Gas pipe remains the only meaning of Ukraine


In Ukraine, they started talking about the tragic role of the gas pipe in the fate of the state, which, with enormous potential, turned into an object of international relations in less than thirty years.


On the air of News One television channel, businessman and TV presenter Andrei Palchevsky said that linking Ukraine to a gas pipe not only divided the population into rich and poor, but also “corrupted” it as a state.

According to him, gas may lead to the death of Ukraine or, if President Vladimir Zelensky can solve this problem, it will benefit the country.

Palchevsky’s statement was supported by media expert Aleksey Molchanov, who expressed confidence that Ukraine had forgotten the true meaning of existence, “attached” to a gas pipe.

As today's events show, the opinion of experts is not based on an empty place.

Recall that, despite the rapidly approaching expiration of the contract for the transit of Russian gas, the Ukrainian side not only continues to red tape with Gazprom, but also puts forward transit conditions that are obviously unacceptable for Moscow.

Thus, Ukraine turned into a pirate, the whole reason for the existence of which is to obtain funds for the use of its gas transportation system.

At the same time, in Kiev, they try not to recall that without Russian gas the Ukrainian gas transportation system will turn into a pile of useless scrap metal that no one needs.
Photos used: https://news-life.pro/
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  1. steelmaker Online
    steelmaker 30 November 2019 13: 57
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    Ukraine and Russia lead to a civil war. Such an attitude towards people cannot but jerk. There is no right reaction to an elementary jamb and theft either in Ukraine or in Russia. And the fact that Ukraine is being destroyed is nothing to rejoice about. The fraternal peoples will someday unite, and then we will restore it all!
    1. Ravshan Offline
      Ravshan (Jamsut) 30 November 2019 14: 37
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      Quote: steel maker
      Brotherly nations will ever unite

      What are the fraternal peoples?
      Today fraternal in Russia and Ukraine are only Soviet citizens.
      There are no more fraternal peoples on these lands.
      Rusichs (in the Republic of Ingushetia they were called Little Russians, this is one of the peoples of Ukraine) and Great Russians (one of the peoples of the Russian Federation) have historically diverged for quite some time. And on the most serious grounds, religious. Therefore, everything in this hatred is adult.
      Joining back seems dubious. Only, perhaps, by the forced assimilation of one of the peoples. But who will do it today?
    2. gore Offline
      gore (Alexander) 1 December 2019 06: 48
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      Having such "brothers", and enemies do not ...
  2. The comment was deleted.
    1. Bakht Offline
      Bakht (Bakhtiyar) 30 November 2019 15: 52
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      Not tired of speaking for Ukraine? What is a "long-term contract"? No contract and no gas supplies. It’s easier to pay 3 billion by arbitration decision and close this page.
      1. Ravshan Offline
        Ravshan (Jamsut) 30 November 2019 16: 45
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        Quote: Bakht
        No contract and no gas supplies. It’s easier to pay 3 billion by arbitration decision and close this page.

        Of course, easier.
        It’s also easy to pay European consumers for disrupting contract deliveries.
        It will also be easy when they refuse the services of Gazprom, calling it an unreliable supplier.
        In general, lying on the couch and drooling pink is easiest.
        But Gazprom is now very difficult. And it will be even harder.
        1. Bakht Offline
          Bakht (Bakhtiyar) 30 November 2019 16: 54
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          Do not make me laugh. Read the Gazprom report and Miller’s conversation with Medvedev. And also a letter to NOVATEK. There will be no supply disruption. And by the fall, all flows will earn 100%.
          In the meantime, this:

          according to the forecast of Naftogaz Ukrainy, the absence of gas transit may lead to an increase in gas prices from January 1, 2020 to 10,751 thousand UAH per 1 thousand cubic meters. m (hereinafter - without VAT and tariffs for transportation and distribution)
          ------
          The Cabinet of Ministers approved a guaranteed for the entire heating season gas price for the population at the level of 8 thousand UAH / 1 thousand cubic meters. m., - said the Prime Minister of Ukraine Alexey Goncharuk.
          1. Ravshan Offline
            Ravshan (Jamsut) 30 November 2019 17: 24
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            Quote: Bakht
            Do not make me laugh.

            I do not have your habits.

            Quote: Bakht
            There will be no supply disruption. And by the fall, all flows will earn 100%.

            It is still a pitchfork on the water.
            In addition, with NG until the fall another 8 months. During this time, a lot of penalties from European consumers will run up.
            1. Bakht Offline
              Bakht (Bakhtiyar) 30 November 2019 17: 26
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              Did not read the information? Keep on making everyone laugh?
              1. Ravshan Offline
                Ravshan (Jamsut) 30 November 2019 17: 29
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                Quote: Bakht
                Did not read the information?

                Your "information" is absolutely uninteresting to me.

                Quote: Bakht
                Keep on making everyone laugh?

                I already wrote, I do not have your habits.
                1. Bakht Offline
                  Bakht (Bakhtiyar) 30 November 2019 17: 45
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                  Without information, your words are no more than the rustle of fallen leaves. With the same success, you can listen to grandmothers on the bench. It’s not interesting with you ....
                  1. Ravshan Offline
                    Ravshan (Jamsut) 30 November 2019 19: 14
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                    Quote: Bakht
                    With the same success, you can listen to grandmothers on the bench.

                    It looks like all your “information” is direct from them.
                    1. Bakht Offline
                      Bakht (Bakhtiyar) 30 November 2019 20: 57
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                      Ravshan (if, of course, Ravshan). You would still visit at least occasionally the website of Gazprom or Naftogaz. Or at least the news of the Cabinet of Ukraine.
                      I explain. The price of 10700 hryvnias for 1 thousand cubic meters - this means 450 bucks for that same thousand. This price is predicted by Naftogaz of Ukraine, and not by the grandmother at the entrance. The Cabinet of Ministers of Ukraine ordered the introduction of a NON-MARKET fixed price for the entire heating season of 8 hryvnia per 1 cubic meter. So? Naftogaz will incur losses of almost 3 hryvnia per thousand cubic meters. It's hard to believe.
                      According to European underground gas storage facilities, 100 billion cubic meters of gas are stored there. A significant part of them is gas from Gazprom. Throughout 2019, GasProm drove gas to Europe precisely in anticipation of such a situation. According to Miller, there are already 11 billion cubic meters of Russian gas in Europe. Ukrainian experts say that much more. With Gazprom’s general obligations, about 200 billion. So there will be no penalties.
                      And in the summer of this year, NOVATEK officially announced that in the event of force majeure, all LNG from Yamal will go to Europe to pay off Gazprom’s debt. Given that both companies are only conditionally private, no penalties from Europe are foreseen.
                      With this force majeure, LNG prices will skyrocket. Americans are already rubbing their hands and plan to sell Ukraine gas at 600 bucks per thousand cubic meters. Poland is also in chocolate.
                      Will Ukraine survive - this is of no interest to anyone. Any LNG from Yamal will be cheaper than American. So the Russian Federation will fulfill its obligations. And Europe, in principle, doesn’t care what kind of gas it will have.
                      Watching a movie.
                      PS By the way, Ukrainian experts and deputies are already openly saying that if Kobolev is not removed, then there will be no transit agreement. Kobolev and Vitrenko openly play for the Americans.
                      That's all the news and facts (information) from quite official sources. And you continue to use OBS.
                      1. Bakht Offline
                        Bakht (Bakhtiyar) 30 November 2019 21: 03
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                        Conclusion:
                        There is a court decision, the appeal is lost. You have to pay 3 billion and turn the page. Be sure to continue collecting from Ukraine 3 billion for a loan.
                        Russia is ABSOLUTELY not interested in continuing transit through Ukraine. You can talk only in one case, "who feeds the girl, he dances”
                      2. 321 Offline
                        321 (321) 30 November 2019 21: 05
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                        All the same, he won’t go anywhere, the reason is simple - he has “two opinions - his and wrong”, with knowledge he has tight, but what can he learn now, who will teach him now? bully
                      3. Ravshan Offline
                        Ravshan (Jamsut) 30 November 2019 21: 15
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                        Quote: Bakht
                        You would still visit at least occasionally the website of Gazprom or Naftogaz. Or at least the news of the Cabinet of Ukraine.

                        And what for?

                        Quote: Bakht
                        The Cabinet of Ministers of Ukraine ordered the introduction of a NON-MARKET fixed price for the entire heating season of 8 hryvnia per 1 cubic meter.

                        It is not interesting to me.

                        Quote: Bakht
                        According to Miller, there are already 11 billion cubic meters of Russian gas in Europe. Ukrainian experts say that much more. With Gazprom’s general obligations, about 200 billion. So there will be no penalties.

                        A masterpiece.
                        You wrote a little higher that gas pipelines would not work before the fall of next year. 200 billion cubic meters, this is 17 billion cubic meters per month (on average).
                        Count you how many months of supply will last 11 billion cubic meters in storage?

                        Quote: Bakht
                        And in the summer of this year, NOVATEK officially announced that in the event of force majeure, all LNG from Yamal will go to Europe to pay off Gazprom’s debt. Given that both companies are only conditionally private, no penalties from Europe are foreseen.

                        They will be in other places. In those where they were supposed to be put. But they will not be delivered.
                        In addition, Yamal LNG is a drop in the bucket.

                        Quote: Bakht
                        With this force majeure, LNG prices will skyrocket. The Americans are already rubbing their hands and plan to sell Ukraine gas at 600 bucks per thousand cubic meters. Poland is also in chocolate.

                        This is generally not interesting to anyone. And unrealistic.
                        The price of gas without Gazprom’s gas will not change in any way. And today it is less than 200 dollars per thousand cubic meters.
                        In Europe, gas is now like dirt. That is why it was decided to transfer Gazprom to the status of a reserve gas supplier to Europe. By minimizing its supply.

                        Quote: Bakht
                        Will Ukraine survive - this is of no interest to anyone.

                        That's me in the first place.

                        Quote: Bakht
                        LNG from Yamal will be cheaper in any way than American.

                        Did you come up with this yourself?

                        Quote: Bakht
                        So the Russian Federation will fulfill its obligations.

                        The Russian Federation has no obligations. Gazprom has them.
                      4. Bakht Offline
                        Bakht (Bakhtiyar) 30 November 2019 21: 24
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                        You would give at least one digit. And then all the words. And the count is completely childish with you. 11 billion cubic meters is Gazprom’s reserve (!) Just in case. This is ADDITION to what is going in other directions.
                        For God's sake, I said that you use the OBS radio. What price will be - we will see in the winter. If there is so much gas, then Europe is unlikely to need it. Especially then you can agree on a reduction in supplies. Then the Ukrainian direction is even more so - a pipe. Why conclude a transit agreement?
                      5. Ravshan Offline
                        Ravshan (Jamsut) 30 November 2019 21: 43
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                        Quote: Bakht
                        You would give at least one digit. And then all the words.

                        I have enough of yours.

                        Quote: Bakht
                        This is ADDITION to what is going in other directions.

                        So count how much goes in other directions. And how much is this reserve.
                        Until the fall, definitely not enough. Even before the summer is not enough.

                        Quote: Bakht
                        Especially then you can agree on a reduction in supplies.

                        Dear, this is a business. Gazprom will be wet in full. And no one will agree with him.
                        They would not have been wetted before, but now, in connection with an excess of gas in Europe (Gazprom slept at this moment), they will. Since there is no special need for it.
                        Have you heard about the animal grin of capitalism? It will be just him.
                      6. Bakht Offline
                        Bakht (Bakhtiyar) 30 November 2019 21: 48
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                        So just something and have to hold out until the summer. Think for yourself. If there is so much gas, then why is Germany fighting so hard on the SP-2? Did they forget about capitalism?
                        And here is the opinion of Comrade Michelson. News should be read and put in a piggy bank.

                        https://www.rbc.ru/business/02/07/2019/5d1b1e9e9a7947ba31419c74

                        “If there are calls from Gazprom, we will consider. For the country it’s super important not to terminate the contracts that Gazprom signed on European markets, "-0 Mikhelson said

                        As you can see, it was popularly explained to comrade Mikhelson that NOVATEK and GAZPROM are not private companies, but state-owned. Whatever they are called.
                      7. Ravshan Offline
                        Ravshan (Jamsut) 30 November 2019 21: 58
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                        Quote: Bakht
                        So just something and have to hold out until the summer.

                        Already before the summer?
                        More recently, it was necessary to hold out until the fall.
                        Your terms are changing rapidly.

                        Quote: Bakht
                        then why is Germany so struggling with the SP-2?

                        Germany would probably be surprised to find out about this.

                        Quote: Bakht
                        And here is the opinion of Comrade Michelson.

                        It is not interesting.
                        In addition, I already wrote to you about the Yamal LNG above.

                        Quote: Bakht
                        GAZPROM is not private companies, but state-owned.

                        Gazprom is not a state company, but AO.
                      8. Bakht Offline
                        Bakht (Bakhtiyar) 30 November 2019 22: 10
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                        Once Michelson is the head of Novatek. I already realized that the opinion of the grandmothers at the entrance is more important than the opinion of the head of the corporation.
                        Germany is not surprised, but submits to European courts to remove SP-2 and OPAL from the action of the third energy package.
                        And you don’t have to go far. Link directly from the same site.

                        https://topcor.ru/12128-germanija-podala-v-sud-na-evrosojuz-iz-za-severnogo-potoka.html

                        And you just have to hold out nothing. The heating season ends in spring. In summer and early fall, you can agree with the same Germans. So the timing is not the most important. More importantly, another - how long does a hydraulic system stand idle without gas? Somewhere I saw a tsifirka in a month and a half.
                        What do you think, in December the Donbass will discuss in the Norman format? Ha and three more times Ha. They will discuss gas supplies to Europe. And I’m sure that they won’t agree on anything. I'm not a fan of Putin, I’m sure that Putin will win the KGB battle against KVN.
                      9. Bakht Offline
                        Bakht (Bakhtiyar) 30 November 2019 22: 12
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                        Gazprom is not a state company, but AO

                        Blessed is he who believes.
          2. gorenina91 Offline
            gorenina91 (Irina) 30 November 2019 21: 05
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            - Well, Mr. Ravshan (Dzhamshut) ... - your comments on the "gas theme" (and about the "functionality" of Gazprom) ... are quite logical and their content corresponds to the real state of things ...
            - My advantages ... to you ...
            1. Ravshan Offline
              Ravshan (Jamsut) 30 November 2019 21: 20
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              Merci, Madame.
  • gore Offline
    gore (Alexander) 1 December 2019 06: 50
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    Well, "give" them 3 billion, which gave Yanukovych. All the same, they will not be given.
  • zenitovets Offline
    zenitovets (Ivan) 30 November 2019 19: 49
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    We will help to fall apart this filthy Ukraine!
  • gorenina91 Offline
    gorenina91 (Irina) 30 November 2019 20: 51
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    - Again I have to repeat myself ...- I’m already tired of it myself ...- about the same thing .. -But, apparently, such a time has come ...- all the time ...
    - There was already my comment on this topic ...

    The thing is that Ukraine is in Zap. Europe is already tired of everyone ... -And Ukraine is in a critical condition to continue anti-Russian policy ...
    - Both Germany and the entire EU will soon begin to simply “merge” it (they have already begun) and, of course, all the “European courts and arbitrations” (this “instrument of Western Europe”) will cease to “stand up” for Ukraine ...
    - All this “European coalition” (including courts and arbitration) will begin to show all kinds of “claims” to ... to ... to ... to Russia (Gazprom) ... -And I assure everyone present .. that on In this "field" all the actions of this "coalition" (courts and arbitration to help them) will be quite successful ... -And this will not be difficult for them ... -Gazprom itself monstrously "messed up" and continues in the same vein ...
    - Plus to everything .. except for that ...- Gazprom (Russia) will soon have another "headache" ... is the "Turkish Stream" ...
    - Gazprom had no allies before, had “partners” ready to substitute it (and substitute it) at every step ...
    - With the launch of SP-2 and Turkish Stream, pressure on Gazprom will increase many times ...
    - Therefore ... Russia needs to immediately try to have at least some kind of “gas ally” ... -This ally could be “Ukraine abandoned by all” (Ukraine also created a monstrous critical situation ... ...
    - And Russia simply needs to take the initiative to come forward with the proposal to conclude a long-term agreement with Ukraine on the supply of Russian gas through Ukrainian territory ... -And this should be done as soon as possible ... -Russia just needs to have a "backup option" for transporting gas through Ukraine ... -For Russia it is necessary ...

    -By the way ...- this is where Zelensky’s “suitability” for playing the “big politics” is revealed ...
    1. gorenina91 Offline
      gorenina91 (Irina) 30 November 2019 20: 53
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      - To this we can only add ... that the "time of the gas pipeline" of Gazprom is a thing of the past ...
      Pipeline supplies ... this is atavism from ... from the last 20 century, when the USSR, in fact for nothing, supplied the countries of the socialist community with oil, gas and Russian high-voltage transmission pipes ...
      - All this was terribly unprofitable for the USSR ... - but no one took that into account ...- then there were completely different priorities and life values ​​...
      - And in the 21st century, Russian oligarchs continued this unprofitable "gas pipeline business", creating gas corporations and appropriating the lion's share of the sale ... -for this, Gazprom and other similar "offices" were created ... -And for that, for all this to work somehow ... Gazprom didn’t even need competent, highly qualified specialists (in order to get its kickbacks from deliveries and sales) ... there were enough of those “grief managers” that were also headed by Gazprom, and other "offices" ... -Well, the semi-colonial trade in Russian gas has begun (all over price below cost) ... ....
      - Everything was organized at such a primitive level that Gazprom did not even have any “production prospects” for the future ..; slept through the shale revolution; slept through LNG ...; and didn’t think of anything more clever how to increase the construction of unprofitable pipelines abroad ... -in Zap. Europe ..; to Turkey; to China, etc ...
      - This is a very big topic ... and I will not develop it ...
      - I can only say one thing ... -Gazprom has long outlived itself and will need a whole Russian institute of a new gas industry, a whole industrial and social infrastructure ... - a network of LNG plants; for the production of containers for LNG transportation; for the production of cars, railway transport, ships, aircraft, etc. for transporting LNG ...; entire industrial cities with all the amenities for workers, etc ...
      - All this personally I already wrote and more than once ... - already tired ...
      - Well, today Russia (Gazprom) needs to somehow win back assets and already invested funds ...
      - Therefore, it is urgent to conclude a new "gas agreement" with Ukraine ... so that at least Russia does not have to fight long and stubbornly in a judicial and arbitration war with the EU and the whole West. Europe ...
      - Yes, and Russia needs to at least somehow try to compensate for the construction of thousands of kilometers of pipelines ...