comedians?

          Don't juggle. Where did I say that Yanukovych is better than Zelensky? But you probably prefer any nonentity at the helm in the state, if it suits the overseas owners?
        39. Alexey Sergeev Offline
          Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 17 September 2020 20: 02
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          But you probably prefer any nonentity at the helm in the state, if it suits the overseas owners?

          I do not care. Whoever was chosen was chosen. But better than Poroshenko, IMHO.

          Until recently, there was no such backlog in agriculture and gnawed on Canadian grain or "bush legs".

          The production of food and high-tech products is not the same thing. In addition, dependence on sowing grain and pedigree livestock remains.

          They are trying to isolate us, but fortunately they have a problem with the tape.

          Honestly, we didn't seriously try. And good. Even from the fact that the pace of development has significantly decreased (who would not say that this is only for the benefit). And the personal ban on the departure of a number of officials and the blocking of accounts (which should be the subject of internal proceedings) does not affect me or you in any way.

          Let's compare. Mesopotamia ... Remember that word? Writing in the III millennium BC. The USA is younger than the Bolshoi Theater, their whole history is slavery, extermination of the indigenous population, endless wars.

          Independently there was Egypt, then Greece and Rome, which achieved much greater success.
          Let me tell you a secret: throughout history, people have thought of recording information in many places.
          It's about the history of the last 150 years.
          Let's compare the number of Nobel laureates. How are the ancient Persians? Or the Egyptians, maybe? And the Romans?
          Examples: Alexander Fleming discovered penicillin in 1928. And the USA supplied us with almost 100% of penicillin during the Second World War. The benefits are obvious. How did Iran help? No way. Pawn, former Turkish province.
          Slavery .. We remember when serfdom was abolished in our country and how many Russians were slaves (compare the percentage).
          About the local population: merchants very successfully drunk the local population. Which did not call the colonialists. It is clear that the times were different.

          By the way, how about supporting terrorism? There is nothing to object?

          What do you have about supporting US terrorism? Most interesting.
        40. 123 Offline
          123 (123) 17 September 2020 20: 52
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          The production of food and high-tech products is not the same thing. In addition, dependence on sowing grain and pedigree livestock remains.

          Quite right as long as it remains. But this has not happened recently. By the way, why doesn't the EU stop dating its agriculture and focus on disruptive high-tech industries?

          Honestly, we didn't seriously try. And good. Even from the fact that the pace of development has significantly decreased (who would not say that this is only for the benefit).

          Nothing wrong. It's like a vaccine. Temporary malaise, it will be easier further. Does Germany have a higher development rate? Or, for comparison, would you prefer to choose someone from their "herd of comrades" in terms of sanctioning pressure, whose indicators are more or less?

          And the personal ban on the departure of a number of officials and the blocking of accounts (which should be the subject of internal proceedings) does not affect me or you in any way.

          Don't make me the defenders of officials. I don't care about them. I spoke specifically about the economy, bans on the sale of Russia.

          Independently there was Egypt, then Greece and Rome, which achieved much greater success.
          Let me tell you a secret: throughout history, people have thought of recording information in many places.

          If you thought it was a secret, then my condolences. hi If anything abroad, the United States also exists. Do you consider them the navel of the earth?

          It's about the history of the last 150 years.

          Why not for a quarter? belay

          Let's compare the number of Nobel laureates. How are the ancient Persians? Or the Egyptians, maybe? And the Romans?

          Do not make me laugh laughing Apparently it's my turn to reveal secrets .... You see ... the fact is that the Nobel is somewhat younger than the Persian or Egyptian civilization, and the prize itself has been awarded since 1901. What it has become is a separate question. On this get-together, the award is given to just anyone. Mr. Obama turned out to be a peacemaker in advance, Alexievich turned out to be a genius writer. Looks like Trump's turn winked Are you going to measure the culture of ancient civilization with prizes? How many awards do you have? And what do you even know about this country? I doubt that you can even read their numbers or name the year according to the calendar.

          Examples: Alexander Fleming discovered penicillin in 1928. And the USA supplied us with almost 100% of penicillin during the Second World War. The benefits are obvious. How did Iran help? No way. Pawn, former Turkish province.

          Oh yes, these humanists kept technology secret and profited from the death of people. But the medicine could save millions of lives. Back in 1943, they broke off to supply equipment for its production and did this only after the war. And a little earlier, in 1918, they shot civilians in Arkhangelsk. These are the helpers of this former English colony.

          Slavery .. We remember when serfdom was abolished in our country and how many Russians were slaves (compare the percentage).

          Slavery and serfdom were still somewhat different. Mississippi ratified the abolition of slavery amendment in 2013.

          About the local population: merchants very successfully drunk the local population. Which did not call the colonialists. It is clear that the times were different.

          Soldering and scalping or infecting with smallpox are still somewhat different things. In addition, the local population has problems with alcohol. The body is not fit. Such is the feature. Surely the insidious merchants knew this, because their knowledge in medicine was at their best laughing

          What do you have about supporting US terrorism? Most interesting.

          You started talking about Iran's support for terrorism, and your first word hi
        41. Alexey Sergeev Offline
          Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 18 September 2020 03: 39
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          Slavery and serfdom were still somewhat different. Mississippi ratified the abolition of slavery amendment in 2013.

          True, they differed, mainly in name. You can be killed, sold. Separated from the family. But there is a tiny farm. Ask for sales announcements in newspapers from the 1st half of the 19th century. Enough in the style “I will sell a thoroughbred bitch and a girl Agafya. Knows how to cook. "
          So this is the difference:
          Before the abolition of serfdom (1859), the share of serfs was 35%.
          In the USA in 1860, the proportion of slaves was 13%. If we take only the southern States (where half of the population lived) - 26%.
          So we're not better. With the amendment that there are foreigners brought there, and here - their own, Russian, Orthodox. Nekrasov had something about “how a horse brought a Slavic slave to the market”. Classic.

          Surely the insidious merchants knew this, because their knowledge in medicine was at the height of laughing

          They knew that Asians get drunk very easily and quickly. There is enough observation here. By the way, ours also managed to grapple with the Eskimos. If not for the huge distances for the 19th century, a punitive expedition would have been carried out with them (they cut out one of the forts).

          But the medicine could save millions of lives.

          The penicillin supplied and helped save millions.

          Mr. Obama turned out to be a peacemaker in advance, Alexievich turned out to be a genius writer. Looks like Trump's turn

          I don't take literature and the world seriously.
          Let's take the serious guys - physicists. Open the list and see how many there are.
          And not a single Iranian. (Again, unsurprisingly - a recent backward province of Turkey.)

          About Iran's support for terrorism, you started, you and the first word hi

          So there is nothing to say ..
          About Iran - support for terrorist Hezbollah, Hamas, statements of readiness to destroy Israel and Jews. The main tool in this is the IRGC (a kind of Islamist SS), which controls part of the economy.
        42. 123 Offline
          123 (123) 18 September 2020 17: 43
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          True, they differed, mainly in name. You can be killed, sold. Separated from the family. But there is a tiny farm. Ask for sales announcements in newspapers from the 1st half of the 19th century. Enough in the style “I will sell a thoroughbred bitch and a girl Agafya. Knows how to cook. "

          You can just look at the photo. If you don't know, they appeared a little later.



          Before the abolition of serfdom (1859), the share of serfs was 35%.
          In the USA in 1860, the proportion of slaves was 13%. If we take only the southern States (where half of the population lived) - 26%.

          Do you judge such phenomena by interest? I wonder how much of a scoundrel you are? How to count, do not tell me? By the way, how were the Indians doing there? Who were they considered? Those driven into slavery by the steppe inhabitants were not particularly happy about this turn of events, apparently there was a difference.

          So we're not better. With the amendment that there are foreigners brought there, and here - their own, Russian, Orthodox. Nekrasov had something about “how a horse brought a Slavic slave to the market”. Classic.

          And England had its own Protestants. The fact is that by that time slavery had been abolished from them, but the dregs of society who fled to the colonies revived this "glorious" tradition.
          You may not be better, we are definitely better, it is not for you to determine. You take on a lot.

          I don't take literature and the world seriously.
          Let's take the serious guys - physicists. Open the list and see how many there are.
          And not a single Iranian. (Again, unsurprisingly - a recent backward province of Turkey.)

          Obama received a literature award? belay The prize for a get-together and 150 years for civilization is not an age. Everyone has their ups and downs. The states are still ahead. Are you trying to conclude on this basis that the Iranians are inferior?

          So there is nothing to say ..
          About Iran - support for terrorist Hezbollah, Hamas, statements of readiness to destroy Israel and Jews. The main tool in this is the IRGC (a kind of Islamist SS), which controls part of the economy.

          The United States destroyed Yugoslavia, Libya, the list is endless. Supported by ISIS, the Taliban and other abominations. The new tool - the army, the Pentagon, is officially recognized as terrorist organizations after the assassination of an Iranian official (Suleimani) in Iraqi territory.

          Are you going to jump from topic to topic when arguments end? In general, they started with the fleet, they have already walked across the Crimea, smartphones, slavery, what's next? Neanderthals? Maybe it's enough to play around?
        43. Alexey Sergeev Offline
          Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 19 September 2020 13: 48
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          Obama received a literature award? belay

          We read carefully:

          I don't take literature and the world seriously.

          The prize for a get-together and 150 years for civilization is not an age. Everyone has their ups and downs.

          A get-together in which scientists from all over the world want to take a place. And the countries where they work are proud of them. Here, for example. What "luminaries" are proud of in Iran? Oh, they have different priorities.

          You may not be better, we are definitely better, it is not for you to determine. You take on a lot.

          It will not be possible to divide - the story is common. And the ancestors of most of the fellow citizens were white-white slaves. Not by exploited workers, but by slaves.

          Supported by ISIS, the Taliban and other abominations.

          Testimonials? (Not far-fetched. And then Zakharova already said in an interview that the president of the United States received bin Laden).
          What about this:

          https://www.interfax.ru/amp/676440

          The Pentagon is officially recognized as terrorist organizations after the assassination of an Iranian official (Soleimani) in Iraq.

          Remind by whom? UN?
          According to Soleimani: what did he do on the territory of Iraq, illegally crossing the border? And he was the head of the IRGC. Like Himmler and the SS.
          Our many former Chechen field commanders have been eliminated abroad.
        44. 123 Offline
          123 (123) 19 September 2020 14: 52
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          A get-together in which scientists from all over the world want to take a place. And the countries where they work are proud of them. Here, for example. What "luminaries" are proud of in Iran? Oh, they have different priorities.

          What do you know about their priorities and their history? Can you at least read their numbers?

          It will not be possible to divide - the story is common. And the ancestors of most of the fellow citizens were white-white slaves. Not by exploited workers, but by slaves.

          What a strange story you have. There were serfs, I don't remember slaves. Mine as far as I know from the Cossacks. And who are you to speak for everyone? sad

          Testimonials? (Not far-fetched. And then Zakharova already said in an interview that the president of the United States received bin Laden).

          What did you not accept? smile

          What about this:

          Yes, they organized negotiations, to remind how Chernomyrdin negotiated with Basayev? What does it change? Are they no longer terrorists?

          Remind by whom? UN?

          You are outrageously ignorant. There is no single UN list. Despite repeated Russian initiatives

          Deputy Speaker of the State Duma Sergei Neverov (United Russia) called on the UN to follow the example of the CSTO, which creates a single list of terrorist organizations

          https://regnum.ru/news/polit/2525877.html

          So far, each country has its own list.

          https://ru.qwe.wiki/wiki/List_of_designated_terrorist_groups

          The UN called for American "wards" to be included in the lists

          https://news.un.org/ru/story/2017/07/1308311

          According to Soleimani: what did he do on the territory of Iraq, illegally crossing the border? And he was the head of the IRGC. Like Himmler and the SS.

          I flew on a visit to a neighboring independent (formally), in fact, occupied state. What are the Americans doing there? Who allowed them to shell the airport.

          Do you have to stutter on the SS? Surely you had not only slaves in the past, but also policemen. If there is any SS, it is the Americans. They officially allowed torture, all the unfinished Nazis were sitting out with them. They and Ukraine also vote against the resolutions countering the glorification of Nazism.
          Since you are defending them in this regard, it means that you are a fascist henchman.

          Our many former Chechen field commanders have been eliminated abroad.

          Bring facts and evidence, not far-fetched wink
  9. Alexey Sergeev Offline
    Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 17 September 2020 09: 26
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    http://www.amico.ru/production/tomograph/mrt_amiko450

    Aren't you confused by the 450 numbers in the title? And they just mean the magnetic intensity - 0,45 T. Open type tomograph.
    Unlike "closed" Siemens
  10. 123 Offline
    123 (123) 17 September 2020 11: 28
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    Look at the comment below, I wrote yesterday that I was mistaken, I left the wrong link. There is an RTI FullScan Russian MRPT with a field of 1,5 T. by the way, manufacturers write that:

    Is a low-noise tomograph with 1000 times less noise than competitors. This important property makes scanning tomograms comfortable for the patient.

    http://mrt.lebedev.ru/rti-fullscan/

    In general, MRI is used differently, not everyone is "picking their brains", for example, the joint was shone through to me and I am not alone. For such purposes, such "monsters" are redundant. Yes, foreign analogues have taken over the market, but our production is developing. What does not suit you? propose to stop and buy everything abroad?
  11. Alexey Sergeev Offline
    Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 17 September 2020 11: 34
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    What does not suit you? propose to stop and buy everything abroad?

    The question is about profitability. So that such production does not sit on subsidies.
    It is highly unlikely that Siemens will refuse to sell us medical equipment. For this, I don’t know, we need to start a war with the FRG, which is not beneficial to anyone.

    not everyone is "picking their brains"

    The base of the market is now 1,5 T, but more generality is needed for detailed research.

    Is a low-noise tomograph with 1000 times less noise than competitors.

    This is an insignificant criterion. I was examined several times and did not experience any discomfort. Precision is needed above all.
  12. 123 Offline
    123 (123) 17 September 2020 11: 52
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    The question is about profitability. So that such production does not sit on subsidies.
    It is highly unlikely that Siemens will refuse to sell us medical equipment. For this, I don’t know, we need to start a war with the FRG, which is not beneficial to anyone.

    What are you saying laughing Is your saint in the "market will solve" unshakable? And you tell me about "ideological prisms"? belay Germany did not impose sanctions? Remind turbines in Crimea? Right now, they can abandon the Nord Stream. But "THIS OTHER" is true? They will definitely not refuse to sell tomographs laughing are you naive to the extreme or ... winked

    The base of the market is now 1,5 T, but more generality is needed for detailed research.

    I gave you a link specifically to the Russian MRI with a capacity of 1,5 Tesla. After all, write it yourself "the basis of the market." You need a lot of power, so it will be, everything will take time. If they do not have their own, they take imported ones, along the way develop their own samples.
    I still don't understand what you want? Closing production?
  13. Alexey Sergeev Offline
    Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 17 September 2020 16: 11
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    Germany did not impose sanctions? Remind turbines in Crimea?

    Crimea is Crimea. Our honorable burden on the budget. But they showed everyone. And spoiled relations for decades with a neighbor (otherwise there would already be a springboard for the capture of us by the United States belay ). After all, they sleep and see what a great war to kill millions of their citizens ...
    In Yaroslavl or Novosibirsk it will not be difficult to buy, install and maintain Siemens turbines.

    Right now, they can abandon the Nord Stream.

    Stream into many political projects. This is how it is viewed.
    Unlike tomographs and Sapsans.

    Is your saint in the "market will decide" unshakable?

    You don't need to spoil the relationship.
    But I am sure that in order to ban the supply of medical equipment, we need to start a war with Germany.
  14. 123 Offline
    123 (123) 17 September 2020 16: 52
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    Crimea is Crimea. Our honorable burden on the budget. But they showed everyone. And spoiled the relationship for decades with a neighbor.

    You are a burden on the budget. negative Crimeans are our people and no worse than you. I do not like? Bring down to Zelensky. The neighbor ruined the relationship himself. We will not have friendship with the Nazis. Are you justifying Germany's supporting Ukronazis? Yes, you are a renegade dear friend. Everyone will tell us how to live. Let the occupied GDR be liberated first.

    (otherwise there would already be a springboard for the capture of us by the United States. They are asleep and see in what a great war to ditch millions of their citizens ...

    No, they grow chamomile fields around the perimeter of our borders. lol Do you understand what you are talking about? fool

    In Yaroslavl or Novosibirsk it will not be difficult to buy, install and maintain Siemens turbines.

    In Yaroslavl or Novosibirsk it will not be difficult to buy, install and maintain Russian turbines. Siemens will still be lucky if he is allowed to build a plant here and transfer technology. In general, you need to drive them vzasha. They are not reliable partners.

    Stream into many political projects. This is how it is viewed.
    Unlike tomographs and Sapsans.

    Do not play around, politics and economics are closely intertwined. The sanctions are not limited to turbines alone. Today they view tomorrow differently. Who knows what will come into their heads tomorrow?

    You don't need to spoil the relationship.

    Go to them and tell them. They supported the coup in the country, brought the anti-Russian regime to power. What are your claims to us? All Russia's actions were forced and reciprocal.

    But I am sure that in order to ban the supply of medical equipment, we need to start a war with Germany.

    I'm very happy for you. Holy naivete laughing The Germans are rapidly losing their reputation as a reliable partner. What to guess, banned not banned. Why do we need this chamomile? They do their own, the rest is the problem of the Germans.
  15. Alexey Sergeev Offline
    Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 17 September 2020 20: 28
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    We will not have friendship with the Nazis.

    The consequences of brainwashing since 2014 ... Believe it or not, it worked on me at first.
    The question is: what percentage of nationalists are in the parliament? How many did the Ukrainians support? (5% in 2014, now 0%) These are marginals, as they should be.
    Which party does Zelensky represent? (The right sector probably? smile )

    Let the occupied GDR be liberated first.

    That's because what's in your head belay Remind how the GDR came into existence and existed? And how many citizens of the latter were against the unification? Probably thousands of demonstrations? smile

    Siemens will still be lucky if he is allowed to build a plant from us to transfer technology.

    Siemens is not cold from this, we have a small market, in comparison with the EU.

    In general, you need to drive them vzasha. They are not reliable partners.

    There are sanctions adopted by the US and the EU. Siemens is subject to EU acts. And he's afraid of losing huge profits in the US.
    Look: it was possible to offer this firm to compensate for losses over the next few years, say, in the amount of $ 10-20 billion. But that they put turbines in Crimea. Would that be justified? No. Madness pays. So much money for turbines.
    Equally insane would be the supply of turbines for such negative income.
    Put yourself in the shoes of the company, what would you do?

    They supported the coup in the country, brought the anti-Russian regime to power. What are your claims to us? All Russia's actions were forced and reciprocal.

    The support was more moral.
    Forced and reciprocal? Sounds like an excuse. Made a cesspool in the South-East. How many refugees are there in all directions? About Crimea: either our people were not there, or they were.
    Interestingly, the Kaliningrad region can vote for joining the FRG? Or, for this, there must first be Bundeswehr soldiers at every corner?
    (Analogy)

    The Germans are rapidly losing their reputation as a reliable partner. What to guess, banned not banned. Why do we need this chamomile? They do their own, the rest is the problem of the Germans.

    They make their own, but they buy the Germans.
  16. 123 Offline
    123 (123) 17 September 2020 21: 22
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    The consequences of brainwashing since 2014 ... Believe it or not, it worked on me at first.
    The question is: what percentage of nationalists are in the parliament? How many did the Ukrainians support? (5% in 2014, now 0%) These are marginals, as they should be.
    Which party does Zelensky represent? (The right sector probably?)

    Why do they exist there at all and are not persecuted? Those 5% just wipe their feet on this clown.

    That’s what’s in your head. Remind me how the GDR came into existence and existed? And how many citizens of the latter were against the unification? Probably thousands of demonstrations?

    Does this approach shock you? Then figure it out in your head first. How many Crimean residents were against the unification? They did not support the coup and legally had the right to withdraw from Ukraine.

    Siemens is not cold from this, we have a small market, in comparison with the EU.

    This is what you say out of ignorance. The fact is that the service life of the turbines is about 40 years and there are practically no orders on the same EU market. And we are just planning a large-scale update. The entire market is now in Russia. Siemens is ready for 100% localization and technology transfer. By the way, the Americans also want to participate.

    There are sanctions adopted by the US and the EU. Siemens is subject to EU acts. And he's afraid of losing huge profits in the US.

    So let him bring down to work in the USA.

    Look: it was possible to offer this firm to compensate for losses over the next few years, say, in the amount of $ 10-20 billion. But that they put turbines in Crimea. Would that be justified? No. Madness pays. So much money for turbines.
    Equally insane would be the supply of turbines for such negative income.
    Put yourself in the shoes of the company, what would you do?

    Why should I take their place? They drove themselves there. Let them do it.

    The support was more moral.

    Rather immoral. They organized and supported the coup, dragged the country into a civil war.

    Forced and reciprocal? Sounds like an excuse. Made a cesspool in the South-East.

    Did we make the cloaca? It's a pity for communication on the Internet, I would argue with pleasure. People lived quietly for themselves, they did not order a coup, they did not invite Nazi punishers to themselves, they did not ask to translate everything into Ukrainian.

    How many refugees are there in all directions?

    Believe it or not, they still shoot there. If you are constantly bombarded, you will inevitably become a refugee. By the way, people are fleeing from all over Ukraine.

    About Crimea: either our people were not there, or they were.

    What's this? Did I tell you something like that? If you please be articulate.

    Interestingly, the Kaliningrad region can vote for joining the FRG? Or, for this, there must first be Bundeswehr soldiers at every corner?
    (Analogy)

    The analogy is not a good one. According to our legislation, this is impossible and I doubt that they would have voted that way. Crimea had the right to do so; from a legal point of view, everything was done flawlessly. As for the army ... the Ukrainian army was there, they also do not mind. On average, 80% of the siloviki (army, police and others) changed their shoulder straps and stayed on to serve.

    They make their own, but they buy the Germans.

    They buy what they don't produce themselves. What does not suit you in this? you have to buy everything and not produce anything?
  17. Alexey Sergeev Offline
    Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 18 September 2020 06: 54
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    Why do they exist there at all and are not persecuted? Those 5% just wipe their feet on this clown.

    Why have we had “Russian marches” for a long time?
    5% were in 2014, and not the Right Sector, but Lyashko's "Radical Party" (Google to help me smile ). What could they have with a meager composition? Have a discussion?
    And why in "Nazi-captured Ukraine" (as we then shouted from every iron), 5% of nationalists in the parliament of one convocation, and not 50%? In the year of the victorious Maidan? Obviously, the citizens had their own opinion on this matter?
    Now in the parliament there are 0 seats for nationalists, how then do they wipe their feet on Zelensky? belay

    So let him bring down to work in the USA.

    And so they do. Only around the world. And the US makes more money, not just from turbines alone. Business. (I suggested earlier to evaluate the idea of ​​compensating them for all the losses.)

    What's this? Did I tell you something like that? If you please be articulate.

    When Putin first said that there were militias on the streets (in military uniform, well equipped and without insignia), six months or a year later - "yes, they were our fighters."
    I am sure the presence of these people influenced the voting deputies. As well as the fact that some of them were not allowed to vote.

    As for the army ... the Ukrainian army was there, they also do not mind. On average, 80% of the siloviki (army, police and others) changed their shoulder straps and stayed on to serve.

    But in case anyone remembers the oath, the military units were blocked by our troops. It is good to have in your ranks people who are ready to easily change shoulder straps good

    They buy what they don't produce themselves. What does not suit you in this? you have to buy everything and not produce anything?

    I mean that you won't be able to produce everything yourself.
  18. 123 Offline
    123 (123) 18 September 2020 18: 06
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    Why have we had “Russian marches” for a long time?

    The key word went. We also have Nazis, but they are fighting against this. in Ukraine they feel at ease.

    5% were in 2014, and not the Right Sector, but Lyashko's "Radical Party" (Google will help me). What could they have with a meager composition? Have a discussion?
    And why in "Nazi-captured Ukraine" (as we then shouted from every iron), 5% of nationalists in the parliament of one convocation, and not 50%? In the year of the victorious Maidan? Obviously, the citizens had their own opinion on this matter?
    Now in the parliament there are 0 seats for nationalists, how then do they wipe their feet on Zelensky?

    This is how they visit Zelensky



    And this is how they discuss. I wish you to participate in such a discussion.



    And so they do. Only around the world. And the US makes more money, not just from turbines alone. Business. (I suggested earlier to evaluate the idea of ​​compensating them for all the losses.)

    Well, let them bring down wherever they want. Want to compensate out of your own pocket. There are many of you who want to distribute money to just anyone. If the Germans do not have sovereignty, this is a problem from the slaves.

    When Putin first said that there were militias on the streets (in military uniform, well equipped and without insignia), six months or a year later - "yes, they were our fighters."
    I am sure the presence of these people influenced the voting deputies. As well as the fact that some of them were not allowed to vote.

    Give it up already. During the events, they do not tell the whole truth, these are elements of an information war. What specifically does not suit you about Crimea? What deputies are missing? Let's first deal with the Maidan. It all started from there. Was it all fair and legally there?

    But in case anyone remembers the oath, the military units were blocked by our troops.

    And they did the right thing, you never know who would come up with something. There were no less Ukrainian troops in Crimea than Russian ones, the result is known.

    It is good to have in your ranks people who are ready to easily change shoulder straps

    It is wonderful to have in our ranks people who did not support the Nazis, they did not order a coup, Turchinov was not recognized as commander-in-chief. These people are much better than those who are ready to serve the new puppet regime.

    I mean that you won't be able to produce everything yourself.

    Nobody on the planet can produce everything, including the Chinese. What's next? Where are you leading?
  19. Alexey Sergeev Offline
    Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 19 September 2020 13: 59
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    If the Germans do not have sovereignty, this is a problem from the slaves.

    An international company seeking to make a profit, not a loss. Which greatly outweighed.

    And this is how they discuss. I wish you to participate in such a discussion.

    We remember Zhirinovsky and co. There are enough clowns everywhere. Ours has aged, perhaps.

    Let's deal with the Maidan first. It all started from there. Was it all fair and legally there?

    How is it different from 2004? Maidan, Yushchenko's parish. Puppet regime, under-state? No, such words did not sound then and the relationship was maintained at the same level.
  20. 123 Offline
    123 (123) 19 September 2020 14: 59
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    An international company seeking to make a profit, not a loss. Which greatly outweighed.

    And figs with them. outweighed? So let them knock down where it is better for them. What more do you want?

    We remember Zhirinovsky and co. There are enough clowns everywhere. Ours has aged, perhaps.

    Do you want to be blunt? fool Show me how the Liberal Democratic Party of Russia shoots and kills people on buses with opponents on the highway? But you are ready to justify any abomination. The Nazis rule over Ukraine and this is a fact. Why are you harnessing them? Ideologically close? sad

    How is it different from 2004? Maidan, Yushchenko's parish. Puppet regime, under-state? No, such words did not sound then and the relationship was maintained at the same level.

    In 2004, the Nazis were not given power. People were not bombed with "air conditioners", buses with opponents were not shot, people were not burned in Odessa.
    Is this not essential for you? smile Can you honestly admit that you sympathize with them? winked
  21. 123 Offline
    123 (123) 16 September 2020 21: 26
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    He wrote almost on the run, left the wrong link on the MRI hi

    http://mrt.lebedev.ru/rti-fullscan/
  22. Alexey Sergeev Offline
    Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 17 September 2020 09: 31
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    Here is the “opponent”.

    https://cmtrade.ru/products/magnitno-rezonansnyj-tomograf-siemens-magnetom-skyra

    I was mistaken when talking about the maximum, it is 3T. There are 3 models.
    Brain MRI in 5 minutes (earlier models have about 20-25).
    Of course, we can say that why compare the industry giant with a young competitor breaking through .. However, in most centers there are Siemens.
  23. 123 Offline
    123 (123) 17 September 2020 11: 38
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    Here is the “opponent”.

    https://cmtrade.ru/products/magnitno-rezonansnyj-tomograf-siemens-magnetom-skyra

    I was mistaken when talking about the maximum, it is 3T. There are 3 models.
    MRI of the brain in 5 minutes (in earlier models, about 20-25)
    Of course, we can say that why compare the industry giant with a young competitor breaking through .. However, in most centers there are Siemens.

    Apparently you were wrong again when talking about the maximum smile I came across information about power up to 10Tl, although the Europeans are against it. The power is considered excessive and the effect on the human body has not been studied. I still don't understand the message. What do you want? What would you stop production and buy abroad? You yourself say "competitor" is young, he makes his way. Of course, they are imported, because they appeared earlier.
  24. Alexey Sergeev Offline
    Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 17 September 2020 09: 43
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    https://medvestnik.ru/content/articles/Nazad-v-budushee.html

    The share of Russian tomographs in the public procurement market:
    The number of foreign-made tomographs - 217 units 94,8%
    Number of Russian-made tomographs, among them: 12 pcs 5,2%
  25. Alexey Sergeev Offline
    Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 17 September 2020 09: 49
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    Tell Rosatom about smrtfonchiki.

    You shouldn't laugh, compare the profits of Rosatom and Samsung on sales of phones (I'm generally silent about Apple)
  26. 123 Offline
    123 (123) 17 September 2020 11: 41
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    You shouldn't laugh, compare the profits of Rosatom and Samsung on sales of phones (I'm generally silent about Apple)

    You shouldn't laugh. Compare sales of Rosatom and Samsung by sales of rectors (you can also with Apple). winked

    Do you still consider smartphones to be the pinnacle of technology, but all kinds of nuclear rectors are not among those?
  27. Alexey Sergeev Offline
    Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 17 September 2020 12: 05
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    The question here was about profits.
    Without reactors, most of the economy will live well (they are needed mainly in the defense industry, the share in world generation is not so large - 17,8%), and without electronics it will not.
    And the problem of waste disposal has not yet been resolved, which in the future will lead to a decrease in the share of nuclear power plants in generation.
  28. 123 Offline
    123 (123) 17 September 2020 12: 38
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    The question here was about profits.

    With a fright? belay The question was about high-tech production. I asked what do you think? Smartphones? You answered yes. That's where it all started.

    Without reactors, most of the economy will live well (they are needed mainly in the defense industry, the share in world generation is not so large - 17,8%), and without electronics it will not.

    Is nuclear energy needed only in the defense industry? belay Are you generally adequate?
    Without energy, where will you put the plug from the charge? I'm afraid to even imagine. Yes, nuclear power generates only part of the electricity, but smartphones have an alternative. You can call from regular phones, others from a PC.

    And the problem of waste disposal has not yet been resolved, which in the future will lead to a decrease in the share of nuclear power plants in generation.

    Has the problem of recycling electronics been solved? New generation reactors have been developed in Russia, waste is being converted into fuel.

    These rather strange thoughts of yours are an attempt to explain that nuclear technology is about nothing and smartphones are the pinnacle of technological progress?
  29. Alexey Sergeev Offline
    Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 17 September 2020 13: 05
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    I asked what do you think? Smartphones? You answered yes. That's where it all started.

    You asked a question and tried to answer for me (one more trick).
    I said that you should not speak disparagingly about their production and market revenues.

    These rather strange thoughts of yours are an attempt to explain that nuclear technology is about nothing and smartphones are the pinnacle of technological progress?

    Reactors have existed for more than half a century, and microelectronics will be newer. Yes, modern nuclear power plants are full of technologies, but the development of the old ones, of the 20th century.
    And then there are chips with a process less than 10 nm.

    Without energy, where will you stick the plug from the charge?

    Without nuclear power, it's easy. In my city, a CHP is on gas. And they can replace nuclear power plants.

    Has the problem of recycling electronics been solved?

    It is strange that you are comparing them knowing the disproportionate difference in danger.

    but smartphones have an alternative. You can call from regular phones, others from a PC.

    You can call from wired home and street phones. Use a PC in large centers, write mail by hand and "beat off" telegrams. (I still caught it) You can go further into the past smile
  30. 123 Offline
    123 (123) 17 September 2020 14: 56
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    You asked a question and tried to answer for me (one more trick).
    I said that you should not speak disparagingly about their production and market revenues.

    The conversation was about technology, not revenues and market share.

    Reactors have existed for more than half a century, and microelectronics will be newer. Yes, modern nuclear power plants are full of technologies, but the development of the old ones, of the 20th century.
    And then there are chips with a process less than 10 nm.

    The reactors have been in operation for 40 years. do you think that this is yesterday because they are not updated every year? belay Do you want to say anything at all? That nuclear power is nothing special and yesterday? And smartphones are the peak of technology?

    Without nuclear power, it's easy. In my city, a CHP is on gas. And they can replace nuclear power plants.

    The CHP in your city is connected to a single power system, together with a nuclear power plant. How do you determine who produced the electricity? Tell the French that you can do without a nuclear power plant. They have 70%. You can teach the Japanese how to live without a nuclear power plant.
    I dare to assure you, you can also live without a smartphone. Call from a simple cell phone, and everything else from a PC.

    It is strange that you are comparing them knowing the disproportionate difference in danger.

    Don't you think weirdly about the importance of technology by how much you learned to dispose of waste? belay
    If you are in favor of green energy, you can disconnect from the CHP (hydrocarbons are burned there) and install a wind turbine.

    You can call from wired home and street phones. Use a PC in large centers, write mail by hand and "beat off" telegrams. (I still caught it) You can go further into the past

    This is exactly what you are calling for, not so long ago there was no nuclear power. Want to go even further? Before electricity?
  31. Alexey Sergeev Offline
    Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 17 September 2020 15: 32
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    The CHP in your city is connected to a single power system, together with a nuclear power plant.

    But the share in generation in Russia is also small. France - yes, it is strongly tied.
    Gas CHPP is very green, of all hydrocarbon. Better - only wind turbines and solar panels.
    IMHO, over time, the owners of the deserts will benefit: there will be high-power stations.

    You can teach the Japanese how to live without a nuclear power plant.

    The British have windmills in the sea with a diameter of 150m. Isn't it an option?

    This is exactly what you are calling for, not so long ago there was no nuclear power. Want to go even further? Before electricity?

    No, I'm showing the absurdity of this:

    You can call from regular phones, others from a PC.

    You offered to go back in time.
    Now a smartphone is both a universal means of communication and a pocket computer.

    The conversation was about technology, not revenues and market share.

    And I focused on income. In addition, the production of smartphones can be said to be at the peak of the development of micro (or even nano?) Electronics. Vaughn Apple wants to transfer PCs and beeches to ARM processors.
  32. 123 Offline
    123 (123) 17 September 2020 16: 04
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    But the share in generation in Russia is also small.
    France - yes, it is strongly tied.
    Gas CHPP is very green, of all hydrocarbon. Better - only wind turbines and solar panels.

    Wind turbines with panels are also not sugar. It's just expensive, the wind is not everywhere, solar panels are ineffective and there are problems with disposal. How can the Japanese live on wind turbines and panels?

    IMHO, over time, the owners of the deserts will benefit: there will be high-power stations.

    The owners of the deserts will soon graze camels there, everything is heading towards this.

    No, I'm showing the absurdity of this:

    You can call from regular phones, others from a PC.

    You offered to go back in time.
    Now a smartphone is both a universal means of communication and a pocket computer.

    You didn’t succeed. The rejection of the nuclear power plant is no less absurd.
    A smartphone is a convenient and universal means of communication, and a nuclear power plant is a reliable and cheap source of electricity. Why do you consider smartphones to be cutting-edge technologies and nuclear power as yesterday is still not clear. request

    The British have windmills in the sea with a diameter of 150m. Isn't it an option?

    I do not know. Are the Japanese dumb and underdeveloped? Since such a simple idea did not occur to them winked Or is there something else?

    And I focused on income. In addition, the production of smartphones can be said to be at the peak of the development of micro (or even nano?) Electronics. Vaughn Apple wants to transfer PCs and beeches to ARM processors.

    You can also earn income by selling seeds, so this is not the best example. we were talking about technology. By the way, do you ignore the income from electricity production?
    Quantum computers are at their peak right now. Soon all of these processors can be connected to tube receivers. Nuclear power is developing, new generation reactors are practically waste-free. They are working on a thermonuclear installation. A space tug is being developed, this is a huge leap forward in space exploration. You can't fly anywhere on a smartphone.
  33. Alexey Sergeev Offline
    Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 17 September 2020 16: 31
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    nuclear power is still not clear yesterday. request

    The issue of processing zero thousand tons of extremely hazardous waste has not been resolved. Let me remind you that this is not just rubbish, but disgusting, which can kill everyone in 300 years.
    In Pripyat, in the basement of the hospital, there are still firefighter suits. 500 r / hour and at the moment (extreme stalkers measure).

    Are the Japanese dumb and underdeveloped? Since such a simple idea has not occurred to them winked Or is there something else?

    No, IMHO, they got involved with nuclear power plants when there weren't many alternatives (and there was little fossil fuel). And, like France, they won't be untied so easily.

    How can the Japanese live on wind turbines and panels?

    Panels - on the roofs of houses. But there are plenty of milking places for offshore wind turbines. Perhaps the comprehension of the Fukushima accident will bear fruit. (Problems with seismology)

    Quantum computers are at their peak right now. Soon all of these processors can be connected to tube receivers.

    Exactly. And in which computing centers are they present? Not so simple, many more years will pass.
    But these are technologies of the future, with regard to them the reactor is even more anachronistic. Working, useful (for now) anachronism.

    new generation reactors are practically waste-free.

    How much? What is the share in the total mass?
    And the remnants of almost waste-free must be stored somewhere. In the event of an accident, earthquake or tsunami, what to do with the infection?

    A space tug is being developed, this is a huge leap forward in space exploration. You can't fly anywhere on a smartphone.

    The tug is great. But developments on smartphones are used / will soon be used in PC computing centers. Including those that will operate the tug.
  34. 123 Offline
    123 (123) 17 September 2020 17: 11
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    The issue of processing zero thousand tons of extremely hazardous waste has not been resolved. Let me remind you that this is not just rubbish, but disgusting, which can kill everyone in 300 years.
    In Pripyat, in the basement of the hospital, there are still firefighter suits. 500 r / hour and at the moment (extreme stalkers measure).

    Has the problem of plastic recycling been solved? Read what "microplastic" is. In the meantime, get behind the nuclear power plant and start making wooden iPhones.

    No, IMHO, they got involved with nuclear power plants when there weren't many alternatives (and there was little fossil fuel). And, like France, they won't be untied so easily.
    Panels - on the roofs of houses. But there are plenty of milking places for offshore wind turbines. Perhaps the comprehension of the Fukushima accident will bear fruit. (Problems with seismology)

    And why don't they put windmills? Stupid? smile

    Exactly. And in which computing centers are they present? Not so simple, many more years will pass.
    But these are technologies of the future, with regard to them the reactor is even more anachronistic. Working, useful (for now) anachronism.

    Anachronism? belay The reactors under construction now, even with your grandchildren, will work and fly in space. Computer technology and electronics are developing at a frantic pace. Today's smartphones have a much greater chance of becoming an anachronism.

    How much? What is the share in the total mass?

    No more than a fraction of the waste from smartphones. Lithium batteries and plastic poison everything.

    And the remnants of almost waste-free must be stored somewhere. In the event of an accident, earthquake or tsunami, what to do with the infection?

    First, learn how to remove microplastics, no less harm from it. In the meantime, you can not, give up plastic. NPP to put in the zone of earthquake or tsunami is idiocy. This backward American technology was provided to the Japanese, apparently they do not mind. What to bomb with nuclear bombs, put all one hundred nuclear power plants.

    The tug is great. But developments on smartphones are used / will soon be used in PC computing centers

    Which data centers? You overstate. You don't need much to manage. Look at what Shuttle and Buran flew. The tug will fly without your smartphone, the smartphone will fly only in one case, if the astronaut throws it away laughing
  35. Alexey Sergeev Offline
    Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 17 September 2020 20: 38
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    First, learn how to remove microplastics, no less harm from it.

    Let me sit surrounded by a microplate, and you - among the open spent nuclear fuel? For half an hour?

    And why don't they put windmills? Stupid? smile

    To paraphrase: if they are so rich (3 economy, no resources), then why should they be stupid?

    Which data centers? You overstate

    Take an interest in the topic of moving to ARM processors on a PC.

    Today's smartphones have a much greater chance of becoming an anachronism.

    Suggest an alternative from the future to this device?
  36. 123 Offline
    123 (123) 17 September 2020 21: 33
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    Let me sit surrounded by a microplate, and you - among the open spent nuclear fuel? For half an hour?

    Or maybe you just eat a plastic lithium battery for dessert?

    To paraphrase: if they are so rich (3 economy, no resources), then why should they be stupid?

    In terms of GDP (PPP), they are the 5th economy, but that is not the point. As I understand them, you don’t think they’re stupid, so why didn’t they give up the nuclear power plant and didn’t switch to wind turbines? This is so wonderful right? Maybe they just don't want to drop out of the top ten in terms of economy?

    Take an interest in the topic of moving to ARM processors on a PC.

    What's new in this? A tablet with a keyboard has been gathering dust in my closet for a long time, despite the promises a full-fledged operating system has not appeared. Essentially a useless thing. There is nothing fundamentally new in this.

    Suggest an alternative from the future to this device?

    I told you, quantum. And they will appear much earlier than the reactors built today are closed.
    But there is no alternative to reactors. The constructed ones will serve for at least 40-50 years.
  37. Alexey Sergeev Offline
    Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 18 September 2020 04: 02
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    Or maybe you just eat a plastic lithium battery for dessert?

    Ok, I'm a spoonful of plastic, and you are a spoonful of spent nuclear fuel? Just don't come close later belay On the question of the difference in danger. Plastic can be recycled, but how do you remove the radioactivity?

    I don’t think they’re stupid.

    Clearly intelligent, workaholics.

    so why did they not abandon the nuclear power plant and switch to wind turbines?

    Do you think it's a matter of a couple of years?

    What's new in this? A tablet with a keyboard has been gathering dust in my closet for a long time, despite the promises a full-fledged operating system has not appeared. Essentially a useless thing. There is nothing fundamentally new in this.

    My tablet is gathering dust on Win 7. What operating system is not there?
    Familiar on the iPad 12 'keyboard with photos works (photographer) in Final Cut. Everything is enough for him.
    But we are talking about installing ARM instead of x86 / x64.

    https://akket.com/raznoe/215621-apple-otkazalas-ot-intel-v-polzu-sobstvennyh-protsessorov-silicone-v-mac.html/amp

    I told you, quantum. And they will appear much earlier than the reactors built today are closed.

    How will a smartphone change because a new processor has been installed in it? (In fact?)
    I agree, they will appear before 50 years, but not “tomorrow”. Another 10 years minimum will pass.
    In the meantime, we get a further decrease in those processes and an increase in productivity.
  38. 123 Offline
    123 (123) 18 September 2020 18: 16
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    Ok, I'm a spoonful of plastic, and you are a spoonful of spent nuclear fuel? Just don’t come close to the question of the difference in danger. Plastic can be recycled, but how do you remove the radioactivity?

    You certainly did not read about microplastics? What are you hanging on to radioactivity? Do you have to deal with uranium?

    Do you think it's a matter of a couple of years?

    But nothing prevents you from considering that all production in our country should have been restored. Or time is only required for the Japanese, and the fairies instantly do it for us.
    And that the Japanese began to switch to wind turbines? More details smile

    My tablet is gathering dust on Win 7. What operating system is not there?

    On my android, they promised to finish the OS for it, but they never did it. Working with documents and so on did not work normally.

    How will a smartphone change because a new processor has been installed in it? (In fact?)
    I agree, they will appear before 50 years, but not “tomorrow”. Another 10 years minimum will pass.
    In the meantime, we get a further decrease in those processes and an increase in productivity.

    And all this time we will use nuclear power.
    For you, apart from a smartphone, nothing else exists?
  39. Alexey Sergeev Offline
    Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 19 September 2020 14: 06
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    But nothing prevents you from considering that all production in our country should have been restored. Or time is only required for the Japanese, and the fairies instantly do it for us.

    The success could have been much greater if $ 2 trillion had not appeared on accounts in the United States and Britain over the past 20 years. And a fleet of elite yachts. And statements that the fight against corruption only hurts (when Singapore's successes in this area were raised). These same people were thinking that they couldn't recover quickly. Of course, you have to buy a castle (talking about officials).
  40. 123 Offline
    123 (123) 19 September 2020 15: 01
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    The success could have been much greater if $ 2 trillion had not appeared on accounts in the United States and Britain over the past 20 years. And a fleet of elite yachts. And statements that the fight against corruption only hurts (when Singapore's successes in this area were raised). These same people were thinking that they couldn't recover quickly. Of course, you have to buy a castle (talking about officials).

    This is the explanation why the Japanese did not switch to wind turbines? Or do you have one standard phrase for all questions?
    By the way, what business jets did you call to build for? For the proletarians? repeat
  41. Alexey Sergeev Offline
    Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 20 September 2020 14: 09
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    By the way, what business jets did you call to build for? For the proletarians?

    For business, administration and export smile

    Or do you have one routine for all questions?

    How do you strive to protect this category of people .. Ideologically close?
  42. 123 Offline
    123 (123) 20 September 2020 15: 52
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    For business, administration and export

    Is that so? belay As business jets, so we need to produce as Brazilians and Canadians. And the demand for them will be and the administration needs them both for businessmen and for export. And it's too bad that we don't do this, because everyone is so clumsy.
    We take Aurus, which we produce, and the Canadians are not able to do anything of the kind with the Brazilians, it suddenly turns out that ... we do not need it and there will be no demand for it, this is only ...

    For domestic consumption and the President of Turkmenistan.

    And he only needs officials and all Turkmenbashi ...

    There is a prime minister, a number of top officials and governors. I even know who will order exactly (so that Putin has it) Will Gurbanguly really hit his face in the mud?

    How is it in your head that high-ranking officials and governors suddenly turn into an "administration" and it turns out that businessmen will be in demand and will be exported, and not everyone there Gurbanguly ... belay
    This means that if all sorts of governors and oligarchs go to Auris, then they are officials and took it, whatever Putin had, but how will they switch to business jets will suddenly turn into administration and businessmen? What some somersaults you have in your mind belay laughing You are a hypocrite and demagogue practicing double standards and trying to impose this opinion about some kind of superiority of the West and our worthlessness. negative

    How do you strive to protect this category of people .. Ideologically close?

    Ideologically close? belay Nothing more than disgusting propagandists like you. You will show me the fidelity of your false propaganda speech using real facts:

    And in the west, $ trillion does not appear on accounts? Or is the transfer of money from country to country prohibited? Or there are fewer elite yachts, and in the castles there are only sanatoriums for workers? Maybe they eradicated corruption?
    On the one hand, you propose to take them as an example and tell them how great they are and how good the private business is, and then everything turns out to be exactly the opposite.

    To remind you?

    The success could have been much greater if $ 2 trillion had not appeared on accounts in the United States and Britain over the past 20 years. And a fleet of elite yachts. And statements that the fight against corruption only hurts (when Singapore's successes in this area were raised). These same people were thinking that they couldn't recover quickly. Of course, you have to buy a castle (talking about officials).

    So who are you ideologically close to? "Echo of Moscow"? negative
  43. Alexey Sergeev Offline
    Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 20 September 2020 20: 10
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    Look, you have a problem. It is imperative for you to mold the image of an enemy from anyone who does not agree with your position (whoever is not with us is against us). A sort of maximalism. negative

    And so they do. Only around the world. And the US makes more money, not just from turbines alone. Business. (I suggested earlier to evaluate the idea of ​​compensating them for all the losses.)

    Well, let them bring down wherever they want.

    It characterizes well - very much like an adult. negative

    You've Merged: Broke Previous Personalization Records negative ... (Or emotions are off scale? So not a young lady, tea).
    Good luck
  44. 123 Offline
    123 (123) 20 September 2020 20: 51
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    Look, you have a problem. It is imperative for you to mold the image of an enemy from anyone who does not agree with your position (whoever is not with us is against us). A sort of maximalism. negative

    And so they do. Only around the world. And the US makes more money, not just from turbines alone. Business. (I suggested earlier to evaluate the idea of ​​compensating them for all the losses.)

    Well, let them bring down wherever they want.
    It characterizes well - very much like an adult.

    You offer to compensate the seller for the losses that he will incur from the actions of a third party (sitting somewhere overseas), which does not allow him to make a deal. If the seller is not independent, what to talk about with a slave? If you add up the price of the goods with the amount of compensation, then this is completely different money. In fact, you are being sold at an exorbitant price. And this does not bother you much.
    Let it fall .. and this is still putting it mildly. What is typical, you don’t mind giving money for it, while shedding tears as everyone is plundered and taken out of the country. crying

    You have merged: have broken previous personalization records. (Or emotions are off scale? So not a young lady, tea).

    As a matter of fact, there is nothing to answer you, hence the hysteria about the transition to personalities.

    Congratulations on the drain drinks
    Good luck hi
  45. Alexey Sergeev Offline
    Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 8 September 2020 07: 00
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    About the brain drain.

    https://mi3ch.livejournal.com/4299291.html
  46. 123 Offline
    123 (123) 8 September 2020 12: 11
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    Thank. I looked. Beautiful picture. It is immediately evident that the Anglo-Saxons painted. True, it is not clear when and how they counted.
    What can I say from the results of watching ... I'm terribly happy for Mongolia, apparently, their position is better than ours. Ethiopia, Kenya and Nigeria with South Africa, of course, feel sorry for, it turns out, they are fleeing from us, but at the same time this is good news, which means that their brains are appreciated. By the way, can you tell me where African brains are used? Does everyone flee in the US or to Canada?
    Why are they fleeing from Britain, can you tell me? You cite her in economics as an example ...
    By the way, I don't remember the news about Mexican scientists who flooded the whole world ... And you? winked
    Shall we seriously discuss this?
  47. Alexey Sergeev Offline
    Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 8 September 2020 15: 55
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    It is immediately evident that the Anglo-Saxons painted. True, it is not clear when and how

    Such rhetoric indicates a certain ideological commitment. I propose to refrain from this.
    There is a brain drain, this is a fact.

    Fish seeks where it is deeper, and man - where it is better.

    It is logical to assume that the better we are, the less people we will lose.
  48. 123 Offline
    123 (123) 8 September 2020 17: 36
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    Such rhetoric indicates a certain ideological commitment. I propose to refrain from this.
    There is a brain drain, this is a fact. "The fish is looking where it is deeper, and the man - where it is better."
    It is logical to assume that the better we are, the less people we will lose.

    Brain drain is the leakage of the brain from the skull. People are not brains, they can go wherever they like, come back. There is nothing on that "coloring". How to understand who left, where, whether he came back. Again, on the same map, Kenya and Russia are marked with the same color. Are you saying we are facing the same problem? Kenyan Scientists Go to Canada to Develop Science? Or do talented Nigerian students, having received an excellent education, go to work in their specialty in Australia? Who goes to Greenland anyway?
    On the basis of what data this picture was drawn, it is still unclear. How is it determined that it is the "brains" and not the "hands" that have left?
  • Alexey Sergeev Offline
    Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 19 September 2020 14: 16
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    On the issue of mindfulness:

    P-270 "Mosquito", speed 200-470 m / s (speed of sound 333 m / s) Caliber speed (export, hence underestimated) 2,9 M, that is, approximately 965 m / s. This is three times faster than what they seem to have learned to intercept.

    Flight speed:
    cruising - M = 2,35
    maximum - M = 2,8
    Launch Range:
    3M-80 - 10-90 km (up to 250)
    3M-80E - 120 km
    Flight height: 7-20 m
    Carrier flight speed: 200-470 m / s
    The carrier is an airplane (!)
    When attacking, the Mosquito goes just 2,8m.
    And to intercept the target it is not necessary to fly faster than it. The laser sensor will have time to give a command to detonate the warhead.
    An example is the teachings of the Indians, where Barak-8 intercepted Brahmos.
  • Citizen Mѣshkov (Sergѣi) 19 August 2020 20: 56
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    Washington has 333 of them, but American warships are larger than Russian ones.

    It is very good that the vessels are larger. It will be easier to aim.
    1. Rum rum Online
      Rum rum (Rum rum) 20 August 2020 01: 03
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      Yes Yes. American logic.
      The American ones are not more armed, but larger.
    2. Alexey Sergeev Offline
      Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 20 August 2020 14: 42
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      This is from the category "the bigger the cabinet - the louder it falls." What will happen if a 60 kg master boxer is brought against a heavy master into the ring? (Most likely)
      1. Rum rum Online
        Rum rum (Rum rum) 20 August 2020 20: 03
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        There will be a draw.
        Thin, will not fill up, but it is also difficult to get into it (if not a "fool", it will exhaust you until the heavy falls by itself).
        And if the baby is armed as well as the heavy? And if there are two such kids, one for one?
        Mathematics is nothing more.
        1. Alexey Sergeev Offline
          Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 4 September 2020 09: 27
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          The lightweight will lose (if the level is equal, if the goal of both is knockout).
          It is less "durable", the blows are weaker. Its stands are easily broken by heavy, but on the contrary - not.
        2. Alexey Sergeev Offline
          Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 5 September 2020 06: 31
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          A destroyer against a patrol ship is like a heavy MC against one (ok, two) flies with a third rank. Who really do not know how to defend themselves.
      2. Rinat Farkhitov Offline
        Rinat Farkhitov (Rinat Farkhitov) 21 August 2020 11: 55
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        A small boxer can have a hammer blow, and he is more maneuverable.
        1. Alexey Sergeev Offline
          Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 4 September 2020 09: 34
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          It's funny. “Maybe” are keywords. One or two missed hits - and you can end the fight. That is why a weight separation system has been introduced. 80 kg against 100 - still possible, but not 60. Beating.
  • Kuzmich Sibiryakov (Kuzmich Sibiryakov) 19 August 2020 21: 01
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    I found out what 20 Sarmatians can do and grinned. Not a single box of penguins that survived will have nowhere to moor.
    1. Cyrus Offline
      Cyrus (Kirill) 20 August 2020 00: 24
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      The same as 20 trident or minuteman, and what's next? And most importantly, neither side will be able to deliver the fatal blow.
      1. Oyo Sarkazmi Offline
        Oyo Sarkazmi (Oyo Sarkazmi) 20 August 2020 08: 29
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        Quote: Cyrus
        so, what is next? And most importantly, neither side will be able to deliver the fatal blow.

        And then - silence ... So the Danish prince said.
        The blow will just be fatal. Hunger, cold and lack of transport. You can't plow endless fields, you can't fill a truck, you can't plug Tesla into an outlet.
        1. Vladimir Tuzakov (Vladimir Tuzakov) 20 August 2020 11: 55
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          You are right, the war inflicts more damage on large cities, especially millionaires, infrastructure breaks there, and the city's body dies off, people in multi-apartment birdhouses lose all the components of life support with all the consequences ... 6-10 acres in the suburbs, and then 20-30 acres ... Life will become healthier and the population will begin to increase. Moving, with the continuation of the network of the metro line and high-speed railway highways, will even decrease ... Now in megacities, only daily moves take up to a quarter of a day, plus working hours, and when to live ... Military strategy is connected with the entire economic and political life of the state .. ...
        2. Alexey Sergeev Offline
          Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 20 August 2020 14: 45
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          And what will we have? Most of the territory is of little use for habitation, and so (look at the settlement map) people live mainly in large agglomerations, much less evenly than in the United States. There are many small towns there. Rednecks will survive a lot, they will rebuild the States .. And many who will help them.
          1. Oyo Sarkazmi Offline
            Oyo Sarkazmi (Oyo Sarkazmi) 20 August 2020 18: 46
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            Quote: Alexey Sergeev
            Rednecks will survive a lot, they will rebuild the States .. And many who will help them.

            Especially the Mexicans. They will come with a machete and help. So as not to suffer with non-working credit cards.
            1. Alexey Sergeev Offline
              Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 4 September 2020 09: 52
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              Especially the Mexicans. They will come with a machete and help. So as not to suffer with non-working credit cards.

              Dreams and hopes. Canada, Australia and many other DEVELOPED countries.
              1. Oyo Sarkazmi Offline
                Oyo Sarkazmi (Oyo Sarkazmi) 4 September 2020 09: 54
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                Well, blacks kill whites, don't they? And the Mexicans have much more experience with Mochilov. And more offenses. After all, the southern states of the United States, besides Louisiana, are the former Mexico.
                1. Alexey Sergeev Offline
                  Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 4 September 2020 09: 56
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                  All this happens until the limit of patience is exhausted. There are not many black people in the United States.
                  Yeah, Texas is one of them. Let me remind you of the character of the Texans, which has become a kind of meme.
                  1. Oyo Sarkazmi Offline
                    Oyo Sarkazmi (Oyo Sarkazmi) 4 September 2020 10: 02
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                    But we are talking about a country that survived a nuclear strike! The US will be hit, but Mexico will not. And so, the northern neighbor - there is no electricity, communication is only by radio, the administration is disorganized. What kind of patience? Run north and grab what's left!
                    1. Alexey Sergeev Offline
                      Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 5 September 2020 06: 22
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                      The Northern Council, which at least has a powerful fleet. Armed with cruise missiles and nuclear weapons. A machete is difficult to fight against.
                      1. Oyo Sarkazmi Offline
                        Oyo Sarkazmi (Oyo Sarkazmi) 5 September 2020 08: 31
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                        Europe will climb into a nuclear dump?
                        They ran out of bombs after a week of bombing Yugoslavia. NATO will not fight without the United States with anyone. To keep their own from the Turks and Albanians (Russia is also turned off after all).
      2. Kuzmich Sibiryakov (Kuzmich Sibiryakov) 20 August 2020 10: 48
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        Quote: Cyrus
        The same as 20 trident or minuteman, and what's next? And most importantly, neither side will be able to deliver the fatal blow.

        Why did you decide that sooner or later neither side will get tired of yielding to the other? The First World War did not start because of a student's shot. It has matured in the minds of the entire European community.
      3. Kuzmich Sibiryakov (Kuzmich Sibiryakov) 20 August 2020 10: 59
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        Quote: Cyrus
        The same as 20 trident or minuteman, and what's next? And most importantly, neither side will be able to deliver the fatal blow.

        Somewhat wrong. The Americans themselves appreciated this blow. Up to 80% of the population and up to 90% of industry perish. They settled very well there. On the coast, in cities, 20% will remain. Someone needs to clean up the corpses, take care of the sick and wounded? To destroy everyone is inhuman.
        After that, those who have not forgotten that there is an ax, a shovel and the ability to dig potatoes with non-electrified combines will survive. Without 2% of farmers, feeding all the lazy and unable to pull a nail without calling a specialist home, it will be more difficult to survive. Our people survived and will be much more successful. With all other equal losses.
  • Satellite Offline
    Satellite (Satellite) 19 August 2020 21: 49
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    The Russian navy does not pose any serious threat to American warships on the open ocean.

    Thus, an American should always remain with his fleet "in the open ocean." Then nobody and nobody will touch.
  • Netyn Offline
    Netyn (Netyn) 20 August 2020 00: 16
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    Quote: KYYC
    Then the Japanese had a small number of ships, but the Russian fleet was split up in the bud

    Why lie?
    Russia 38 ships, including auxiliary and hospital.
    Japan 125 ships, including auxiliary and hospital ships.
    With such knowledge, the history of the fleet - you should write articles for Seryozha as a co-author.
  • Volga073 Offline
    Volga073 (MIKLE) 20 August 2020 00: 28
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    Oh, stupid!
    Russian nuclear submarines enter the Gulf of Mexico. One volley - and there is no America, but they count all the Buyans))
    1. Alexey Sergeev Offline
      Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 6 September 2020 08: 43
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      Oh, stupid!
      Russian nuclear submarines enter the Gulf of Mexico. One volley - and there is no America

      So they don't need to go anywhere for this. In addition, it is dangerous, because there is a greater likelihood of being destroyed before launch.
  • Cat Offline
    Cat (Sergei) 20 August 2020 00: 35
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    And where did he get these numbers - 12000 strike missiles from them and 3300 from us? What missiles are we talking about? In addition to SLCM, this includes ZURA?
  • Alexander Zima Offline
    Alexander Zima (Alexander Zima) 20 August 2020 08: 09
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    Having received the X-32 missile ....... Su-Z0 will become the best hunter for NATO ships ... otherwise they don't like small Russian ships ... Su even less .... try to catch it.
    1. Alexey Sergeev Offline
      Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 6 September 2020 08: 52
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      Having received the X-32 missile ....... Su-Z0 will become the best hunter for NATO ships ... otherwise they don't like small Russian ships ... Su even less .... try to catch it.

      Sounds like hopes for a wunderwaffe that will allow small numbers to win.
  • boriz Offline
    boriz (boriz) 20 August 2020 09: 29
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    The Russian navy does not pose any serious threat to American warships on the open ocean.

    For God's sake!
    And in the Black and Baltic Seas, Russia does not need any ships to multiply the American fleet to zero. I'm not talking about the Arctic Ocean, they will have to be saved there. In the Far East, the picture is about the same.
    So let them laugh. Laughter for no reason is known that ...
  • Sofa brace Offline
    Sofa brace 20 August 2020 13: 33
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    Yes, he said everything correctly for the current state of our fleet, but by 2028 -2029 the picture will change slightly. By this time, in the ranks, there will most likely be 2 modernized Orlans, 8 frigates 22350, 9 submarine Yasen, 2-3 upgraded submarine Antey with 72 missiles, and this is not counting the MRK corvettes and Poseidons with aviation. And there will be not so few corvettes and RTOs, and even low-noise diesel boats.
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  • p164 Offline
    p164 (Paul) 20 August 2020 15: 45
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    The brave soldier said everything correctly. I did not take into account one. In Russia, they stayed only on sofas or just drinking. But among the real leaders of the state and the armed forces, there are none.
    Who and why will conduct naval battles with America? How, however, where to get the idiots in the Pentagon?
    It is clear that the mosquito fleet of the Russian Federation simply does not have enough missiles for all Arlie Berks. And no one will fight wall to wall, as was done until the middle of the twentieth century. Neither we, nor them. And not to understand this, as well as to talk about who will sink whom, "Peter the Great" or "Tikanderoga", can only be shell-shocked by a case of beer, a hulk with a national flag on his face.
    There is a strategy of the Russian Armed Forces, which clearly states that any missile attack on the Russian Federation is a pretext for a nuclear strike. And we have everything necessary for this. I am sure that in America too. Submarines and even a "mosquito" fleet can inflict not a victorious blow (there will be no victory), but simply cause irreparable damage to the aggressor and his allies. Which makes war an absolutely meaningless pursuit. You can fight for the sake of robbery, occupation, or even for the sake of abstract communism. But this is only possible if the goal is achieved. In our time, the goal will not be achieved.
    And all such lingering are just everyday conversations on a free topic, work for propagandists and delirium of leavened patriots.
    Russia has enough strength to make aggression a senseless exercise. America has enough to be the world's gendarme. Well, as for the newly emerging monsters like China, it is quite enough so that no one dared to solve economic issues with him with the help of brute force. And this is the great meaning. Everyone is comfortable. And the leavened ones have something to talk about.
    However, if someone wants Russia to once again break up into separate principalities, and the people are starving, then please - Win the elections, build aircraft carriers and eat up the last horseradish without bread. You can cry about Soros ...
    1. p164 Offline
      p164 (Paul) 20 August 2020 16: 01
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      What is the problem? You can talk about war, but you can't talk about its meaninglessness?
  • Alexey MAD Offline
    Alexey MAD (Alexey) 20 August 2020 23: 18
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    The one who laughs last laughs well. This time.
    It is not weapons that are fighting, but people. These are two.
    They came to Russia many times and how did it end? These are three.
  • Alexey Shaab Offline
    Alexey Shaab (Alexey Shaab) 20 August 2020 23: 43
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    Underestimating an opponent always leads to defeat. To defeat him, you must always treat him with respect.
    If suddenly, God forbid, there is a war, then humanity will once again slide into the Stone Age. Provided that in general the planet and life on it survive.
    Still, I am aware of the words of our commander-in-chief: we, as martyrs, will go to heaven, and they will simply die. So my advice to the desperate hawks is not to pull the cat's balls.
  • aljeschapop Offline
    aljeschapop (Alyosha Popovich) 21 August 2020 04: 18
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    Convey to these connoisseurs that NO WAR in the world has ever been won in the sea-ocean. Only on land.
  • zz811 Offline
    zz811 (Vlad Pervovich) 21 August 2020 10: 43
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    Quote: boomboom
    What does China have to do with it?

    Despite the fact that China is a potential military adversary of the United States ... and it must be compared with it.
  • shinobi Offline
    shinobi (Yuri) 21 August 2020 12: 12
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    Naive. The future lies not with floating targets such as AUG, but with multipurpose nuclear submarines and missile and gun platforms. How much could they have against Eun? And all it took was to aim two tactical ICBMs with nuclear weapons - and 3 aircraft carriers got out of their way. No one is going to butt the Yankees in the oceans on their terms.
  • Kamerunec Offline
    Kamerunec (Anatoly) 21 August 2020 12: 18
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    A large target is more vulnerable, like a large closet, it falls louder.
  • Alexander Ratskevich (Alexander Ratskevich) 21 August 2020 14: 24
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    If such a comparison is made in the States, it means that our fleet is very worried about them.
  • Sasha Vasiliev Offline
    Sasha Vasiliev (Sasha Vasiliev) 21 August 2020 20: 51
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    RWD generals, you better tell your Yankees who quit Donald Cook that the Russian fleet is rusting. If they were bent 12 times by an old rusty plane, then what will the old Russian ship do and, by the way, your general also said - we are stupid people, even from the Bosphorus, we will not be able to leave, as the Russians will overwhelm us, and, by the way, he is right. Or ask the ISIS slaves how Russian ships bent them for fishing from the Caspian Sea, and this is thousands of kilometers. So, you have something to think about.
  • Valery Kuzmin Offline
    Valery Kuzmin (Valery Kuzmin) 22 August 2020 04: 41
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    And Russia does not need the applause of the West. And here's the answer: starting next year, no enemy warship, in the conditions of war or Russia's desire, will be able to approach the borders of Russia or other places where Zircon missiles are installed closer than one thousand kilometers. Not a single aircraft carrier! No one.
    1. Alexey Sergeev Offline
      Alexey Sergeev (Alexey Sergeev) 16 September 2020 18: 22
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      Zircon is closer than one thousand kilometers.

      Big questions about range if he gets in the UKSK cell.
      There are no images. Instead, they slip an American x-51 Waverider with the US Air Force signs erased. (Sometimes under the wing of B-52)
      And we make rockets like sausages again?
  • andreyicecream Offline
    andreyicecream (Andrey Matyash) 24 August 2020 09: 38
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    It's good that they think so!
  • victor_4suxanow.vikt (Victor Sukhanov) 25 August 2020 11: 14
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    How to say, as we say ... a big figure, but a fool.
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  • Bagel with jam Offline
    Bagel with jam (vadim galiev) 16 September 2020 05: 39
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    Americans do not understand one simple truth. Our fleet will not go to their shores. And if their fleet is
  • Bagel with jam Offline
    Bagel with jam (vadim galiev) 16 September 2020 05: 39
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    Americans do not understand one simple truth. Our fleet will not go to their shores. And if their fleet goes to ours, it will deal with one aircraft carrier with an area of ​​19 million square kilometers.