Maltese "cross" on the USSR: how Gorbachev sold the country to Bush

Three decades ago, an event occurred that became one of the most important episodes of a state crime called the “collapse of the Soviet Union”. Without official protocols and the signing of any agreements, the last leader of the USSR laid at the feet of the president of the United States of America the entire "socialist camp", and indeed his own country, in addition. In fact, it was then that Mikhail Gorbachev capitulated in a decade of confrontation with the West, subsequently exposing his own betrayal, weakness and cowardice as the greatest achievement - the end of the Cold War.

In fact, it was precisely the shameful surrender to the enemy of all that for which tens of millions of Soviet people had sacrificed their lives, the fact that they, not sparing themselves, had built, developed and defended entire generations. How was it and why did it happen? Let's remember together.

Point of non-return

Held on December 2, 1989 in Malta, a meeting of Mikhail Gorbachev and George W. Bush with Russian historians and political scientists is considered, as usual, from two diametrically opposite points of view. The first one, of course, is that initially Mikhail Sergeyevich did not want “anything bad” for his country and people and was by no means a puppet of the West. Fresh tradition ... Adherents of the second (to which I belong), proceed from the fact that the goal of destroying not only the USSR, but also the entire socialist system that had formed at that time in the world, was set by Gorbachev and his clique from the very beginning. How much personal initiative was present here, and how much the fulfillment of plans drawn up very far from Moscow was, is the third question, but there was no “wanted the best” one from the beginning. However, we will try to be objective and consider the situation from both positions voiced above. So, if we believe the supporters of the version about the good intentions of the “chief perestroika”, then the Maltese summit was necessary for him as, first of all, a “lifeline” for his own image. Let me remind you - by 1989, even a blind person could see: the processes that started in the country in 1985-86 began to “turn” somewhere else. And it’s not right there ... “Perestroika” quite naturally developed into a complete mess in all areas, and “acceleration” turned into a flight of the country into the abyss at a really huge speed. Shop shelves, first of all grocery ones, were empty until they were completely sterile, prices cherished by the newly-born “geniuses” economics»The co-operative sector caused fainting and heart attacks. Crime and drug addiction grew at a tremendous pace. And on the threshold ethnic conflicts loomed in the union republics that had thought up "nationally self-determined".

The universal veal enthusiasm of the first years of Gorbachevschina, bordering on mass insanity, was gradually disappearing, the name of the General Secretary was increasingly inclined to angry obscene ditties. Even individuals with tightly stuck brains of “democracy” wanted to eat something, but from the writings of Solzhenitsyn and Sakharov’s nonsense, the replacement of doctor’s sausage was, to put it mildly, not very. The danger was becoming very real that the people would come to their senses and think about where they would drag them all the same ... And here Gorbachev decided to play in the eternal Russian “if only there was no war”! That is, to make a “breakthrough” on the international front, to end the confrontation between the West and the social camp, NATO and the Warsaw Treaty Organization, well, all that jazz ... In short, create a loud and positive informational occasion for Soviet people who are already starting to go satanic and happening around the colovert. Hence the meeting in Malta. In truth, all this is believed with great difficulty. In order to take at face value the readiness of the United States and the entire “collective West” for equal negotiations and the conclusion of honest deals with the Soviet Union, which was shaky at that moment and was cracking at the seams, you just had to be a fool, naive to the extreme. Mikhail Sergeyevich, however, he writhed himself all that way from himself, continues to writhe to this day. However, no, no, yes, a truly diabolical, evil trick will peep in his eyes. No I do not believe! Rather, the truth is that the traitor General Secretary was in a hurry with a report on the work done to the American president. And also to clarify and coordinate new, even larger-scale and vile plans. And this meeting was needed, first of all, to the West. Its rulers were eager to make sure that the USSR passed, as the pilots say, a “point of no return” and that you can continue to act without fear and looking back.

Speaking about, if it’s been damned three times, “perestroika”, it must be remembered that the first real attempt to dismantle the USSR and the socialist system was made in the 50-60s, under Khrushchev. This “manager” almost ruined everything that was possible: he reduced the army, destroyed the economy, quarreled with the Chinese ... However, he “kicked” so that they only hiccuped and wiped sweat in the West. In 1958, he ironed the rebellious Hungary with tanks, in 1962 he caused the Caribbean crisis, which nearly ended the Third World War, and in the Union itself, unlike Stalin, it shot the demonstrations “at times”. Then the fool was thrown at all, and the USSR returned to a more or less normal course, the West categorically did not suit. In 1989, in Washington, there was no certainty that the suicidal experiments undertaken by Gorbachev would end with what the United States needed - the destruction of the USSR as a great power. An analysis of national security signed in the Bush administration in 1989 explicitly stated that "perestroika is in the interests of the United States" and "the reforms taking place in the USSR must be irreversible." Let's not forget: that far year in Eastern Europe, whose countries were military and political the allies of our country, the contingents of the Soviet army were still located more than enough to both suppress the internal riots in the same GDR and Czechoslovakia, and repel the attack of NATO, which tried to support them from the outside. In the Union itself, the “leading and directing" Communist Party continued to remain, and no one thought to dissolve the State Security Committee. The ominous "pererosstroenny" gangrene could still be cured. Yes, it was already impossible to do without surgery with the spilling of a certain amount of blood at that stage. But didn’t it spill a little afterwards ?!

Delivery of all positions

Interestingly, not only Gorbachev, but also some participants in those vile glorified events, even today, 30 years later, despite all their terrifying consequences, try to imagine the case as if there were no ill intentions not only in the Secretary General of Judah , but also with his American counterpart, who arrived in Malta to accept surrender. So, for example, Pavel Palazhchenko, who performed the duties of a translator Gorbachev during the “historic summit”, undertakes today to assert that the USA is absolutely in vain “accused of the collapse of the USSR”. This, they say, was completely "not included in our plans, nor in the plans of the Americans." Both sides only craved "deepening and expanding partnerships." Yeah, it’s exactly that of partnerships ... I would joke about this, but it’ll hurt to come out ... Although, what else can a person who is now the head of the international relations department of the Gorbachev Foundation besides dodging and lying, trying to betray black for white? However, many others are pulling the same song, especially personally involved in an unprecedented betrayal that happened in 1989. And it is simply impossible to characterize the meeting in Malta in any other way - on the basis of its consequences, both short-term and long-term. Let’s talk about them in detail. First of all, Gorbachev assured Bush that the main thing is that the USSR will not use force in any case, no matter what happens near him, even within the country itself. According to the recollections of the participants, the American president, who was definitely a hundred goals higher than the unfortunate General Secretary in the game that was played at the negotiating table, began from afar. So to say, “came from the shallow map”: raised the question of supporting socialist regimes in Cuba and Nicaragua. Mikhail Sergeyevich, having revealed something about the “pluralism of opinions” and “the right to self-determination of the Cuban people,” he said that the leaders there “can do what they want, we won’t teach them.” In fact, he disowned Castro ...

After such a peppy start, things started to go happier. The owner of the White House began to probe Moscow’s intentions regarding its allies in Eastern Europe. It was then that Gorbachev showed himself “in all its glory”! First of all, he vowed, almost with tears in his eyes, assured "dear George" that the Soviet Union would never dare to "raise a hand" in the United States. Moreover, he "is ready to no longer consider them his opponent." Most importantly, the Secretary General of Judah made it absolutely clear and unequivocal that Moscow would not under any circumstances intervene in the destructive processes in the countries of the socialist camp. She has the same “vision” of the “positive changes” taking place there as her newfound “Western partners”. "Do what you want!" Want to unite Germany? Yes please! “We are for peaceful changes, we do not want to interfere and do not interfere in ongoing processes. Let the peoples themselves, without outside interference, decide how they should be ... ”is a verbatim quote from Gorbachev's treacherous trepidation. In fact, it was in Malta that the “green light” was given not only to the unification of Germany, but also to its subsequent accession to NATO. But this was nothing more than treason, for which citizen Gorbachev should certainly have been arrested at the gangway of a government plane as soon as he landed in Moscow. Before meeting with Bush from the Politburo of the CPSU Central Committee, the Secretary General received a completely clear and unequivocal order: any talk about the merger of the FRG and the GDR into a single state will become possible only if both the ATS and NATO, or, speaking of the unrealistic, their merger into one block. But not before! For this one episode, Mikhail Sergeyevich, according to all the rules, had to be removed from office and tried. Least...

After that, Bush’s next move became completely logical, he felt that a loser was sitting at the same table with him, whom it would be a sin not to leave his pants on. Talking about the "national movement" growing in the Baltic States, the American president threw words in the face of Gorbachev that the United States "will never recognize the forcible accession of these republics to the USSR." Instead of immediately advising Mr. Bush to put his “non-recognition” in an appropriate unpronounceable place and leave the negotiations, slamming the door, Mikhail Sergeyevich began to bark and wag his tail like a beaten dog. He began long speeches about the “specific situation” and “the complexity of the moment”, spewing tons of intricate verbal garbage at the interlocutor, as he always adored. Bush continued to "forge iron" - pressed on the interlocutor, already openly threatening "extremely unpleasant consequences" in case of "use of force". What is the result? Managed (and perhaps initially set up for just such an option), the Secretary General vowed to the president that “exclusively non-violent methods” would be used in the Baltic states. That's all ... After that, it was possible to order a requiem for the Soviet Union. Having realized that the insignificance that has settled in the Kremlin either cannot or does not want to save the state from collapse, all fears and doubts, as well as conventions and decency, have been discarded in the West. There they began breaking the USSR at a forced pace. Enough, as we know, only two years. According to the memoirs and sensible assessments of all sane and honest participants in the meeting in Malta, she was a terrifying defeat for Gorbachev and an incredible, moreover, completely unexpected for them triumph of the United States. Yes, they could not even imagine that everything would turn out so easily!

Russia trampled by Bush’s legs

Marshal Sergei Akhromeev, who participated in those fateful negotiations as part of the Soviet delegation, with the status of military adviser to Gorbachev, called them the first time that the United States spoke with the Soviet Union from a position of strength. Without any reason, note, solely because of the capitulary and treacherous position taken by the "head" of our state. From that moment, in fact, everything rolled completely downhill. Speaking at the final press conference after the shameful event, Gorbachev chirped that “the world is entering a new era of lasting peace without violent action.” Well, yes - a new era has really begun. The era of the "unipolar world" with the sole dominance of the United States. And of course, without any violence ... Yugoslavia, Iraq, Libya, the American invasion of Afghanistan and the countless series of "color revolutions" around the planet - all this does not count, of course. The seeds of all this horror, like dragon teeth in an ancient myth, were sown precisely in Malta. After the shortest time, blood was shed in Romania, “velvet revolutions” gave way to coups. And not so long after a river of blood surged in the former USSR - “perestroika” was replaced by a shootout, as they used to say. And the same Bush Sr. in 1991 could from the rostrum of the parliament, who was just getting ready to become “unassailable” of Ukraine, push as much as necessary fiery speeches that “they would not tolerate nationalism” in Washington de. A few months later, Yeltsin, with a handful of accomplices, who signed the death sentence to the Soviet Union, rushed to call him first! As he himself admitted then: "and could not wait ten minutes." Used for its intended purpose, the Gorbachev product was thrown out as unnecessary by the same Yeltsin. The Americans, albeit wincing at heart from disgust, picked up ...

We must give him credit, the American leader, who managed to bring Gorbachev to his knees, subsequently honestly admitted the true motives and intentions of the United States. At the 1992 Republican Party Congress, he said the following: “... rest assured: the fall of communism was not a predetermined outcome. This required the strong leadership of the presidents and the support of the American people. Otherwise, the Soviet Union would be a powerful superpower today, but now it can only be found in history books ... ”Amazing cynicism of crystal clearness! On the other hand, this is just what Bush Sr. has nothing to complain about. He acted in the interests of his own country and its allies. But Gorbachev in this situation looks completely different. To sell the Motherland, to betray hundreds of millions of people around the world ... And all this for the praise of Americans, the Nobel Prize and a mountain of trinkets - awards from various American foundations and "international organizations", for which he was admitted in 1990 during a visit to his beloved USA, had to allocate as much as 4 hours. The bag of silver was impressive, but will it outweigh all the curses that are still pouring on the head of the main national Jude? Subsequently, Gorbachev claimed that Bush “deceived him.” He, they say, and NATO promised not to expand to the East, and all sorts of malicious amendments like "Jackson-Venik" to cancel, and swore to overwhelm the USSR with all sorts of tasty and healthy goods. And also - to provide the country with almost dimensionless and interest-free “development” loans. Well, this, most likely, is again an attempt to pretend to be such a blissful fool, whom the evil American uncles promised a pretty penny, but did not give.

Gorbachev received no written guarantees of anything: the non-expansion of the Alliance, non-interference in the internal affairs of the USSR or economic assistance to him, either in Malta or later. Some people who are particularly bruised by liberalism today are smarting about this: “So what? The Americans would have wanted, and they would have violated the written treaties! Look, how famously they have treated the INF Treaty now ... ”Well, it's hard to argue with such“ logic ”. It remains only to ask: and what the hell were there negotiations at all then, if they throw it anyway ?! The Soviet Union at the suggestion of Gorbachev and "thrown." The crown of the trade agreement signed in 1990 by these same characters (Gorbachev and Bush Sr.) was massive deliveries to the USSR and, subsequently, to Russia of frozen chicken legs, which went down in history under the name of “Bush's legs”. Residents of the United States themselves categorically did not want to eat them, considering them "second-rate offal." A huge achievement! He fed the country, a bastard labeled ... After ditching both agriculture and the food industry (however, like its other branches), bringing the people to the brink of hunger and a half-Kot state. In different years, from 70% to one third of exports, the mass of poultry in our country was accounted for by these very legs, whether they were amiss. Thus, by crushing our own poultry farming, we provided about half of the American “chicken” export. And that they just could not be found in them - and hormones, and chlorine, and antibiotics, and salmonella. But there was no way to refuse - the tantrum in Washington began immediately. They got rid of violence in 2014. And nothing, we live. It is clear that the United States did not intend to give any loans or investments to the Soviet Union they were seeking, nor to Russia. They planned to turn into their own raw material base and market for third-rate products. However, what am I talking about? To date, their plans and intentions have not changed at all!

The consequences of betrayal in Malta, we disentangle to this day. A little slowed down the presumptuous and felt sovereign masters of the planet of the Americans succeeded already in Syria. But the main battles are likely to come. The blood of the Donbass, Nazis marching in Ukraine and the Baltic states, the danger of a new world war intensified to the limit - all this originates precisely there, in the distant 1989. The only benefit of the Maltese Summit is that it serves as an eternal lesson: our country can come to an agreement with the West in general and the Americans in particular in two versions. Or - putting something extremely impressive, very large caliber on your forehead. Or - surrendering to them all their interests. Refusing honor, pride, strength. Rejecting yourself and your own future. Malta’s shameful lessons must be remembered so that nothing like this ever happens again.
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  1. Alien on this holiday of life 7 December 2019 11: 08
    Some characteristic features of the late USSR, my subjective impression is Giant lines for potatoes and meat.
    Large shops with wooden shoes and clothes that no one wanted to take.
    Meaningless scribble at work, harassing tons of paper.
    A total deficit, everything worthwhile had to be "taken out".
    Total backwardness in everything, both at work and in everyday life.
    Extreme hatred among the people for the Soviet and party system, as the press called it "the administrative-command system" at that time.
    I can testify - all this was real, because everything passed before my eyes. I can express my main impression of this time in two words - meaninglessness and worthlessness. I do not pretend to be true, but my personal opinion, despite the tragic consequences of what happened, Soviet society decayed, and the great and mighty crumbled under its own weight, due to an elementary inability to organize a modern human dormitory. Perhaps the author of this article was somewhat right, but when the line for meat had to be taken at 5:30 in the morning and stood until the evening, there were completely different thoughts in my head.
    1. plabu Offline plabu
      plabu 7 December 2019 12: 25
      I don’t know where exactly you stood from 5 until the evening, it took us a lot less time, there are some common thoughts in your description of those times who would argue, but quite a lot is incorrect - well, at least that’s what the first doubts began around the same time - somehow with the transition to the market, well too abruptly inventories appeared - and products, and not only, well, there is no such thing as a wave of a magic wand, and ... well, there is no such thing.
      And my doubts were confirmed soon enough - the deficit was created INTELLIGENT in many respects, at the bases - even the warehouses were cracking, but in the stores it was empty, the uncle who at that time commanded the base confirmed that they simply forbade, without SPECIAL instructions, well, etc. ....
      1. chobasa Offline chobasa
        chobasa (Choi Bal San) 13 December 2019 23: 56
        Quote: 321
        Well, too suddenly, commodity stocks appeared - and products, and not only, well, it doesn’t happen that it waved with a magic wand, and ... well, there’s no such thing.

        And it wasn’t like that.
        After the commodity shortage of the times of the USSR, products appeared. But not so harsh.

        Quote: 321
        the deficit was created in many ways INTENTIONALLY, on the bases — even the warehouses were cracking, but in the stores it was empty, the uncle who at that time commanded the base confirmed that they simply forbade, without a SPECIAL ORDER, well, etc ....

        Oh wow these Soviet storytellers.
        They themselves sacredly believe in some kind of mythical popping food depots. Which actually never happened.
        This myth is akin to the myth that it is worth converting the Soviet defense industry (fabulously urinary), and we will heal everything as if in the bosom.
        As a result, it turned out that the Soviet defense industry was not able to produce ANYTHING WAY and could not. Neither military nor civilian.
        And in general, it is not much different from the wretched Soviet civil industry. Only Ponte at times more.
        1. plabu Offline plabu
          plabu 14 December 2019 00: 02
          Now I’ll drop everything right and rush to you and the others to prove that it was just that, what i came across - wait, and your opuses, from the series "have disappeared and will soon disappear more") - I personally do not care much ...
    2. DPN Offline DPN
      DPN (DPN) 7 December 2019 21: 50
      He worked at the factory, there were no such problems, in '92 it was worse, the children went, they asked for BREAD.
      Then YOU probably remember the program "600 seconds", there was a lot of truth in it, food was thrown into a landfill. One of us went to the dump for food, and bragged about it. It is not for nothing that the people say that the fish rots from the head, which is why troubled times arise.
    3. andrew.strygin Offline andrew.strygin
      andrew.strygin (Andrey Strygin) 7 December 2019 22: 16
      You forgot to write about cars with products that were not allowed into the cities. And huge dumps of rot. It was obviously impossible then to feed the people. The artist must be hungry. So they drew.
    4. begemot20091 Offline begemot20091
      begemot20091 (begemot20091) 8 December 2019 17: 23
      40 years of his life lived in the USSR. I also remember these queues, created artificially in the 90s, the foolishness of "dry law", but more I remember "Artek", student groups. I traveled all over the country, flew in airplanes and helicopters, sailed on Rockets, Comets, Zarya, motor ships, steamers, barges. I flew to Novosibirsk from Tomsk for 3 steering wheels like a student, I drove 1-2 a quarter for a penny on a "steam locomotive" to my parents, and my parents - pensioners - to me. The parents, me and my sister got the apartments. Once a year - on vacation - my two children and I went to the sea. I will not talk about salary, but I will say: "to fly from Tomsk to Moscow for a couple of days to drink vodka and champagne was enough. Not everyone, of course, had such an income, but lumberjacks and oilmen lived with us ... a cheerful young people .. and, most importantly, we were young and knew what we would have tomorrow ... today you don’t remember what happened yesterday, denigrating your history, and therefore, you don’t have a future either. Listen more liberasts: stankevichs, gozmanov, stejman ... they have a big bench there.
      1. chobasa Offline chobasa
        chobasa (Choi Bal San) 14 December 2019 00: 19
        Quote: begemot20091
        Listen more to Liberasts: the Stankevichs, gozman, the matte ... there they have a big bench.

        Why listen to them if there are storytellers like you?
        He flew to Moscow for a couple of days to tramp there in a drunken stupor.
        What shishi? A ticket from Tomsk to Moscow by plane and back cost a month's salary for an engineer. Slept in Moscow where? There were few hotels, and there were NEVER vacancies in them. Yes, and they cost, even if in terms of armor, very good. But there was no reservation for "drink vodka". Where did you sleep? At the train station or in the sewer?

        Quote: begemot20091
        I went to the sea with two children.

        You did not go to the sea, you went at best "to the Black Sea".
        And this, although the sea, but not a resort.
        In addition, I was there under socialism: there are two halls in the barracks, one for men and one for women.
        A toilet with holes in the floor on the street, everything is knee-deep shit.
        Feeding in the "canteen" with natural waste.
        Well, and other delights of "Soviet rest".
        Under the USSR it was called "boarding house". And such a "rest" was also very expensive.
        1. plabu Offline plabu
          plabu 14 December 2019 00: 45
          How did you describe YOUR PERSONAL EXPERIENCE at that time in detail, and you don’t have enough intelligence to understand that this was NOT for everyone, so I couldn’t arrange something better for myself - your problems, and the reliability of your opuses, am what about boarding houses and toilets, what about flying around, the ticket costed a month’s salary, depending on which city the ticket from Rostov to Moscow cost no more than 25 rubles, the ticket Moscow - Khabarovsk - Petropavlovsk-Kamchatsky is less than 200, so tell your tales elsewhere hi go and remember at least something reliable, while you will not set off ... laughing
        2. begemot20091 Offline begemot20091
          begemot20091 (begemot20091) 14 December 2019 02: 45
          From Tomsk to Novosib a ticket cost 6 rubles, for a student one - 3 minutes flight and you are right in the city, at the end of Krasny Prospekt practically. I got on a trolley bus and ... Until the NiiVT hostel - childhood friends studied there. A ticket from Tomsk to Moscow cost 45 rubles. On the student's - 60. As an assistant turner (moonlighting) they paid 30 rubles, + as a technician at the Research Institute-140, + scholarship -80 = living in Moscow and St. Petersburg - free, friends had their own apartments. Construction team every summer. The smallest - after 50 course, 1 brought. So ... And to stay in different cities - what problems - we have friends in construction teams - all over the country. Yes, and now we meet quite often. I am an engineer every other day and every day I went to your Moscow. But now we already had our own hotels in many cities of the country - without signs. After working as an engineer for a year and a half, he left to serve. Initial salary for the lieutenant - 1980. Travel and flight to the place of rest - free of charge. And the Black Sea was only 250 km away from me when I served - so I went to the Baltic states in Jurmala - our sanatoriums (there were no holes in the floor) and for free. And under the USSR it was called either a resort, or a rest house, or a sanatorium. In Jurmala, there are often just separate cottages. The flyers from the Tu-100, after flying around the "ball", regularly rested there, as in a dispensary. Their salaries were even higher. And in foreign countries, they also paid salaries with imported grandmas. Well, and those who fought ... Maybe a day for 22. So you don't have to lie if you didn't live at that time. And then I have everything: my salary, my pension is normal, I have several apartments, and I have learned my children. And they are provided with apartments, cars, and children.
          PS And now, according to the mood: I live in a resort - on the Black Sea, I'm tired, I'm going to the Baltic - there is also an apartment. And I want snow - to my homeland, to Siberia ... It's ridiculous, but there is also a small apartment there.
          1. chobasa Offline chobasa
            chobasa (Choi Bal San) 14 December 2019 11: 59
            Quote: begemot20091
            From Tomsk to Novosib, the ticket cost 6 rubles.

            And where does the trip to Novosib in the Soviet sedentary cattle truck? It was:
            1. About Moscow from Tomsk.
            2. About air tickets.

            Quote: begemot20091
            A ticket from Tomsk to Moscow cost 60 rubles. By student - 30.

            So this is you for student 40 rubles.

            Quote: begemot20091
            "fly from Tomsk to Moscow for a couple of days to drink vodka and champagne

            Oh well. By the way, the salary of an engineer (before taxes) was 110 rubles / month. Count how many times with this money you could

            Quote: begemot20091
            fly from Tomsk to Moscow for a couple of days to drink vodka and champagne

            Quote: begemot20091
            As an assistant turner (moonlighting) paid 140 rubles

            The trouble is that the assistant turner got more engineer. Such a society will not last long. It did not live long.

            Quote: begemot20091
            + scholarship - 50

            50 rub received ONLY excellent students. The usual scholarship was 40 rubles.

            Quote: begemot20091
            Every summer a construction team. The smallest - after 1 course, 1980 brought.

            Right, why study? Anyway, then they will not pay money. Better to work with your hands. More profitable.

            Quote: begemot20091
            The initial salary of the lieutenant is 250.

            Yes, there was grief in the USSR. It's funny to say that women in the USSR retired at 55, and healthy foreheads at 45. And the pensions of the "foreheads" were much higher than civilians. But direct bribery of the USSR military did not help. During the collapse of the USSR, they did not even move.

            Quote: begemot20091
            so I went to the Baltic states in Jurmala

            Jurmala, this is not the sea.

            Quote: begemot20091
            our sanatoriums (without a hole in the floor were there) and free

            And again, bribing the military to the authorities of the USSR did not help.

            Quote: begemot20091
            Flyers with the Tu-22

            Are these those that crashed 13% in the first 20 years of operation? Oh well.

            Quote: begemot20091
            after flying around the "ball"

            The flight range of the Tu-22 with all possible refueling is 7 thousand km. Therefore, "flying around the ball" is their tales for suckers from other branches of the military.

            Quote: begemot20091
            And in foreign countries, they also paid a salary by imported grandmothers.

            It was impossible to buy anything with these "imported grandmothers" anyway. Because "foreign" consisted of ragamount countries such as Cuba, Vietnam (then) and other ragamuffins.

            Quote: begemot20091
            Well, the warrior ...

            In fact, there were no fighters either. USSR from 1945 to 1982 did not fight with anyone. And in Afghanistan, the Tu-22 is useless. You relay Soviet tales less.

            Quote: begemot20091
            So do not lie if you did not live at that time.

            Unfortunately, he lived a very long time. I would like to have less. But it turned out a lot.
            1. begemot20091 Offline begemot20091
              begemot20091 (begemot20091) 14 December 2019 13: 46
              In order, they even tricked the sour with the fresh: I didn’t even know that the Tu-22 was not refueling in the air. In Afghanistan -

              A plane ticket cost from Tomsk to Novosibirsk - 6 rubles. As for the scholarships, it was necessary to study well, my friend. And the neighbors from the military medical faculty were paid a scholarship - 90. Well, about healthy foreheads at 45 - why didn't you go with healthy foreheads - to run around the mountains with a gun. I write in my pants to crumple - this is not to "go around the world." By country ragamuffins: Iran, Libya, Germany, Czechoslovakia, Turkey ... List all? B-52, too, 80 pieces "disappeared" so what? These risks are paid for. By the way, about the "lumpen": today any turner, milling machine operator, electrician (lumpen in your opinion) gets many times more "manager". As the technical director of the plant, I barely found a milling machine for 2 operations - we pay 60 thousand. And to top it off: from 1945 to 1982 ... google to help you -

              This is only what is publicly available. And the military retired at 35 and 38 - how it goes. You jump with a parachute - a year for 1,5, you serve in a "wild" area for 1 year for 1,5 or 2 years, you fly, a year for two, in an autonomous system - too. You fight in three years. So ... after 36 years I also have 31 civilian experience and I want to go back to the USSR. And it doesn't pull abroad - I don't like it there. I visit 1-2 times a month.
              By the way, the military also receives a second pension. Civilian, and military, and for awards, and veteran, and for Chernobyl.
              A flag in your hands. If you did not earn a pension under the USSR, these are your problems.
              PS I had two apartments in the USSR - I note, for free. Both my parents and wives received free of charge.
              1. chobasa Offline chobasa
                chobasa (Choi Bal San) 14 December 2019 14: 37
                Quote: begemot20091
                And I did not know that the Tu-22 is not refueling in the air.

                Refuel. And in this case, their range of 7 thousand km. No refueling, less.

                Quote: begemot20091
                And the neighbors from the military medical faculty

                I already wrote about the bribery of the security forces by the Bolshevik Communists, which the USSR did not help in any way.

                Quote: begemot20091
                why didn’t you go to healthy foreheads - with a machine gun to run through the mountains.

                You do not tell me fables about military service. I have devoted too much time to her, I have seen too much with my own eyes to believe your fairy tales about mountains and a machine gun.

                I write in my pants to crumple - this is not to "go around the world."

                So do not wrinkle then. As for the trip around the world, tourists pay money for such trips. Big ones. Fishermen go much more. Merchant sailors, again, go a lot more. And retire, like everyone else. And only naval sailors, who rarely go somewhere, somehow get very tired of these "walkers".

                Quote: begemot20091
                By ragged countries: Iran, Libya, Germany, Czechoslovakia, Turkey ... Do you want to list all?

                All ragged, including the GDR. And where is Turkey? She left NATO and entered the VD?

                Quote: begemot20091
                They pay for these risks.

                They don’t pay a dime for risks at all. Pay for another.

                Quote: begemot20091
                today, any turner, milling machine operator, electrician (lumpen in your opinion) gets many times more "manager"

                Do not confuse an engineer with a grassroots manager.

                Quote: begemot20091
                And the military retired at 35 and 38 - as it turns out.

                This is very in vain. And besides, this is unconstitutional. Violation of the Basic Law of the country. In Russia, everyone is equal by law. And the retirement age should be the same for everyone.
                It is one thing to HAVE THE RIGHT TO PENSION (to earn such a right ahead of schedule), and it is another thing to RECEIVE A PENSION before the age established in the country. Today for men it is 60-65 years old. By the way, different age of retirement of men and women is not a violation of the Constitution. In the Russian Federation, gender equality.
                1. akarfoxhound Offline akarfoxhound
                  akarfoxhound 21 December 2019 01: 39
                  In a warm warehouse a couple of years maximum, and did not serve. He devoted time to the army, yeah ... tell the white plankton surrounding you. laughing This is all over your opus, read for life offended. It did not take place under the Union, zero under the "democrats", at the moment, the finish is in only trousers with a "sonny" pension. Does the bile of a loser burn through "claudia" when typing? "I" lived under the bench ", read about everything, so I have no real idea of ​​life, but I know everything!" Have some milk, dreamer. wink

                  PS Listen, and I have already read your opuses on this topic, offended by the world, on a couple of sites! Exactly! And you are different people, servicemen and no, the same answer! And everywhere you have the same thing - it's not me that failed nothing, it's the world of unfair shit, especially before. "We are all equal, but I'm not rushing!" wassat No, well, for sure !!!
  2. Warrior Offline Warrior
    Warrior 7 December 2019 13: 05
    For the betrayal of the peoples of the USSR Gorbachev and ALL Communists of the USSR must be hung ...
    1. DPN Offline DPN
      DPN (DPN) 7 December 2019 21: 54
      If not YOU, then your parents fall under your statement - do not mind?
      You are right about Gorbachev, but he is guarded by the constitution and he is not convicted of a crime.
      1. Warrior Offline Warrior
        Warrior 7 December 2019 22: 29
        My parents NEVER belonged to this anti-people party, where solid careerists and traitors gathered, who then betrayed the peoples of the USSR.
        And the traitors of Gorbachev were chosen by the then Communists, who then betrayed the peoples of the USSR.
        Before his assassination, Stalin correctly wanted to make the USSR a people’s state and remove the Communist Party from power, because already then there were solid crooks-careerists and traitors of the peoples of the USSR, for which he was killed by party bonzes.
        1. DPN Offline DPN
          DPN (DPN) 13 December 2019 23: 11
          My parents NEVER belonged to this anti-people party, where solid careerists and traitors gathered, who then betrayed the peoples of the USSR.

          Now you choose EP, which threw 7 years to retirement age and swallowed normally, so how are you different? Yes, and you still live in the parental apartment, given by the Soviet government for free.
          1. chobasa Offline chobasa
            chobasa (Choi Bal San) 14 December 2019 00: 23
            Quote: DPN
            Yes, and you still live in the parental apartment, given by the Soviet government for free.

            The Soviet government didn’t give anyone an apartment (keep your pocket wider), it rented people to them for rent.
            The people that you scold so much for FREE distributed apartments to people.
            1. begemot20091 Offline begemot20091
              begemot20091 (begemot20091) 14 December 2019 02: 52
              Here they are all connoisseurs and generals who can only play billiards ... Pocket. They all know about the USSR and how bad it was for us there. Read smart books, not comics, you are sick, our iPhones.

            2. DPN Offline DPN
              DPN (DPN) 18 December 2019 00: 33
              The apartment under the USSR passed by inheritance and no one could take it from a person. Now they can throw out just onto the street.
              Yes, the apartment was impossible to sell, in the absence of an heir, she passed to the state. The young people were given a dormitory for a penny.
              Russian capitalism simply sold Soviet free to a family who lived in this apartment.
        2. chobasa Offline chobasa
          chobasa (Choi Bal San) 14 December 2019 00: 21
          Quote: Warrior
          ... because already then there were solid rogue careerists and traitors of the peoples of the USSR

          Those. did he collect them all and raise them?
          Write more, it's fun with you.
          1. plabu Offline plabu
            plabu 14 December 2019 00: 50
            And you write, it’s even more fun with you, well, just like a Phoenix bird. laughing
    2. andrew.strygin Offline andrew.strygin
      andrew.strygin (Andrey Strygin) 7 December 2019 22: 21
      Do not equate this shit to the Communists of the USSR.
  3. steelmaker Offline steelmaker
    steelmaker 7 December 2019 16: 25
    Such articles should be included in school textbooks. Those who are friends with the head will draw the right conclusions themselves. I would also add for some that even in 1990 the USSR’s GDP was 4,7%. Tens of thousands of enterprises worked, but there weren’t even nails in stores. And if it’s not Sabotage at the highest level, then what is Sabotage? The people of the USSR have long concluded that who Gorbachev is, I would like the current government to say that too!
    1. DPN Offline DPN
      DPN (DPN) 13 December 2019 23: 16
      Steel YOU began to cook fig steel, even you have to buy Chinese nails.
    2. chobasa Offline chobasa
      chobasa (Choi Bal San) 14 December 2019 00: 26
      Quote: steel maker
      I would also add for some that even in 1990 the USSR’s GDP was 4,7%.

      4,7% of the level of Martian civilization?

      Quote: steel maker
      Tens of thousands of enterprises worked, but there weren’t even nails in stores.

      That's why it wasn’t that they actually pretended to work.

      Quote: steel maker
      The people of the USSR have long concluded that who Gorbachev is, I would like the current government to say that too!

      And what for the current government is the people of the USSR?
      She has her own people. And it somehow somehow does well without the people of the USSR.
  4. Sergey Latyshev Offline Sergey Latyshev
    Sergey Latyshev (Serge) 8 December 2019 12: 15
    But in fact, an anti-Putin article, if we distract from the individual.
    Is it not in vain that GDP pays awesome pensions to these heroes of collapse? Contains their funds? Yeltsin centers? Sports competitions, libraries, forums in their memory? Family members and subordinates?

    Until now, not a word about cotton cases, etc., about the famous "suitcases of compromising evidence."

    Not in vain!
    Shows class solidarity ....
  5. Jar.serge Offline Jar.serge
    Jar.serge (Reznik) 8 December 2019 13: 25
    No wonder Tagged sits in Germany. Occasionally, however, impudently blathers ....
  6. Roarv Offline Roarv
    Roarv (Robert) 9 December 2019 05: 54
    For active unlabeled and labeled Judas and those claiming to be such.
    Compare where China was at the time 1985-1989 and why it didn’t break up ....
    In order to "jerk" in the economy and increase the FORBS list, eat foods with palm content, sausage without meat, and products made according to TU ...
    all the hunchbackers were prevented by the USSR.
  7. Nikolay Malyugin (Nikolai Malyugin) 13 December 2019 06: 52
    And were there any prerequisites for the transition from socialism to capitalism of our country? I think no. You just need to see what formed the bourgeois society in the West. Better to look, not to powder our brains.
    1. chobasa Offline chobasa
      chobasa (Choi Bal San) 14 December 2019 00: 29
      Quote: Nikolay Malyugin
      And were there any prerequisites for the transition from socialism to capitalism of our country?

      To capitalism?
      Do you live in the Baltic states? Or in Eastern Europe?
      Congratulations to you then.

      Quote: Nikolay Malyugin
      You just need to see what formed the bourgeois society in the West.

      From feudal society. Nothing new, ordinary classical political economy.
      1. plabu Offline plabu
        plabu 14 December 2019 00: 52
        Once again, everything is written the same, all the same dregs. hi "peshi ischo" (s)
      2. Nikolay Malyugin (Nikolai Malyugin) 14 December 2019 06: 14
        You probably see the whole story in quick animation. First the primitive system, then the feudal system, and then .. Look at what happened in the interim.
        1. chobasa Offline chobasa
          chobasa (Choi Bal San) 14 December 2019 11: 21
          Quote: Nikolay Malyugin
          First the primitive system, then the feudal system, and then ..

          Between the primitive communal and feudal mode of production (the system, in your terminology) is still slave.
          After the feudal "system" in the DEVELOPMENT of society comes the bourgeois (capitalist) one.
          But development does not always happen, in some places degradation of society also happens (see the Republic of Ingushetia from the time of the RSFSR and further USSR). And then the movement goes back.
          1. Nikolay Malyugin (Nikolai Malyugin) 15 December 2019 05: 42
            Speaking about the prerequisites for the transition to capitalism, I had in mind a completely different thing. Even in the Russian Empire, capitalism was in its infancy. Capitalism involves free enterprise. Having adopted the patterns of the USA (not even Europe), we assumed that in this world all paths are open to us. Not considering fierce competition and our mentality.
  8. Nikolay Malyugin (Nikolai Malyugin) 15 December 2019 06: 14
    The concept of "as if there was no war" between the people and Gorbachev was different. People believed in the strength of the Soviet Army. Moreover, they felt the elbow of the Army. This happened in all kinds of natural disasters. This is also the extinguishing of peat bogs near Moscow. Help with floods and fires. And the readiness of the engineering troops was simply on top.
  9. begemot20091 Offline begemot20091
    begemot20091 (begemot20091) 16 December 2019 20: 55
    Quote: chobasa
    Refuel. And in this case, their range of 7 thousand km. No refueling, less.

    And I did not know, i.e. the rest of the kilometers - in the holy spirit ... just refueled and ... and the submarines also did not go around the world under water? ... Fishermen go more. My neighbor "fished", took risks with the cook in the galley - a real captain while I ran through the mountains. Well, to compare Libya with the ragamuffins, rub your certificate. I already wrote to you - you should have studied better. Or, if the "walker" is a civilian, leave the "Norwegian". In 5 years, a piece of gayropension would have been earned. And now cry in your shirt-front, a civilian seaman who gave many years of military service, who went to war on the way, who served in impoverished Turkey and Libya, who flew on the Tu-22 on the way and ... Who did not decide to leave this "damned" Russia. If you don't like the country: go out, or take off your harem pants and show your ass to the Kremlin on Red Square. Weak. Then there is nothing to find fault with what you have. Look at the maydanutyh - they are also jumping. I (though an atheist) thank God that after so many years I broke free, plucked up courage and left the country of duremaria, which was once the Ukrainian SSR. And, believe me, I'm glad to snot. I will die at home.
  10. The comment was deleted.
  11. polar fox Offline polar fox
    polar fox (Oleg) 22 January 2020 16: 59
    Some, like Makarevich, believe that Gorbachev "gave freedom." And I believe that this fantastic chatterbox and mediocrity gave nothing but shame to the country, poverty and blood to people. It is necessary to bring the country to economic ruin, then declare that it is impossible to reform its - the country.